Where's the evidence re: aspartame, msg, carbs, gmo etc?
Replies
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You did mention eating ice cream all the time didn't you? It is relevant.
They do it because they are jerks. They know EXACTLY what they are doing when they brag about that. They are rubbing it in the faces of those who struggle to lose. They know that the majority of people here are hurt, are suffering, are overweight, or are obese, uneducated on health and nutrition, are sick, are depressed about their current condition and are wanting to change. Wanting to learn. They make sure YOU KNOW, THEY CAN and YOU CAN'T so what is wrong with YOU and how cool are they? It is very immature and very rude. It's as if they are in junior high. Like I said, they know what they are doing. Why do they think we care? What is the purpose of getting on MFP and saying, "look at my six pack and I eat ice cream every day." It's like me sitting outside of an AA meeting with a beer on a hot day and making slurping noises as I drink it, holding it up to the member saying, "I do this every day, but in moderation and I'm not an alcoholic". I CAN, you can't
I'd agree but some of these guys preach eating ice cram everyday.
just making sure you all know. But hey, I do it in moderation and I STILL am not an alcoholic. " Or more in comparison would be to go to an AA forum online and post I drink wine every night with dinner and am not an alcoholic. Just childish! Just cruel and completely stupid.
Truth is they never really experienced obesity. They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
Ask these people anything about the psychological aspect of weight loss. How do you take someone severely obese and get them in to shape? They wouldn't know where to begin. They never been there.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are. I can also name many people on here who where obese and who eat ice cream all the time...and I know you know they are here.
Question is, who will die first in the long run?
Sorry, I do not have my crystal ball. However, your question is completely irrelevant to the comment I made.
I have talked to a lot of people who have lost over 100lbs. Funny thing is most of them don't know much about nutrition or even exercise. What did they did works, as you know fat loss is simple.
3 people come to mind.
person 1:
Ate 1,200 calories a day, and exercised.
Person 2:
Don't know his calorie limit but was on the elliptical about 2hrs a day.
Person 3:
This person would eat about 1,000 calories a day (a man) lost over 250lbs.
You think this is the best way to get results?
Still trying to dodge the comment?
You: Truth is they never really experienced obesity.
Not true and you know it. It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition.
You: They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are.
Um, i am not avoiding anything, you just don't understand. You mentioned ice cream, i replied to ice cream. Below is the "path/chain" of how what i said is linked to what you said,...
Lets go back to where this discussion started. It started with that girl about most people being jerks and bragging about the food they eat.
The people who do that haven't been through what i mentioned above. Lets put the puzzle pieces together because my logic is so flawed.
If you were obese you would know it's not cool at all to be doing that stuff in the first place.If you do this i am pretty sure you weren't obese. So this common still stands. My original comment still stands.
Now you're just making things up. I never said people who eat ice cream know noting about nutrition.
Lol - I quoted you. How am I making things up? Your statement was, and still is, incorrect.
Qoute me where i said, " It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition. "
Yeah i am wrong, you have been obese and have taken people from obesity to a healthy weight. You got me there...
See bolded part on the post you were quoting.
And I was not talking about me re being obese, I never said I was. However, you have no idea what I have been through to get where I am, just as you have no idea about others.
Also, you have not addressed your incorrect statement, again, that "Truth is they never really experienced obesity. They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today."0 -
I've heard stories, isn't that enough?0
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You did mention eating ice cream all the time didn't you? It is relevant.
They do it because they are jerks. They know EXACTLY what they are doing when they brag about that. They are rubbing it in the faces of those who struggle to lose. They know that the majority of people here are hurt, are suffering, are overweight, or are obese, uneducated on health and nutrition, are sick, are depressed about their current condition and are wanting to change. Wanting to learn. They make sure YOU KNOW, THEY CAN and YOU CAN'T so what is wrong with YOU and how cool are they? It is very immature and very rude. It's as if they are in junior high. Like I said, they know what they are doing. Why do they think we care? What is the purpose of getting on MFP and saying, "look at my six pack and I eat ice cream every day." It's like me sitting outside of an AA meeting with a beer on a hot day and making slurping noises as I drink it, holding it up to the member saying, "I do this every day, but in moderation and I'm not an alcoholic". I CAN, you can't
I'd agree but some of these guys preach eating ice cram everyday. just making sure you all know. But hey, I do it in moderation and I STILL am not an alcoholic. " Or more in comparison would be to go to an AA forum online and post I drink wine every night with dinner and am not an alcoholic. Just childish! Just cruel and completely stupid.
