A Calorie is NOT just a Calorie
Replies
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Delicious sugar water.
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
Hi! Do I smell Kool-aid on your breath? I think I do! :bigsmile:
I'm just butting in to say that many, many of us exercise, but many also don't do any extra activity and just track calories to lose/maintain
Excuses my ignorance - what's kool aid.
Your point is true but I'm not sure too many of the my FITNESS pal members fall into that category.
Also used when referring to cults because some cult people put poison in it and mass suicided for their god or something?0 -
the difference between 1500 cals of junk is- skinny fat or fat
1500 cals - of lean meats and good carbs and veggies -clean eating- sleek body, not bloated , weight loss perhaps? better skin and appearance..
obvious- choice #2
When will it end???....
Who wants it to end. This is the best debate I've had in weeks.
I've never known so many shades of grey (there's definitely more than 50)
Ah yes, but this is about the 2000th thread that is nearly identical. You weren't the first to come to MFP and debate
No joined in about page 5 of part 1.
In fact it may have been me that thought I had stumbled on to a cult.:happy:
I know when you joined the conversation. I was just saying that there have been many (probably 3-5 per month) prior to this thread for as long as I can remember that debate the same things and I haven't been on the forums all that long. I can only imagine how many even prior to me. Stick around, you can argue with the "right" side in the next week or so
Oh, and here is a hint....I thought along the same lines as the people who thought they had to cut out everything that tasted good before I read and learned.
That's great, you're in learning mode.
I take it that means your views are flexible (as they should be).
We're all different (you could say were like calories) we all act and react to things in different ways and therefore we all take different paths to reach the same destination.0 -
Delicious sugar water.
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
Hi! Do I smell Kool-aid on your breath? I think I do! :bigsmile:
I'm just butting in to say that many, many of us exercise, but many also don't do any extra activity and just track calories to lose/maintain
Excuses my ignorance - what's kool aid.
Your point is true but I'm not sure too many of the my FITNESS pal members fall into that category.
Also used when referring to cults because some cult people put poison in it and mass suicided for their god or something?
Cool (or should I say kool).
So I have stumbled on the Waco of the diet forums.
0 -
Koolaid is in reference to the mass suicide of the cult led by Jim Jones (the fed the children purple koolaid laced with poison).
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
Hi! Do I smell Kool-aid on your breath? I think I do! :bigsmile:
I'm just butting in to say that many, many of us exercise, but many also don't do any extra activity and just track calories to lose/maintain
Excuses my ignorance - what's kool aid.
Your point is true but I'm not sure too many of the my FITNESS pal members fall into that category.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Jones0 -
Koolaid is in reference to the mass suicide of the cult led by Jim Jones (the fed the children purple koolaid laced with poison).
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
Hi! Do I smell Kool-aid on your breath? I think I do! :bigsmile:
I'm just butting in to say that many, many of us exercise, but many also don't do any extra activity and just track calories to lose/maintain
Excuses my ignorance - what's kool aid.
Your point is true but I'm not sure too many of the my FITNESS pal members fall into that category.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Jones
I'm from the UK we miss out on all this stuff.0 -
simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.0 -
the difference between 1500 cals of junk is- skinny fat or fat
1500 cals - of lean meats and good carbs and veggies -clean eating- sleek body, not bloated , weight loss perhaps? better skin and appearance..
obvious- choice #2
When will it end???....
Who wants it to end. This is the best debate I've had in weeks.
I've never known so many shades of grey (there's definitely more than 50)
Ah yes, but this is about the 2000th thread that is nearly identical. You weren't the first to come to MFP and debate
No joined in about page 5 of part 1.
In fact it may have been me that thought I had stumbled on to a cult.:happy:
I know when you joined the conversation. I was just saying that there have been many (probably 3-5 per month) prior to this thread for as long as I can remember that debate the same things and I haven't been on the forums all that long. I can only imagine how many even prior to me. Stick around, you can argue with the "right" side in the next week or so
Oh, and here is a hint....I thought along the same lines as the people who thought they had to cut out everything that tasted good before I read and learned.
That's great, you're in learning mode.
Always, everyone should always be in learning mode. When people aren't is when issues arise.0 -
But a "calorie is a calorie" as generic as it is, actually addresses that willpower issue IMO.
