Language Does Matter!

Farfourah

Language evolves, deal with it.

So, the evolving of language means we should not try to keep up and have some comprehension of it and how to communicate properly? Or, did I take that the wrong way?

It can be an evolution of language. There's a reason why we don't speak like Shakespeare. Language is ever-changing, and there are some scholars that even argue for the teaching of Ebonics, widely considered to be horrid way of spelling and extremely grammatically incorrect.

I do think Language is important and it does matter SOMETIMES. But I also think Geography, History and Math is pretty important. I'm not going to knock anyone for not understanding basic arithmetic, or World History or not knowing where Lebanon is on a world map.

On top of that, I don't think grammar is reflective of a person at all. Rather, grammar,among many other things, is reflective of the poor state of our education.

I think language is more important than just sometimes if people have no clue what a person is saying, therefore the communication comes to a standstill. I' not knocking anyone. I'm just saying that language is more important than people are willing to admit.

Language is important, we agree. A language free of grammatical errors all the time with zero misspellings is not important most times is my view. To each, their own.

And I refuse to believe that people can not comprehend what someone is trying to communicate because of a few grammatical errors, or misspellings.

IpuffyheartHeelsinthegym

I feel that the original intent of the blog has been misconstrued. Perhaps I need to work on my communication skills.

I will make a pine cone bird feeder or a nice pirate hat out of newspaper.

I need a new arts & crafts project for the kids. Any ideas?

HeelsAndBoxingGloves

Overall, humans are judgmental. All of us. We judge based on limited information that we are given. No, judging other based on spelling, grammar, math skills, reading level, clothing, hair style, shoes, weight, etc. is not okay but it happens now and will continue to happen in the future. The blog wasn't saying people "suck" because they can't spell and have trouble with grammar, it was making a point that you will be judged on how you type on an internet forum (and perhaps your picture) because that is all the information that we have available about you, and if you try and use proper spelling and grammar you will be judged differently than if you use "text speak". Also, that communication skills are a necessary part of life and even if spelling and grammar are difficult for you there are lots of resources to help you out. Heck, I just started using Google Chrome instead of IE, and it spell checks everything I type, definitely helps me out since I suck at spelling.

Chagama

I'm majoring in early childhood education, of course I value education and I plan on doing my best to make sure that every child I teach gets the best education that they can. However, I recognize that it is harder for some than others and some people will always struggle with grammar, so I refuse to judge people and feel better about myself just because something comes easier to me than it does others.

NO offense to you personally since I don't know you, but of the 4 teachers my boys have had at school, 2 of these teachers had VERY poor grammatical skills and made typos constantly on newsletters that were sent home to the parents. Since they were teaching preschool and kindergarten respectively, I didn't frown upon it. However, if it had been in higher grade levels, I as a parent would have been very concerned that my child was being taught by someone who made these type of errors, and I would have approached the principal about moving to a different class where they would learn properly. Please keep this in mind in your future endeavors.

Poor grammar by teachers has been a significant issue with our children at times. My daughter had some interesting experiences early on in math because her teacher constantly used poor grammar in word problems. My daughter would read it correctly and conclude that there was not enough information to answer the question. Her teacher would mark her as having the wrong answer and we'd have to intercede on her behalf.

yummy♥

How do you like my strawman?

A strawman, you say? This sounds like another lovely project!
Do you have instructions for this, good sir?

AmberJslimsAWAY

I'm an ESL teacher, and it SHOCKS me that native speakers mistake you're/your and their/there/they're.

That shocks you? They're three words that sound the same, it doesn't surprise me that some people get it confused. I know the difference but that doesn't mean that you won't ever catch me accidentally typing there when I mean their.

Proper grammar comes naturally to some of us, so it's easy to not realize that it really can be a struggle for some people. It doesn't mean that they don't care or that they're stupid and it certainly isn't a reason to start feeling better about yourself.

Why not worry about real problems and not petty things like how someone spells or types...this isn't a classroom.

I couldn't disagree more. Their, there, and they're all sound the same yes, but they all have differen't meanings.

Not using correct grammar=stupidity and laziness, in my opinion.

AliciaBeth78

I'm majoring in early childhood education, of course I value education and I plan on doing my best to make sure that every child I teach gets the best education that they can. However, I recognize that it is harder for some than others and some people will always struggle with grammar, so I refuse to judge people and feel better about myself just because something comes easier to me than it does others.

NO offense to you personally since I don't know you, but of the 4 teachers my boys have had at school, 2 of these teachers had VERY poor grammatical skills and made typos constantly on newsletters that were sent home to the parents. Since they were teaching preschool and kindergarten respectively, I didn't frown upon it. However, if it had been in higher grade levels, I as a parent would have been very concerned that my child was being taught by someone who made these type of errors, and I would have approached the principal about moving to a different class where they would learn properly. Please keep this in mind in your future endeavors.

