Gaining Muscle is NOT that easy.

SergeantSunshine_reused

If you were seeking a trainer they would do that for you if that's what you wanted. I don't take measurements on regular clients unless they comply since it's very personal for some of them (some women don't want me pinching them on various areas on their body). You keep thinking that everyone is thinking like you. The majority of bodybuilders, especially men don't have trainers. They may have training partners for spotting and motivation, but except for the one's that actually make money, they train with knowledge they've accrued through trial and error.

I'm only thinking for myself. I have never said that people should think like me.

There's more than one way to get a person's body fat percentage than a caliper. I have a caliper, but don't use it. I own a 6 year old body fat scale and a 2 month old Omron Handheld body fat monitor. Both gives me the same body fat reading.

A lot of trainers use the Omron handheld body fat monitor.

those are known for being inaccurate. I would laugh at my trainer if he wanted to give me an accurate reading with one of those hand held ones or a body fat% scale.

AZackery

I would listen to some of the people in this thread then.

How many are personal trainers?

AZackery

those are known for being inaccurate. I would laugh at my trainer if he wanted to give me an accurate reading with one of those hand held ones or a body fat% scale.

What's 100% accurate?

Mine is giving me the same body fat percentage my scale is giving me. I trust them.

DKBelle

Agreed. I've been lifting 8lbs of dumbbells and doing 25lbs of kettlebell workouts, but there was no big change and I am working out a couple of months ago ) I am lazy to do this type of workout, but maybe you guys like www.bodyrock.tv
Check it out!

SergeantSunshine_reused

those are known for being inaccurate. I would laugh at my trainer if he wanted to give me an accurate reading with one of those hand held ones or a body fat% scale.

What's 100% accurate?

Mine is giving me the same body fat percentage my scale is giving me. I trust them.

I didn't say 100% there are ones that are more accurate then others.

For an accurate measure I get mine tested in the bod pod.

SergeantSunshine_reused

I would listen to some of the people in this thread then.

How many are personal trainers?

Uh I have met a lot of personal trainers who don't know *kitten* honestly. So saying that really doesn't help.
A lot of these people know what they are talking about and have many years of experience backing them up.

AZackery

I didn't say 100% there are ones that are more accurate then others.

For an accurate measure I get mine tested in the bod pod.

My scale and Omron Handheld monitor is accurate to me.

People have gotten a dunk test done and then a test done by an Omron handheld monitor and have came out with the same body fat percentage. The dunk test is said to be more accurate than any other body fat percentage device.

I tell anyone, whatever works for you, go with it. I'm not going to let anyone turn me away from my scale and Omron handheld device. Something has to be accurate for me, to have two devices giving me the same reading.

AZackery

Uh I have met a lot of personal trainers who don't know *kitten* honestly. So saying that really doesn't help.
A lot of these people know what they are talking about and have many years of experience backing them up.

You have told me that I should listen to some of the people on here. Who were you referring to and what makes them know what they are talking about?

SergeantSunshine_reused

I didn't say 100% there are ones that are more accurate then others.

For an accurate measure I get mine tested in the bod pod.

My scale and Omron Handheld monitor is accurate to me.

People have gotten a dunk test done and then a test done by an Omron handheld monitor and have came out with the same body fat percentage. The dunk test is said to be more accurate than any other body fat percentage device.

I tell anyone, whatever works for you, go with it. I'm not going to let anyone turn me away from my scale and Omron handheld device. Something has to be accurate for me, to have two devices giving me the same reading.

I wouldn't say its more accurate. But more convenient and not as expensive! Being an athlete I do not have to pay for the bod pod which is lucky :] I used the body fat % scale and the bod pod gave me a very different reading

AZackery

I wouldn't say its more accurate. But more convenient and not as expensive! Being an athlete I do not have to pay for the bod pod which is lucky :] I used the body fat % scale and the bod pod gave me a very different reading

Use what's best for you. All body fat percentage devices have errors.

