Fast Food Workers Strikes = Win for better health
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Anyone know how much the average salary is for a police officer? srs question.
Varies greatly depending on area. But for a moderate city like I'm in the starting salary is only around 45K.
However unions ensure that they get regular raises, there is a clear path for promotion based on service, and most of all there are incredibly lucrative opportunities in regards to overtime pay.
In the city I live in, the highest paid employees in the entire city are public safety employees. Not the Mayor, not City Council...cops, firemen, and paramedics make the highest wage of any city employee.
Thank you for that, I honestly thought it would be much less.
There goes your point. LOL :laugh: :laugh:
Not entirely, If minimum wage were raised to $15/hr then the average pay for an officer in my area, $18/hr, would hardly be worth the inherent dangers of such work.
oh, LOL..0 -
Reading all the comments it's funny to see how someone can be labeled an elitist just because they feel people should work hard to earn the things they get as opposed to having government intervention to make it so that everyone is on part with each other. Saying that we should give fast food workers 15 dollars is basically devaluing other people who worked hard to earn their wage. But who care about us right? Because we don't live in poverty.
This whole thread is funny... I love watching people get their panties in a wad when the poor try to make better for themselves.
Every time I hear someone say that minimum wage makes things better for the poor, I instantly know that person either 1) knows nothing about economics and/or 2) values symbolic / feel good actions over substantive, effective actions0 -
Saying someone who works fast food doesn't work hard is ignorant. I worked there during college, started as a regular crew member, ended as an assistant manager (the joke was that I had a lot more responsibility, but maybe a dollar or two more in pay than the crew).
The job is highly stressful for little pay and zero appreciation. The general public tends to be rude and condescending to you, a place to take out their frustrations. You have to strive to be quick AND accurate, or they'll let you know it.
Heck, when I was 14 and worked at Subway, one man came in and ordered a sandwich, and I started cutting the bread how we were trained to and he started yelling at me because he wanted it cut a particular way but he never told me (I was somehow suppose to read his mind). That was years and years ago, but I will probably remember the way he treated me until the day I die.
You have to be on your feet for long hours (I had 10 hour shifts), lift heavy boxes, filter and scrub fryers and broilers, clean up after people that leave their trays and trash on the tables, take food out to customers if it will take a bit longer than usual (without the tip), scrub bathrooms and toilets, mop the entire restaurant, scrub tables, wash dishes. God forbid there is a play area like we had, then you found yourself cleaning up kid pee and puke on top of that. I also had to work with balancing cash drawers, deposits, secure the store (I worked nights), and prepare the nightly sales reports.
They are customer service, food prep, janitors, etc all wrapped up in one, accept at a much lower pay. And if you are regular crew, you can expect 15-20 hours a week. Heck, as an assistant manager, nonsalaried, my "full" time was 32 hours.
I'm not saying the job requires tons of pay. There's definitely something called a pay scale, for taking the initiative and risk of schooling and going into debt, and the opportunity costs thereof.
Just don't say that people that work fast food aren't hard workers, or unskilled. They have their own skill sets that develop and can carry over to other types of employment.
The majority of my crew were hard workers, I only had a few problem people and those I had to find creative ways to get them to actually earn their check. Heck, if I had to send someone home to watch my labor percentage, usually those would be the first I would send unless I knew one of my good workers needed time for college or personal reasons, in which I'd give them the option if they wanted.0 -
Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?0
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Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?
The whole thread is resonating with that sentiment. :noway:0 -
Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?
The whole thread is resonating with that sentiment. :noway:
Interpretations.
Go Cowboys!0 -
Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?
The whole thread is resonating with that sentiment. :noway:
Interpretations.
Go Cowboys!
:laugh:0 -
Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?
The whole thread is resonating with that sentiment. :noway:
Interpretations.
Go Cowboys!
:laugh:
Whats funny? Obviously we have different opinions, as do others in the thread.0 -
Has anyone directly said "fast food workers are lazy?" It's hard to call anyone in any industry lazy without actually being by their side to witness it. Would anyone deny that working FF sucks really hard?
The whole thread is resonating with that sentiment. :noway:
Interpretations.
Go Cowboys!
:laugh:
Whats funny? Obviously we have different opinions, as do others in the thread.
As I said earlier, the whole thread is funny to me as most things on MFP.0 -
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I think what really needs to happen is that some controls need to be put in place to manage the cost of living. I have worked fast food. We all have. It was never a livable wage. It was never meant to be a livable wage. But the cost of living gets higher and higher and wages, in general (not just fast food), have not kept up.