Truth is they never really experienced obesity. They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
Ask these people anything about the psychological aspect of weight loss. How do you take someone severely obese and get them in to shape? They wouldn't know where to begin. They never been there.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are. I can also name many people on here who where obese and who eat ice cream all the time...and I know you know they are here.
Question is, who will die first in the long run?
Sorry, I do not have my crystal ball. However, your question is completely irrelevant to the comment I made.
I have talked to a lot of people who have lost over 100lbs. Funny thing is most of them don't know much about nutrition or even exercise. What did they did works, as you know fat loss is simple.
3 people come to mind.
person 1:
Ate 1,200 calories a day, and exercised.
Person 2:
Don't know his calorie limit but was on the elliptical about 2hrs a day.
Person 3:
This person would eat about 1,000 calories a day (a man) lost over 250lbs.
You think this is the best way to get results?
Still trying to dodge the comment?
You: Truth is they never really experienced obesity.
Not true and you know it. It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition.
You: They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are.
Um, i am not avoiding anything, you just don't understand. You mentioned ice cream, i replied to ice cream. Below is the "path/chain" of how what i said is linked to what you said,...
Lets go back to where this discussion started. It started with that girl about most people being jerks and bragging about the food they eat.
The people who do that haven't been through what i mentioned above. Lets put the puzzle pieces together because my logic is so flawed.
If you were obese you would know it's not cool at all to be doing that stuff in the first place.If you do this i am pretty sure you weren't obese. So this common still stands. My original comment still stands.
Now you're just making things up. I never said people who eat ice cream know noting about nutrition.
Lol - I quoted you. How am I making things up? Your statement was, and still is, incorrect.
Qoute me where i said, " It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition. "
Yeah i am wrong, you have been obese and have taken people from obesity to a healthy weight. You got me there...
See bolded part on the post you were quoting.
And I was not talking about me re being obese, I never said I was. However, you have no idea what I have been through to get where I am, just as you have no idea about others.
keyword "MOST"
You are still avoiding the actual original statement that was not correct:
You: Truth is they never really experienced obesity.
You: They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
You were the one that brought up the example that was totally irrelevant to the point at hand, not me.
Your comment: "If you were obese you would know it's not cool at all to be doing that stuff in the first place.If you do this i am pretty sure you weren't obese. So this common still stands. My original comment still stands."
I can name you a bunch of people who were obese and regularly eat ice cream and pop tarts and who are not shy about mentioning is on the forums.0 -
The purpose of this thread is simple, if you think aspartame, msg, carbs, gmo foods, animal protein etc etc are bad for you, simply post a few links to the human studies that show it is bad for you.
Scorecard for human studies.
Aspartame 0
MSG 1
Carbs 0
GMO 0
Animal protein 0
Number of pages 11.0 -
The people who do that haven't been through what i mentioned above. Lets put the puzzle pieces together because my logic is so flawed.
This isn't true... the OP of the ice cream thread was obese and lost a massive amount of weight. That woman posted in this thread after I said I eat ice cream in moderation as well, and I have always been overweight to some extent, and actually obese in the last 5 years or so.
To be quite frank, that woman was highly offensive to anyone who has been obese and learned to have a healthy relationship with food.0 -
Do you actually read any of the studies you post?
Funny how last year you guys where bashing paleo because there was no "evidence," here it is now. I got many more paleo studies if you want them.
1.http://www.hindawi.com/journals/grp/2010/212563
^^Identifies a receptor that may be responsible for gene expression^^ No mention of Paleo.
Where did i say that study was linked to paleo?
Identifies a link between long-chain-fatty-acids and insulin resistance. Hardly a glowing recommendation for Paleo.
I specifically said on a later post i don't fully recommend paleo for this reason.
Where did i say whole grain was paleo?
From the article:
"Whole-Grain Cereal Fights Diabetes"
Whole-grain is Paleo now? Who knew?
And, finally, an article that actually mentions Paleo. But wait:
the Paleolithic diet was lower in total energy, energy density,
So it wasn't compared to an isocaloric diet. So, we can toss that out too.