It lets people know they don't have to waste willpower cutting out wide swaths of food and/or demonizing entire macros. If the goal is to reduce willpower to the lowest level (i tend to agree) then I see "Calories in/Calories Out" as an important part of that equation.
For sure.
We know that as a dieting model anything which puts high levels of restriction against willpower generally tends to fail. Our stores of willpower are finite and if it constantly has to fight the tension created by deprivation it will buckle most times. People then feel they have failed and go on to hoover up everything palatable food item in a ten mile radius. That is why the idea of CICO really helps as it reduces feelings of deprivation as you understand that you can incorporate pretty much anything and still succeed.
The problem comes when you have foods which people have tremendously difficult regulating their intake of properly. Knowing intellectually that CICO will work ("twinkie diet yo!") doesn't give you the skills, particularly psychological, to do so, especially when eating them has become autonomous. Moderation may not even be the best solution in the short term. Giving some people alternative strategies to deal with their "kryptonite"may be necessary.
I think the detailed discussions of physiology are good but not when it crowds out discussions about dieting psychology. Addressing both are important.
Great post.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.0 -
the difference between 1500 cals of junk is- skinny fat or fat
1500 cals - of lean meats and good carbs and veggies -clean eating- sleek body, not bloated , weight loss perhaps? better skin and appearance..
obvious- choice #2
When will it end???....
Who wants it to end. This is the best debate I've had in weeks.
I've never known so many shades of grey (there's definitely more than 50)
Ah yes, but this is about the 2000th thread that is nearly identical. You weren't the first to come to MFP and debate
No joined in about page 5 of part 1.
In fact it may have been me that thought I had stumbled on to a cult.:happy:
I know when you joined the conversation. I was just saying that there have been many (probably 3-5 per month) prior to this thread for as long as I can remember that debate the same things and I haven't been on the forums all that long. I can only imagine how many even prior to me. Stick around, you can argue with the "right" side in the next week or so
Oh, and here is a hint....I thought along the same lines as the people who thought they had to cut out everything that tasted good before I read and learned.
That's great, you're in learning mode.
Always, everyone should always be in learning mode. When people aren't is when issues arise.
Agreed, when presented with evidence that contradicts my current beliefs I'm not adverse to a u-turn or two.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.0 -
the difference between 1500 cals of junk is- skinny fat or fat
1500 cals - of lean meats and good carbs and veggies -clean eating- sleek body, not bloated , weight loss perhaps? better skin and appearance..
obvious- choice #2
When will it end???....
Who wants it to end. This is the best debate I've had in weeks.
I've never known so many shades of grey (there's definitely more than 50)
This is much less boring than 50 shades of grey. Not to mention, most posts are better written.
Soooo true :laugh:0 -
But exercise can be benefical yes...but you can't outrun a bad diet...as I said before..
No such thing as a bad diet. Eat whatever you want. A calorie is a calorie.
You were in the cult before the roll. You seem to be coming out of it in the last couple of posts. Congratulations.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No. A calorie is a calorie. One guy in Botswana lost weight eating nothing but KFC's Double Down. How dare you tell anyone what to eat!
It sounds like a joke now, but no kidding - that's darn near exactly what I was being met with in the first part of this thread. Like I keep saying, it isn't inaccurate. It's just terrible advice. Well, the example is inaccurate. I made that up. Insert whatever Twinkie/McDonalds anecdote you care to for that bit.0 -
But exercise can be benefical yes...but you can't outrun a bad diet...as I said before..
No such thing as a bad diet. Eat whatever you want. A calorie is a calorie.
You were in the cult before the roll. You seem to be coming out of it in the last couple of posts. Congratulations.
You're right there is no bad diets (apart from eating disorders - which are technically diets)
But unlike calories - a diet is not just a diet.0 -
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
No, exercise had no importance in my weight loss, because I didn't do any while I was actively losing weight. Over 50lbs lost, without exercise here I had a very specific goal in mind when I started losing weight-to get my glucose number back down in the normal range. To do that my doctor told me to focus on losing weight. I had never dieted before in my life. I had also never exercised before in my life. To learn how to do both at the same time was too overwhelming for me, so I focused on the one thing that really matters for weight loss-a calorie deficit (and I did this with alternate day IF).
