How I have avoided plateauing ***length warning***

ziggy67

I haven't lost anything for a month...thought I'd give myself a break and treated myself to a delicious chinese take away last night....wham bam.....I'm two pounds heavier this morning. Ah well.....onwards and upwards!

colleenjw2

bump!!!

SHBoss1673

I haven't lost anything for a month...thought I'd give myself a break and treated myself to a delicious chinese take away last night....wham bam.....I'm two pounds heavier this morning. Ah well.....onwards and upwards!

that would be the sodium talking. Chinese food = TONS of sodium = water retention = temporary weight gain.

cmriverside

Hi, Steve. The original poster of this thread is now known as SHBoss1673

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/shboss1673

CrystalFlury

Wow, thanks! That really made me think about what I'm doing now and what I should do in the future. I'm one of those people who might be a little too determined to lose weight NOW. I do need to relax a little and not be AS strict as I am now with eating. A 'cheat' meal every now and then isn't going to kill me.

Again, thanks for the advice! Happy losing!

thedestar

Love this!

cardbucfan

bumping so I can find this again!

ladyhawk00

Bump

Russellb97

Good post but #3 is wrong, meal size doesn't really matter. It's more about overall calories in 24 hours-several days. Many doctors and weight loss specialists are agreeing now that extra calories get stored as glycogen first and when those stores are full the remaining can become body-fat. This provides us a "buffer" when we go to the buffet and over eat here and there.
This is why diets like Intermittent Fasting can and do work, when they eat one large meal a day.

The best way to break a plateau is to have a bad day and splurge, overeat on purpose and spike your metabolism up. It will help both mentally and physically.

servilia

Great article!
I do agree with Russell though, I`ve had good results with taking most of my 1200 cals in the evening.

Another factor I would like to add, if I may, is estimated calorie burns. Not everyone has heart rate monitors, and I know that in my case, and many others, the cardio type machines grossly OVERestimate calories burned. In the case of elliptical, the machine at my gym overestimated by almost 100%! Machine said 140 cals for a given time, my HRM said 80, for the same session. And this machine did take my age and weight into account and I kept my hand on the machine`s heart rate plates the whole time. If I ate back all those exercise cals I`d be over my goal for the day. Even MFP overestimates for me. I love my HRM

SHBoss1673

Good post but #3 is wrong, meal size doesn't really matter. It's more about overall calories in 24 hours-several days. Many doctors and weight loss specialists are agreeing now that extra calories get stored as glycogen first and when those stores are full the remaining can become body-fat. This provides us a "buffer" when we go to the buffet and over eat here and there.
This is why diets like Intermittent Fasting can and do work, when they eat one large meal a day.

The best way to break a plateau is to have a bad day and splurge, overeat on purpose and spike your metabolism up. It will help both mentally and physically.

It's not wrong, you mention glycogen stores, but you neglect to think about the myriad of complex chemical equations that go into converting food into glycogen. 1, the body can only store a few hundred grams of glycogen at any one time. Assuming you aren't totally depleted of glycogen when you consume a large meal, you're almost certainly going to be storing fat. Under the aforementioned assumption, fat has a different metabolic time to delivery than glucose in the body, and in that sense, the body can't burn fat as fast or as efficiently as it can carbohydrates, and the body needs what the body needs at any one point in time, if you can't deliver enough energy to it, then it will canabalize protein to help fill out those deficits.

Saying that many doctors and weight loss specialists agree with glycogen storage is a moot statement for 2 reasons, 1) they've been in agreement with that hypothesis for about 35 years now (since the mid 70's) and 2) nobody is debating that your body uses glycogen, but unless you're in a state of fasting or ketogenic, the body will prioritize glycogen replenishment over almost any other activity (other than repairing injury or disease), and thus you're never going to need a big meal's worth of calories, even if you only ate exactly what your body needs in glycogen (because you always have some glycogen already in the liver and at the muscle sites). FYI your body stores (depending on your physical traits) somewhere around 300 to 600 grams of glycogen. A big meal (say 1500 calories with a majority being carbohydrates) can supply up to twice that much. Taking into account that you need a bit of that as free flowing blood sugar, and a portion as glycogen replenishment, anywhere from 20% to 60% of those calories could be stored as fat, which is much more difficult to convert to usable energy than carbohydrates.

if you want to learn more, there's a great book that describes glycogen usage and fat storage:

Exercise physiology: energy, nutrition, and human performance By William D. McArdle, Frank I. Katch, Victor L. Katch

4theking

I don't agree with 3 or 4. It doesn't matter what you eat as long as you hit the correct macros and size and number of meals has nothing to do with plateuing. This is old school thinking.

Fat is added and lost constantly in a 24hour period. All you have to do is 'take away' more than gets stored in a day and you lose bodyfat.