Honestly, demanding that something be done to lower the cost of living... that's a cause I could support and rally behind and protest for.
Yes.
See: The entire history of the labour movement Wat Tyler - Lech Walesa.
It gets pretty interesting 1848-1952.....
Yes both these I would give a thumbs up if it would let me.0 -
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There's a documentary called 'Inequality for all' made by Bill Clinton's economic advisor you could watch on Netflix that basically talks about the importance of raising the minimum wage and is probably where this idea for the strike started since it mentions raising the min. wage to $15 in the film.
It's by Robert Reich, who was actually Clinton's labor secretary. A very intelligent and compassionate man. I haven't seen the film yet but it's on my list.0 -
Yea, so let's all demand what we think we should make and force employers to pay it. Because there would be no repercussions in terms of impacting our economy.
This thread has a very strong socialist mentality. Lol.
Yeah. That's how asking for a raise works. I see nothing wrong with it if you're an essential part of the company you work for and they have the profits to afford it.
We really don't need to fear socialism in this country. Not by a long shot. The wealthy in this county are light years ahead of even the middle class.
If you're truly concerned about socialism you'd realize that you can only oppress the lower class for so long before things get ugly. A healthy middle class is the key to economic security.
Throughout history the rich and powerful have believed they can dictate how the lower classes are treated and if they don't like it they can shut up about it. It's never ended well.
A thought provoking post. Thank you for the different angle.0 -
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The fact is that the minimum wage has stayed the same, while the purchasing power of the dollar has gone down. See the chart in the link below which compares what the minimum wage was at various times at "current level" dollars:
http://www.dol.gov/minwage/minwage-gdp-history.htm
The cost of living has already increased incredibly since 2008 -- housing, food, fuel, you name it, while wages have remained stagnant. Those who argue that prices will have to go way up again are ignoring the fact that prices have already gone way up, and not because companies are paying workers more. If one sticks to the argument that if wages rise, prices will rise, so we shouldn'[t raise wages, then we would never raise wages. Why don't we just pay our workers what they pay in Bangladesh -- that will keep the price of everything low?
By the way, in Mass., many of my associates who were small business owners actually paid above minimum wage because they had an interest in keeping their employees and insuring the same level of continuity and service to their customers. Those fighting the minimum wage -- big corporations making huge profits who see employees as cogs in the wheel. There are also some companies like GAP and Costco that have gone public in their commitment to pay their employees above minimum wage. Gee, I just bought a brand new workout outfit at GAP with my Rewards -- $26.00 -- it didn't exactly break the bank.
It's possible to pay a fair wage and make a profit. However, some companies decide that there's never enough profit.
COLA since 2008 has not "already increased incredibly". CPI in 2009 was negative, and on average from 2009 through 2013 it is a little more then 1.5% per annum. Hardly 'increased incredibly'. You are going to see a very slow and steady climb out of the real estate valuations in the US for many years. You can thank Dodd-Frank and the government for some of it(government over reach). The greatest increases, personally, are college costs(demand increase) and prescription drugs. They are both closer to double digit increases then food, fuel, and housing.
And since corporations like Home Depot, Costco, and GAP(the few you have mentioned) are paying a better wage then people at McDonald's and Walmart can apply for those jobs if they choose to. The economy is what you make of it; if you want a job tied to minimum wage working for a large corporation and be eligible for federal assistance stay at those jobs. If you want more, apply for the jobs when they are available at the above referenced companies.
There is only 1 GAP, 1 Costco, and 1 Home Depot in a 15 mile radius in my area. Whereas, there are about 10 McDonald's and at least 3 WalMarts. Maybe those Walmart and McDonald's employees are applying for those jobs, but not getting them.
The fact is the cost of living has gone up 1.5% per year, but wages have not kept pace. This is the argument in the film another poster referenced on income inequality, which is by Robert Reich I used his book, "Beyond Outrage" to teach a course on Economic Justice and Social Change. For those who are saying it is unfair for the minimum to go as high as $15 an hour because it would make other jobs worth less, Reich and others feel that all wages need to rise. Wages for other fields have also stagnated, across the board. My spouse is in software engineering/project management (a more "elite" profession) -- he didn't get any pay increase from 2001 until last year. Another friend who worked in construction 20 years ago made $18 an hour. Guess what the pay is for the same position today -- $18 and hour because his son was applying for a similar job. My dad after he retired did substitute teaching in 1987 -- the pay $45 a day. The pay for a sub today -- it went up -- a whole $65 a day for being a in class all day with school children -- what is that, a little over $8.00 an hour? So to the EMTs and other who say their wages should go up to $22 a day, yes, they should.
