Why should I go VEGAN??
Replies
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Obviously, you haven't looked deep enough for the info, it's there......But if someone puts themselves in a box and won't look outside of it, then there is things they will not be able to see....Raw Vegan: Nature's Path to Bodybuilding, is one book I'm aware of. Several books available on this topic.
No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".0 -
No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".
vegan body builders:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegetarian-vegan-bodybuilding-info/6826696189/
http://www.belsandia.com/vegan-bodybuilding.html
http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_marlon
Not impossible. Just more work.
...that comment of mine was in response to you.
Those three guys are small.
The first has a great physique but he is 218 pounds. Not close to 250 lean. He was IFBB pro a long time ago, he would never be able to compete on the same level against the current crop of competitors. Too small.
And I GUARANTEE you he had to overcompensate with his AAS dosages. He absolutely had to take in more anabolic and GH than he otherwise would have.
So perhaps it's possible with enough exogenous hormones. I mean ****...I could eat candy all day and take a few whey shakes and be 300lbs lean if I just dosed 50 IU's of HGH every day.
Edit: that 240lb guy you edited in is fat and 6'1" and only 240. He is not big.0 -
I don't have a problem with vegans. I have a problem with vegans who assume that because I eat meat (lots of it, like at least 2 lbs per day), I am ignorant about where it comes from or its nutritive properties or how the animals are treated. I grew up on a beef cattle ranch. I raised orphan calves, pigs, chickens, rabbits, goats, etc., throughout my childhood, so give it a rest. My diet is perfectly healthy. I guess I'm just not virtuous enough to care that an animal has to die so that I can eat what I want. I bought a crap ton of steak yesterday for a great price, and I feel awesome about it. Every day, I am proud not to be vegan. Or a hypocrite. You say you care about animals ... well, stop eating all their food.
Stop eating all their food? Really?0 -
No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".
theres a vegan bodybuilding magazine and a website www.veganbodybuilding.com0 -
Bad thing about self-limiters.....they are self-limiting.....
No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".
vegan body builders:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegetarian-vegan-bodybuilding-info/6826696189/
http://www.belsandia.com/vegan-bodybuilding.html
http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_marlon
Not impossible. Just more work.
...that comment of mine was in response to you.
Those three guys are small.
The first has a great physique but he is 218 pounds. Not close to 250 lean. He was IFBB pro a long time ago, he would never be able to compete on the same level against the current crop of competitors. Too small.
And I GUARANTEE you he had to overcompensate with his AAS dosages. He absolutely had to take in more anabolic and GH than he otherwise would have.
So perhaps it's possible with enough exogenous hormones. I mean ****...I could eat candy all day and take a few whey shakes and be 300lbs lean if I just dosed 50 IU's of HGH every day.0 -
No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".
vegan body builders:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegetarian-vegan-bodybuilding-info/6826696189/
http://www.belsandia.com/vegan-bodybuilding.html
http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_marlon
Not impossible. Just more work.
...that comment of mine was in response to you.
Those three guys are small.
The first has a great physique but he is 218 pounds. Not close to 250 lean. He was IFBB pro a long time ago, he would never be able to compete on the same level against the current crop of competitors. Too small.
And I GUARANTEE you he had to overcompensate with his AAS dosages. He absolutely had to take in more anabolic and GH than he otherwise would have.
So perhaps it's possible with enough exogenous hormones. I mean ****...I could eat candy all day and take a few whey shakes and be 300lbs lean if I just dosed 50 IU's of HGH every day.
This guy is 240# http://veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_bill
Well, I personally don't give a hoot what you do. But I oppose the idea that a vegan "can't" be a body builder. I'm a vegetarian. Is it hard to hit my macros? Not really now that I got it figured out. Would it be easier if i ate meat? Sure. But it isn't impossible.
We all do what we can.
