PSU Punishment...
Replies
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You know who I'd like to see punished? The parents of the first victims, who knew their child had been abused, that didn't report the abuse to the police. They could've just as easily prevented the later cases as JoPa. They didn't, and now, years later, they are getting monetary rewards. That is just as sick in my opinion.
Do you know any of this for fact?0 -
I think they should change the name of the University to Pathetic State University for the 4 years too.
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You know who I'd like to see punished? The parents of the first victims, who knew their child had been abused, that didn't report the abuse to the police. They could've just as easily prevented the later cases as JoPa. They didn't, and now, years later, they are getting monetary rewards. That is just as sick in my opinion.
Do you know any of this for fact?
From Wiki, so maybe not fact but usually a good starting point:
"The investigation was initiated in the spring of 2008, after the mother of a boy (identified in court papers as "Victim 1"), then a freshman at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County, Pennsylvania, reported that the boy had been sexually abused by Sandusky. " She clearly didn't "report" to the police or there wouldn't have been a cover-up.0 -
I have mixed feelings on the severity of the punishment and whether it should have been harsher. I can argue on both sides of it. I feel that the ones hit the hardest over and over are the kids. First the kids that were abused, and now the ones in the current and impending future teams are suffering for what some really messed up people decided to do and to cover up.0
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Go after those involed. The student athlete, the progam and the institution do not need to be destroyed. there are a lot of people that are going to be punished that have nothing to with it. Fire administers and people involved, but there are innocent people being punished not just chidren
how so?inapropriate0 -
You know who I'd like to see punished? The parents of the first victims, who knew their child had been abused, that didn't report the abuse to the police. They could've just as easily prevented the later cases as JoPa. They didn't, and now, years later, they are getting monetary rewards. That is just as sick in my opinion.
Do you know any of this for fact?
From Wiki, so maybe not fact but usually a good starting point:
"The investigation was initiated in the spring of 2008, after the mother of a boy (identified in court papers as "Victim 1"), then a freshman at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County, Pennsylvania, reported that the boy had been sexually abused by Sandusky. " She clearly didn't "report" to the police or there wouldn't have been a cover-up.
2008 was a good 10 years or so after the abuse first started, correct?0 -
You know who I'd like to see punished? The parents of the first victims, who knew their child had been abused, that didn't report the abuse to the police. They could've just as easily prevented the later cases as JoPa. They didn't, and now, years later, they are getting monetary rewards. That is just as sick in my opinion.
Do you know any of this for fact?
From Wiki, so maybe not fact but usually a good starting point:
"The investigation was initiated in the spring of 2008, after the mother of a boy (identified in court papers as "Victim 1"), then a freshman at Central Mountain High School in Clinton County, Pennsylvania, reported that the boy had been sexually abused by Sandusky. " She clearly didn't "report" to the police or there wouldn't have been a cover-up.
2008 was a good 10 years or so after the abuse first started, correct?
Just an example. This was the most clear case I could find of a parent reporting the abuse to the wrong people, and it still happened 3 years before this all went to light which is an ETERNITY. But if you study the "timelines" out there, there are other cases where the parents were clearly at least very suspicious of abuse but didn't go right to the police.
If I had even the remotest inkling that my child had been abused, I wouldn't have reported it to the people who were there and responsible, I would've been taking my suspicions to the police. Going to the University itself stinks of asking for money/compensation no matter how you look at it.
I do not claim that the legions of people who took place in the cover-up don't deserve to be punished, but I really hate the idea that parents knew about this **** and didn't do anything to protect other people's children from the same.
EDIT: From http://www.npr.org/2011/11/08/142111804/penn-state-abuse-scandal-a-guide-and-timeline1998: An 11-year-old boy returns home with wet hair after an outing with Sandusky. Victim 6 tells his mother he took a shower with Sandusky and that the coach hugged him several times. The boy's mother contacts university police, triggering an investigation.0 -
Not. This is punishing PLAYERS for illegal behaviors of coaches. Those students did nothing wrong, and the ones who are already at or committed to PSU did nothing wrong. I also don't think it is appropriate for the NCAA to dole out punishment for illegal activities not related to sports, that is what the judicial system is for.
how is this NOT related to sports? the football program covered up child rape in order to maintain a competitive advantage. this exactly the kind of thing the NCAA needs to punish. it also makes other schools think twice about doing the same thing.
as for current student athletes they are allowed to transfer right now without penalty.0 -
Think the penalties are fine, especially since they said all Penn State players may transfer without penalty AND they don't count against their new school's scholarship total. Also per NCAA "Any entering or returning football student-athlete will be allowed to immediately transfer and will be eligible to immediately compete at the transfer institution, provided he is otherwise eligible. Any football student-athlete who wants to remain at the University may retain his athletic grant-in-aid, as long as he meets and maintains applicable academic requirements, regardless of whether he competes on the football team."