One of the reasons that middle class skilled workers are angry is that their wages have also remained stagnant. But instead of blaming a system that rewards CEOS and investment income more than income earned through labor (of whatever kind); instead their anger is redirected at low wage workers, unions, and anybody who is on some type of "safety net" program, which more and more working people are.
QFT0 -
So going off a thread from the other day and this thread is it safe to say teachers and fast food workers don't deserve raises? Or is it more of a "anyone who isn't me" doesn't deserve a raise type of thing?
I don't get a raise.
When I worked for a company sure I got a raise but I wasn't of the "Oh, I totally know I'm going to get one because I deserve it!" mind set like everyone else I worked with. I knew that it wasn't something I was guaranteed even though I was an excellent employee so I never felt as though I was entitled to it.
And should teachers get raises? Sure but it shouldn't be something that's guaranteed and written into their contract. If you're a crappy teacher then no, you shouldn't get a raise. Same with fast food workers. Yes, they should get raises but it shouldn't be a blanket thing. Why should someone who slacks off get an increase in salary along with the person who busts their butt? If I were the person who busted my butt, came in on my days off, worked extra hours etc. etc. and found out that the guy who calls in on every nice day, comes in late, skips out early and did the minimal amount of work got an increase in salary as well where is MY incentive to continue to be a good employee? If you're going to reward everyone regardless of what they put in then why should I continue to work hard if my reward isn't a reward at all?
It's not an issue of whether or not someone should get a raise it's the issue of wanting to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr. So ok. The minimum wage is raised to $15/hr. So the people who are now earning that have some extra cash in their pocket which they spend. Fine but then they complain that they can't live on the $15/hr increase because they're spending that extra money they have so they need more so lets raise it to $20/hr. Then $30/hr. Where does it stop?0 -
I'm guessing at one time or another, everyone here worked in a minimum wage job. I highly doubt they would have considered themselves "unskilled, lazy, entitled" when they applied and worked.We have the right to demand and our employers have the right to say yes or no. Then we have the choice to accept that or quit.
I don't believe in oppressing the lower class. I believe in working as hard as we can to progress.
Yes, employers can and often say no. Sometimes it becomes such a problem in a company or industry that workers choose to go on strike, as is happening here. There are options besides, "You'll earn what I give you or leave."
Can the striking workers be replaced, yes. Do you think that's a wise decision for the company?
People may feel that fast food workers are unskilled, I disagree but that's separate from what matters. What matters is that they are absolutely essential to the company. Without burgers being cooked and cash registers being operated they don't make one dollar. Not one. All your "skilled" CEO's and Vice Presidents of Northwest Operations and marketing geniuses are suddenly useless, the company makes it profits on the backs of the people on the front lines. The people they pay the least of all.
But they can be replaced easily, right? Ever gone to a restaurant when someone was brand new, they're never good are they? Now imagine an entirely new staff that needs to be trained. It'd be a financial nightmare for the company. People would be turned away in droves.
These people at the bottom, these "unskilled, lazy, entitled" employees, are absolutely essential to the survival of the company. Period. They provide an important service and help the company earn a fortune in revenue. As such they deserve better than poverty wages.
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Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
So going off a thread from the other day and this thread is it safe to say teachers and fast food workers don't deserve raises? Or is it more of a "anyone who isn't me" doesn't deserve a raise type of thing?
I think someone who works hard and earns a raise should get a raise. I don't think an entire random group of people -- some of whom do a great job and some of whom really suck at their jobs -- should get a raise "just because."
I also think you will find that even in fast food, being skilled at customer service and at least pretending not to hate your job will result in upward momentum in both pay and position, regardless of education. At the same time, doing the absolute bare minimum or less will not, no matter one's education level.
I have shopped at Walmart enough and been to enough fast food restaurants to know that there are many people in those jobs who really don't deserve raises and I'd venture to say they probably aren't worth minimum wage.0 -
Um, when I was 18 and working minimum wage jobs, the pay way $3.25 an hour. Somehow our economy has survived the current minimum wage without the country going under.It's not an issue of whether or not someone should get a raise it's the issue of wanting to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr. So ok. The minimum wage is raised to $15/hr. So the people who are now earning that have some extra cash in their pocket which they spend. Fine but then they complain that they can't live on the $15/hr increase because they're spending that extra money they have so they need more so lets raise it to $20/hr. Then $30/hr. Where does it stop?