SHBoss1673

I don't agree with 3 or 4. It doesn't matter what you eat as long as you hit the correct macros and size and number of meals has nothing to do with plateuing. This is old school thinking.

Fat is added and lost constantly in a 24hour period. All you have to do is 'take away' more than gets stored in a day and you lose bodyfat.

I've done the research on this, I've looked at the available studies, it does matter how much you eat. I know what some "experts" say, and I know why they say it. For certain things, like that old myth about "keeping your metabolism high" it's a myth, but not for the amount of calories at any one time. The science behind the theory is that while you don't need "many small meals" to boost the metabolism, your body can only use so many carbohydrates at any one time, flood your body, and not only do you overtax your liver, but you force your body to do something with the glucose created that's over and above the glycogen and blood sugar needs, this all becomes fat, you can avoid this by reducing the meal amount and spreading out the calories throughout the day.
In the same vein, the idea of flooding your body with protein post workout is a bit of a myth, while you can slightly increase muscle repair after a workout by increasing your protein and carbohydrate intake immediately after, it's no where near as dramatic as people once thought, and really, as long as protein levels are consistently high enough, you will be fine.

I won't even touch number four. Nutritional value of your food is important, I never thought I would have to defend that position.

4theking

I don't agree with 3 or 4. It doesn't matter what you eat as long as you hit the correct macros and size and number of meals has nothing to do with plateuing. This is old school thinking.

Fat is added and lost constantly in a 24hour period. All you have to do is 'take away' more than gets stored in a day and you lose bodyfat.

I've done the research on this, I've looked at the available studies, it does matter how much you eat. I know what some "experts" say, and I know why they say it. For certain things, like that old myth about "keeping your metabolism high" it's a myth, but not for the amount of calories at any one time. The science behind the theory is that while you don't need "many small meals" to boost the metabolism, your body can only use so many carbohydrates at any one time, flood your body, and not only do you overtax your liver, but you force your body to do something with the glucose created that's over and above the glycogen and blood sugar needs, this all becomes fat, you can avoid this by reducing the meal amount and spreading out the calories throughout the day.
In the same vein, the idea of flooding your body with protein post workout is a bit of a myth, while you can slightly increase muscle repair after a workout by increasing your protein and carbohydrate intake immediately after, it's no where near as dramatic as people once thought, and really, as long as protein levels are consistently high enough, you will be fine.

I won't even touch number four. Nutritional value of your food is important, I never thought I would have to defend that position.

Number four for avoiding plateauing, seriously?

I love science. I love research, and my career is in it. But to me, the one thing that trumps any study, is real world results. Intermittent fasting results tell me more than any study could.

SHBoss1673

I don't agree with 3 or 4. It doesn't matter what you eat as long as you hit the correct macros and size and number of meals has nothing to do with plateuing. This is old school thinking.

Fat is added and lost constantly in a 24hour period. All you have to do is 'take away' more than gets stored in a day and you lose bodyfat.

I've done the research on this, I've looked at the available studies, it does matter how much you eat. I know what some "experts" say, and I know why they say it. For certain things, like that old myth about "keeping your metabolism high" it's a myth, but not for the amount of calories at any one time. The science behind the theory is that while you don't need "many small meals" to boost the metabolism, your body can only use so many carbohydrates at any one time, flood your body, and not only do you overtax your liver, but you force your body to do something with the glucose created that's over and above the glycogen and blood sugar needs, this all becomes fat, you can avoid this by reducing the meal amount and spreading out the calories throughout the day.
In the same vein, the idea of flooding your body with protein post workout is a bit of a myth, while you can slightly increase muscle repair after a workout by increasing your protein and carbohydrate intake immediately after, it's no where near as dramatic as people once thought, and really, as long as protein levels are consistently high enough, you will be fine.

I won't even touch number four. Nutritional value of your food is important, I never thought I would have to defend that position.

Number four for avoiding plateauing, seriously?

I love science. I love research, and my career is in it. But to me, the one thing that trumps any study, is real world results. Intermittent fasting results tell me more than any study could.

so you say people who eat crappy food can expect the same results as those who eat healthy with regards to weight loss? What's the science behind that? you give me a good scientific argument on how sugar and trans fats are no different as complex carbs with fiber and protein with regards to how your body process them, and I'll discuss it.

4theking

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

ohmariposa

lots of good advice here...THX :-)

SHBoss1673

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

sure they do. What about Glycemic index and Glycemic load? Not all carbohydrates are broken down with the same speed. Highly processed carbohydrates can be turned into glucose within minutes, flooding the blood stream with glucose and causing the body to convert some of it to fat and/or creating a spike in blood sugar levels which can cause insulin responses. If done on a regular basis, this can lead to metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes, which reduces the body's ability to uptake blood sugar forcing the body to reduce metabolic rate (among other things). It's more than just the macros you get, it's the type of macros also. Don't forget that cortisol (released during times of high insulin) also counteracts HGH, IGF2, and Testosterone uptake, which means slower muscular development further impairing RMR.