I actually have to disagree with this. I'm a high school teacher and I have to tell you that kids come to my class every year barely knowing common words. I can't even tell you how many times I have heard the word "pacifically" JUST this year alone. It makes me cringe every time I hear it! The problem is if the kids aren't learning things in the lower grades, they have no foundation to build upon in the higher grades.... THAT is one place where the educational system is suffering!

scs143

I do struggle with grammar and spelling. I'm not sure why. English was my best subject as a child, but as an adult, I find it slipping away, which is kind of scary. Plus, I am super sensitive about it.

I do read quite a bit. Always have. It's weird. I will be typing and suddenly I will forget how to spell a very simple word and I have to google it. This is coming from the 4th grade class spelling bee champion. I guess maybe technology has contributed to it. Almost everything has spell check or auto correct.

While my initial response was to disagree, on reflection I am inclined to wonder whether this is correct, as all too often I've found myself clicking on my calculator to solve a problem that once I'd have solved using mental arithmetic.

My response: In many situations in life, your writing will precede you, and you will be judged according to it. It's not necessarily FAIR...but it's the way it is.

It's ironic that as social networking has become more prevalent, communication skills have become more and more vital. Remember, once something has been posted online, it doesn't go away; googling people's names and email addresses is becoming commonplace in recruitment.

I don't know about any of you, but when I see someone write things like "wat's dat?" or "u kno", I tend to think they are of a lesser intelligence or very very young. Either way, it's not okay.

On the contrary, it's perfectly okay to be either very very young, or of a lesser intelligence.

Of course, those writing in this way may not necessarily realise those inferences are being drawn about them... :bigsmile:

I just have to say, I really loved your last comment. "On the contrary, it's perfectly okay to be either very very young, or of a lesser intelligence."

Yes, it is okay. And in no way does it make you less of a person. Not to mention that grammar and spelling abilities do not dictate a person's intelligence. I can out-write my fiance any day but he is by far the smartest person I've ever met when it comes to anything math based. Who is to say which trait is more valued?

In no way was I attempting to say that it's not okay to be young or of a lesser intelligence. I was saying that is it not okay to use the language that I referenced and I think that she knew that.

EXACTLY... grammar and spelling abilities do not dictate a person's intelligence. The person who writes like that may very well be smart. But, it doesn't appear that way. To me, they appear stupid. APPEAR being the operative word. Writing is all we do here. Why would you want the impression to be that you are stupid?

honeysprinkles

I'm majoring in early childhood education, of course I value education and I plan on doing my best to make sure that every child I teach gets the best education that they can. However, I recognize that it is harder for some than others and some people will always struggle with grammar, so I refuse to judge people and feel better about myself just because something comes easier to me than it does others.

NO offense to you personally since I don't know you, but of the 4 teachers my boys have had at school, 2 of these teachers had VERY poor grammatical skills and made typos constantly on newsletters that were sent home to the parents. Since they were teaching preschool and kindergarten respectively, I didn't frown upon it. However, if it had been in higher grade levels, I as a parent would have been very concerned that my child was being taught by someone who made these type of errors, and I would have approached the principal about moving to a different class where they would learn properly. Please keep this in mind in your future endeavors.

Poor grammar by teachers has been a significant issue with our children at times. My daughter had some interesting experiences early on in math because her teacher constantly used poor grammar in word problems. My daughter would read it correctly and conclude that there was not enough information to answer the question. Her teacher would mark her as having the wrong answer and we'd have to intercede on her behalf.

And this is where the real problem lies. Not half-hearted internet slang/shorthand and rants about poor grammar. Too many kids are being failed by their teachers and the education system.

TDGee

Bad spelling/ grammar is perpetuated by the internet, text messaging and ignorance in general. I just want to know why someone who can't figure out the difference between there/their/they're would want to teach young children....

are you trying to take a jab at me? point out one place where I've indicated that I don't know the difference between their, they're, or there. Or better yet, point out where I've misused any of them. Please. :flowerforyou:

Language matters. That is what I am taking with me from this thread.

I bid you adieu with this because this is the mental image I am getting about your posts.




I think it's time you go take your rag medicine. Good day.

Oh, that's right. I forgot, I'm a female so clearly all of my problems are due to my menstrual cycle. I don't know how I even made my way out of the kitchen long enough to engage in this argument, but let me take my mydol and get back to where I belong. So sorry...

Honestly, I'd understand being offended by that if a guy posted it... but a girl posted it, get over yourself a little bit and enjoy a laugh. :flowerforyou:

I find it all the more offensive coming from a female. Sexism is sexism and it's only worse when perpetuated by members of my own gender.

