America is doomed
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Because you have to have a certain amount of calories on a regular basis to function. If you have enough money for a Big Mac Value Meal or enough for a healthy meal that doesn't have enough calories to get through your day, you're going to go with the Big Mac Value Meal.
So does that mean that every establishment that sells a burger has to look at the nutritional info and charge by calorie? Utter nonsense. How about instead of buying a Big Mac every day, you spend £/$25 on a weeks shopping and make it last, get your calorie intake without being gluttonous?Another problem is what happens when the foods a person eat cause excess hunger and cravings and there is a little money left over to feed those cravings. I have five dollars. I buy a Big Mac. I have a dollar left. I buy a box of snack cakes and eat those, too. I'm over my calories. If I buy and eat a salad, I'm starving.
That's your problem. This is called breaking habits. Plus you are being simplistic to suit your argument. You can get a lot more than you suggest for the price of a Big Mac and not everybody is starving because they havent had something the size of a Big Mac. You are overeating, which is why people get overweight.
What an earth has a multi vitamin got to do with it? If you are obese, then you are eating too much. McDonalds or not. End of. Too much.Actually, that is the biggest short-term problem. The biggest long-term problem is the health effects of eating cheap food every day for lack of money to buy healthier food. Obesity is only part of that. And while a multivitamin can help, it isn't enough. Just try getting your daily recommended potassium on $5 a day and enough calories with that as well.
How about eating a smaller McDonalds meal? No. Didnt think that would have crossed your mind....
That is where satiety comes in. Studies show different foods have different effects on satiety. Apparently you aren't familiar with it. And in fact I was looking yesterday for studies on proper nutrition's effects on satiety (or the reverse) and didn't find anything. Also, if your rudeness toward me is an attempt to bait me into a flame war, save your energy.
And I'm waiting for anyone to be so kind as to show me a way to spend $5 a day on food, get all my potassium needs met (minus the standard %3 found in a multivitamin) and still get 1200 calories out of it to meet my MFP recommended minimum.0 -
Maybe because the yeast eats all the sugar so they don't have to include it in the ingredients?
Meanwhile, if you're making bread at home, you probably don't want to omit the sugar from the recipe.
Yeast doesn't work that way. Yeast eats the carbs naturally present in the flour. It doesn't need added sugar. Not at all.
Oh, yeast actually *does* work that way...it just doesn't *have* to. Yeast will gladly eat sugar...that part, I know is true...but had forgotten that yeast will also eat that essentially-the-same-thing-as-sugar-wheat-flour too. The yeast treats them similarly...(I wonder why?).
I also wonder if there are any other living organisms that do the same...
You should read the above posts more carefully. The claim was that the added sugar is what the yeast uses to raise the bread. Which is entirely incorrect, as yeast requires NO added sugar at all, as it is designed to process natural carbohydrate, which is chemically far more complex than sucrose. People add sugar to yeast because they don't know any better, not because the yeast actually needs it.
You can literally add dry yeast to flour and water, and stick in the fridge for days on end, and it will cheerfully bubble away...if much more slowly. I've been doing that very thing for years. Its a common way to vastly improve the quality of bread.
I think it's *you* that needs to read *my* post more carefully...
...but it's okay if you ultimately don't get it. Others will (and already have).
ETA: Oh, and yeast was "designed to process natural carbohydrate"??? "...which is chemically far more complex than sucrose"??? Please explain the chemical structure of this "natural carbohydrate" that yeast eats and how it differs from table sugar (which just so happens also to be more complex than sucrose).0 -
Because you have to have a certain amount of calories on a regular basis to function. If you have enough money for a Big Mac Value Meal or enough for a healthy meal that doesn't have enough calories to get through your day, you're going to go with the Big Mac Value Meal.
So does that mean that every establishment that sells a burger has to look at the nutritional info and charge by calorie? Utter nonsense. How about instead of buying a Big Mac every day, you spend £/$25 on a weeks shopping and make it last, get your calorie intake without being gluttonous?Another problem is what happens when the foods a person eat cause excess hunger and cravings and there is a little money left over to feed those cravings. I have five dollars. I buy a Big Mac. I have a dollar left. I buy a box of snack cakes and eat those, too. I'm over my calories. If I buy and eat a salad, I'm starving.
