Why should I go VEGAN??
Replies
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Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.0 -
Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you HAVE to supplement if you do it correctly.0 -
Maybe come up with an instruction manual for all new trainee's.Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you HAVE to supplement if you do it correctly.
0 -
Maybe come up with an instruction manual for all new trainee's.Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you HAVE to supplement if you do it correctly.
There is one called 'looking it up on the internet' lol. Google how much of what you should have every day, then google 'getting iron in a vegan diet' or 'foods with protein in a vegan diet.' I doubt people get as much as they should even with meat and dairy. So many people just eat junk without even thinking about what they are or aren't getting out of it. I've been vegan for only 6 days now and I've been getting everything I need off of veggies. I feel great. No headaches, no sluggishness, more energy and great food.0 -
Thanks god for the internet.:happy:
Maybe come up with an instruction manual for all new trainee's.Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you HAVE to supplement if you do it correctly.
There is one called 'looking it up on the internet' lol. Google how much of what you should have every day, then google 'getting iron in a vegan diet' or 'foods with protein in a vegan diet.' I doubt people get as much as they should even with meat and dairy. So many people just eat junk without even thinking about what they are or aren't getting out of it. I've been vegan for only 6 days now and I've been getting everything I need off of veggies. I feel great. No headaches, no sluggishness, more energy and great food.0 -
Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
The opposite is true. If you are eating animals, you are missing out on several essential nutrients. The 2010 US Dietary Guidelines document points this out. The typical American diet is too low on fiber, to high on protein, fatty acids and cholesterol according to the document.
I'll reiterate what I said a few days ago. My weekly iron intake increased from an average of 70% to 140% of RDA. My fiber went from an average of 180 grams (acceptable according to Guideline) to 450+ grams. Line by line, every single metric documented in MFP was better on this diet than when I was religiously logging calories last summer. Substantialy better. In hindsight, I should have been taking supplements when I was eating the typical American diet for the last 53 years of my life.
What am I missing out on? Animal products provide cholesterol.
On page 26 of the Dietary Guidelines for Americans, 2010 it says under the subheading "Cholesterol":
"The body uses cholesterol for physiological and structural functions, but it makes more than enough for these purposes. Therefore, people do not need to eat sources of dietary cholesterol. Cholesterol is found only in animal foods. The major sources of cholesterol in the American diet include eggs and egg mixed dishes, chicken and chicken mixed dishes, beef and beef mixed dishes, and all type of beef burgers."
Protein? I'm getting more than enough, well within the Dietary Guideline.
What else? Is there some super secret stuff in it that no one's told me about?0 -
Thanks god for the internet.:happy:
Maybe come up with an instruction manual for all new trainee's.Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
just because you don't eat meat doesn't mean you HAVE to supplement if you do it correctly.
There is one called 'looking it up on the internet' lol. Google how much of what you should have every day, then google 'getting iron in a vegan diet' or 'foods with protein in a vegan diet.' I doubt people get as much as they should even with meat and dairy. So many people just eat junk without even thinking about what they are or aren't getting out of it. I've been vegan for only 6 days now and I've been getting everything I need off of veggies. I feel great. No headaches, no sluggishness, more energy and great food.
How did we live without it? LOL0 -
By the way I'm taking my hunting bow to Replay Sports today to sell it. Anyone wanna buy an Oneida Strike Eagle?
I'll be down to 2 hunting rifles, one for large game, and one for medium game.
Morally, I believe humans are predators. We need to keep human predators around to keep the wild animal populations in balance. Domestic animals are ruining the planet, including pets. All domestic animals are a colossal waste of resources and are hugely inefficient for our wellbeing (and the planets wellbeing).
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result. Which is another colossal waste, mostly to benefit the health care industry. Think of how much collective productivity is lost treating the most common disease in the western world (or any other world), cardiovascular disease. What a waste.0 -
Animals are too delicous to pass on. I like my fruits and vegetables, but meat is the best. The fact that meat is so nutritious is just a bonus :-)0
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Animals are too delicous to pass on. I like my fruits and vegetables, but meat is the best. The fact that meat is so nutritious is just a bonus :-)
You nailed it!
The real reason people want to keep eating meat and cheese is 1) they like their meat and cheese because it tastes good and 2) they believe that meat and cheese is not harmful; that it won't hurt them if they eat it. Makes sense.