Nice try, thanks for playing.
Now Vanna will send you home with a copy of our home game.
A complete failure isn't winning. So i am not the one who lost. The isocaloric diet is in the full study reference 44. Go get it. You're way off in another world, you're not getting what this topic is about honestly. This is mostly about the effects of high GI carbs. Not "PALEO." Naturally paleo does have low GI carbs, so I did mention it.
Your evasion is astoundingFunny how last year you guys where bashing paleo because there was no "evidence," here it is now. I got many more paleo studies if you want them.
But those studies werent' about Paleo? LOL OK.0 -
Your comprehension is astounding.
Oh, I see. Because who would ever thing that this phase would be followed by references supporting paleo?Funny how last year you guys where bashing paleo because there was no "evidence," here it is now. I got many more paleo studies if you want them.
How silly of me.0 -
To my knowledge...
Aspartame is fine, unless you have problems digesting phenylalanine (PKU if you know what that is.)
MSG is fine unless excessive amounts are used
Carbohydrates are fine unless they cannot be regulated.
GMO, Not sure where you're going with this.
I echo this.
I also tend to brush off anything but the biggest and most obvious "this causes cancer" type of items. I have a friend who told me I shouldn't drink Diet Mt. Dew because of aspartame being broken down into formaldehyde, I mentioned that one byproduct of cyanocobalimin (common B vitamin supplement) is cyanide. *shrug*0 -
You did mention eating ice cream all the time didn't you? It is relevant.
They do it because they are jerks. They know EXACTLY what they are doing when they brag about that. They are rubbing it in the faces of those who struggle to lose. They know that the majority of people here are hurt, are suffering, are overweight, or are obese, uneducated on health and nutrition, are sick, are depressed about their current condition and are wanting to change. Wanting to learn. They make sure YOU KNOW, THEY CAN and YOU CAN'T so what is wrong with YOU and how cool are they? It is very immature and very rude. It's as if they are in junior high. Like I said, they know what they are doing. Why do they think we care? What is the purpose of getting on MFP and saying, "look at my six pack and I eat ice cream every day." It's like me sitting outside of an AA meeting with a beer on a hot day and making slurping noises as I drink it, holding it up to the member saying, "I do this every day, but in moderation and I'm not an alcoholic". I CAN, you can't
I'd agree but some of these guys preach eating ice cram everyday. just making sure you all know. But hey, I do it in moderation and I STILL am not an alcoholic. " Or more in comparison would be to go to an AA forum online and post I drink wine every night with dinner and am not an alcoholic. Just childish! Just cruel and completely stupid.
Truth is they never really experienced obesity. They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
Ask these people anything about the psychological aspect of weight loss. How do you take someone severely obese and get them in to shape? They wouldn't know where to begin. They never been there.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are. I can also name many people on here who where obese and who eat ice cream all the time...and I know you know they are here.
Question is, who will die first in the long run?
Sorry, I do not have my crystal ball. However, your question is completely irrelevant to the comment I made.
I have talked to a lot of people who have lost over 100lbs. Funny thing is most of them don't know much about nutrition or even exercise. What did they did works, as you know fat loss is simple.
3 people come to mind.
person 1:
Ate 1,200 calories a day, and exercised.
Person 2:
Don't know his calorie limit but was on the elliptical about 2hrs a day.
Person 3:
This person would eat about 1,000 calories a day (a man) lost over 250lbs.
You think this is the best way to get results?
Still trying to dodge the comment?
You: Truth is they never really experienced obesity.
Not true and you know it. It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition.
You: They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
You have absolutely no idea about people's lives and what they have had to go through to get where they are.
Um, i am not avoiding anything, you just don't understand. You mentioned ice cream, i replied to ice cream. Below is the "path/chain" of how what i said is linked to what you said,...
Lets go back to where this discussion started. It started with that girl about most people being jerks and bragging about the food they eat.
The people who do that haven't been through what i mentioned above. Lets put the puzzle pieces together because my logic is so flawed.
If you were obese you would know it's not cool at all to be doing that stuff in the first place.If you do this i am pretty sure you weren't obese. So this common still stands. My original comment still stands.
Now you're just making things up. I never said people who eat ice cream know noting about nutrition.