Whoever posted the deleted Midol comment made this a sexism argument. There was NOTHING alluding to gender in the cartoon. What would you like to argue about now? There is a debatable debating group, some really great stuff in there.
Now, I'm off to buy some heavy duty foil to make a new hat.

honeysprinkles

I'm an ESL teacher, and it SHOCKS me that native speakers mistake you're/your and their/there/they're.

That shocks you? They're three words that sound the same, it doesn't surprise me that some people get it confused. I know the difference but that doesn't mean that you won't ever catch me accidentally typing there when I mean their.

Proper grammar comes naturally to some of us, so it's easy to not realize that it really can be a struggle for some people. It doesn't mean that they don't care or that they're stupid and it certainly isn't a reason to start feeling better about yourself.

Why not worry about real problems and not petty things like how someone spells or types...this isn't a classroom.

I couldn't disagree more. Their, there, and they're all sound the same yes, but they all have differen't meanings.

Not using correct grammar=stupidity and laziness, in my opinion.

Generalizations like the above = ignorance in my opinion.

My mom has a terrible time with grammar and spelling and simple things like when to keep an "e" or when to drop it. When she was in school, she got passed along instead of ever getting the time and education she needed. She is NOT stupid and she is absolutely NOT lazy and that's exactly why your ignorance pisses me off so much.

MikeSEA

While languages do die--no culture speaks Latin as its primary language--the English language isn't dying. It's just changing, and it will continue to change to suit the communication needs of the population.

If one set of speakers see a deficiency in the linguistic skills of another set of speakers, I think it probably has more to do with the differences in values for those sets. I don't mean values in a moral sense necessarily. Let's take its/it's as an example. We know they're not identical in use because they mean different things; it's the difference between using a possessive and using a contraction. It's interesting, though, that the misuse of the apostrophe doesn't make a sentence completely unparseable. I would guess that most of the time that this error occurs, people don't have a problem deriving the intended meaning. It begs the question about how necessary the rule is.

Does it serve a grammatical purpose or sociolinguistic purpose for identifying people by class/education level as it's performed?

I guess the TLDR version is: Unless meaning is confused or communication is hampered, language doesn't matter so much as we think it does.

While Mark Twain was correct in that the difference between the lightning bug and the lightning is a small, yet important, word, not everything is lightning.

HeelsAndBoxingGloves

Bad spelling/ grammar is perpetuated by the internet, text messaging and ignorance in general. I just want to know why someone who can't figure out the difference between there/their/they're would want to teach young children....

are you trying to take a jab at me? point out one place where I've indicated that I don't know the difference between their, they're, or there. Or better yet, point out where I've misused any of them. Please. :flowerforyou:

Language matters. That is what I am taking with me from this thread.

I bid you adieu with this because this is the mental image I am getting about your posts.




I think it's time you go take your rag medicine. Good day.

Oh, that's right. I forgot, I'm a female so clearly all of my problems are due to my menstrual cycle. I don't know how I even made my way out of the kitchen long enough to engage in this argument, but let me take my mydol and get back to where I belong. So sorry...

Honestly, I'd understand being offended by that if a guy posted it... but a girl posted it, get over yourself a little bit and enjoy a laugh. :flowerforyou:

I find it all the more offensive coming from a female. Sexism is sexism and it's only worse when perpetuated by members of my own gender.

Whoever posted the deleted Midol comment made this a sexism argument. There was NOTHING alluding to gender in the cartoon. What would you like to argue about now? There is a debatable debating group, some really great stuff in there.
Now, I'm off to buy some heavy duty foil to make a new hat.

The person who said it was sexist posted the quoted Midol comment that you are referring too

myofibril

How do you like my strawman?

A strawman, you say? This sounds like another lovely project!
Do you have instructions for this, good sir?

It would involve straw of some sort. Maybe hay.

Oh, and a man. Definitely a man.

Apart from that I got nuffink...

honeysprinkles

Bad spelling/ grammar is perpetuated by the internet, text messaging and ignorance in general. I just want to know why someone who can't figure out the difference between there/their/they're would want to teach young children....

are you trying to take a jab at me? point out one place where I've indicated that I don't know the difference between their, they're, or there. Or better yet, point out where I've misused any of them. Please. :flowerforyou:

Language matters. That is what I am taking with me from this thread.

I bid you adieu with this because this is the mental image I am getting about your posts.




I think it's time you go take your rag medicine. Good day.

Oh, that's right. I forgot, I'm a female so clearly all of my problems are due to my menstrual cycle. I don't know how I even made my way out of the kitchen long enough to engage in this argument, but let me take my mydol and get back to where I belong. So sorry...

Honestly, I'd understand being offended by that if a guy posted it... but a girl posted it, get over yourself a little bit and enjoy a laugh. :flowerforyou:

I find it all the more offensive coming from a female. Sexism is sexism and it's only worse when perpetuated by members of my own gender.

