Sexual Orientation Changed Through Reparative Therapy?
Replies
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Not to be rude, but this is a fitness website. Please keep this to the groups, I'm sure there are plenty of Dr. Oz-based groups on here.
Chit chat, fun and games there bucko. Doesnt need to be fitness related in this section, in case you couldnt tell from all the "rate me" threads.
It was a reference to another thread that got shut down.0 -
Thanks. I posted it in another thread, but it promptly got shut down too. So I saw this one and jumped in.Not to be rude, but this is a fitness website. Please keep this to the groups, I'm sure there are plenty of Dr. Oz-based groups on here.
Chit chat, fun and games there bucko. Doesnt need to be fitness related in this section, in case you couldnt tell from all the "rate me" threads.
It was a reference to another thread that got shut down.
I can't believe the other responses I got. "...plenty of Dr. Oz-based groups on here" - how can you read that and think it's anything but a joke?0 -
Not to be rude, but this is a fitness website. Please keep this to the groups, I'm sure there are plenty of Dr. Oz-based groups on here.
Chit chat, fun and games there bucko. Doesnt need to be fitness related in this section, in case you couldnt tell from all the "rate me" threads.
It was a reference to another thread that got shut down.
that is good to know0 -
I realize this is risking great flame and is completely off-topic, but Dr. Oz is actually a highly regarded heart surgeon. One of the best in the country. Not that this has anything to do with his television show, but a "quack" he is not.0
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I realize this is risking great flame and is completely off-topic, but Dr. Oz is actually a highly regarded heart surgeon. One of the best in the country. Not that this has anything to do with his television show, but a "quack" he is not.
Dr. Oz is a *kitten* who hasnt seen the inside of an operating room since Oprah unleashed him on us years ago0 -
No.
And no ethical therapist engages in this sort of thing.
Just. No.
And **** Dr. Oz if he's promoting this crap. It is worse than the BS he's done with Rasperry ketones and all that other ****. **** him.0 -
And a ****ing heart surgeon needs to shut the **** up about things that are not heart surgery.
Or would he like me to start having opinions about cardio-thoracic medicine that I push on my show.
Again. No ethical therapist engages in this half-witted, oppresive bull****.
I feel kindda strongly about this.0 -
That is so awesome! Way to word it!0
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Meh. Don't want to resize. https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/63784_10151314861751578_1299685802_n.jpg0 -
anyone think that in some circumstances sexual orientation can be the result of abuse by older males at a young age?
This certainly seems to be at least highly correlated if not causative...
...but then that would seem to challenge the majority position of being born that way.
ETA: Oh, and Dr. Oz is an idiot.0 -
Choosing to be gay is silly. Life is so hard being gay, and exspecially when your brought up that it is wrong. I wish people would just accept people for who they are, but lets face it, there are so many predidouse for the color of ones skin and even how much money they have However, we CAN MAKE A CHANGE! And it starts with one, then becomes two etc....0
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is it possible to think it is wrong but also to accept those that are?0
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Sexual orientation being 'wrong' one way or another is entirely culturally based. . In Ancient Greece, it was not an unusual belief that women were beneath men intellectually and that it was debasing to lie with one for ultimate satisfaction. Unfortunately (and I hesitate to bring it up because I worry I'll be labeled an advocate for the wrong things), it's also true that women used to marry at the age of 11 and no one sent men to jail for it. Why? Because society said it was OK.
Anyone looking into studies / therapies like this should really look at who is behind them. Who funds it? What is their agenda? I can guarantee you it isn't 'happiness and well-being for all.'
From a therapist's perspective, it's not difficult to assume that men and women who identify as gay or lesbian experience a deal of hardship in living their life as they want (and need to), and doing so can include (and probably often does) feelings of guilt, shame, worry, loneliness, and feeling misunderstood. I say only that these are the feelings associated with anyone who feels others find them 'in need of repair,' especially family members. Why would reparative therapy appear to 'work?' Perhaps there are those that came to their orientation due to an intense mistrust of the other sex, but my guess is these are not many. My guess is that for those for whom it 'worked,' they simply made an unconscious choice in their psyche to behave in a way that produced feelings of acceptance - it's a strong desire for most folks in this world. A very human thing.
Think about that when you judge people, and their actions.0 -
anyone think that in some circumstances sexual orientation can be the result of abuse by older males at a young age?