But what if you reviewed the evidence and concluded that the correlations between eating meat and cheese and cardiovascular disease points to causation? What if you rigorously researched the issue and believed the scientists who have identified many of the mechanisms that lead to disease and death. Wouldn't you then start wondering more about how to avoid cardiovascular disease while learning more about how much protein a person really needs and how to get enough of it?
Because after all, in 2008 in the U.S. there were 193,329,000 people alive between the ages of 15 and 59. 231 of those people died of protein deficiency. 107,133 of those people died of cardiovascular disease. That's more than the entire population of Green Bay, Wisconsin. In 1 year. That same year of the population over age 60 763,903 people died of cardiovascular disease. That's more than the entire population of Detroit, Michigan.
I'd rather die of old age.0 -
You're applying meat and dairy to the entire no of people who died from cardiovascular disease?0
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You're applying meat and dairy to the entire no of people who died from cardiovascular disease?
I wish I was that smart. I'm not, Caldwell Esselstyn is.
Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease
Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr., M.D.
A groundbreaking program backed by the irrefutable results from Dr. Esselstyn’s 20-year study proving changes in diet and nutrition can actually cure heart disease
Heart disease remains the leading cause of death in the United States for men and women. But, as Dr. Caldwell B. Esselstyn, Jr., a former internationally known surgeon, researcher and clinician at the Cleveland Clinic, explains in this book it can be prevented, reversed, and even abolished. Dr. Esselstyn argues that conventional cardiology has failed patients by developing treatments that focus only on the symptoms of heart disease, not the cause.
Based on the groundbreaking results of his 20-year nutritional study—the longest study of its kind ever conducted—this book explains, with irrefutable scientific evidence, how we can end the heart disease epidemic in this country forever by changing what we eat.
Here, Dr. Esselstyn convincingly argues that a plant-based, oil-free diet can not only prevent and stop the progression of heart disease, but also reverse its effects.0 -
Animals are too delicous to pass on. I like my fruits and vegetables, but meat is the best. The fact that meat is so nutritious is just a bonus :-)
You nailed it!
The real reason people want to keep eating meat and cheese is 1) they like their meat and cheese because it tastes good and 2) they believe that meat and cheese is not harmful; that it won't hurt them if they eat it. Makes sense.
Thank you. And I do think you gloss over the fact that most people can eat meat and cheese knowing that like anything else, moderation is key to all diets :-) Besides, if you were using an oneida bow you probably didn't have much meat to eat anyway :-)0 -
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result.
Are you suggesting that hawks, mountain lions, and the other predators all die of cardiovascular disease :-P0 -
You're applying meat and dairy to the entire no of people who died from cardiovascular disease?
I wish I was that smart. I'm not, Caldwell Esselstyn is.
A man who considers the China Study for this cant be as smart as you might otherwise expect.
There have been plenty of links on this thread to why the China Study was flawed. I will not repeat them.
A man who takes 18 people with existing cardiovascular problems, changes their diet and exercise and see's (and I don't doubt this) massive improvement in their health, in particular their cardiovascular health, is smart. When he doesn't have a control group of ones with the same healthy diet and exercise inc the stuff he mentions as bad, but in moderation, is not so smart.
The rate drop of 32%(?) is an impressively big number but as with all statistics, it's how you report it. You go from a 6.8 in 100 chance of developing heart disease to a 4.6 in 100 chance with his diet and exercise. An improvement yes, and any improvement is not to be sniffed at, but where would my control group eating meat and dairy be vs the std rate of 6.8? Somewhere in between? Maybe? I can't say for sure but you would expect some improvement no?
What about other aspects of the patients health moving to this diet vs my control group eating the healthy meat and dairy in moderation? This is a study in heart disease reversal.
I've posted earlier about the 4 groups I want to see. And I want a hell of a lot more than 18 ppl in them. But his time scale was good.
Ah, I see he has a book. And he's a military veteran! Not sure how that helps, but good to know for promotional purposes...
I shall buy it and give it pride of place above the last medical doctor who could improve my health immeasurably with a restricted diet, good old Dr Atkins. Where is he these days???0 -
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result.
Are you suggesting that hawks, mountain lions, and the other predators all die of cardiovascular disease :-P
Dunno but the fact herbivores still die is because they didn't take supplements.
Nature overlooked it.0 -
Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
The opposite is true. If you are eating animals, you are missing out on several essential nutrients. The 2010 US Dietary Guidelines document points this out. The typical American diet is too low on fiber, to high on protein, fatty acids and cholesterol according to the document.
