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Keto and Fasting has been amazing thus far.

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  • lemurcat2lemurcat2 Member Posts: 7,222 Member Member Posts: 7,222 Member
    Poobah1972 wrote: »
    Good day everyone!

    I reckon I'll get a bunch more Disagrees bringing this thread back up. But I thought it was worthwhile to up date anyone that was interested in our progress and KETO and Fasting in general.

    Seems like you are having fun with it, and if you like the food you are eating, that's great. Personally, for me, I don't see the appeal at all of taking a day off food weekly (I will do it for religious reasons, but I would find it problematic to exercise on a no food day, but even beyond that I just wouldn't like it). But I do get the not having to think about food as often thing (it's one reason I currently enjoy eating just 2 meals/TRE). I would hope that you aren't using it as an excuse to go too low on overall cals, but I understand that when you have a lot to lose faster weight loss can be okay.

    Anyway, that I wouldn't like it as a regular thing doesn't mean you shouldn't (and I didn't disagree) -- a friend of mine maintains doing 5/2, which I think I would find very difficult, but for her it's great (she only ever lost vanity weight and doesn't count on the 5 days, only the 2 low cal ones).
  • Poobah1972Poobah1972 Member, Premium Posts: 483 Member Member, Premium Posts: 483 Member
    @jogman Thank you for your encouraging comments... It is appreciated Sir!

    @ lemurcat2 Yeah, it really has been a very interesting and good time thus far. Learned lots and continue to learn. Religious or otherwise, I think it's a very natural part of being a human being for most of our existence, thus a good part why the entire multifueled system developed in us as it is today. (this makes sense in my head). Also, my weekly weight loss does not exceed 1% and I am being totally truthful, when I stated I'm 100% satiated day in day out (With minor exceptions on Sunday of course). Blood monitoring suggests I have likely fully fat adapted as well, and am well capable of producing all my required calories on fasting days, backed up by energy levels, mood etc. I really think I'm doing this safely, and in a healthy way. Granted my average is as @ WeatherJane suggested less then 1600 with the fast in effect.

    To counter that I do eat a high proportion of good foods, Berries, Nuts, Fiber, Flax, every single week day... and veggies/salad at least once if not twice daily. I believe I am getting a solid amount of nutrients for the food I eat. As for a Doctor, I don't have a doctor, but as stated in my last post I did see one recently and he seems all for it. Blood work is coming up, and It will be interesting to see.

    Again, if my previous posts weren't read... I very much intend to raise calories as my body dictates I should. I suspect this will happen with the addition of exercise, and also with reaching the sub 300lb mark, where I foresee my bodies ability to pull requirements from fat reserves will begin to diminish.

    I put a lot of work into this... And I do have the long game in mind. :)
    edited April 12
  • Poobah1972Poobah1972 Member, Premium Posts: 483 Member Member, Premium Posts: 483 Member
    Meant to also mention, I find it interesting that there definitely seems to be somewhat of a double standard(probably not the best term) in the way IF windowed approach is generally widely accepted... As long as you don't go over the 18 to 24 hour maximum fasting window. Yet if I essentially go to sleep for 8 more hours, it tends to rile up a considerable amount of people. (not that I'm suggesting any of the last posters feel that way... Just in general)

    I should also note, some would say once fully fat adapted exercise is actually quite good... even when fasted. Granted you will always have more overall strength on a non keto diet... Glycogen loaded muscle is just going to be better in part due to the inflated cells and better leverage due to internal muscle pressure etc. And There is nothing wrong with Glycogen.. (I'm not a hater)
    edited April 12
  • psuLemonpsuLemon Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,370 MFP Moderator Member, MFP Moderator, Greeter, Premium Posts: 37,370 MFP Moderator
    Poobah1972 wrote: »
    Good day everyone!

    I reckon I'll get a bunch more Disagrees bringing this thread back up. But I thought it was worthwhile to up date anyone that was interested in our progress and KETO and Fasting in general..

    My fiancé and I have now successfully fasted for 11 straight Sundays. We continue to be fully committed to the Keto Life style, and invest much time, thought and research into making this WOE a forever reality (Granted fasting will not be). We are still as excited now as we were when we started, except Sundays have become old hat and just a regular Sunday. We love the food we eat, and continue to be 100% satiated 6 days of the week, and Sundays, just the odd occasion of stomach gurgles etc, that water easily remedies. Energy levels remain high every week 7 days a week, and mood is great, sleep is great... Though we do have the habit of waking up a bit early on Monday morning excited to get the day started (and eat of course).

    I did make the decision along the way that I love eating, cooking and baking... And I've decided that I have no interest in attempting a longer fast. And that's that. Sunday just works for us, it's like a day off in the kitchen, it's enjoyable... And come Monday morning, we simply enjoy eating. On the other side of the equation I now know IF, OMAD (windowed approaches) wouldn't fit within our lifestyles. What works is what's important for anyone I believe.

    I've started maintaining a couple spreadsheets... One that tracks my blood glucoses, ketones and GKI as well as all other key macro's and total calorie intake. This has proven very useful in clearly indicating my blood glucose and GKI have been steadily improving from the very beginning. This morning in fact hitting all time new records.