After I lost the weight, my glucose number stabilized into the normal range. As I began transitioning into maintenance I shifted focus away from weight loss and started exercising, to give myself new goals to work towards. I started with walking and it's progressed from there. But, I lost the weight without exercise and my blood panel numbers improved greatly without exercise-losing the weight by eating at a calorie deficit did that.
Eta: I know the way I went about weight loss goes against the norm here on MFP, but I have no regrets and I would do the same thing over, if I had to. I also get pm's all the time from people who have read my posts about weight loss without exercise and they're in the same place I was at-just starting out, feeling overwhelmed and stressed out by trying to figure it all out at once. It's great to walk them through the process and show them that you can lose the weight and you can become healthier, just by following an appropriate calorie deficit for your age/height/weight. Exercise is great, but it doesn't need to be added right away. Some people need to do this whole thing at a slower pace, in order to stick with it and have long term sustainability.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No. A calorie is a calorie. One guy in Botswana lost weight eating nothing but KFC's Double Down. How dare you tell anyone what to eat!
It sounds like a joke now, but no kidding - that's darn near exactly what I was being met with in the first part of this thread. Like I keep saying, it isn't inaccurate. It's just terrible advice. Well, the example is inaccurate. I made that up. Insert whatever Twinkie/McDonalds anecdote you care to for that bit.
I'm not your dad - why would I be telling you what to eat?
What you eat is your choice. I'm just passing on some knowledge that whilst a calorie is just a calorie the vessel you get it from does different things for you.
In fact why not do an experiment - for the next 30 days get your daily calorie intake from just m&m's.
Get back in contact in 30 days and tell me how you feel ( no need to tell me if you lost weight because the answer will probably be yes).0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No one stopped taking after saying "a calorie is a calorie"?!?!?!?!
These are quotes from PAGE ONE of the last thread. There have to be 100 more if you go through the whole thing.
“<
lost almost 60lbs doing the whole 'calorie is just a calorie' thing ”
“I must have just gotten lucky with my near 70 pound weight loss. “
“91lbs in 12 months here with the whole 'calorie is just a calorie'”
“funny thing is he says people are overweight due to excess calories .....haha
but he qualifies this statement with...but that is over similified...whatever...
In for the gifs”
Those ALL say "a calorie is a calorie" and leave it at that. Nothing about Macros or Micros or cravings or anything else. And mocking anyone who might even suggest that there could be more to a successful diet than ONLY that. Just "You're wrong, do it my way!"0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No. A calorie is a calorie. One guy in Botswana lost weight eating nothing but KFC's Double Down. How dare you tell anyone what to eat!
It sounds like a joke now, but no kidding - that's darn near exactly what I was being met with in the first part of this thread. Like I keep saying, it isn't inaccurate. It's just terrible advice. Well, the example is inaccurate. I made that up. Insert whatever Twinkie/McDonalds anecdote you care to for that bit.
I'm not your dad - why would I be telling you what to eat?
What you eat is your choice. I'm just passing on some knowledge that whilst a calorie is just a calorie the vessel you get it from does different things for you.
In fact why not do an experiment - for the next 30 days get your daily calorie intake from just m&m's.
Get back in contact in 30 days and tell me how you feel ( no need to tell me if you lost weight because the answer will probably be yes).
Sorry. You missed my sarcasm. I completely agree.
This one is clear. Not a cultist. Carry on. Nothing to see here. These aren't the droids you're looking for.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No one stopped taking after saying "a calorie is a calorie"?!?!?!?!
These are quotes from PAGE ONE of the last thread. There have to be 100 more if you go through the whole thing.
“<
lost almost 60lbs doing the whole 'calorie is just a calorie' thing ”
“I must have just gotten lucky with my near 70 pound weight loss. “
“91lbs in 12 months here with the whole 'calorie is just a calorie'”
“funny thing is he says people are overweight due to excess calories .....haha
but he qualifies this statement with...but that is over similified...whatever...
In for the gifs”
Those ALL say "a calorie is a calorie" and leave it at that. Nothing about Macros or Micros or cravings or anything else. Just "You're wrong, do it my way!"
Yea, but the OP wasn't asking for advice. Had it been an OP with someone genuinely asking advice, people would explain more. The debate was with the article. Who should they be giving advice to if the OP wasn't asking for it? She was posting an article to try and disprove that a calorie isn't just a calorie. The article failed to most.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No one stopped taking after saying "a calorie is a calorie"?!?!?!?!