SergeantSunshine_reused

Uh I have met a lot of personal trainers who don't know *kitten* honestly. So saying that really doesn't help.
A lot of these people know what they are talking about and have many years of experience backing them up.

You have told me that I should listen to some of the people on here. Who were you referring to and what makes them know what they are talking about?

Ninerbuff is an obvious one. Also pay attention to PB67's posts. Im just saying that they have a ton of experience. And PB will give you plenty of peer reviewed studies. You don't have much backing you up at the moment. Maybe try to open up to some of the replys they are giving :]

AZackery

Ninerbuff is an obvious one. Also pay attention to PB67's posts. Im just saying that they have a ton of experience. And PB will give you plenty of peer reviewed studies. You don't have much backing you up at the moment. Maybe try to open up to some of the replys they are giving :]

They don't have much backing them up either.

taso42

Ninerbuff is an obvious one. Also pay attention to PB67's posts. Im just saying that they have a ton of experience. And PB will give you plenty of peer reviewed studies. You don't have much backing you up at the moment. Maybe try to open up to some of the replys they are giving :]

They don't have much backing them up either.

Are you really that dense* ? Decades of experience, consistent good info, and a good physique to back it up. I guess that's not much though.

Keep up the good work, speading lulz on the boards. Have you considered starting a blog or newsletter?

* specifically - steel dumbbell dense, as opposed to ream of copy paper dense

Rae6503

I still don't understand what we are arguing about. AZ, you think it IS easy to gain muscle?

prdough

azackary, regardless of what arguments you are making, do you really think you will change people's minds?

If you believe that you are correct, use this as fuel to prove it to everyone! follow your program and get muscular without lifting! If some actress can do it in 60 days, give it 90 days and post an update. You will have a lot more credibility then.


I for one think you should give it a shot. If it doesn't work well for you, try lifting weights and see if you can see a difference. Prove it to yourself instead of using actresses and athletes as anecdotal evidence.

Me, I'm going to keep lifting to preserve the muscle i have.

Cheers and good luck!

IronSmasher

I have to use paper, I can't pick up dumbells

AZackery

I will end this by saying this. No one has told me how a person can tell if they are gaining muscles.

There's a formula people can use to tell how much of their scale weight is from fat and how much is from lean body mass.

Anyone that doesn't believe me, feel free to search the internet.

Formula:

Weight x Body fat percentage = Pounds of fat
Weight - Pounds of fat = Lean body mass

If there's a formula that people can use to track their fat/lean body mass gain/loss, then surely there should be a formula a person can use to track their muscle gain.

Fact: No one that's trying to lose weight can step on their scale and see a 20 pounds scale weight loss and say they have loss 20 pounds of fat. In order for a person to know how much fat they have loss, they need to know their body fat percentage and do the math to see how much fat they have loss.

Fact: Fat loss and scale weight loss aren't the same thing. Why? A person can lose 5 pounds of scale weight in an hour, but they can't lose 5 pounds of fat in an hour.

Fact: A person can't step on their scale and see a 20 pounds scale weight gain and say they have gained 20 pounds of muscles. In order for a person to know how much muscle or should I say lean body mass, they have gained, they need to know their body fat percentage and do the math to see how much lean body mass they have gained.

Fact: A lot of people, including bodybuilders sees an increase in lean body mass as muscle gain. They use the formula I have shared to track both their fat loss and muscles gain.

Fact: It's not easy to gain muscles or to lose pounds of fat. I know that scale weight gain, can be a result of muscle gain.

To me there's a difference between regular muscular arms and bodybuilder muscular arms.

Madonna has regular muscular arms. She's not a bodybuilder. Chyna is a bodybuilder and she has bulky arms. I don't believe the time to get either arms are the same. That's why I believe that a person can get regular muscular arms in a short period of time. To me, 1, 2, 3 and 4 months is fast. Time goes fast.

