Women who put on muscle fast

JaxDemon

My argument, in response to a rather rude and dismissive demand for 'proof' that the woman quoted became bulky from lifting weights, was that body image is fundamentally about individual perception of one's own body. The woman who said she became bulky became so in her own view ie. she felt that the image she saw in the mirror - her body image - was too muscularly developed in a particular area for her own comfort. Her view and the reality of her body may not match up to the perception of 'bulk' held by the person who demanded proof, but that does not mean that her perception of her own body is necessarily invalid.

We're not talking about body image. We're talking about physical reality. Whether a woman thinks she is "too bulky" is a completely separate issue of whether or not she, in reality, became more bulky during a given time frame.

She said she got too bulky while doing this class. The reality is that her bulk decreased. If her body image changed, that's a separate issue.

The point is that it's literally impossible to become bulkier while you're at a calorie deficit, no matter how much weight you lift. Period, end of story, thanks for playing, let's all go home now.

Your body will gain muscle on a caloric deficit up to a certain point when you first start out. But you will see the gains level out eventually. At that point it becomes all about maintaining the muscle you have while you burn fat.

She may also have great genetics.

Newbie gains I think the term is.

No quantity of newbie gains will make any person or body part actually bigger. In some cases, a person in a calorie deficit can gain small amounts of muscle mass with newbie gains, but this is more than offset by a drop in fat mass.

No one actually gets larger in a calorie deficit, and bulk is literally size. You cannot increase your bulk in a calorie deficit.

Anyone who says they did failed to take proper measurements and track actual progress.

I've not read all the argument. But if she is weight training then of course the body part will get bigger over time depending on what she's doing when training it or the illusion will be fat coming off that area giving her the perceived look that it's bigger as it takes more definition. As far as I'm aware it's pretty difficult for a women to pack on mass size due to the low level of testosterone in their bodies. Unless of cause she's taking stuff lol.

BeachIron

I wish I had this "problem". My legs are always kind of man muscular, but damn can I get some upper body to match?

pics?

why?

Because they want to examine your pics and then tell you why you're wrong and then lecture you on weights, body fat %, muscle definition, heavy lifting vs. baby pink dumbbells, and throw in a bunch of sarcastic digs so they can show that they're part of the cool kids' club. Ad nauseam.

Yea. So sorry, that people who have been through this process are attempting to illustrate a point. Go find someone who will give you a hug, pat your head, and tell you "wow, you're so bulky!" It's all about the teddy bears and rainbows for some, actual progress for others.

LMAO!!!!

Sweetie, you've been here since March and you already have over 4000 posts. You seriously need to find something better to do with your time.

I read your profile. Rather than laughing and making snarky comments, you may want to listen to people who lost weight and have kept it off and also built muscle mass.

Start by re-reading the posts here because you are clearly reading them in a manner that is not intended or warranted. Again, we have been discussing the facts of what we could reasonably call bulking and cutting phases. A pro bodybuilder even entered for a while and graciously provided her pictures to illustrate.

This isn't about my time or the number of posts I have made. I'd honestly have to make fewer if people such as yourself would read more carefully.

ItsCasey

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

EvgeniZyntx

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

Why not? Bulkiness is purely perception. There isn't a special scale for it.

JaxDemon

Merely trying to add another perspective to the discussion, and responding a specific part of a specific post, not the whole thread. If you don't want to acknowledge that a woman may feel herself to be too 'bulky' despite the scientific difficulties in that matching up to your view of that term, please, continue on in blissful ignorance.

Again, this thread is specifically not about how anyone feels at the moment.

The entire thread is about change over time. It's not about being bulky or having muscle, it's about getting bulky or gaining muscle.

You can have muscle or not have muscle. You can be bulky or not be bulky. That's not what this is about. This is about whether you can BECOME bulkier or GAIN muscle while losing weight.

The answer is "you cannot."

Am I reading that right. You are saying you can't gain muscle while losing weight?

MireyGal76

I love my manly man muscles.








Carry on arguing.




ETA... oh and how about this... If you are afraid to start lifting because you are going to become she-hulk, then do this.
Take measurements of all your feared bulky areas... Thighs, Calves, Biceps, what have you.

Measure every couple of weeks and if you find those areas are gaining inches, then stop lifting.

I look much stronger now than I did three years ago... but guess what... my bicep sizes have not changed much whatsoever. I just lost the fat that was hiding the definition.

If you don't like the definition... keep the layer of fat.

IronCakes

I wish I had this "problem". My legs are always kind of man muscular, but damn can I get some upper body to match?

pics?

why?