These are quotes from PAGE ONE of the last thread. There have to be 100 more if you go through the whole thing.
“<
lost almost 60lbs doing the whole 'calorie is just a calorie' thing ”
“I must have just gotten lucky with my near 70 pound weight loss. “
“91lbs in 12 months here with the whole 'calorie is just a calorie'”
“funny thing is he says people are overweight due to excess calories .....haha
but he qualifies this statement with...but that is over similified...whatever...
In for the gifs”
Those ALL say "a calorie is a calorie" and leave it at that. Nothing about Macros or Micros or cravings or anything else. Just "You're wrong, do it my way!"
Yea, but the OP wasn't asking for advice. Had it been an OP with someone genuinely asking advice, people would explain more. The debate was with the article. Who should they be giving advice to if the OP wasn't asking for it? She was posting an article to try and disprove that a calorie isn't just a calorie. The article failed to most.
"Yea, but..."
Exactly.
I was responding to the post that said "I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".
Yes. They did. Over and over again.0 -
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
No, exercise had no importance in my weight loss, because I didn't do any while I was actively losing weight. Over 50lbs lost, without exercise here I had a very specific goal in mind when I lost weight-to get my glucose number back down in the normal range. To do that my doctor told me to focus on losing weight. I had never dieted before in my life. I had also never exercised before in my life. To learn how to do both at the same time was too overwhelming for me, so I focused on the one thing that really matters for weight loss-a calorie deficit (and I did this with alternate day IF).
After I lost the weight, my glucose number stabilized into the normal range. As I began transitioning into maintenance I shifted focus away from weight loss and started exercising, to give me new goals to work towards. I started with walking and it's progressed from there. But, I lost the weight without exercise and my blood panel numbers improved greatly without exercise-losing the weight by eating at a calorie deficit did that.
For members of MFP you are probably the exception and not the rule.
Based on the fact that MFP is a diet and exercise site
Well done - more power to your elbow.
You must agree though that exercise is a more effective ( quicker and overall healthier way of weight lose)
Exercise doesn't necessarily mean going to the gym, it could be just walking a bit more in a day.0 -
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
No, exercise had no importance in my weight loss, because I didn't do any while I was actively losing weight. Over 50lbs lost, without exercise here I had a very specific goal in mind when I lost weight-to get my glucose number back down in the normal range. To do that my doctor told me to focus on losing weight. I had never dieted before in my life. I had also never exercised before in my life. To learn how to do both at the same time was too overwhelming for me, so I focused on the one thing that really matters for weight loss-a calorie deficit (and I did this with alternate day IF).
After I lost the weight, my glucose number stabilized into the normal range. As I began transitioning into maintenance I shifted focus away from weight loss and started exercising, to give me new goals to work towards. I started with walking and it's progressed from there. But, I lost the weight without exercise and my blood panel numbers improved greatly without exercise-losing the weight by eating at a calorie deficit did that.
For members of MFP you are probably the exception and not the rule.
Based on the fact that MFP is a diet and exercise site
Well done - more power to your elbow.
You must agree though that exercise is a more effective ( quicker and overall healthier way of weight lose)
Exercise doesn't necessarily mean going to the gym, it could be just walking a bit more in a day.
Definitely agree that you should exercise for health, but no, I do not think it is quicker with exercise. I guess it could be if you don't follow your calories and create huge deficits, but if you use the site as it is designed, you create the same deficit regardless of exercise or not.0 -
I'm fairly sure no one in here stopped talking after saying "a calorie is a calorie".simply saying "a calorie is a calorie" with no other explanation is easily misinterpreted as "I don't have to change my diet at all". It's not wrong. I'll say that again. It's not wrong. (lol Like it matters how many times I say it. Some will just not read it) It's just incomplete information that could lead people to making poor choices. You can incorporate any food you like into a diet that will result in you losing weight. (Doesn't matter how many times I say that either, to the cultists).
So you agree a calorie is a calorie and you can incorporate any food into your weight loss plan? Not being a **** - just clarifying.
...because that is exactly what most of these "cultists" believe. In fact these "cultists" also agree that a proper diet includes tracking macros and micros. I only know this because of being on the forums for a bit though, so maybe for someone new they wouldn't know that. Fair enough.