If I'm these kids, I work out, study for a year, then treat the year like free agency and go find somewhere good to play. Right now most teams are set but they might find a few takers.
Thanks for clarifying that aspect. Still pretty hard for the players who are unable to find transfer berths, and given the nature of football, some of them will find it very hard to get their careers back on track if they're forced to take a year out from playing, but at least they won't be losing their educational prospects as well, which is, after all, what college is supposed to be about, even for student athletes!0 -
Not. This is punishing PLAYERS for illegal behaviors of coaches. Those students did nothing wrong, and the ones who are already at or committed to PSU did nothing wrong. I also don't think it is appropriate for the NCAA to dole out punishment for illegal activities not related to sports, that is what the judicial system is for.
how is this NOT related to sports? the football program covered up child rape in order to maintain a competitive advantage. this exactly the kind of thing the NCAA needs to punish. it also makes other schools think twice about doing the same thing.
as for current student athletes they are allowed to transfer right now without penalty.
No, covering this up doesn't maintain a competitive advantage. It maintained the public image of the program, but had nothing to do with the way that football was played. The coach in question was removed from his coaching position pretty much immediately after his superiors found out, although he was allowed to stay in a non-coaching position at the university.0 -
I find it funny how people are saying this was unfair. Somebodys kids for abused....SERIOUSLY? Sports fan sometimes disgust me
The strikes removed were more than fair. The fine was too little considering that the university made more than that in a year of PROFIT. The players might be victims but they'll either move on to a different college or I'm sure will be taken care of financially so no biggie. I wish they could have thrown in a death sentence to those involved.
I do like the tone in the minds of some of the fans though. "Child abuse is wrong...as long as it doesn't hurt me watching a game!"0 -
It comes down to this. All current players with scholarships get to keep them. They can also transfer to Universities who can still participate in Bowls. And there are Universities out there who would welcome transfers.
The punishment may seem to be affecting the players more than the program but you have to look at it like this.
Less scholarships means less top end recruits they can get. It punishes the program.
No Bowls means there are high school candidates right now who will not go to PSU because of the lack of Bowl status. That punishes the program completely.
The wins being stripped is in direct response to the coverup. By not displaying the sportsmanlike qualities they violated the NCAA standards and rules and thus were ineligible for those wins. Its no different than if he had doped up his students. He violated NCAA rules and thus his wins are ineligible.0 -
Not. This is punishing PLAYERS for illegal behaviors of coaches. Those students did nothing wrong, and the ones who are already at or committed to PSU did nothing wrong. I also don't think it is appropriate for the NCAA to dole out punishment for illegal activities not related to sports, that is what the judicial system is for.
how is this NOT related to sports? the football program covered up child rape in order to maintain a competitive advantage. this exactly the kind of thing the NCAA needs to punish. it also makes other schools think twice about doing the same thing.
as for current student athletes they are allowed to transfer right now without penalty.
No, covering this up doesn't maintain a competitive advantage. It maintained the public image of the program, but had nothing to do with the way that football was played. The coach in question was removed from his coaching position pretty much immediately after his superiors found out, although he was allowed to stay in a non-coaching position at the university.
do you know how football recruiting works? if this had come out their recruiting would have taken a serious hit. that is why it was covered up. therefore preserving their competitive advantage. and like you said...they allowed him to still be part of the program knowing he rapes kids. this is the definition of "lack of institutional control".0 -
Not. This is punishing PLAYERS for illegal behaviors of coaches. Those students did nothing wrong, and the ones who are already at or committed to PSU did nothing wrong. I also don't think it is appropriate for the NCAA to dole out punishment for illegal activities not related to sports, that is what the judicial system is for.
how is this NOT related to sports? the football program covered up child rape in order to maintain a competitive advantage. this exactly the kind of thing the NCAA needs to punish. it also makes other schools think twice about doing the same thing.
as for current student athletes they are allowed to transfer right now without penalty.
No, covering this up doesn't maintain a competitive advantage. It maintained the public image of the program, but had nothing to do with the way that football was played. The coach in question was removed from his coaching position pretty much immediately after his superiors found out, although he was allowed to stay in a non-coaching position at the university.
Actually, the "public image" of a school is exactly what would attract talent, which translates to wins on the field, which translates to money/prestige for the university. If this had happened to a history professor, do you honestly think there would've been a cover up? Or if it was an English professor? Or even the rowing coach or any other lower-tier entity of the school?