Lol - I quoted you. How am I making things up? Your statement was, and still is, incorrect.
Qoute me where i said, " It is also incorrect that the people who I know eat ice cream with regularity and who were obese know nothing about nutrition. "
Yeah i am wrong, you have been obese and have taken people from obesity to a healthy weight. You got me there...
See bolded part on the post you were quoting.
And I was not talking about me re being obese, I never said I was. However, you have no idea what I have been through to get where I am, just as you have no idea about others.
keyword "MOST"
You are still avoiding the actual original statement that was not correct:
You: Truth is they never really experienced obesity.
You: They really had nothing to push through or fight for to be where they are at today.
You were the one that brought up the example that was totally irrelevant to the point at hand, not me.
Your comment: "If you were obese you would know it's not cool at all to be doing that stuff in the first place.If you do this i am pretty sure you weren't obese. So this common still stands. My original comment still stands."
I can name you a bunch of people who were obese and regularly eat ice cream and pop tarts and who are not shy about mentioning is on the forums.
haha, let me make it SIMPLE For you sara.... This is about you're little groupies you troll with. Have any of you experienced obesity??? You're the guys always rubbing it in people's faces. That's who the girl was talking about. I am glad I could open the shades for you so you're on topic. You're looking from tine inside in, not from the outside in. You don't see what a lot o people on MFP see.
Personally insulting me does not change the fact that your statements were incorrect.0 -
There is a difference of awareness and mockery. I have told many people to stick to their calories and not worry about anything else. If you want ice cream go for it if it fits in to your calories.
I don't go around saying "Look i just bought 20 things of ben and jerry, I eat it everyday. I am going to go eat 10lbs burrito look at me!"
I don't think that woman differentiated between that. She was happy enough to spam this thread as she did the other one. I still find what she said offensive, and she made it clear she meant moderation as well... even though a half cup serving (60 grams) of the ice cream I eat is only 100 calories, with 17 g of carbs.
Not deathly in the grand scheme for a dessert, and I use a food scale to measure it. Anybody could do this, but it always perplexes me why so many people refuse to use a scale and likely make themselves unnecessarily miserable with carb cravings when they wouldn't have to if they just budgeted a certain amount of them and used the scale to enforce that budget. I don't have cravings at all anymore since I do this.
I'm glad you support moderation though
I think that the ice cream does fit the calories and macros of the OP, however.0 -
To my knowledge...
Aspartame is fine, unless you have problems digesting phenylalanine (PKU if you know what that is.)
MSG is fine unless excessive amounts are used
Carbohydrates are fine unless they cannot be regulated.
GMO, Not sure where you're going with this.
I echo this.
I also tend to brush off anything but the biggest and most obvious "this causes cancer" type of items. I have a friend who told me I shouldn't drink Diet Mt. Dew because of aspartame being broken down into formaldehyde, I mentioned that one byproduct of cyanocobalimin (common B vitamin supplement) is cyanide. *shrug*
Sounds like you're saying this is dose/concentration related. I'll go with that. Lets say you have a brita water filter you know those kind you put in a fridge. You put a few drops of gasoline in it everyday, what will happen?
Spoken like someone with no understanding of how the human body works.0 -
To my knowledge...
Aspartame is fine, unless you have problems digesting phenylalanine (PKU if you know what that is.)
MSG is fine unless excessive amounts are used
Carbohydrates are fine unless they cannot be regulated.
GMO, Not sure where you're going with this.
I echo this.
I also tend to brush off anything but the biggest and most obvious "this causes cancer" type of items. I have a friend who told me I shouldn't drink Diet Mt. Dew because of aspartame being broken down into formaldehyde, I mentioned that one byproduct of cyanocobalimin (common B vitamin supplement) is cyanide. *shrug*
Sounds like you're saying this is dose/concentration related. I'll go with that. Lets say you have a brita water filter you know those kind you put in a fridge. You put a few drops of gasoline in it everyday, what will happen?
Spoken like someone with no understanding of how the human body works.
explain to me how it works?
You're comparing a device that does not filter the contaminant in question (brita/gasoline) with the human body, which is quite adept at filtering out "toxins".