Because they want to examine your pics and then tell you why you're wrong and then lecture you on weights, body fat %, muscle definition, heavy lifting vs. baby pink dumbbells, and throw in a bunch of sarcastic digs so they can show that they're part of the cool kids' club. Ad nauseam.

Yea. So sorry, that people who have been through this process are attempting to illustrate a point. Go find someone who will give you a hug, pat your head, and tell you "wow, you're so bulky!" It's all about the teddy bears and rainbows for some, actual progress for others.

LMAO!!!!

Sweetie, you've been here since March and you already have over 4000 posts. You seriously need to find something better to do with your time.

I read your profile. Rather than laughing and making snarky comments, you may want to listen to people who lost weight and have kept it off and also built muscle mass.

Start by re-reading the posts here because you are clearly reading them in a manner that is not intended or warranted. Again, we have been discussing the facts of what we could reasonably call bulking and cutting phases. A pro bodybuilder even entered for a while and graciously provided her pictures to illustrate.

This isn't about my time or the number of posts I have made. I'd honestly have to make fewer if people such as yourself would read more carefully.

I don't understand why my simple why escaladed into this...kind of unnecessary don't ya think?
All I wanted to know is why the original person I quoted wanted to see my pictures...

EvgeniZyntx

Merely trying to add another perspective to the discussion, and responding a specific part of a specific post, not the whole thread. If you don't want to acknowledge that a woman may feel herself to be too 'bulky' despite the scientific difficulties in that matching up to your view of that term, please, continue on in blissful ignorance.

Again, this thread is specifically not about how anyone feels at the moment.

The entire thread is about change over time. It's not about being bulky or having muscle, it's about getting bulky or gaining muscle.

You can have muscle or not have muscle. You can be bulky or not be bulky. That's not what this is about. This is about whether you can BECOME bulkier or GAIN muscle while losing weight.

The answer is "you cannot."

Am I reading that right. You are saying you can't gain muscle while losing weight?

You can't gain significant volume while losing weight.

jonnythan

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

Why not? Bulkiness is purely perception. There isn't a special scale for it.

There is no room for perception when it comes to whether you are getting more or less bulky.

castadiva

I think it's likely your understanding of 'bulky' and hers may be different. In her context, I took the word 'bulky' to mean highly-defined, perhaps large in proportion to the rest of her body, and inelegant - not a lithe, svelte look, but visibly muscular, which many women believe is unfeminine and unappealing. I know 'bulk' has a particular connotation in weightlifting, but it's not the only way to use that word.

If only there were some book written, where we could collect definitions of words so that when we use them we could make sure we're using them correctly. You could have them in alphabetical order, and give the meanings of words right next to the word itself.

If such a book existed, and the word "bulky" was in it, it could, for instance, say "of relatively large size" and not "smaller yet more defined."

If only such a book existed.

How many times a day do you use words in a sense not precisely aligned with their primary dictionary definition, but rather, in colloquial fashion? Context matters, and language evolves - just ask the Oxford English Dictionary team who spend all year, every year updating and editing the content of their publication. Do you 'follow' someone on Twitter or indulge in weightlifting 'geekery'? If we followed your apparent standards for the 'correct' use of language and ignored context, neither of those things would be possible, according to their precise dictionary definitions, until fairly recent years.

jonnythan

Merely trying to add another perspective to the discussion, and responding a specific part of a specific post, not the whole thread. If you don't want to acknowledge that a woman may feel herself to be too 'bulky' despite the scientific difficulties in that matching up to your view of that term, please, continue on in blissful ignorance.

Again, this thread is specifically not about how anyone feels at the moment.

The entire thread is about change over time. It's not about being bulky or having muscle, it's about getting bulky or gaining muscle.

You can have muscle or not have muscle. You can be bulky or not be bulky. That's not what this is about. This is about whether you can BECOME bulkier or GAIN muscle while losing weight.

The answer is "you cannot."

Am I reading that right. You are saying you can't gain muscle while losing weight?

Not to any significant degree, no. Certainly you can't gain enough muscle in a caloric deficit to make a body part larger.

WhitneySheree88

I gain a lot of muscle in my legs without really even trying. My calves are huge but I kind of like that ... just wish the rest of my body would catch up lol

JoRocka

so unless you're a certain inch size you can't look bulky? and becasue you're a woman if you drop body fat, your defined muscles can't look masculine? what does it matter if someone gained inches and bulked up? if you look bulky you look bulky. a person doesn't need to gain to look bulky if it's already there. there are plenty of women with broad shoulders, large quads, large calves, big arms, naturally and sometimes working them just makes them bigger which some women don't like.