What I find ironic here is "skilled" people all over America complaining about the minimum wage raise proposal on "unskilled" workers in fast food/restaurant industry, yet aren't "skilled" enough to prepare food for themselves or family, so they go to place where "unskilled" workers do it for them.:laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Group Fitness and Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
If MW increases, the price of goods and services will also increase. Nobody will actually have more money because they will be paying more for the things they buy. My prediction would be that if fast food employees got 15 an hour the price of food would go up to make sure the company doesn't lose money. That 2$ burger will 6$ or more. Who is going to pay that? Fast food restaurants will lose money because people won't pay the higher prices and then the fast food restaurant will start firing workers because they don't have the business to warrant that number of employees.0
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Um, when I was 18 and working minimum wage jobs, the pay way $3.25 an hour. Somehow our economy has survived the current minimum wage without the country going under.It's not an issue of whether or not someone should get a raise it's the issue of wanting to raise the minimum wage to $15/hr. So ok. The minimum wage is raised to $15/hr. So the people who are now earning that have some extra cash in their pocket which they spend. Fine but then they complain that they can't live on the $15/hr increase because they're spending that extra money they have so they need more so lets raise it to $20/hr. Then $30/hr. Where does it stop?
What I find ironic here is "skilled" people all over America complaining about the minimum wage raise proposal on "unskilled" workers in fast food/restaurant industry, yet aren't "skilled" enough to prepare food for themselves or family, so they go to place where "unskilled" workers do it for them.:laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Group Fitness and Personal Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
If you raise the minimum wage dramatically then you have to raise everyone else's wages to compensate for the increase. If the minimum wage is increased to say $30/hr then the person who currently gets paid $30/hr wouldn't want to be paid "minimum wage" so their compensation would need to be increased which would cause a hardship on companies big and small. As it stands if the minimum wage is increased to $15/hr there are a lot of small businesses who won't be able to support this and therefore will have to let people go.0 -
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Today I learned that unskilled workers shouldn't be allowed to survive. Maybe it would be simpler to just execute high school dropouts and the bottom 10% of each graduating class...0
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Today I learned that unskilled workers shouldn't be allowed to survive. Maybe it would be simpler to just execute high school dropouts and the bottom 10% of each graduating class...
No, we should reinstitute slavery or at the very least, indentured servitude for those who can't achieve a certain skill or education level. After all, it worked so well pre-1860.0 -
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Yea, so let's all demand what we think we should make and force employers to pay it. Because there would be no repercussions in terms of impacting our economy.
This thread has a very strong socialist mentality. Lol.
Yeah. That's how asking for a raise works. I see nothing wrong with it if you're an essential part of the company you work for and they have the profits to afford it.
We really don't need to fear socialism in this country. Not by a long shot. The wealthy in this county are light years ahead of even the middle class.
If you're truly concerned about socialism you'd realize that you can only oppress the lower class for so long before things get ugly. A healthy middle class is the key to economic security.
Throughout history the rich and powerful have believed they can dictate how the lower classes are treated and if they don't like it they can shut up about it. It's never ended well.
A thought provoking post. Thank you for the different angle.
Thanks for saying that. You made many good points yourself.
Nothing at all will be solved by this thread. But if we can all learn something from the other I consider that to be a win.
I was very close to bowing out of the thread, but I am glad I stuck around. Speaking to others with different opinions is the best way to learn, and may solve something eventually.0 -
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Maybe this will make an impression on those who think this minimum wage increase will benefit fast food workers (or anyone else):
Also:
The Daily Signal also reports that when this is applied to some of our favorite fast food items:
A Big Mac meal increases from $5.69 to $7.82.
Wendy’s Son of a Baconator combo increases from $6.49 to $8.92.
Taco Bell’s 3 crunchy tacos combo increases from $4.59 to $6.31.
A Whopper meal increases from $6.15 to $8.46.
Subway’s turkey breast Footlong increases from $6.50 to $8.94.
Edit- the image is huge, here is the direct URL: http://static.ijreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Screen-Shot-2014-09-04-at-10.03.58-PM-1024x529.png?10ae6a0
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