    Blood Ketones - 2.7
    Blood Glucose - 83 (New Record) (by something like 15 points)
    GKI - 1.71 (New Record)

    This has been a very steady reminder of progress, and I have also been able to see how slight adjustments to macro directly affect those reading. For instance I recently decided to stop having a pudding with 7 grams of carb 5 days a week, and I replaced it with 6-12 grams of Coconut fat as part of my breakfast... The immediate effect of which has raised ketone levels and reduced Glucose levels. I also believed by making that adjustment, it would raise my fat percentage to protein, along with the input of MTC oils, my body would likely require less protein to glucose conversion in light of increased ketone production. This was an effort to reduce uric acid in my blood, and flare ups of gout. The numbers seem to show that this conclusion is a sound one... As Ketones and glucose levels both immediately improved. Basically this move also put me more in line with a stricter Keto profile. Yet we still eat like kings and I average 25 grams of fiber daily, sometimes more sometimes less. Big thanks in part to the keto bread doe recipe we use daily in many fashions.

    So yeah, I had 2 flare ups of gout... Very mild ones, that didn't lay me out... But still I needed to do something. I also saw a doctor, got a prescription and am getting a complete blood work up done in about a months time as to allow the prescription and my uric levels to stabilize. Bare in mind I've had issues with gout on occasion going all the way back to my 20's. But certainly more so when I'm losing weight, and more so again when eating KETO. But i do believe paying attention to what you eat and maintaining a proper fat (specially the input of Healthy fats high in MTC) to protein ratio does work to help this issue.

    I've also started a spreadsheet that precisely monitors my daily changing TDEE based on my new weight every day and my new age and the Calories i eat each day. The accuracy to actual readings thus far as been amazing. It also calculates among other things weight loss % per week on a daily basis. Some may be interested to know that I have not exceeded 1% of body weight loss per week some know it as a "Golden Rule". With exception of the one week period that included the 1 and only fast I extended to 48 hours. Currently I am losing 4.16 pounds per week, Started higher then that and by the end of the year calculations show a drop to around 2.81 or so and I just might reach the 300 pound plateau by years end.

    My fiancé at 4'7" is doing equally well albeit vastly different numbers then I, but I have to say she loves the fasting even more then I, as the smaller you are and the smaller your calorie headroom the greater % boost to overall weight loss fast day becomes. For instance I loose about 0.5 pounds 6 days a week and 1 pound on Sundays (So Sundays basically counts as 2 days of normal weight loss). For Lynn it's more like 4 days in one.

    At the moment though I'm still trucking along at 420+ pounds plus (Down something over 60lb), and hope to break the 400 pounds plateau by around the end of May. My next weigh in is in 2 weeks from today. :)

    Happy to answer any questions if anyone is interested. My diary is also open to the public.

    Thanks everyone!

    Can you expand on the protein to glucose conversion? I am not sure i understand your view point or "benefit". I assume you aare talking gluconeogenesis.
  • lemurcat2lemurcat2 Member Posts: 7,222 Member Member Posts: 7,222 Member
    Poobah1972 wrote: »
    Meant to also mention, I find it interesting that there definitely seems to be somewhat of a double standard(probably not the best term) in the way IF windowed approach is generally widely accepted... As long as you don't go over the 18 to 24 hour maximum fasting window. Yet if I essentially go to sleep for 8 more hours, it tends to rile up a considerable amount of people. (not that I'm suggesting any of the last posters feel that way... Just in general)

    I wasn't meaning to suggest that (just in case you did think maybe I did), and I don't find a 36 (or whatever) hr fast to be unhealthy in someone who doesn't respond to it badly. I just don't prefer it.
    I should also note, some would say once fully fat adapted exercise is actually quite good... even when fasted. Granted you will always have more overall strength on a non keto diet... Glycogen loaded muscle is just going to be better in part due to the inflated cells and better leverage due to internal muscle pressure etc. And There is nothing wrong with Glycogen.. (I'm not a hater)

    I don't think it's so hard as all that to be fat adapted as most of us should be good at using fat as energy already when exercising moderately (i.e., not super hard), but I also agree one can improve one's capacity -- I did a running training plan for a while that was intended to improve on that some by adding in fasted runs and so on (this was not otherwise a plan that recommended low carb, but I wasn't following the utrition plan). I also agree that non keto is usually better for optimal performance (I feel a boost from more carbs w/in individual workouts and I'm not even super low carb, but it doesn't matter for my purposes, and in fact training fasted can be useful in some ways for me, and -- the main point -- prevents any stomach issues when running). I also exercise fasted (as in before I eat that day) most of the time these days, but I do think it can be limiting for some, and I don't really like (again, for me) not being able to do a refeed after (or not to be fancy, just having a meal). I did a casual bike ride for about 60 mins on Good Friday (when I generally do a complete fast day), but I wouldn't have wanted to do anything that involved pushing it (which probably means running or weights or a harder or much longer ride, for me), as I would be concerned it would affect recovery. Of course, if one desires one can fit in the fast on a rest day or something, and maybe others don't feel the same way, it's just something that I find helps. (I only started doing TRE, and not eating until early afternoon when I could push my workout up to noon. I don't like doing anything hard and then waiting hours to eat, which is why when I was in the office every day and worked out early in the morning I'd eat breakfast after. Again, this is my personal preference, not something I am claiming everyone must do.)

    Random thoughts about eating and workouts, again not claiming any particular way is best.
  • FitRicanFitRican Member Posts: 98 Member Member Posts: 98 Member
    Poobah1972 , good for you both. If it is working for you enjoy it! Low carb diet with fasting is a healthy way of life. I have been in low carb diet for years. I do IF 2-3 weeks and do HST training. I love KETO diet too, love the roasted pork, filet mignon, shrimp, cheese, butter. I'd rather use fat as energy than sugar. Best Wishes!
    edited April 13
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