That's your problem. This is called breaking habits. Plus you are being simplistic to suit your argument. You can get a lot more than you suggest for the price of a Big Mac and not everybody is starving because they havent had something the size of a Big Mac. You are overeating, which is why people get overweight.
What an earth has a multi vitamin got to do with it? If you are obese, then you are eating too much. McDonalds or not. End of. Too much.Actually, that is the biggest short-term problem. The biggest long-term problem is the health effects of eating cheap food every day for lack of money to buy healthier food. Obesity is only part of that. And while a multivitamin can help, it isn't enough. Just try getting your daily recommended potassium on $5 a day and enough calories with that as well.
How about eating a smaller McDonalds meal? No. Didnt think that would have crossed your mind....
That is where satiety comes in. Studies show different foods have different effects on satiety. Apparently you aren't familiar with it. And in fact I was looking yesterday for studies on proper nutrition's effects on satiety (or the reverse) and didn't find anything. Also, if your rudeness toward me is an attempt to bait me into a flame war, save your energy.
And I'm waiting for anyone to be so kind as to show me a way to spend $5 a day on food, get all my potassium needs met (minus the standard %3 found in a multivitamin) and still get 1200 calories out of it to meet my MFP recommended minimum.
Buy and cook dried beans. You can buy a lb of dried beans for ~$1. Plenty of potassium. Plenty of calories if you feel like meeting them all with the beans (I wouldn't). There's money left over if you want to buy something else to fill in the calories after your potassium needs are met, or if you want to buy things to flavor/enhance the beans.
There's a reason poor people have often turned to beans for their meals. They're good nutrition, and you get lots of them for the price. They can be flavored umpteen different ways, and are great to stretch other, more expensive foods.0 -
All the new cheeseburgers that are huge and the bigger pizzas make it hard on Americans....we are pretty much doomed if no one snaps out of it!
I know, right? All this value for the dollar that we have available here...it's terrible...awful, I say. Yes, indeed, we are doomed...unless we can figure out a way to get *less* food for the same amount of money. That is obviously the answer to this problem. It's the only way. Think about the children.
Well, that or a shred of self control and awareness when ordering the food.
But you're probably right, we'll probably go your route by governmental edict...for the good of the people and all that.
Meanwhile, I've been using the latter approach with wonderful success throughout my life...and I taught my kids the same.
TL;DR - Not everyone needs protection from themselves in the form of bureaucratic intervention.0 -
All the new cheeseburgers that are huge and the bigger pizzas make it hard on Americans....we are pretty much doomed if no one snaps out of it!
They haven't gotten bigger over the course of MY lifetime, yet obesity has increased over those years, especially in children.
What has changed in my lifetime, though, is how sedentary we are. More time in front of computers and smart phones, lack of recess and gym class in schools, more gaming, people being scared to death to let their children just go outside and play ...
It isn't about the available food.0 -
Because you have to have a certain amount of calories on a regular basis to function. If you have enough money for a Big Mac Value Meal or enough for a healthy meal that doesn't have enough calories to get through your day, you're going to go with the Big Mac Value Meal.
So does that mean that every establishment that sells a burger has to look at the nutritional info and charge by calorie? Utter nonsense. How about instead of buying a Big Mac every day, you spend £/$25 on a weeks shopping and make it last, get your calorie intake without being gluttonous?Another problem is what happens when the foods a person eat cause excess hunger and cravings and there is a little money left over to feed those cravings. I have five dollars. I buy a Big Mac. I have a dollar left. I buy a box of snack cakes and eat those, too. I'm over my calories. If I buy and eat a salad, I'm starving.
That's your problem. This is called breaking habits. Plus you are being simplistic to suit your argument. You can get a lot more than you suggest for the price of a Big Mac and not everybody is starving because they havent had something the size of a Big Mac. You are overeating, which is why people get overweight.