A calorie is a calorie. I've made a point of saying so in every post on the topic. The cultists are the ones who go ape **** if you suggest that food cravings are real and it's helpful to avoid those foods when trying to maintain a calorie deficit. That's the only thing that bugs me. If you tell someone that it's a good idea to eat things that keep you feeling satisfied for a while to help keep you away from the vending machine, without fail someone says "Why? A calorie is a calorie." Yeaaaah. But candy doesn't satisfy you. And an hour later you'll be back because you're hungry again. And if you're eating fewer calories, it's good to keep an eye on getting some nutrition- as you said. Hitting your goals. JUST saying "a calorie is a calorie" without including any of the rest of that is just poor advice and could easily be the kind of advice that sets someone up to fail. Just as telling them they can never eat the foods they love.
Hey, notice how all my posts on the subject keep saying the same things? Yeah. Kinda like that.
A calorie is a calorie, it's just the vessel that carries them aren't.
No. A calorie is a calorie. One guy in Botswana lost weight eating nothing but KFC's Double Down. How dare you tell anyone what to eat!
It sounds like a joke now, but no kidding - that's darn near exactly what I was being met with in the first part of this thread. Like I keep saying, it isn't inaccurate. It's just terrible advice. Well, the example is inaccurate. I made that up. Insert whatever Twinkie/McDonalds anecdote you care to for that bit.
I'm not your dad - why would I be telling you what to eat?
What you eat is your choice. I'm just passing on some knowledge that whilst a calorie is just a calorie the vessel you get it from does different things for you.
In fact why not do an experiment - for the next 30 days get your daily calorie intake from just m&m's.
Get back in contact in 30 days and tell me how you feel ( no need to tell me if you lost weight because the answer will probably be yes).
Sorry. You missed my sarcasm. I completely agree.
This one is clear. Not a cultist. Carry on. Nothing to see here. These aren't the droids you're looking for.
Sorry, I've been on this site too long.
Not many opinions have had the fun aspect of sarcasm.0 -
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
No, exercise had no importance in my weight loss, because I didn't do any while I was actively losing weight. Over 50lbs lost, without exercise here I had a very specific goal in mind when I lost weight-to get my glucose number back down in the normal range. To do that my doctor told me to focus on losing weight. I had never dieted before in my life. I had also never exercised before in my life. To learn how to do both at the same time was too overwhelming for me, so I focused on the one thing that really matters for weight loss-a calorie deficit (and I did this with alternate day IF).
After I lost the weight, my glucose number stabilized into the normal range. As I began transitioning into maintenance I shifted focus away from weight loss and started exercising, to give me new goals to work towards. I started with walking and it's progressed from there. But, I lost the weight without exercise and my blood panel numbers improved greatly without exercise-losing the weight by eating at a calorie deficit did that.
For members of MFP you are probably the exception and not the rule.
Based on the fact that MFP is a diet and exercise site
Well done - more power to your elbow.
You must agree though that exercise is a more effective ( quicker and overall healthier way of weight lose)
Exercise doesn't necessarily mean going to the gym, it could be just walking a bit more in a day.
Definitely agree that you should exercise for health, but no, I do not think it is quicker with exercise. I guess it could be if you don't follow your calories and create huge deficits, but if you use the site as it is designed, you create the same deficit regardless of exercise or not.
???? You don't think exercise speeds up weight lose - okay?????00 -
Is this really a thread of people saying the same thing but trying to argue about how the other side is wrong?
No. It isn't. It's a thread about how misleading it is to offer one trite line with no context to people who may be looking for advice on how to lose weight and then going Buddy Rich if someone suggests a salad every third Tuesday couldn't hurt.0 -
Is this really a thread of people saying the same thing but trying to argue about how the other side is wrong?
No. It isn't. It's a thread about how misleading it is to offer one trite line with no context to people who may be looking for advice on how to lose weight and then going Buddy Rich if someone suggests a salad every third Tuesday couldn't hurt.
?0 -
Is this really a thread of people saying the same thing but trying to argue about how the other side is wrong?
No. It isn't. It's a thread about how misleading it is to offer one trite line with no context to people who may be looking for advice on how to lose weight and then going Buddy Rich if someone suggests a salad every third Tuesday couldn't hurt.
?