Just don't say to someone else that they "can't" jsut because you would rather not take that route because you personally find it too difficult.0 -
you can buy meat and eggs from organic, certified humane farms, plus those products dont have the added growth hormones or antibiotics in them.0
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No they can't.
And my goals are impossible to reach with a vegan diet.
So have you tried and failed or are you just talking out of your *kitten*?
Please show me one 250+ lb lean (under 8% bf) man that got there on a vegan diet. I have yet to ever see a vegan diet outline that managed to fit in 6000+ Calories while still being remotely calorie dense enough for a person to consume each day. it will need at least 250g protein and most decent protein supplements are out since they aren't vegan.
It may be possible to make such a diet and keep it vegan....but there is no way in hell I could cram that down every single day, since vegan foods are usually much less calorie dense.
And getting halfway decent macros for optimal hormone response is going to be extremely hard on a vegan diet. Creatine, certain fats, certain aminos, etc etc will all have to be supplemented, assuming that's even "vegan".
vegan body builders:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegetarian-vegan-bodybuilding-info/6826696189/
http://www.belsandia.com/vegan-bodybuilding.html
http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_marlon
Not impossible. Just more work.
...that comment of mine was in response to you.
Those three guys are small.
The first has a great physique but he is 218 pounds. Not close to 250 lean. He was IFBB pro a long time ago, he would never be able to compete on the same level against the current crop of competitors. Too small.
And I GUARANTEE you he had to overcompensate with his AAS dosages. He absolutely had to take in more anabolic and GH than he otherwise would have.
So perhaps it's possible with enough exogenous hormones. I mean ****...I could eat candy all day and take a few whey shakes and be 300lbs lean if I just dosed 50 IU's of HGH every day.
This guy is 240# http://veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_bill
Well, I personally don't give a hoot what you do. But I oppose the idea that a vegan "can't" be a body builder. I'm a vegetarian. Is it hard to hit my macros? Not really now that I got it figured out. Would it be easier if i ate meat? Sure. But it isn't impossible.
We all do what we can.
Just don't say to someone else that they "can't" jsut because you would rather not take that route because you personally find it too difficult.
I just saw your edit with the 240lb guy. that 240lb guy you edited in is fat and at 6'1" and only 240 non-lean...He is not big. He wouldn't even place top 10 in a local show assuming he dieted down.
Sorry. Just being realistic. There are a few vegan bodybuilders out there, but they have to up their doses to compensate...doses which are already sky-high.. So there goes the whole health thing0 -
I just saw your edit with the 240lb guy. that 240lb guy you edited in is fat and at 6'1" and only 240 non-lean...He is not big. He wouldn't even place top 10 in a local show assuming he dieted down.
Sorry. Just being realistic. There are a few vegan bodybuilders out there, but they have to up their doses to compensate...doses which are already sky-high.. So there goes the whole health thing
I am also being realistic that with proper discipline, it can be done. I don't even know what "doses" you are talking about. Are you talking about steroids? In which case, you aren't even talking about anything natural in which case all of my interest has been lost. Might as well get these:
http://www.plasticsurgeon-virginia.com/PlasticSurgeryVirginia/calf_implant_men_virginia.htm0 -
I won't go vegan because no plant TASTES LIKE MEAT. Especially BACON.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Every animal saved by someone going meatless I will eat two off. Esp if it involves bacon.
I used to be a vegan, but had to stop for health reasons. Even with vitamins my iron was WAY to low. Between that and the health problems that arose with my soy consumption I just didn't think it was worth it.0 -
I just saw your edit with the 240lb guy. that 240lb guy you edited in is fat and at 6'1" and only 240 non-lean...He is not big. He wouldn't even place top 10 in a local show assuming he dieted down.
Sorry. Just being realistic. There are a few vegan bodybuilders out there, but they have to up their doses to compensate...doses which are already sky-high.. So there goes the whole health thing
I am also being realistic that with proper discipline, it can be done. I don't even know what "doses" you are talking about. Are you talking about steroids? In which case, you aren't even talking about anything natural in which case all of my interest has been lost. Might as well get these:
http://www.plasticsurgeon-virginia.com/PlasticSurgeryVirginia/calf_implant_men_virginia.htm
hate to break it to you, but that first guy you linked to me was on more than a few steroids. There aint any natural IFBB pros...not even in his day.
and if you don't even know what I meant by "doses"...then really our knowledge of what can and can't be done in terms of bodybuilding and muscular development is not even on the same level. No offense meant.0 -
I really enjoyed the reading of this topic. So many different opinions. :} I agree with the statement that every person has his own right to decide what to eat. Can you imagine all people in the world as being vegetarians/vegans? How much land we would then need to grow enough crops to feed the population? That's why vegetarians/vegans create sort of balance for meat-eaters. Anyway, if a person is okey with eating meat, it's fine. If he prefers vegetarian/vegan diet, it's even better from my viewpoint because it will be three years on March since I became vegetarian. To be honest, I'm sure that it was the best decision I made. :} Personally I know four vegetarian people and they all are healthy, fit and happy. As for veganism, I would like to swith into vegan diet later in my life although I would find it pretty difficult I suppose because I really like milk and honey. ^^ Anyway, I think I don't have enough knowledge about vegan diet and that's what makes everything more complicated.
As for reasons for going vegan, you should have your own, not ask them here. :} Everything depends on your priorities - whether there are animal rights or health issues.I believe that it's possible to be completely healthy while eating vegan. It might be more challanging of course but still possible. :}0 -
I could live without meat - indeed I did for a while when particularly broke and don't large servings nor daily now - but not without cheese or fish. Many vegan alternatives to meat/ fish/ eggs/ dairy are processed rubbish with lengthy ingredients lists and the diet NEEDS to be supplemented and/ or fortified, which is against my food ethos.
Hi! I'm not disagreeing with you exactly, my food ethos is the same as yours, I'm vegan and haven't taken a supplement since I was 15 - I thought you had to supplement, at that time, my vegetarian diet and took supplements for the first three years. I forgot one one day and almost fainted. That made me angry, I knew I was depending on the supplements then. I woke up, got smart and now over a decade later I get everything I need with no supplements.0 -
... Can you imagine all people in the world as being vegetarians/vegans? How much land we would then need to grow enough crops to feed the population? ......
head! desk! head! desk!
Because, obviously, we don't grow crops to feed cows that we later kill to eat????
Ok. I'm really leaving this thread before I give myself a concussion.0 -
Not taking the bait.
Glad I stayed out of most of it. Everyone so angry in here..lmao.0 -
I just saw your edit with the 240lb guy. that 240lb guy you edited in is fat and at 6'1" and only 240 non-lean...He is not big. He wouldn't even place top 10 in a local show assuming he dieted down.
Sorry. Just being realistic. There are a few vegan bodybuilders out there, but they have to up their doses to compensate...doses which are already sky-high.. So there goes the whole health thing
I am also being realistic that with proper discipline, it can be done. I don't even know what "doses" you are talking about. Are you talking about steroids? In which case, you aren't even talking about anything natural in which case all of my interest has been lost. Might as well get these:
http://www.plasticsurgeon-virginia.com/PlasticSurgeryVirginia/calf_implant_men_virginia.htm
hate to break it to you, but that first guy you linked to me was on more than a few steroids. There aint any natural IFBB pros...not even in his day.
and if you don't even know what I meant by "doses"...then really our knowledge of what can and can't be done in terms of bodybuilding and muscular development is not even on the same level. No offense meant.
Of course not. We just have wildly different views about what constitutes being worthy of praise.0 -
...but the meat and dairy industries are no longer what they used to be.
Haven't read through the entire thread yet. HOWEVER, the meat and dairy industries are a lot better today than "what they used to be." Factory farming has its faults, and if you're super worried about it, buy meat from a local farmer. But read The Jungle by Upton Sinclair, and you will see why we are so much better off now than we were a century ago.