Whoever posted the deleted Midol comment made this a sexism argument. There was NOTHING alluding to gender in the cartoon. What would you like to argue about now? There is a debatable debating group, some really great stuff in there.
Now, I'm off to buy some heavy duty foil to make a new hat.

"I think it's time you go take your rag medicine. Good day. " Was that not a reference to my menstrual cycle?

myofibril

People who aren't good at spelling/grammar are usually on low carb.

It's the inshulin. I knew it!

AmberJslimsAWAY

I'm an ESL teacher, and it SHOCKS me that native speakers mistake you're/your and their/there/they're.

That shocks you? They're three words that sound the same, it doesn't surprise me that some people get it confused. I know the difference but that doesn't mean that you won't ever catch me accidentally typing there when I mean their.

Proper grammar comes naturally to some of us, so it's easy to not realize that it really can be a struggle for some people. It doesn't mean that they don't care or that they're stupid and it certainly isn't a reason to start feeling better about yourself.

Why not worry about real problems and not petty things like how someone spells or types...this isn't a classroom.

I couldn't disagree more. Their, there, and they're all sound the same yes, but they all have differen't meanings.

Not using correct grammar=stupidity and laziness, in my opinion.

Generalizations like the above = ignorance in my opinion.

My mom has a terrible time with grammar and spelling and simple things like when to keep an "e" or when to drop it. When she was in school, she got passed along instead of ever getting the time and education she needed. She is NOT stupid and she is absolutely NOT lazy and that's exactly why your ignorance pisses me off so much.

I was more talking about different words that sound the same and have different meanings. But you obviously are in a tizzy over this thread.... which boggles my mind

yummy♥

How do you like my strawman?

A strawman, you say? This sounds like another lovely project!
Do you have instructions for this, good sir?

It would involve straw of some sort. Maybe hay.

Oh, and a man. Definitely a man.

Apart from that I got nuffink...

*heads off to find a man*

k8blujay2

Language evolves, deal with it.

So, the evolving of language means we should not try to keep up and have some comprehension of it and how to communicate properly? Or, did I take that the wrong way?

It can be an evolution of language. There's a reason why we don't speak like Shakespeare. Language is ever-changing, and there are some scholars that even argue for the teaching of Ebonics, widely considered to be horrid way of spelling and extremely grammatically incorrect.

I do think Language is important and it does matter SOMETIMES. But I also think Geography, History and Math is pretty important. I'm not going to knock anyone for not understanding basic arithmetic, or World History or not knowing where Lebanon is on a world map.

On top of that, I don't think grammar is reflective of a person at all. Rather, grammar,among many other things, is reflective of the poor state of our education.

But we can still read and understand Shakespeare some 500 years later without too much of a translation (meaning one does not need a degree in Literature to understand Shakespeares plays). And to be honest, I also find it a problem when people cannot do basic arithmetic (I will give a pass on algebra or calculus) or cannot find their own State (or any other State) on a map. These are basic skills. Yes, we make mistakes. However, there is a difference between unintentional mistakes (e.g. typos) and ones made because the person doesn't care or doesn't know any better. Does that mean we have a poor state of our education? Perhaps, but it takes more than the teachers (or the school system) to educate a person. They have to care and desire it. I don't have the greatest of grammar or spelling skills myself, but it's not that hard to look up the rules online or in a book.

honeysprinkles

I'm an ESL teacher, and it SHOCKS me that native speakers mistake you're/your and their/there/they're.

That shocks you? They're three words that sound the same, it doesn't surprise me that some people get it confused. I know the difference but that doesn't mean that you won't ever catch me accidentally typing there when I mean their.

Proper grammar comes naturally to some of us, so it's easy to not realize that it really can be a struggle for some people. It doesn't mean that they don't care or that they're stupid and it certainly isn't a reason to start feeling better about yourself.

Why not worry about real problems and not petty things like how someone spells or types...this isn't a classroom.

I couldn't disagree more. Their, there, and they're all sound the same yes, but they all have differen't meanings.

Not using correct grammar=stupidity and laziness, in my opinion.

Generalizations like the above = ignorance in my opinion.

My mom has a terrible time with grammar and spelling and simple things like when to keep an "e" or when to drop it. When she was in school, she got passed along instead of ever getting the time and education she needed. She is NOT stupid and she is absolutely NOT lazy and that's exactly why your ignorance pisses me off so much.

I was more talking about different words that sound the same and have different meanings. But you obviously are in a tizzy over this thread.... which boggles my mind

It's about more than just this thread, it's about the people who have to deal with the judgmental ignorance rampant in this thread on a daily basis.

And I'm not "in a tizzy," I like arguing and I don't have much else going on atm so it's keeping me busy.