You can't take 1 concept in a vacuum in the human body, everything is connected, macros affect hormone response, which affects multiple systems, which can change body chemistry...etc.

4theking

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

sure they do. What about Glycemic index and Glycemic load? Not all carbohydrates are broken down with the same speed. Highly processed carbohydrates can be turned into glucose within minutes, flooding the blood stream with glucose and causing the body to convert some of it to fat and/or creating a spike in blood sugar levels which can cause insulin responses. If done on a regular basis, this can lead to metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes, which reduces the body's ability to uptake blood sugar forcing the body to reduce metabolic rate (among other things). It's more than just the macros you get, it's the type of macros also. Don't forget that cortisol (released during times of high insulin) also counteracts HGH, IGF2, and Testosterone uptake, which means slower muscular development further impairing RMR.

You can't take 1 concept in a vacuum in the human body, everything is connected, macros affect hormone response, which affects multiple systems, which can change body chemistry...etc.

Not speaking on long term health issues. I was just pointing out I disagreed that eating junkfood will make you plateau in weightloss. I do understand all the science with how the body works.

We can agree to disagree and I will continue eating my ice cream and donuts.

SHBoss1673

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

sure they do. What about Glycemic index and Glycemic load? Not all carbohydrates are broken down with the same speed. Highly processed carbohydrates can be turned into glucose within minutes, flooding the blood stream with glucose and causing the body to convert some of it to fat and/or creating a spike in blood sugar levels which can cause insulin responses. If done on a regular basis, this can lead to metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes, which reduces the body's ability to uptake blood sugar forcing the body to reduce metabolic rate (among other things). It's more than just the macros you get, it's the type of macros also. Don't forget that cortisol (released during times of high insulin) also counteracts HGH, IGF2, and Testosterone uptake, which means slower muscular development further impairing RMR.

You can't take 1 concept in a vacuum in the human body, everything is connected, macros affect hormone response, which affects multiple systems, which can change body chemistry...etc.

Not speaking on long term health issues. I was just pointing out I disagreed that eating junkfood will make you plateau in weightloss. I do understand all the science with how the body works.

We can agree to disagree and I will continue eating my ice cream and donuts.

what ever works for you.

brucedelaney

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

sure they do. What about Glycemic index and Glycemic load? Not all carbohydrates are broken down with the same speed. Highly processed carbohydrates can be turned into glucose within minutes, flooding the blood stream with glucose and causing the body to convert some of it to fat and/or creating a spike in blood sugar levels which can cause insulin responses. If done on a regular basis, this can lead to metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes, which reduces the body's ability to uptake blood sugar forcing the body to reduce metabolic rate (among other things). It's more than just the macros you get, it's the type of macros also. Don't forget that cortisol (released during times of high insulin) also counteracts HGH, IGF2, and Testosterone uptake, which means slower muscular development further impairing RMR.

You can't take 1 concept in a vacuum in the human body, everything is connected, macros affect hormone response, which affects multiple systems, which can change body chemistry...etc.

Not speaking on long term health issues. I was just pointing out I disagreed that eating junkfood will make you plateau in weightloss. I do understand all the science with how the body works.

We can agree to disagree and I will continue eating my ice cream and donuts.

what ever works for you.

Looked at 4TheKing's Pics and his diary.... Seems to be working

Looked at your pics and your diary (which is empty for at least the last two months)... Let's just say... Seem's 4TheKing's plan seems to be working.

CoraGregoryCPA

Not saying to not eat protein and fiber. I am saying you can eat a lot of processed food and still get into fantastic shape and it will not hinder your progress. Macros matter yes, not where said macros come from.

sure they do. What about Glycemic index and Glycemic load? Not all carbohydrates are broken down with the same speed. Highly processed carbohydrates can be turned into glucose within minutes, flooding the blood stream with glucose and causing the body to convert some of it to fat and/or creating a spike in blood sugar levels which can cause insulin responses. If done on a regular basis, this can lead to metabolic syndrome and type 2 diabetes, which reduces the body's ability to uptake blood sugar forcing the body to reduce metabolic rate (among other things). It's more than just the macros you get, it's the type of macros also. Don't forget that cortisol (released during times of high insulin) also counteracts HGH, IGF2, and Testosterone uptake, which means slower muscular development further impairing RMR.

You can't take 1 concept in a vacuum in the human body, everything is connected, macros affect hormone response, which affects multiple systems, which can change body chemistry...etc.