GAH!!!! NOOOOOO NOO No no no!
This is precisely the **** that keeps men who were abused from getting the help they need. They're already worried they were abused by sick pedophiles because something about them magically said, please, hurt me, even though I'm 5 or 8 or 12 or 15 or whatever, and may or may not have a clue about sex, I'm actually gay. Or they think because they were abused they are gay. Or they think if they let anyone know they were abused those people will think they are gay.
Trust me. Some old guy with a beard power rapes a woman, that doesn't make that woman think old guys with beards are hot.
Why on ****ing earth would a poor kid that was sexually abused by a sick guy (not a homosexual, because we're talking about pedophilia here) means that now they are attracted to men.
That's just stupid thinking. Dumb. And stupid. And culturally prevalent, so no disrespect for thinking it. But its dumb and doesn't make any sense and is really more a measure of how effed up we are as a society that that is how we think about stuff.
But no. Gay is different from sexual abuse survivor. And Gay is different from pedophilia. And sexual abuse survivors are primarily straight, like the rest of the population. And pedophiles are primarily straight (in marriages with children) like the rest of the population.0 -
Ideas like "conversion therapy" are toxic, and they trickle down, resulting in middle schoolers being bullied and committing suicide.
I don't give a hoot if an adult chooses to pursue changing their sexual orientation, but when those adults poison the minds of others and children end up tortured because of it, I have a big problem.
Edit...I just feel like I have to clarify. This almost makes it sound like I'm OK with conversion therapy on an individual basis for adults- I am not. Just the fact that it exists is toxic, and will always be 'out there' as an 'option', indirectly hurting kids.0 -
It's important to note that all major medical and counseling associations have taken the stance that homosexuality is not a disorder. American Psychological Association (APA) says: Homosexuality is not considered a mental disorder, so we do not recommend "curing" same-sex attraction in any case. Instead, societal ignorance, prejudice and pressure to conform to heterosexual desires are the real dangers to gay people's mental health.
No one decides their orientation. It's not an over bearing mothers fault or an absent fathers. It's not birth order, race, abuse... It just is.
I can not wait until people can be more than JUST tolerant. When it's not even a discussion who or how you love.0 -
Y'know, I'm still waiting for all of my straight friends to tell me about the moment they chose to be straight. They all seem very hush, hush about it.
I actually had someone tell me that I'm bisexual because I'm indecisive. That was a fun conversation. :huh:0 -
Of course it's possible, as demonstrated by the OP and some of the early posts that followed.is it possible to think it is wrong but also to accept those that are?
Though being tired of those "flamboyant gays" that "seem to be flaunting for the sole purpose of flaunting" probably doesn't fall into the "acceptance" bucket.0 -
How can you change something that was biologically hardwired?0
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I'm happy to see tolerance on the forum. I appreciate that some people do not agree with a lifestyle choice, but are willing to publicly state they accept homosexuality as something that just is. I am no expert, and haven't formally studied the issue, and there are smarter people on here than me (and Dr. Oz) that could probably discuss this issue better. My attitude toward being gay has evolved somewhat over the years, but I've never been able to make sense of the notion that someone could *choose* their sexual identity.
I think the idea of "reparative therapy" is fear and shame-based. The name alone implies something is "broken" and needs repairing. I think there are people who may be gay but live a straight lifestyle because they are surrounded by intolerance and ignorance, or maybe simply scared of their own truth. In my opinion, that's what needs repairing. I can't imagine denying something so fundamental about who you are and trying to live a life against that.
^You are an extremely intelligent young man and I agree 100%:flowerforyou:0 -
I don't usually watch the Dr. Oz show, but I did watch this one when I saw the commercial about it. I'm not defending Dr. Oz. But, just want to say that he did not promote the conversion therapy. He said he was doing the show to get it out in the open. I did feel that he did a good job at allowing the most ample speaking time for people that are homosexual and have had bad experiences with conversion therapy and shared that (including becoming suicidal), and therapists that explained why conversion therapy goes against everything that therapy is supposed to be (to help people), as well as people from organizations speaking directly to any teens out there about how to get the proper help and education if they are struggling and don't have family support (such as if they have family that is promoting the "reparation" therapy or whatever it's called). So, I think it ended up being a good show.