Incorrect

BULK means SIZE. There is this ridiculous notion that people who have highly define musculature are bulky. They are not. They have a highly developed sense of how to eat properly to maintain a low body fat percentage. Muscle DEFINITION (or lack there of) comes from body fat percentage- high or low. Period. Plain and simple

You cannot be bulky if you aren't gaining in size.

And- if you are a woman. and you have muscles- it doesn't make you manish. Guess what. I'm a woman. I will NEVER look like a man- because I"m not a MAN. I seriously do not understand why people get so caught up comparing to men. Women aren't men. Men aren't women.

Muscles are muscles- and muscled people look like muscled people- gender is irrelevant. Why must we always go about saying women who are bulky look like men- NO they look like people who bulk. Much like men who bulk... look like people who bulk.

Stop comparing women and men with muscles. it's stupid- it's the stupidest reason to not do something ever. It's a ridiculous notion- and and a ridiculous insult- or joke or whatever.

a whole lot of this

We're not talking about body image. We're talking about physical reality. Whether a woman thinks she is "too bulky" is a completely separate issue of whether or not she, in reality, became more bulky during a given time frame.

She said she got too bulky while doing this class. The reality is that her bulk decreased. If her body image changed, that's a separate issue.

The point is that it's literally impossible to become bulkier while you're at a calorie deficit, no matter how much weight you lift. Period, end of story, thanks for playing, let's all go home now.

and this too

No quantity of newbie gains will make any person or body part actually bigger. In some cases, a person in a calorie deficit can gain small amounts of muscle mass with newbie gains, but this is more than offset by a drop in fat mass.

No one actually gets larger in a calorie deficit, and bulk is literally size. You cannot increase your bulk in a calorie deficit.

Anyone who says they did failed to take proper measurements and track actual progress.

although I disagree with the body image to a point.

the REASON we are still having this conversation- and will continue to have it as long as SHAPE magazine and thier ilk exhist- is because of perception of body image. But otherwise I fully concur with your posts.

jonnythan

I think it's likely your understanding of 'bulky' and hers may be different. In her context, I took the word 'bulky' to mean highly-defined, perhaps large in proportion to the rest of her body, and inelegant - not a lithe, svelte look, but visibly muscular, which many women believe is unfeminine and unappealing. I know 'bulk' has a particular connotation in weightlifting, but it's not the only way to use that word.

If only there were some book written, where we could collect definitions of words so that when we use them we could make sure we're using them correctly. You could have them in alphabetical order, and give the meanings of words right next to the word itself.

If such a book existed, and the word "bulky" was in it, it could, for instance, say "of relatively large size" and not "smaller yet more defined."

If only such a book existed.

How many times a day do you use words in a sense not precisely aligned with their primary dictionary definition, but rather, in colloquial fashion? Context matters, and language evolves - just ask the Oxford English Dictionary team who spend all year, every year updating and editing the content of their publication. Do you 'follow' someone on Twitter or indulge in weightlifting 'geekery'? If we followed your apparent standards for the 'correct' use of language and ignored context, neither of those things would be possible, according to their precise dictionary definitions, until fairly recent years.

Even those OED guys who spend all year updating their entry for the word "bulky" have not found it reasonable to include an entry that says "small but defined."

If you are losing size and your muscles are becoming more visible, you are, literally and unarguably, not becoming bulkier.

Read the title of the thread. It's about "putting on muscle." People are using bulky to mean "bigger muscles." There is no semantic argument here.

People who complain that they're getting too bulky literally think their muscles are getting bigger. They are not. Period, end of story, zero room for argument.

castadiva

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

Why not? Bulkiness is purely perception. There isn't a special scale for it.

Bingo. Perception, which ties into body image, and how one feels about how one looks.

For what it's worth people invent new meanings for words all the time - see my post above about the OED.

phatguerilla

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

Why not? Bulkiness is purely perception. There isn't a special scale for it.

The why not is there are people here who think they added visibly significant 'bulk' to their body within two weeks of starting a shredding programme. No weight changes were reported, but even assuming a 5lb change had happening if that were muscular it would be across the whole body and visibly imperceptible. The problem has never been whether women can feel bulky or not the problem is women here adamantly stating they are building large quantities of localised muscle in an extremely short time frame, usually while trying to get smaller.

jonnythan

Let's get back to the initial post.

It's about women who think they're gaining muscle, and certain body parts are literally getting bigger, while losing weight.

You are not, and they are not.

jonnythan

Why do people keep insisting that this is an issue of differing viewpoints on the word "bulky?" You can't just decide on your own what words mean.

Why not? Bulkiness is purely perception. There isn't a special scale for it.

Bingo. Perception, which ties into body image, and how one feels about how one looks.

For what it's worth people invent new meanings for words all the time - see my post above about the OED.