What an earth has a multi vitamin got to do with it? If you are obese, then you are eating too much. McDonalds or not. End of. Too much.Actually, that is the biggest short-term problem. The biggest long-term problem is the health effects of eating cheap food every day for lack of money to buy healthier food. Obesity is only part of that. And while a multivitamin can help, it isn't enough. Just try getting your daily recommended potassium on $5 a day and enough calories with that as well.
How about eating a smaller McDonalds meal? No. Didnt think that would have crossed your mind....
That is where satiety comes in. Studies show different foods have different effects on satiety. Apparently you aren't familiar with it. And in fact I was looking yesterday for studies on proper nutrition's effects on satiety (or the reverse) and didn't find anything. Also, if your rudeness toward me is an attempt to bait me into a flame war, save your energy.
And I'm waiting for anyone to be so kind as to show me a way to spend $5 a day on food, get all my potassium needs met (minus the standard %3 found in a multivitamin) and still get 1200 calories out of it to meet my MFP recommended minimum.
Buy and cook dried beans. You can buy a lb of dried beans for ~$1. Plenty of potassium. Plenty of calories if you feel like meeting them all with the beans (I wouldn't). There's money left over if you want to buy something else to fill in the calories after your potassium needs are met, or if you want to buy things to flavor/enhance the beans.
There's a reason poor people have often turned to beans for their meals. They're good nutrition, and you get lots of them for the price. They can be flavored umpteen different ways, and are great to stretch other, more expensive foods.
Not enough potassium in the beans, I don't think. Unless I ate over 1200 calories of them.
I did forget when I typed the question that potatoes are a really good source of potassium and cheaper than tomatoes around here, though.
But the other day I read non-organic potatoes have a lot of other things in them I don't want to eat. Pesticides, fungicides. Ick. :sad:
Not to move the goalposts, though, I remembered after posting that one can live on potatoes and milk alone, provided one has a multivitamin source of Molybdenum. If I can find organic potatoes cheap enough, I might very well try it. I'll just be bored to tears with it. And I have to see if one can do so without going over calories. I don't need many calories in a day because I'm not very active, so if I had to drink a lot of milk and eat a lot of potatoes it would be pointless.0 -
What gives anyone the right to know how the person who is eating the pizza, burger or what ever is feeling or thinking and be so judgemental. Your not with them by their sides second by second. You have no better idea how their body reacts to food than how to fly to the moon.
Many healthy foods contain toxins which make the unfortunate ill and overweight and more ill and less able to help themselves. Think before you criticise. I had problems before I discovered these toxins. The worst bit is the, better you eat the worse you feel, so why then should one bother. Books are judged by covers and everyone knows you don't give a damn because of the way you look. When you do try to take control you are not helped by those who should know all about the potential for toxicity in foods. Doctors and dietitians usually only see what they want to, and assume what is frequently put into the pained, poisoned bodies which need their help work efficiently.
This toxicity causes medical symptoms which get treated but neglect the underlying problem.
:huh:0 -
TL;DR - Not everyone needs protection from themselves in the form of bureaucratic intervention.
What? Make our own lifestyle choices, even if they are poor ones from the perspective of others in society? Madness!0 -
The PIZZUPS gif on the first page is awesome.0
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That sure would motivate me!The PIZZUPS gif on the first page is awesome.0 -
Because you have to have a certain amount of calories on a regular basis to function. If you have enough money for a Big Mac Value Meal or enough for a healthy meal that doesn't have enough calories to get through your day, you're going to go with the Big Mac Value Meal.
So does that mean that every establishment that sells a burger has to look at the nutritional info and charge by calorie? Utter nonsense. How about instead of buying a Big Mac every day, you spend £/$25 on a weeks shopping and make it last, get your calorie intake without being gluttonous?Another problem is what happens when the foods a person eat cause excess hunger and cravings and there is a little money left over to feed those cravings. I have five dollars. I buy a Big Mac. I have a dollar left. I buy a box of snack cakes and eat those, too. I'm over my calories. If I buy and eat a salad, I'm starving.
That's your problem. This is called breaking habits. Plus you are being simplistic to suit your argument. You can get a lot more than you suggest for the price of a Big Mac and not everybody is starving because they havent had something the size of a Big Mac. You are overeating, which is why people get overweight.