I'll reiterate what I said a few days ago. My weekly iron intake increased from an average of 70% to 140% of RDA. My fiber went from an average of 180 grams (acceptable according to Guideline) to 450+ grams. Line by line, every single metric documented in MFP was better on this diet than when I was religiously logging calories last summer. Substantialy better. In hindsight, I should have been taking supplements when I was eating the typical American diet for the last 53 years of my life.
What am I missing out on? Animal products provide cholesterol.
On page 26 of the Dietary Guidelines for Americans, 2010 it says under the subheading "Cholesterol":
"The body uses cholesterol for physiological and structural functions, but it makes more than enough for these purposes. Therefore, people do not need to eat sources of dietary cholesterol. Cholesterol is found only in animal foods. The major sources of cholesterol in the American diet include eggs and egg mixed dishes, chicken and chicken mixed dishes, beef and beef mixed dishes, and all type of beef burgers."
Protein? I'm getting more than enough, well within the Dietary Guideline.
What else? Is there some super secret stuff in it that no one's told me about?
How are you getting your vitamin D?
How are you getting your vitamin B12?
How are you getting your calcium?
And what am I not getting again when I eat a *mixed* diet.
I know if I was only eating meat I'd die before a vegan.0 -
Animals are too delicous to pass on. I like my fruits and vegetables, but meat is the best. The fact that meat is so nutritious is just a bonus :-)
You nailed it!
The real reason people want to keep eating meat and cheese is 1) they like their meat and cheese because it tastes good and 2) they believe that meat and cheese is not harmful; that it won't hurt them if they eat it. Makes sense.
Thank you. And I do think you gloss over the fact that most people can eat meat and cheese knowing that like anything else, moderation is key to all diets :-) Besides, if you were using an oneida bow you probably didn't have much meat to eat anyway :-)
Haha, but my T/C Encore 7mm-08 sure kills deer, and my 300 WBY Mark V does a number on elk and buffalo.0 -
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result.
Are you suggesting that hawks, mountain lions, and the other predators all die of cardiovascular disease :-P
No, they die of lacking human intelligence.0 -
Nature did not design your body to smoke.
We came up with that.
Nature did not design your body to skip animals, hence the need for man made supplements.
We came up with that.
Nature also builds in warning signals for you as it does when you're injured (pain).
Like when you first start smoking and cough. And the increased coughing and hacking when you've smoked for a few years.
Man tried to tell you don't worry, it's actually good for you!
Much like man is telling you to cut out animals and buy their expensive supplements.
The opposite is true. If you are eating animals, you are missing out on several essential nutrients. The 2010 US Dietary Guidelines document points this out. The typical American diet is too low on fiber, to high on protein, fatty acids and cholesterol according to the document.
I'll reiterate what I said a few days ago. My weekly iron intake increased from an average of 70% to 140% of RDA. My fiber went from an average of 180 grams (acceptable according to Guideline) to 450+ grams. Line by line, every single metric documented in MFP was better on this diet than when I was religiously logging calories last summer. Substantialy better. In hindsight, I should have been taking supplements when I was eating the typical American diet for the last 53 years of my life.
What am I missing out on? Animal products provide cholesterol.
On page 26 of the Dietary Guidelines for Americans, 2010 it says under the subheading "Cholesterol":
"The body uses cholesterol for physiological and structural functions, but it makes more than enough for these purposes. Therefore, people do not need to eat sources of dietary cholesterol. Cholesterol is found only in animal foods. The major sources of cholesterol in the American diet include eggs and egg mixed dishes, chicken and chicken mixed dishes, beef and beef mixed dishes, and all type of beef burgers."
Protein? I'm getting more than enough, well within the Dietary Guideline.
What else? Is there some super secret stuff in it that no one's told me about?
How are you getting your vitamin D?
How are you getting your vitamin B12?
How are you getting your calcium?
And what am I not getting again when I eat a *mixed* diet.
I know if I was only eating meat I'd die before a vegan.
I'm geting my vitamin D riding my bike outside and/or skiing outside.
I'm getting my vitamin B12 the same way I've been getting it for the last 7 years... injecting cyanobalamin every other week. Completely superior way, painless, and guarantees my levels are optimal.
I'm getting my calcium having almond milk with my rolled oats every morning.
I have no idea what you're not getting. I know what I wasn't getting by looking at the nutrition information from when I was eating the typical MFP diet last year. I didn't really analyze before debating on this thread. I had no idea how much difference there was between my old diet and what I'm doing now. It sold me on what I'm doing now.