I'm not aiming to gain muscles, but if I see scale weight gain, I will definitely check to see if I have gained muscles. I don't care if it's 1 pound of muscle.

People are going to believe what they want to believe. I believe that a person can get regular muscular arms in a short period of time.

I believe that in order for a person to find out if they have gained muscles, they need to use the formula I have shared above.

Okay, I'm done. No one needs to reply to anything I have said, because I'm moving along. This is my last post. Everyone continue to do what you feel is right for your body. Keep believing what you want to believe.

Lyadeia

Ninerbuff is an obvious one. Also pay attention to PB67's posts. Im just saying that they have a ton of experience. And PB will give you plenty of peer reviewed studies. You don't have much backing you up at the moment. Maybe try to open up to some of the replys they are giving :]

They don't have much backing them up either.

Are you really that dense* ? Decades of experience, consistent good info, and a good physique to back it up. I guess that's not much though.

Keep up the good work, speading lulz on the boards. Have you considered starting a blog or newsletter?

* specifically - steel dumbbell dense, as opposed to ream of copy paper dense

+1

I've gotten a pretty good laugh at most of AZackery's posts. There's no reason for me to respond since Ninerbuff did so with what I would have said anyway.

And as far as her last post...she asks us to "feel free to search the internet" rather than peer reviewed scientific studies...cause obviously some blogger in his basement with no real training and most likely is hiding his flabby physique behind his computer knows more than the researchers and actual bodybuilders who live this stuff on a daily basis. Whateva...

Lyadeia

Madonna has regular muscular arms. She's not a bodybuilder. Chyna is a bodybuilder and she has bulky arms. I don't believe the time to get either arms are the same. That's why I believe that a person can get regular muscular arms in a short period of time.

Wow, you do realize that Madonna LIFTS WEIGHTS and that Chyna is on STEROIDS? Kinda different, ya know.

I'm a fan of Madonna from way back, and her workout routines are probably more than a person such as yourself could handle. Lots of weight lifting, yoga/pilates, and cardio...

Chyna, just like many other current and ex wrestlers, got "bulky" because of too much testosterone injections...

emmab0902

Weight x Body fat percentage = Pounds of fat
Weight - Pounds of fat = Lean body mass


How does that work?? Which category does blood, stomach contents, bones and vital organs fit into - fat or lean body mass??

lexgem

Arguments aside, I think I've learned a bit from this thread. I honestly thought that I had been gaining muscle while eating at a deficit and doing mostly water calisthenics and a body pump class per week, spinning, step, pilates, and a bit of ripped in 30 when I can't make it to the gym (I try to hit each of those classes once a week)
One thing I know for sure is that I have gotten stronger -- I can feel it, I can lift heavier weights in body pump than I could two months ago, I can carry my dog without feeling like I'm going to die, I can actually help my husband move furniture, and I have some (still on the low side of normal) core strength where before I hardly had any at all. I have also increased my endurance.

Before, like 4 years ago, I was 50 kg. But I was skinny-fat. When I joined MFP I was 60 kg (having lost 2 kg through diet alone before joining). Now, I'm 58 kg and I know I look better than I did at 54 kg last time, and I know that last time I was 58 kg there was no way I could fit into the jeans I wear now.

So I assumed I had gained muscle.

I have to admit all I really learned from this thread is that I don't know much. I just want to be in overall better shape. I never want to be that girl who was out of breath for 15 minutes of class after climbing 4 flights of stairs. I never want to be that girl who is exhausted after 10 minutes of skiing and needs frequent breaks. Last year i went skiing with my husband and he did 2 pistes while I was resting, then we did one together and I rested again. So for me it isn't about muscle gain alone or weight loss alone but about being fit overall (which is why I'm doing so many different classes, I figure this way I'm improving my overall fitness and keeping it interesting enough so I don't get bored and quit.
I would like to gain actual muscle, to be stronger and actually be able to help friends move house and be an active participant in my next move beyond just packing boxes. I want to not break my back when picking up my child for the first time (adoption, I might have a 3 year-old...). Kids get heavy faster than lhasa apsos tend to (and mine is big at 7.5 kg), to the point where even a one-year old would be heavy for me at this point, honestly, if I had to carry one around for awhile.