What an earth has a multi vitamin got to do with it? If you are obese, then you are eating too much. McDonalds or not. End of. Too much.Actually, that is the biggest short-term problem. The biggest long-term problem is the health effects of eating cheap food every day for lack of money to buy healthier food. Obesity is only part of that. And while a multivitamin can help, it isn't enough. Just try getting your daily recommended potassium on $5 a day and enough calories with that as well.
How about eating a smaller McDonalds meal? No. Didnt think that would have crossed your mind....
That is where satiety comes in. Studies show different foods have different effects on satiety. Apparently you aren't familiar with it. And in fact I was looking yesterday for studies on proper nutrition's effects on satiety (or the reverse) and didn't find anything. Also, if your rudeness toward me is an attempt to bait me into a flame war, save your energy.
And I'm waiting for anyone to be so kind as to show me a way to spend $5 a day on food, get all my potassium needs met (minus the standard %3 found in a multivitamin) and still get 1200 calories out of it to meet my MFP recommended minimum.
Buy and cook dried beans. You can buy a lb of dried beans for ~$1. Plenty of potassium. Plenty of calories if you feel like meeting them all with the beans (I wouldn't). There's money left over if you want to buy something else to fill in the calories after your potassium needs are met, or if you want to buy things to flavor/enhance the beans.
There's a reason poor people have often turned to beans for their meals. They're good nutrition, and you get lots of them for the price. They can be flavored umpteen different ways, and are great to stretch other, more expensive foods.
Not enough potassium in the beans, I don't think. Unless I ate over 1200 calories of them.
I did forget when I typed the question that potatoes are a really good source of potassium and cheaper than tomatoes around here, though.
But the other day I read non-organic potatoes have a lot of other things in them I don't want to eat. Pesticides, fungicides. Ick. :sad:
Not to move the goalposts, though, I remembered after posting that one can live on potatoes and milk alone, provided one has a multivitamin source of Molybdenum. If I can find organic potatoes cheap enough, I might very well try it. I'll just be bored to tears with it. And I have to see if one can do so without going over calories. I don't need many calories in a day because I'm not very active, so if I had to drink a lot of milk and eat a lot of potatoes it would be pointless.
Why not address this problem first instead of trying to micromanage your diet?
(Also, this advice applies to the more general issue at hand as I believe it is a likely more significant cause of the problems being discussed. For example, being fairly active myself with a TDEE of ~2700, I have little trouble meeting my micronutrient requirements. (That said, I do not worry about meeting each of them in any one 24 hour period, but in meeting them over time...because our bodies do not reset at midnight and we are not limited to the nutrients consumed in any one day.))0 -
All this thread has done is make me hungry. All this talk about delicious giant cheeseburgers and massive amounts of pizza. MMMMmmmmm I could really go for a bucket of fried chicken too.
Thanks a lot OP. Its all your fault I am now doomed to fail in meeting my goals now.
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Because you have to have a certain amount of calories on a regular basis to function. If you have enough money for a Big Mac Value Meal or enough for a healthy meal that doesn't have enough calories to get through your day, you're going to go with the Big Mac Value Meal.
So does that mean that every establishment that sells a burger has to look at the nutritional info and charge by calorie? Utter nonsense. How about instead of buying a Big Mac every day, you spend £/$25 on a weeks shopping and make it last, get your calorie intake without being gluttonous?Another problem is what happens when the foods a person eat cause excess hunger and cravings and there is a little money left over to feed those cravings. I have five dollars. I buy a Big Mac. I have a dollar left. I buy a box of snack cakes and eat those, too. I'm over my calories. If I buy and eat a salad, I'm starving.
That's your problem. This is called breaking habits. Plus you are being simplistic to suit your argument. You can get a lot more than you suggest for the price of a Big Mac and not everybody is starving because they havent had something the size of a Big Mac. You are overeating, which is why people get overweight.
What an earth has a multi vitamin got to do with it? If you are obese, then you are eating too much. McDonalds or not. End of. Too much.Actually, that is the biggest short-term problem. The biggest long-term problem is the health effects of eating cheap food every day for lack of money to buy healthier food. Obesity is only part of that. And while a multivitamin can help, it isn't enough. Just try getting your daily recommended potassium on $5 a day and enough calories with that as well.