No. This was done because it was football, and football is the cash cow for most programs. The "prestige" of PSU, the "prestige and mystique" of Joe Paterno, how much of a father figure he was, and even though he was removed, the connections between Penn State and Sandusky's charity (they can claim "look at our community service") are EXACTLY what they'd be peddling to parents of recruits they want to get into the school. It was that facade that they wanted to keep at all costs, and that's why the hammer is falling today. Was the coach removed? Yes. But it was consistently covered up, over and over, throughout the years.0 -
I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!0 -
Better yet close down the whole university.I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!0 -
Better yet close down the whole university.I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!
Yeah, this thread just reached the idiotic stage. :ohwell:0 -
Just? Someone suggested the same thing already.
Better yet close down the whole university.I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!
Yeah, this thread just reached the idiotic stage. :ohwell:0 -
Better yet close down the whole university.I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!
I know you are being sarcastic but that's the truth, you make the punishment so damned painful no one ever dreams of covering something up like this again. You let all students keep scholarships and attend somewhere else. those that feel it's unfair can cry themselves to sleep, life sucks, man up and get over it.0 -
Better yet close down the whole university.I would have closed down the whole PSU football program!
GTFO!
I know you are being sarcastic but that's the truth, you make the punishment so damned painful no one ever dreams of covering something up like this again. You let all students keep scholarships and attend somewhere else. those that feel it's unfair can cry themselves to sleep, life sucks, man up and get over it.
Penn State is so much more than a football program. You would seriously consider it appropriate to interrupt the education of tens of thousands of students, terminate the employment of thousands of faculty and staff, and interrupt research (including medical research on the scale of millions of dollars) over the mistakes of a football program, which most of those students, faculty, and staff never even participated or watched? Get real. Grow up. Your narrow mindedness is astounding.0 -
so how long does this keep them down? at least a decade right? or are we talking an SMU type situation where they never really recover?0
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so how long does this keep them down? at least a decade right? or are we talking an SMU type situation where they never really recover?
20years.
Even then they may never recover.0 -
so how long does this keep them down? at least a decade right? or are we talking an SMU type situation where they never really recover?
20years.
Even then they may never recover.
I have never been a Penn State fan, but I expect they will make it to a bowl the first season they are elligible.0 -
so how long does this keep them down? at least a decade right? or are we talking an SMU type situation where they never really recover?
20years.
Even then they may never recover.
I have never been a Penn State fan, but I expect they will make it to a bowl the first season they are elligible.
Not a good bowl. Not being bowl eligible for 4 years means no decent recruit will commit during those 4 years, and after that they won't get the top recruits because the incoming ones know that they will have to carry the team.0 -
with the scholarships taken away...
I don't think they'll ever recover.
How long ago did SMU recieve a lighter penalty? They JUST finally made it back into a bowl game.
I hope this new coach is very good. Then again people thought USC could take a while to recover as well.0 -
To be fair MOST in this thread are saying the punishment was just. Even PSU fans.I find it funny how people are saying this was unfair. Somebodys kids for abused....SERIOUSLY? Sports fan sometimes disgust me
The strikes removed were more than fair. The fine was too little considering that the university made more than that in a year of PROFIT. The players might be victims but they'll either move on to a different college or I'm sure will be taken care of financially so no biggie. I wish they could have thrown in a death sentence to those involved.
I do like the tone in the minds of some of the fans though. "Child abuse is wrong...as long as it doesn't hurt me watching a game!"0 -
i cant imagine how brutal opposing fans are going to be at the games. all of the signs. pedo bears. i just dont see how any recruit would want to subject themselves to that.0
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with the scholarships taken away...
I don't think they'll ever recover.
How long ago did SMU recieve a lighter penalty? They JUST finally made it back into a bowl game.
I hope this new coach is very good. Then again people thought USC could take a while to recover as well.
true but USC is a football mill. they are on a much higher level than PSU and their penalty was a lot less. and of course they werent involved with raping kids.
if i was a student at PSU i'd transfer unless i was a semester or so away from graduating.0 -
if i was a student at PSU i'd transfer unless i was a semester or so away from graduating.
That's a ridiculous statement. Many programs are unique to colleges and you lose half your credits upon transferring. Who can afford to waste 2 years of college tuition? Not to mention there are people like myself there, doing PhDs, that can't just up and move at a whim.
I think it's a stretch to punish a football program for actions of the coaching staff, but to hold the entire academic establishment responsible is absurd. You put way too much importance on sports at an educational establishment. And this is coming from someone whose love of college football comes in 2nd only to her husband.0 -
Question. I have not been following the Penn State stuff like crazy. I know about Them keeping it secretly. Did any MAJOR people know about this. I don't know how high this went. Who knew. It wouldn't be fair to the football guys if they didn't know. I'm sure the guys who play for Penn State now, who knew nothing ( if possible) about this want to even play for them anymore. Now they have that scar on their records. Even if they knew nothing. Who's going to sign someone from Penn State. I know I am ignorant when it comes to this topic. Sorry. I should pay more attention to what was going on.0
This discussion has been closed.
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