I agree with everyone here that it is not ok to put kids/teens into that kind of therapy. I'm bisexual and it was sometimes a struggle for me when I was younger and trying to understand myself, then I grew up and it's no big deal. I would like to see a world in which it's no big deal for kids to be able to feel comfortable with who they are, while they are navigating their sexuality and growing. Being bisexual you do go through the "Am I gay, am I straight, what am I?" And then realizing being around a lot of people that say they understand if people are gay, but not bisexuality, followed by rude remarks. Although, I do think being gay is more of a challenge in difficult circumstances than it was for me being bisexual (just want to make that clear).0 -
I think the consensus is that sexual orientation is genetically influenced. I don't buy the idea that societal influences make a person gay. The U.S. is still such a heteronormative society that the pressure is to be straight, not gay.
I read a recent article about these therapies. For some it didn't, work, others were struggling, others were older and it may be that sex not as important. Being able to tolerate marriage and have relations with a woman when one is 60 is not the same thing as not being gay.0 -
I've always felt that you are born gay or straight. Anyone who has witnessed a small child exhibiting strong preference for one or the other should realize that it is part of a persons genetics. My mom's best friend has a son and by the time he was four we all knew that he would be gay. No problem to accept it, that was what he was born to be. To see people ridiculed or abused for their sexual orientation just makes me sick. Dr. Oz should be ashamed for promoting the brainwashing therapy. I've disliked him for a while, he seems to be going down the same path as Dr Phil. Promoting things that don't really work just for the kick back.0
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Indeed! Regretfully, Germany appears to be moving in the direction away from recognizing that sexual orientation does not need to be corrected:"Therapy" suggests a malfunction, something that needs corrected.
Sexual orientation does not need to be corrected. Anything claiming it can do so is just a shaming tactic designed to shove obvious behaviors under the rug.
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/world/germany-to-ban-sex-with-animals-report/story-fnddckzi-12265245442810 -
I'm happy to see tolerance on the forum. I appreciate that some people do not agree with a lifestyle choice, but are willing to publicly state they accept homosexuality as something that just is.
^You are an extremely intelligent young man and I agree 100%:flowerforyou:
I think you're being overly generous to bigots. Besides, if sexual orientation "just is" than it's not a "choice." Whenever I read "lifestyle choice," I can't help thinking of interior recognition. People don't choose their orientation the way they would pick a rug.
I'm not gay, but I really believe that if I want my rights respected, I have a duty to support others in their struggle..0 -
That's pretty much true for any psychotherapy--just the fact that it exists is toxic. Basically, it is a statement to all the psychopaths, sociopaths, and psychotics -- there is something wrong with you.This almost makes it sound like I'm OK with conversion therapy on an individual basis for adults- I am not. Just the fact that it exists is toxic, and will always be 'out there' as an 'option', indirectly hurting kids.
Extremely judgmental.0 -
I think the word therapy implies that there is a "correct" and a deviation from this, so I don't like it. If someone dislikes their attraction and chooses to try to change that, it's fine by me... but it isn't okay with me to say or imply that any preference is better than another. Whether it is genetically determined or effected by environment is pretty inconsequential to me.0
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That's pretty much true for any psychotherapy--just the fact that it exists is toxic. Basically, it is a statement to all the psychopaths, sociopaths, and psychotics -- there is something wrong with you.This almost makes it sound like I'm OK with conversion therapy on an individual basis for adults- I am not. Just the fact that it exists is toxic, and will always be 'out there' as an 'option', indirectly hurting kids.
Extremely judgmental.
Way to compare gayness to sociopathy and to stigmatize mental illness. You truly are an exemplary human being. :noway:0 -
That's pretty much true for any psychotherapy--just the fact that it exists is toxic. Basically, it is a statement to all the psychopaths, sociopaths, and psychotics -- there is something wrong with you.This almost makes it sound like I'm OK with conversion therapy on an individual basis for adults- I am not. Just the fact that it exists is toxic, and will always be 'out there' as an 'option', indirectly hurting kids.
Extremely judgmental.
I refuse to take you seriously.
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That's pretty much true for any psychotherapy--just the fact that it exists is toxic. Basically, it is a statement to all the psychopaths, sociopaths, and psychotics -- there is something wrong with you.This almost makes it sound like I'm OK with conversion therapy on an individual basis for adults- I am not. Just the fact that it exists is toxic, and will always be 'out there' as an 'option', indirectly hurting kids.
Extremely judgmental.
I refuse to take you seriously.
Yeah this ^0
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