By your rationale nobody should ever eat fish, since our bodies are MUCH less efficient at eliminating heavy metals than they are in the other chemicals found in trace amounts in so called "evil" food additives.0 -
Here is my view, someone who is just starting out should just eat whatever they want as long as it fits in to their "calories." As people lose weight their health indicators improve. That's most important if you're obese. As you get closer to a healthy weight you should clean up your diet. Eating junk food at a lower weight isn't "optimal."
When I think of "junk food" ... I think of foods that have no nutritional value. Take candy corn or marshmallows for instance... nothing whatsoever, pure sucrose and nothing else.
Some ice creams might rise to that depending on the flavor, but the one I eat sure doesn't, its a fairly plain vanilla bean. Nothing really bad in it aside the sugar used to sweeten it, and out of those 17 carbs, 12 of those come from sugars. All well within my macros... and there is no reason I have to give it up, ever. I'd like to see a study where someone eating 70-80 g of sugar a day, with most of them coming from natural sources (the dried fruit I eat in the mornings, and the 3/4 cup of milk I have a day with the approximately half cup of greek yogurt that I also consume daily) and only around 25 grams or so coming from refined sucrose has health problems.
I guarantee there isn't one.
Now, if you are paleo, you probably believe all dairy is bad. But I don't subscribe to the anti-dairy opinion. It is your opinion, and there's not much that supports the evils of dairy.
(what is in bold is a pretty extreme statement by you, because a little dessert is not bad for you and it is certainly not junk food to have a small bit of a dairy dessert in context to a balanced diet)0 -
Late, but in. (Spent the last two days in the pop tart thread. Missed a lot!)0
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Chronic inflammation is a key feature of insulin resistance and obesity(TLR4 is important to modulating insulin resistance))[1]
The saturated fatty acid (SFA) palmitate induces insulin resistance in cultured skeletal muscle cells, which may be related to NF-kappaB activation. Collectively, these results demonstrate that SFA-induced NF-kappaB activation coincides with insulin resistance and depends on FA chain length.
So now we have NF-kB linked to insulin resistance. Chronic high levels of glucose can lead to insulin resistance. NF-kB is also linked to simple carbs. [3]
A 3 months study comparing a paleo diet to a diabetics diet concluded the paleo diet improved glycemic control. [4]
A diet that has lower GI foods lowered lower inflammation to a greater degree compared to an isocaloric diet with a higher carbohydrate and lower protein content although the weight loss was the same.[5]
Funny how last year you guys where bashing paleo because there was no "evidence," here it is now. I got many more paleo studies if you want them.
1.http://www.hindawi.com/journals/grp/2010/212563
2. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18957619
3. http://diabetes.webmd.com/news/20071126/refined-carbohydrates-up-diabetes-risk
4. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407
5.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17189547
You don't have to eat hardcore paleo to up your protein intake and moderately reduce carbohydrates, with an eye to glycemic loads.
I am not promoting the paleo diet. My point is how HIGH GI foods can lead to cellular inflammation.
If you eat too much of it, maybe. In small to moderate quantities in context to a balanced diet, I don't think they're that much of an issue. I've been using myself as a guinea pig here because a great deal of replacement starches for celiacs are higher GI. It's why people gain weight when they go GF and eat them, just like I did. I've lost weight through moderating them, but not completely eliminating them.
I'd agree but some of these guys preach eating ice cram everyday.
I even put some Girlscout cookies in mine:bigsmile:0 -
There is a difference of awareness and mockery. I have told many people to stick to their calories and not worry about anything else. If you want ice cream go for it if it fits in to your calories.
I don't go around saying "Look i just bought 20 things of ben and jerry, I eat it everyday. I am going to go eat 10lbs burrito look at me!"
I don't think that woman differentiated between that. She was happy enough to spam this thread as she did the other one. I still find what she said offensive, and she made it clear she meant moderation as well... even though a half cup serving (60 grams) of the ice cream I eat is only 100 calories, with 17 g of carbs.
Not deathly in the grand scheme for a dessert, and I use a food scale to measure it. Anybody could do this, but it always perplexes me why so many people refuse to use a scale and likely make themselves unnecessarily miserable with carb cravings when they wouldn't have to if they just budgeted a certain amount of them and used the scale to enforce that budget. I don't have cravings at all anymore since I do this.