Go read the OP again. It's literally a woman who thinks her muscles get bigger while she's losing weight, and that it makes her "bulkier" and "manish."

This is literally impossible.

CoderGal

I got really into weights and Les Mills BodyPump.. Was doing it a fair few times a week with heavy weights (no other women in the class were lifting what I was lifting & I wasn't taking anything apart from the odd protein shake here and there)

The long and short of it is I became 'bulky' my upper body, shoulders, back and arms was just horrible when I had clothes on

No, you didn't.

Show us the pics and measurements to prove it, because if that happened while you weren't gaining weight then you are a marvel of biology.

Why does she need to 'prove' anything? Her perception was that she started to look bulky doing those activities, and she changed her habits to avoid that. Her idea of bulky and yours may not be the same, but that doesn't mean that her perception of her own body is invalid or necessarily inaccurate.

Body image is an intensely personal thing, and what we perceive may not match others' perceptions of us, because their view is measured by a different fundamental scale to ours, produced by their own experiences. We all know someone who obsesses about some part of their appearance that we don't even notice. Just because their 'hooked' nose/'bulky' calves/'sticky-out' ears/ 'frizzy' hair doesn't bother our aesthetic sense, or measure up to our personal frame of reference for those things, does not mean that it isn't a real problem/issue and a source of self-consciousness to the person who owns the nose/ears/hair/calves/shoulders in question.

People need to learn to love their bodies, regardless of whether or not they are working to make improvements. No amount of diet or exercise will make you happy if you can't find happiness with who you are *right now.*

I don't believe that there is a person in this thread that would argue with that statement. What is being discussed is objective reality. I said earlier that it is very easy for people to misperceive what is happening with their own bodies, I have experienced it myself. Everyone believes that lifting weights makes people bigger but that only happens if that person is eating at a calorie surplus. For the vast majority of people on MFP, i.e. those who are dieting, lifting weights will simply preserve the LBM that they have as they lose weight. Even for the few who are completely untrained or who are genetically gifted and do gain some limited muscle mass while eating at a deficit, they will actually get smaller, as was illustrated by the fat/muscle comparison that CoderGal posted earlier.

I know this is a hard concept for people to learn. I've seen it again and again with others starting the process and quite far along in it, and I experienced it myself. No one is attacking anyone in this thread or challenging their "happiness." This is a genuine attempt to explain what is going on.

um no...bulk means large...large volume large size large mass...bulk. It doesn't mean smaller yet defined...and it never did no matter what context as far as I know.

BeachIron

I wish I had this "problem". My legs are always kind of man muscular, but damn can I get some upper body to match?

pics?

why?

Because they want to examine your pics and then tell you why you're wrong and then lecture you on weights, body fat %, muscle definition, heavy lifting vs. baby pink dumbbells, and throw in a bunch of sarcastic digs so they can show that they're part of the cool kids' club. Ad nauseam.

Yea. So sorry, that people who have been through this process are attempting to illustrate a point. Go find someone who will give you a hug, pat your head, and tell you "wow, you're so bulky!" It's all about the teddy bears and rainbows for some, actual progress for others.

LMAO!!!!

Sweetie, you've been here since March and you already have over 4000 posts. You seriously need to find something better to do with your time.

I read your profile. Rather than laughing and making snarky comments, you may want to listen to people who lost weight and have kept it off and also built muscle mass.

Start by re-reading the posts here because you are clearly reading them in a manner that is not intended or warranted. Again, we have been discussing the facts of what we could reasonably call bulking and cutting phases. A pro bodybuilder even entered for a while and graciously provided her pictures to illustrate.

This isn't about my time or the number of posts I have made. I'd honestly have to make fewer if people such as yourself would read more carefully.

I don't understand why my simple why escaladed into this...kind of unnecessary don't ya think?
All I wanted to know is why the original person I quoted wanted to see my pictures...

No one here wants to make fun of your pictures. I will state unequivocally that it is POSSIBLE for a woman to get bulky. I personally know women who I would call "bulky" (in the sense of muscle mass and not in the sense of fat as so many really are). You know what it took? Years, and I mean years, of lifting heavy weights and steroids. Yes. Steroids. Why do I know? Because the women told me that they used steroids.

What we can do, is if we look at your pictures, is tell you where you are and help you get to where you want to be. Most of the time it is a matter of continuing lifting, because once the fat comes off, if you are lifting heavy, you will be left with a lean and "toned" body. But it is 99 times out of 100 a case of too much body fat and not a case of too much muscle.

The pictures also help illustrate the difference between perception and reality. Again, and I've said repeatedly in this thread, I went through the same mental process of thinking I was getting bigger muscles when all I was doing was losing fat. The tape measure doesn't lie though.