So I'm going to try my best to learn. I want this to work.

Does rowing build muscle? I'm curious because I always thought that swimming did and even running (in the legs). Please don't make fun of me, these are real newbie questions.

Also one question. At the gym, just two days ago, I had measurements done, and I climbed on a scale and the scale actually said what percentage of muscle I have and what percentage of body fat. I can't remember the numbers (my trainer will e-mail me the files this week) except the body fat was 25%. Are those measurements reliable or is it kind of gimmicky and should I just trust the jeans test?

emmab0902

Also one question. At the gym, just two days ago, I had measurements done, and I climbed on a scale and the scale actually said what percentage of muscle I have and what percentage of body fat. I can't remember the numbers (my trainer will e-mail me the files this week) except the body fat was 25%. Are those measurements reliable or is it kind of gimmicky and should I just trust the jeans test?

In my experience they are bollocks. Case in point, when I was at my thinnest (ate nearly no protein and did zero exercise let alone strength training) they said I had 50% lean body mass and -3% body fat - yes you read that right MINUS 3%.

Lyadeia

Does rowing build muscle? I'm curious because I always thought that swimming did and even running (in the legs). Please don't make fun of me, these are real newbie questions.

Also one question. At the gym, just two days ago, I had measurements done, and I climbed on a scale and the scale actually said what percentage of muscle I have and what percentage of body fat. I can't remember the numbers (my trainer will e-mail me the files this week) except the body fat was 25%. Are those measurements reliable or is it kind of gimmicky and should I just trust the jeans test?

Rowing, running, swimming, etc. strengthens the muscle that you have by activating more muscle fibers that you already have. The creation of new muscle fibers comes from resistance training...weight training and body weight exercises (pull-ups, push-ups, etc). I like to think of the brain getting smarter analogy...when you learn something new, you didn't grow new brain matter, you just activated more of what you already had to store new facts.

Those body fat type scales are not that accurate. If you use that scale consistently at the same time of day, wearing the same thing, after the same meal (or lack thereof) it can be used to gauge success by showing a positive change. When measuring body fat like this or some crazy formula that "everyone" knows, lol, it's really not the number that it gives you which is important, but the change in those numbers over time which can numerically show you if you are doing the right thing with your nutrition and workouts. That said, the jeans test is awesome. I've never known someone to jump for joy when their body fat scale said they went from 25 to 24 percent...but it's a different story when that same person fits into a size 4 when they were previously in a 6, for example.

soysos

Arguments aside, I think I've learned a bit from this thread. I honestly thought that I had been gaining muscle while eating at a deficit and doing mostly water calisthenics and a body pump class per week, spinning, step, pilates, and a bit of ripped in 30 when I can't make it to the gym (I try to hit each of those classes once a week)
One thing I know for sure is that I have gotten stronger -- I can feel it, I can lift heavier weights in body pump than I could two months ago, I can carry my dog without feeling like I'm going to die, I can actually help my husband move furniture, and I have some (still on the low side of normal) core strength where before I hardly had any at all. I have also increased my endurance.

Before, like 4 years ago, I was 50 kg. But I was skinny-fat. When I joined MFP I was 60 kg (having lost 2 kg through diet alone before joining). Now, I'm 58 kg and I know I look better than I did at 54 kg last time, and I know that last time I was 58 kg there was no way I could fit into the jeans I wear now.

So I assumed I had gained muscle.