How about eating a smaller McDonalds meal? No. Didnt think that would have crossed your mind....
That is where satiety comes in. Studies show different foods have different effects on satiety. Apparently you aren't familiar with it. And in fact I was looking yesterday for studies on proper nutrition's effects on satiety (or the reverse) and didn't find anything. Also, if your rudeness toward me is an attempt to bait me into a flame war, save your energy.
And I'm waiting for anyone to be so kind as to show me a way to spend $5 a day on food, get all my potassium needs met (minus the standard %3 found in a multivitamin) and still get 1200 calories out of it to meet my MFP recommended minimum.
Buy and cook dried beans. You can buy a lb of dried beans for ~$1. Plenty of potassium. Plenty of calories if you feel like meeting them all with the beans (I wouldn't). There's money left over if you want to buy something else to fill in the calories after your potassium needs are met, or if you want to buy things to flavor/enhance the beans.
There's a reason poor people have often turned to beans for their meals. They're good nutrition, and you get lots of them for the price. They can be flavored umpteen different ways, and are great to stretch other, more expensive foods.
Not enough potassium in the beans, I don't think. Unless I ate over 1200 calories of them.
I did forget when I typed the question that potatoes are a really good source of potassium and cheaper than tomatoes around here, though.
But the other day I read non-organic potatoes have a lot of other things in them I don't want to eat. Pesticides, fungicides. Ick. :sad:
Not to move the goalposts, though, I remembered after posting that one can live on potatoes and milk alone, provided one has a multivitamin source of Molybdenum. If I can find organic potatoes cheap enough, I might very well try it. I'll just be bored to tears with it. And I have to see if one can do so without going over calories. I don't need many calories in a day because I'm not very active, so if I had to drink a lot of milk and eat a lot of potatoes it would be pointless.
Why not address this problem first instead of trying to micromanage your diet?
(Also, this advice applies to the more general issue at hand as I believe it is a likely more significant cause of the problems being discussed. For example, being fairly active myself with a TDEE of ~2700, I have little trouble meeting my micronutrient requirements. (That said, I do not worry about meeting each of them in any one 24 hour period, but in meeting them over time...because our bodies do not reset at midnight and we are not limited to the nutrients consumed in any one day.))
I suspect some of my craving and satiety issues might be a sign of vitamin and mineral deficiencies. I looked for some studies on it, found none, just the general vague take your vitamins and minerals it might help with hunger articles on sites like Livestrong. Also, I'm a healthy weight now and have been for over a year, but I don't feel so healthy. So I figured before throwing in the towel and saying none of this is worth the effort I'd try really hard to meet all my nutritional needs first and see how I feel then.
Edit: Not worried about meeting them each and every day, especially since I do alternate day fasting at the moment, but a weekly or at least monthly proper average seems like a good goal.0 -
meh. natural selection.
It isn't natural selection when many poor people are obese because they can't afford healthy food. It's extermination. And if allowed to continue, America should be doomed.
This is a myth: -
a) healthy food is not more expensive
b) if people are so poor then surely they can only afford small amounts of unhealthy food anyway. You wouldnt put on weight....
Yeah, right. Healthy food isn't more expensive. Sure. And that is why I can't afford meat anymore and have more money when I overeat because the foods I buy when I overeat are so much cheaper.
This is of course rubbish and ignorant of the truth. And if you, as you admit, are overeating, then you are spending more than you should on food. So how is this cheaper?
Low carb with a heaping helping of vegetables on the side is healthier than mac and cheese, peanut butter and jelly, and cookies. And on low carb I don't have as much of an issue with cravings and overeating. But I can't afford meat anymore, so I have to buy foods I will overeat on.
And I'm relatively lucky, or I couldn't even contemplate trying to meet all my nutritional needs. I bought a tomato the other day in the grocery store. It cost four dollars. Admittedly, it was a big tomato, but some people have only four or five dollars a day to use for food, and they can't just eat a tomato.