I wonder why the majority of type 2 diebetes people are because they are overweight, not because of the insulin responses. Thinner people could do the same spike in blood sugar levels and not risk themselves for type 2 diabetes. I don't truly understand the comment above, but that's ok. I believe the calories in and calories out to a point.

boyslie72487

Hmm maybe I'm having cheat days too often... I'm gonna try a few of these out and hopefully get back on track! Thanks!

SHBoss1673

I wonder why the majority of type 2 diebetes people are because they are overweight, not because of the insulin responses. Thinner people could do the same spike in blood sugar levels and not risk themselves for type 2 diabetes. I don't truly understand the comment above, but that's ok. I believe the calories in and calories out to a point.

first, you don't have to be overweight to have type 2 diabetes, but if you notice, my comments with regards to metabolic syndrome and diabetes talk about long term risk for type 2 diabetes, and people who eat badly long term tend to be overweight, likewise, not all overweight or obese individuals have diabetes, the two just coincide because many overweight people don't eat healthy foods AND they overeat. Type 2 diabetes can be caused by putting the body into sugar overdrive, which creates a situation where cells become insulin resistant, insulin which is a hormone that tells cells to open up and take glucose from the blood, no longer performs the way it normally would. When you flood the body with simple carbohydrates on a regular basis for months or years, the odds go way up that your body will become insulin resistant.

take a look at this, it gives a decent overview of type 2 diabetes.

http://diabetes.webmd.com/guide/type-2-diabetes

I've never argued against calories in vs calories out, I'm all about eating the right amount of calories, but I'm also all about eating the right types of calories.

CoraGregoryCPA

I wonder why the majority of type 2 diebetes people are because they are overweight, not because of the insulin responses. Thinner people could do the same spike in blood sugar levels and not risk themselves for type 2 diabetes. I don't truly understand the comment above, but that's ok. I believe the calories in and calories out to a point.

first, you don't have to be overweight to have type 2 diabetes, but if you notice, my comments with regards to metabolic syndrome and diabetes talk about long term risk for type 2 diabetes, and people who eat badly long term tend to be overweight, likewise, not all overweight or obese individuals have diabetes, the two just coincide because many overweight people don't eat healthy foods AND they overeat. Type 2 diabetes can be caused by putting the body into sugar overdrive, which creates a situation where cells become insulin resistant, insulin which is a hormone that tells cells to open up and take glucose from the blood, no longer performs the way it normally would. When you flood the body with simple carbohydrates on a regular basis for months or years, the odds go way up that your body will become insulin resistant.

take a look at this, it gives a decent overview of type 2 diabetes.

http://diabetes.webmd.com/guide/type-2-diabetes

I've never argued against calories in vs calories out, I'm all about eating the right amount of calories, but I'm also all about eating the right types of calories.

Thanks for the additional info.

tangiesharp

bump

cardbucfan

Thanks for bumping this, it fell off my topics page and I like to re-read it occasionally-like now!

kellch

*

kenna44cat

Thanks for this, the large helpings three times a day are my downfall and I recognize why I can't lose weight when doing that. I've started leaving something on my plate every meal, that makes me feel good, and it's true, burgers and fries will make me suffer from heartburn and a tummyache (or more) if I eat them now, anything deep fried, I see why some people have acid reflux all the time.

ramonafrincu

I don't agree with 3 or 4. It doesn't matter what you eat as long as you hit the correct macros and size and number of meals has nothing to do with plateuing. This is old school thinking.

Fat is added and lost constantly in a 24hour period. All you have to do is 'take away' more than gets stored in a day and you lose bodyfat.

I've done the research on this, I've looked at the available studies, it does matter how much you eat. I know what some "experts" say, and I know why they say it. For certain things, like that old myth about "keeping your metabolism high" it's a myth, but not for the amount of calories at any one time. The science behind the theory is that while you don't need "many small meals" to boost the metabolism, your body can only use so many carbohydrates at any one time, flood your body, and not only do you overtax your liver, but you force your body to do something with the glucose created that's over and above the glycogen and blood sugar needs, this all becomes fat, you can avoid this by reducing the meal amount and spreading out the calories throughout the day.
In the same vein, the idea of flooding your body with protein post workout is a bit of a myth, while you can slightly increase muscle repair after a workout by increasing your protein and carbohydrate intake immediately after, it's no where near as dramatic as people once thought, and really, as long as protein levels are consistently high enough, you will be fine.

I won't even touch number four. Nutritional value of your food is important, I never thought I would have to defend that position.

Number four for avoiding plateauing, seriously?

I love science. I love research, and my career is in it. But to me, the one thing that trumps any study, is real world results. Intermittent fasting results tell me more than any study could.

QFT :flowerforyou: