KETONE DIET- what are youir thoughts on it????
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Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
For the last time, if you are not factoring in hormonal imbalances and such (which was my case) it doesn't matter.
My TDEE was factored by professionals and they developed a meal plan for me to follow to only watch me gain weight. I was given a hospital grade food scale, everything was weighed, measured, etc.
I was following it correctly.
And for the record, I know what TDEE stands for.
Sorry, but sometimes when there are METABOLIC AND ENDOCRINE disorders - the human body does NOT follow simple mathemathics............it is much more complex than that.
Stop telling people that its so simple when there are medical issues to consider most times.0 -
Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
This is over simplifying things. Other factors have to be considered for instance if you have high cortisol levels you will not lose weight. Sleep, lifestyle, stress, illness etc all have to be factored in.0 -
Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
For the last time, if you are not factoring in hormonal imbalances and such (which was my case) it doesn't matter.
My TDEE was factored by professionals and they developed a meal plan for me to follow to only watch me gain weight. I was given a hospital grade food scale, everything was weighed, measured, etc.
I was following it correctly.
And for the record, I know what TDEE stands for.
Sorry, but sometimes when there are METABOLIC AND ENDOCRINE disorders - the human body does NOT follow simple mathemathics............it is much more complex than that.
Stop telling people that its so simple when there are medical issues to consider most times.
I'm sure metabolic and endocrine disorders have zero effect on the energy out part of the energy balance equation and thus that is how you magically gained while in a "deficit"0 -
Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
For the last time, if you are not factoring in hormonal imbalances and such (which was my case) it doesn't matter.
My TDEE was factored by professionals and they developed a meal plan for me to follow to only watch me gain weight. I was given a hospital grade food scale, everything was weighed, measured, etc.
I was following it correctly.
And for the record, I know what TDEE stands for.
Sorry, but sometimes when there are METABOLIC AND ENDOCRINE disorders - the human body does NOT follow simple mathemathics............it is much more complex than that.
Stop telling people that its so simple when there are medical issues to consider most times.
Most times? Sorry no. For most folks, it's really just that simple.
You may well be a special snowflake, but you are in the minority. And again, just because you are a special snowflake doesn't invalidate simple tautologies like calories in minus calories out. Your calories in was just trickier to figure out.
Don't go trying to apply specifics about your special case to the general public. It makes no sense.0 -
Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
For the last time, if you are not factoring in hormonal imbalances and such (which was my case) it doesn't matter.
My TDEE was factored by professionals and they developed a meal plan for me to follow to only watch me gain weight. I was given a hospital grade food scale, everything was weighed, measured, etc.
I was following it correctly.
And for the record, I know what TDEE stands for.
Sorry, but sometimes when there are METABOLIC AND ENDOCRINE disorders - the human body does NOT follow simple mathemathics............it is much more complex than that.
Stop telling people that its so simple when there are medical issues to consider most times.
Most times? Sorry no. For most folks, it's really just that simple.
You may well be a special snowflake, but you are in the minority. And again, just because you are a special snowflake doesn't invalidate simple tautologies like calories in minus calories out. Your calories in was just trickier to figure out.
Don't go trying to apply specifics about your special case to the general public. It makes no sense.
I am not the only one in the world, or in this thread that has been through this. There are plenty of others that go through this and end up at a loss because Doctors don't even know what to do to begin lining the hormonal imbalances out.
The stress of going through this only compounds things and makes weight loss even more impossible.0 -
Exercise, eat healthy. It is really just that simple. TDEE -20% and lift weights. Don't subscribe to gimicky diets, they may have short term loss but are not sustainable over a long term.
Sorry, but this is simply not true for everyone.
Which part? TDEE-20% is true. That's just simple math.
Lifting weights- ok you don't HAVE TO
Gimmicky diets - ok every now and then some does a gimmicky diet and keeps the weight off. This typically means they used the gimmick diet as a stepping stone to a new lifestyle.
You can't tell me what works regardless. That is insane at best.
I have lived through this with undiagnosed metabolic disorders and was unexplainably gaining weight, even though I was correctly measured and was told to eat x amount of calories and was even given a meal plan, which I adhered to 100% and gained weight.
Try living with metabolic and endocrine disorders and try to lose weight with your so simple reasoning and get back with me when you find it difficult or impossible to lose weight.
Don't tell me unless you have been in MY shoes, which it is so obvious that you haven't.
TDEE stands for Total Daily Energy Expenditure.
If you consume less than that, you lose weight.
Sorry but this is true.
In your case, it sounds like your actual TDEE was lower than calculated.
If I screwed up how I balance my checkbook, does that invalidate mathematics?
This is over simplifying things. Other factors have to be considered for instance if you have high cortisol levels you will not lose weight. Sleep, lifestyle, stress, illness etc all have to be factored in.
Yes, these 2 are way over simplifying like they know everything and think its just so simple. Maybe for them, but it hasn't been for me.
High Cortisol
Low Leptin
Insulin Resistance
Thyroid issues with T3, T4 and the conversion
Too much estrogen, converting to too much testosterone
Low progestrone
FH, FSH and Lt hormones were all out of normal ranges also
I was a walking hormonal nightmare in which I would barely eat anything and would not lose weight.
Throw in insomnia due to high cortisol levels and it just compounds matters even worse.
You will never get Taso and ACG to understand these things because they are so trapped in the simplicity of CICO works for everyone and it DOESN'T.0 -
I believe too many people don't fully understand what the "Calories out" portion of the equation really means. "Calories out" takes into account all the factors your body has/uses to burn Calories - including hormones, sleep, stress, etc. The only issue is that for people with hormonal and/or metabolic disorders - or whatever - their "Calories out" can't be measured simply by weight, age, sex, and activity level like most people. These people need additional medical guidance to figure out just how many Calories they use. Regardless of how your "Calories out" gets calculated, it still ends up being "Calories in vs. Calories out." It's just more difficult for some to determine their "Calories out" and a simple online calculator won't fit them.0
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Its not an excuse, it is a REALLY REAL REALITY.
And I never said the majority..............I said MOST people that try the whole simplistic formula of CICO and it doesn't work, needs to get evaluated by a medical professional, preferrably a specialist that knows what to do to get them where they need to be.
I eat about triple of what I used to and I able to lose weight. The difference is the majority of what I eat is high fat, protein, very calorie dense food. I can easily eat more than 2.000 calories of food on a ketogenic way of eating and lose weight.
If I follow the whole eat whatever you want in moderation and stay within these calories and you will lose weight, my weight loss stops and I begin to gain.0 -
Sorry...
I meant to add that, in addition to it being more difficult to determine the "Calories out," the people with certain medical conditions may need to have specific medicinal and/or dietary concerns to assist in getting their "Calories out" to a "normal" level.0 -
i don't believe it's a good idea. by going on the ketone diet, you might lose weight but you'll also be missing out on a lot of dietary fiber and vitamins you can't get from the foods allowed (getting nutrients from food is not the same as getting it from supplements!).
also, forcing the body to use protein as energy also means you'll be excreting more nitrogen and hurt your kidneys. Also, too much protein inhibits calcium absorption.
PLUS, most protein foods that we consume (U.S.) are high in cholesterol and saturated fats. That's like an early death just waiting to happen.