FOUR dollars??? That €2.88 :noway: A regular tomato here is ~ €0.20
Out of curiosity, how much is a Big Mac?
Big Mac Index. Global prices for a Big Mac in January 2014, by country (in U.S. dollars)*
High End = Norway @ $7.80
Low End = India @ $1.54
USA = $4.62
http://www.statista.com/statistics/274326/big-mac-index-global-prices-for-a-big-mac/0 -
What sort of place were you shopping at to pay $4 for one tomato.
If I go to some shops, I can pay a hell of a lot for fresh fruit and veg in the UK.
As it is, I paid £1 for 4 large 'tomatoes on the vine' earlier - $1.50. I'd consider that expensive - I can get a good number of smaller tomatoes for less than that if I want..0 -
I'm sure there are other things in other countries that are just as bad. America is not doomed. Don't be foolish. Portion sizes is what is important. I wouldn't want to be anywhere BUT America.0
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What sort of place were you shopping at to pay $4 for one tomato.
If I go to some shops, I can pay a hell of a lot for fresh fruit and veg in the UK.
As it is, I paid £1 for 4 large 'tomatoes on the vine' earlier - $1.50. I'd consider that expensive - I can get a good number of smaller tomatoes for less than that if I want..
Publix. I was wrong, I paid 3.71 before tax. It was priced 3.99 a pound. Wasn't even organic, at least as far as I know. Next time I will shop around! I'm new to buying tomatoes, I don't like them much, too juicy, but I wanted the potassium and I bought a dehydrator because sun dried ones are delicious. My dehydrator should arrive tomorrow but if I don't find tomatoes cheaper than that I won't get much use out of it!0 -
I shop at Publix all the time. I have never seen prices like that there.What sort of place were you shopping at to pay $4 for one tomato.
If I go to some shops, I can pay a hell of a lot for fresh fruit and veg in the UK.
As it is, I paid £1 for 4 large 'tomatoes on the vine' earlier - $1.50. I'd consider that expensive - I can get a good number of smaller tomatoes for less than that if I want..
Publix. I was wrong, I paid 3.71 before tax. It was priced 3.99 a pound. Wasn't even organic, at least as far as I know. Next time I will shop around! I'm new to buying tomatoes, I don't like them much, too juicy, but I wanted the potassium and I bought a dehydrator because sun dried ones are delicious. My dehydrator should arrive tomorrow but if I don't find tomatoes cheaper than that I won't get much use out of it!
To give some perspective, I regularly get a whole veggie sub made from whole wheat bread, cheese (they do double cheese for veggie subs), a slew of onions, ton of lettuce and enough tomato slices to make a tomato and a half. It costs about $6 for the entire sub.0 -
What sort of place were you shopping at to pay $4 for one tomato.
If I go to some shops, I can pay a hell of a lot for fresh fruit and veg in the UK.
As it is, I paid £1 for 4 large 'tomatoes on the vine' earlier - $1.50. I'd consider that expensive - I can get a good number of smaller tomatoes for less than that if I want..
And in some places (like where I grew up), during "tomato season", you have to keep your house locked...
...or your neighbors will leave 5-gallon buckets of tomatoes in your house when you're not home.
True story.0 -
Uhh, you don't get sun-dried tomatoes by throwing them in a dehydrator. The clue to making them is kind of in the name...What sort of place were you shopping at to pay $4 for one tomato.
If I go to some shops, I can pay a hell of a lot for fresh fruit and veg in the UK.
As it is, I paid £1 for 4 large 'tomatoes on the vine' earlier - $1.50. I'd consider that expensive - I can get a good number of smaller tomatoes for less than that if I want..
Publix. I was wrong, I paid 3.71 before tax. It was priced 3.99 a pound. Wasn't even organic, at least as far as I know. Next time I will shop around! I'm new to buying tomatoes, I don't like them much, too juicy, but I wanted the potassium and I bought a dehydrator because sun dried ones are delicious. My dehydrator should arrive tomorrow but if I don't find tomatoes cheaper than that I won't get much use out of it!
Dehydrators are pretty good wastes of money, though...0
This discussion has been closed.
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