And I eat meat because I like it.0 -
Not taking the bait.
Glad I stayed out of most of it. Everyone so angry in here..lmao.
I'm not angry
I'm mediterranean. People confuse the two all the time 0 -
Not taking the bait.
Glad I stayed out of most of it. Everyone so angry in here..lmao.
I'm not angry I'm mediterranean. People confuse the two all the time
:laugh: what do you mean stop yelling? we're just talking!0 -
Not taking the bait.
Glad I stayed out of most of it. Everyone so angry in here..lmao.
I'm not angry I'm mediterranean. People confuse the two all the time
:laugh: what do you mean stop yelling? we're just talking!
:laugh:0 -
I get where you're coming from and I've thought about it myself.
But those vegan substitutes are so processed, I'd rather eat chicken.
Can the average person pronounce all of the ingredients in those fake meat crumbles or the fake cheese?
Some of the additives are pretty bad...
Thats why you don't eat processed foods vegan or not. Saying you'd rather eat chicken b/c some vegan substitutes are so processed is like saying - That **** has a lot of chemicals in it - so I rather eat this that has even MORE chemicals in it!
If you eat organic chicken, I take that back!
You do make a great point- ALL DIETS, including vegan can be unhealthy if you don't eat right.0 -
I get where you're coming from and I've thought about it myself.
But those vegan substitutes are so processed, I'd rather eat chicken.
Can the average person pronounce all of the ingredients in those fake meat crumbles or the fake cheese?
Some of the additives are pretty bad...
Agree with this, I would rather find a balance and get my meat and dairy free range, organic, or from somewhere that is reputable, and eat plenty of foods found on a vegan diet as well, excepting the over processed substitutes. Thus, I eat fish, a little meat, dairy, plenty of vegetables, beans, nuts, seeds along with a very small amount of grain, and it works just fine for me.0 -
I want to save animals from a unrespectful life + death. If you know how animals are killed, it breaks my heart. I try to only eat fish & bio/organic meat which is threated well. & also things such as eggs and milk are produced in awful situations... I feel like I save lives by this.0
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I'm mostly vegan except for the occasional fish and chicken/turkey breast. That is because I can't eat dairy, red meats, beans and eggs due to a bizarre digestive disorder. I don't eat any of that fake, processed wannabe meat crap. I eat real food. I don't miss meat, but I miss cheese.
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Because animals will thank you and plants will fear you, and you will become scary to all plants worldwide. Plants will know you as the herbivore of dooooooooooom.0
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I just started eating vegan on 1/1/13 for my health after watching Forks Over Knifes. I did not make this change in my diet for animal rights or anything like that. That being said, everyone talking about humane open pasture beef, I found this "article" (intended as satire) very....funny/sad/interesting. http://www.theonion.com/articles/we-raise-all-our-beef-humanely-on-open-pasture-and,30983/0
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...Can you imagine all people in the world as being vegetarians/vegans? How much land we would then need to grow enough crops to feed the population? That's why vegetarians/vegans create sort of balance for meat-eaters...
:noway: I'm speechless.0 -
if ur going to go vegan it had better be for environmental or political reasons... because if you think you are going to be "healthier" or "look better" you are just fooling yourself.0
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if ur going to go vegan it had better be for environmental or political reasons... because if you think you are going to be "healthier" or "look better" you are just fooling yourself.
QFT, speaking from experience.
ETA: i'm a total liar. I didn't leave this thread. I'm avoiding what i *should* be doing today.0 -
if ur going to go vegan it had better be for environmental or political reasons... because if you think you are going to be "healthier" or "look better" you are just fooling yourself.
QFT, speaking from experience.
ETA: i'm a total liar. I didn't leave this thread. I'm avoiding what i *should* be doing today.
Get to work, lady!
<- avoiding studying AND cleaning0
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