Buddy Rich was known, especially in his later years, for having a bit of a temper and going pretty crazy on his band. I'd link to a video, but his language is more than slightly inappropriate.0 -
People keep arguing (myself included) because at the heart of the matter we all agree!
Calorie deficit plus exercise equals weight lose.
I suppose what we're not agreeing on is where that weight lose is coming from.
Sorry couldn't help myself...even my husband said..."nope you can't let things go"
But...a calorie deficet equals weight loss...exercise is for fitness and health...cause you can't outrun a bad diet...
PS I admit I am dogmatic...don't hate me I was suppose to be a lawyer...
Okay but do you agree exercise (to any degree) is important in your weight loss.
No, exercise had no importance in my weight loss, because I didn't do any while I was actively losing weight. Over 50lbs lost, without exercise here I had a very specific goal in mind when I lost weight-to get my glucose number back down in the normal range. To do that my doctor told me to focus on losing weight. I had never dieted before in my life. I had also never exercised before in my life. To learn how to do both at the same time was too overwhelming for me, so I focused on the one thing that really matters for weight loss-a calorie deficit (and I did this with alternate day IF).
After I lost the weight, my glucose number stabilized into the normal range. As I began transitioning into maintenance I shifted focus away from weight loss and started exercising, to give me new goals to work towards. I started with walking and it's progressed from there. But, I lost the weight without exercise and my blood panel numbers improved greatly without exercise-losing the weight by eating at a calorie deficit did that.
For members of MFP you are probably the exception and not the rule.
Based on the fact that MFP is a diet and exercise site
Well done - more power to your elbow.
You must agree though that exercise is a more effective ( quicker and overall healthier way of weight lose)
Exercise doesn't necessarily mean going to the gym, it could be just walking a bit more in a day.
I didn't join MFP until after I had already transitioned into maintenance-during weight loss I hung out on a different site that was plan specific to what I was doing and exercise wasn't a focus. Most of the people over there have had similar success, without the exercise. As for being more effective/healthier-I can only speak from my own experience:
SW 175lbs-started losing weight October 17, 2012 (remember the date vividly because I got my fasting glucose number test results that morning)
Called original goal April 2013, at 135lbs, for a loss of 40lbs in about 6 months, which included the Thanksgiving/Christmas holidays. That's a decently paced time frame and is comparable to those who diet and exercise (from what I've read in various MFP posts). At that time I had my blood work done again, including another fasting glucose test. All of my numbers had improved-I was no longer considered high risk for diabetes, very low risk for heart disease, my cholesterol numbers were great, blood pressure was spot on etc. Considering all of this happened without exercise, how can I say exercising would have been a healthier way to do it? The numbers are what they are, and were achieved by a calorie deficit, not exercise.
After I hit my original goal I transitioned into semi-maintenance. I started walking at this point. I continued to eat at a calorie deficit, but not as big of one as before, and I continued to lose weight at a slower pace over the summer, and called final goal last fall. Late in the summer I added in some jogging, (to do a 5K and then quit running after that, just didn't enjoy it that much), and then this fall I started doing an at home strength training program (November). One of the biggest factors in long term weight loss success, based on polls/studies that have been done of the 5% that actually maintain long term, is to always have new goals to work towards. That's why I started exercising-to give me something new to work towards. I was already healthy before it, but the exercise keeps me focused on maintenance
CW: 117-120lbs is my maintenance range/blood work panel is pretty much perfect/bf% around 17% (was at this before I started the strength training).
Again, I have no regrets for how I did things, and I'd do it again
eta: my other post should have said 40lbs without exercise, as I did start walking as I began transitioning into maintenance. I was doing another version of IF at that point (5:2) and I wasn't counting calories in a conventional way/adding exercise calories. So I don't know how much/if any impact the walking had on the last pounds I lost?0 -
Is this really a thread of people saying the same thing but trying to argue about how the other side is wrong?
No, it's a thread that originally irritated some folks that follow the MFP plan (apparently a cult) when the OP posted an article that wanted to disprove what science says works. Then there was a bunch of banter between folks. Some scientific articles were posted. IIFYM prevailed, and left some people butt hurt that everyone doesn't explain the way it works, even though that wasn't the point from the OP to begin with. Nevermind that fact that you can do a search for related posts where people do ask for advice, and plenty of people give it. Now people just want to have the last word.0
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