Do, uh, don't do it I guess :huh:0 -
The Standard American Diet is VERY high in carbs (particularly sugar--a calorie dense, nutritionally empty carbohydrate) and leads to excess body fat and ill health. Bad teeth, bad skin, poor upper and lower respiratory health, etc. can be attributed, at least in part to sugar and starch consumption. BUT, that does not mean that we should restrict carbs to a very low level and think that we will be blessed with a reduction in body fat AND good health. Everyone is different of course, but something to think about before launching onto a ketogenic diet is that you will lose the "muscle sparing" effect of carbohydrates. A loss of lean body mass is NOT healthy in anyone's reckoning. Lower carb diets (those that keep to around 100 grams of carbohydrate) have the same appetite suppression characteristics as ketogenic diets but avoid the downside of ketogenic diets. They usually come with slower weight loss but a slower weight loss is usually more sustainable than a quick weight loss. Those on a diet with carbohydrates consumed in proportion to energy expenditure have a greater tendency to retain LBM and thus are healthier in the long run.0
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i don't believe it's a good idea. by going on the ketone diet, you might lose weight but you'll also be missing out on a lot of dietary fiber and vitamins you can't get from the foods allowed (getting nutrients from food is not the same as getting it from supplements!).
also, forcing the body to use protein as energy also means you'll be excreting more nitrogen and hurt your kidneys. Also, too much protein inhibits calcium absorption.
PLUS, most protein foods that we consume (U.S.) are high in cholesterol and saturated fats. That's like an early death just waiting to happen.
Do, uh, don't do it I guess :huh:
Lol unfortunately a lot of what you just said isn't right0 -
LMAO!Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Don't let anyone tell you you're not a funny guy.0 -
Those guys and their peer-reviewed science. Next thing you know they'll be arguing against a geocentric universe. Just because some guy in a lab who gets paid to study things comes to a logical, well-thought conclusion, and then has that conclusion checked, and double-checked by a bunch of over-educated hunks, that's no reason at all to assume you can quote what they say as any kind of truth!
Buncha hocus pocus if you ask me!
Yes, but it was a fun straw man to knock over.0 -
LMAO!Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Don't let anyone tell you you're not a funny guy.
I aim to please.0 -
Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Spartan - thanks so much for the info, and yes it I'm totally going to dive into the rabbit hole. Sounds fascinating.
Better to make stuff up and post livestrong and mercola links, right?0 -
Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Now that's rich! Talking like you think there are a bunch of people that are going to ignore anyone on your say so. :laugh:
So let's see. A couple of days ago you are lumping people together as cliques and calling them lackys because they didn't agree with you. Now you want a couple of people to be ignored because they don't agree with you (Acg67, you are the winner! You made both groups) What is the common denominator here? (besides Acg67 lol)0 -
Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Spartan - thanks so much for the info, and yes it I'm totally going to dive into the rabbit hole. Sounds fascinating.
Better to make stuff up and post livestrong and mercola links, right?
then to blindly follow "science"? both are flawed.
again... leeches...0 -
Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Now that's rich! Talking like you think there are a bunch of people that are going to ignore anyone on your say so. :laugh:
So let's see. A couple of days ago you are lumping people together as cliques and calling them lackys because they didn't agree with you. Now you want a couple of people to be ignored because they don't agree with you (Acg67, you are the winner! You made both groups) What is the common denominator here? (besides Acg67 lol)
honestly the problem is this - we were having a really good and interesting conversation about keto vs paleo vs normal carb diets and taso, acg and you came in and blew it all to **** with your TDEE, cal in/out, BS that you spout in every thread. We get it. That's what you believe. We hear you. Now let us talk about other things without having to insert yourselves into every conversation.0 -
Guys just ignore taso and acg. They think they have all the answers and aren't willing to discuss anything unless a peer reviewed study is attached to it. Maybe if we ignore them they'll go away.
Now that's rich! Talking like you think there are a bunch of people that are going to ignore anyone on your say so. :laugh:
So let's see. A couple of days ago you are lumping people together as cliques and calling them lackys because they didn't agree with you. Now you want a couple of people to be ignored because they don't agree with you (Acg67, you are the winner! You made both groups) What is the common denominator here? (besides Acg67 lol)
honestly the problem is this - we were having a really good and interesting conversation about keto vs paleo vs normal carb diets and taso, acg and you came in and blew it all to **** with your TDEE, cal in/out, BS that you spout in every thread. We get it. That's what you believe. We hear you. Now let us talk about other things without having to insert yourselves into every conversation.
Exactly.0
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