I have to admit all I really learned from this thread is that I don't know much. I just want to be in overall better shape. I never want to be that girl who was out of breath for 15 minutes of class after climbing 4 flights of stairs. I never want to be that girl who is exhausted after 10 minutes of skiing and needs frequent breaks. Last year i went skiing with my husband and he did 2 pistes while I was resting, then we did one together and I rested again. So for me it isn't about muscle gain alone or weight loss alone but about being fit overall (which is why I'm doing so many different classes, I figure this way I'm improving my overall fitness and keeping it interesting enough so I don't get bored and quit.
I would like to gain actual muscle, to be stronger and actually be able to help friends move house and be an active participant in my next move beyond just packing boxes. I want to not break my back when picking up my child for the first time (adoption, I might have a 3 year-old...). Kids get heavy faster than lhasa apsos tend to (and mine is big at 7.5 kg), to the point where even a one-year old would be heavy for me at this point, honestly, if I had to carry one around for awhile.

So I'm going to try my best to learn. I want this to work.

Does rowing build muscle? I'm curious because I always thought that swimming did and even running (in the legs). Please don't make fun of me, these are real newbie questions.

Also one question. At the gym, just two days ago, I had measurements done, and I climbed on a scale and the scale actually said what percentage of muscle I have and what percentage of body fat. I can't remember the numbers (my trainer will e-mail me the files this week) except the body fat was 25%. Are those measurements reliable or is it kind of gimmicky and should I just trust the jeans test?

you did gain muscle. one cannot get stronger without gaining muscle.

lexgem

Rowing, running, swimming, etc. strengthens the muscle that you have by activating more muscle fibers that you already have. The creation of new muscle fibers comes from resistance training...weight training and body weight exercises (pull-ups, push-ups, etc). I like to think of the brain getting smarter analogy...when you learn something new, you didn't grow new brain matter, you just activated more of what you already had to store new facts.

Thanks! This makes a lot of sense to me, actually. I think that's mostly what I've been doing, but I think I might have put on a (little) muscle mass over the last 2 months, since I do body pump once a week and pilates (pilates builds muscles, right, since it uses body weight quite a bit with the planks), aquagym (a lot of resistance training in my particular class with floating objects we need to push, pull, and the core is engaged quite a bit too) and of course ripped in 30 has some strength too.

One more question, about "muscle confusion". What does that do exactly? Is that for strengthening muscle you already have, building new muscle, or both?

Lyadeia

One more question, about "muscle confusion". What does that do exactly? Is that for strengthening muscle you already have, building new muscle, or both?

Muscle confusion is a fancy way of saying that you do different exercises to hit the same muscle. Like for a month I do hammer curls for the biceps, and then in the second month I do preacher curls. People like to throw the term around a lot lately, especially because of P90X. Not that I am downing P90X, cause I love the program. Anyway, it's mainly used a way to keep your workouts varied so you avoid plateaus. This can be a building muscle plateau, or a losing fat plateau...but changing up your routines when they start becoming less effective is really all it boils down to. In P90X, you change routines every 4 weeks. You still work the same muscles, just do different exercises in different orders to prevent your body from getting too accustomed to it.

dad106

AZackery, don't listen to these people. They are just jealous.

I just want to say jealous of what.. the fact that she has no clue what she's talking about and has been refuted multiple times?

Hell, I even know better then her, and I don't know that much about gaining muscle except what I've read from the people refuting her on this site.

soysos

First off if rowing, swimming, and running is not resistance training define resistance.

Second any time you stress your muscles beyond what there used to they break down, after that the body repairs them. Do it consistently the protects itself from farther damage by building more muscle fibers. This is how streangth is built. Any activity can become resistance training if the muscles are breaking down. This may not be the fastest way to build muscle but ot will build.

PB67

you did gain muscle. one cannot get stronger without gaining muscle.

This is not true at all.

Two words: Rate Coding.

PB67

One more question, about "muscle confusion". What does that do exactly? Is that for strengthening muscle you already have, building new muscle, or both?

Nothing.

Muscle confusion is a myth used to sell a product.