My old diet was essentially a coffee/creamer first thing 6 AM, a protein bar at 10 AM, a Subway 6 inch turkey on wheat w/veggies for lunch, a clif bar at 3 PM (or beef jerky and an apple), and shrimp or chicken stir fry with rice for dinner (or girlled chicken with potato, or tilapia or shrimp tacos on corn tortillas grilled with lots of veggies and avocado and feta cheese). And 2 glasses of white or red wine depending on what I paired it with. I had cut down beef, venison or pork to once a week.
Before I just thought I felt better, had a better lipid panel, was losing weight while eating a greater volume of food. Oh and my times climbing up Blacktail mountain on skis went from high 50's (I had a 58 and a 57 minute time in late December) to a 51:06 on 1/19 and a 49:40 on 1/27. A little over a mile in length with elevation change of 5,220 feet up to 6,580 feet at the top. I've lost about 4 pounds in 3 weeks. In my experience 4 pounds hasn't given me 7 minutes on the mountain. 10 pounds has given me 5 minutes in the past.
Now the core of my diet is still coffee. I replaced the protein bar with rolled oats with almond milk and blackberries. The turkey sandwich is replaced with now a hummus and veggie sandwich, or a footlong Subway without cheese or meat on wheat with extra spinach, extra tomato, extra bell pepper, onion, jalapeno, olive, and oregano. Afternoon snack is now bananas, apples, and oranges as many as I want, and dinner is black bean tacos, or veggie stir fry, or beans and rice, or pizza with my own whole wheat pizza crust (nutritional yeast instead of cheese), or pasta with lots of veggies. And 2 glasses of wine of course. Only I eat dinner until I'm completely sated. And hopefully have a little left to finish it off at 10 PM.
Basically, this diet lets me fill my belly at lunch and dinner, and late night.0 -
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result.
Are you suggesting that hawks, mountain lions, and the other predators all die of cardiovascular disease :-P
No, they die of lacking human intelligence.
Now I am lost, so humans don't die too? Or is it vegans that live forever? Has there been a study done on how long really smart vegans live?0 -
Sadly, the predators eat too much animal products and end up with debilitating diseases as a result.
Are you suggesting that hawks, mountain lions, and the other predators all die of cardiovascular disease :-P
No, they die of lacking human intelligence.
Now I am lost, so humans don't die too? Or is it vegans that live forever? Has there been a study done on how long really smart vegans live?
I was just being a smarta$$.0 -
If you value your social life, think again. My sister and brother in law visited me last year for 2 weeks, and had become Vegan before they came. I love my sister and they have visited us many times in the past. However, this time it was a complete nightmare and I will never ask them to stay with us again. Shopping was a mission - every packet had to be read to ensure no honey, butter or milk were in any product, and this became a time consuming drudge.They also wouldn't eat quorn or soya for some reason?? I tried cooking and eating Vegan for the first week, but became very ill, weak and had constant headaches. We couldn't go to nice restaurants ( we live in Portsmouth in England - she lives in Seattle in the USA and I think vegans are better catered for there ) Neighbours who invited us over for coffee had to hear about why they wouldn't try the cake that had been baked for them etc. It is enough to have visitors ( we are all in our 70's) and I am happy to be hospitable, but to impose such strict dietary limitiations on hosts is not reasonable, when there is no medical reason for the food restrictions. They were vegetarian before and I could cope with that - no problems. We had cheese and there was plenty we could eat. This time however it really was very bad. In the past I have invited them to share our time share holidays with us, but not any more. I was made miserable and although I know what they eat is their choice - and it has been an environmental, political and social choice for them. However to impose this on others is not reasonable. So if you do go Vegan - don't visit your relatives unless you are willing to relax the regime a bit while you are a guest in somebody else's house.
WOW. How inconsiderate and rude can a person get? I would imagine *they* would never want to visit someone as rude as *you*! I am not a vegetarian or a vegan but have lived with vegans and vegetarians and respected their choices. I even asked that my birthday cake be made vegan so that it could be enjoyed by my friends as well. Vegan cake actually has less ingredients so if you or those entertaining people who you know are vegans couldn't take one minute to Google a vegan cake recipe you probably shouldn't bother socializing with others because you suck at it. How incredibly disrespectful - your family was taking up too much of your time with their grocery shopping? Really? I am more considerate to friends than you were to your own family! Learn some manners!0 -
A good place to start for someone who wants to learn about the Vegetarian diet is:
http://pcrm.org/health/diets/vsk/vegetarian-starter-kit0
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