I'm glad you support moderation though
I think that the ice cream does fit the calories and macros of the OP, however.
Here is my view, someone who is just starting out should just eat whatever they want as long as it fits in to their "calories." As people lose weight their health indicators improve. That's most important if you're obese. As you get closer to a healthy weight you should clean up your diet. Eating junk food at a lower weight isn't "optimal."
I did it (and currently am) the opposite way. I WAS obese. My markers, from labs last week, are awesome. Diary's open.
Resting HR: 58
BP: 110/70
Chol: 930 -
Personally insulting me does not change the fact that's your statements were incorrect.
You don't understand. I didn't want to mention any names so you didn't feel insulted but you weren't understanding.
What i said, was directly related to the people in the little clique you hang around with. Knowing that, my statement is correct. That's who the entire topic was directed at.
I am pretty sure "those people" haven't been severely obese, and really can't help someone who is. You guys give cookie cutter answers. 20% cut, 1g of protein minimum of LBM. Fat 0.35 per lbs fill the rest with carbs.
What if someone is so fat you can't even measure their BF within reason? What if they never exercised one day in their life? If they're constantly binging? If they can't even walk 5mins.? Protein or carb sensitive?
I hope my assumption is wrong, but i assume you guys wouldn't even know where to begin.
Calling me a troll is a personal insult. Also, I hear a lovely guy called Ed loves ice cream - you know the one who was over 500lb and has lost over 300lb.0 -
Chronic inflammation is a key feature of insulin resistance and obesity(TLR4 is important to modulating insulin resistance))[1]
The saturated fatty acid (SFA) palmitate induces insulin resistance in cultured skeletal muscle cells, which may be related to NF-kappaB activation. Collectively, these results demonstrate that SFA-induced NF-kappaB activation coincides with insulin resistance and depends on FA chain length.
So now we have NF-kB linked to insulin resistance. Chronic high levels of glucose can lead to insulin resistance. NF-kB is also linked to simple carbs. [3]
A 3 months study comparing a paleo diet to a diabetics diet concluded the paleo diet improved glycemic control. [4]
A diet that has lower GI foods lowered lower inflammation to a greater degree compared to an isocaloric diet with a higher carbohydrate and lower protein content although the weight loss was the same.[5]
Funny how last year you guys where bashing paleo because there was no "evidence," here it is now. I got many more paleo studies if you want them.
1.http://www.hindawi.com/journals/grp/2010/212563
2. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18957619
3. http://diabetes.webmd.com/news/20071126/refined-carbohydrates-up-diabetes-risk
4. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407
5.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17189547
You don't have to eat hardcore paleo to up your protein intake and moderately reduce carbohydrates, with an eye to glycemic loads.
I am not promoting the paleo diet. My point is how HIGH GI foods can lead to cellular inflammation.
If you eat too much of it, maybe. In small to moderate quantities in context to a balanced diet, I don't think they're that much of an issue. I've been using myself as a guinea pig here because a great deal of replacement starches for celiacs are higher GI. It's why people gain weight when they go GF and eat them, just like I did. I've lost weight through moderating them, but not completely eliminating them.
I'd agree but some of these guys preach eating ice cram everyday.
I even put some Girlscout cookies in mine:bigsmile:
I eat ice cream daily. Pop tarts too.0 -
Personally insulting me does not change the fact that's your statements were incorrect.
You don't understand. I didn't want to mention any names so you didn't feel insulted but you weren't understanding.
What i said, was directly related to the people in the little clique you hang around with. Knowing that, my statement is correct. That's who the entire topic was directed at.
I am pretty sure "those people" haven't been severely obese, and really can't help someone who is. You guys give cookie cutter answers. 20% cut, 1g of protein minimum of LBM. Fat 0.35 per lbs fill the rest with carbs.
What if someone is so fat you can't even measure their BF within reason? What if they never exercised one day in their life? If they're constantly binging? If they can't even walk 5mins.? Protein or carb sensitive?
I hope my assumption is wrong, but i assume you guys wouldn't even know where to begin.
Calling me a troll is a personal insult. Also, I hear a lovely guy called Ed loves ice cream - you know the one who was over 500lb and has lost over 300lb.
He didn't call you a "troll". He said you "troll" (as in an action). Not "troll" as in name calling. Many see you as someone who does this and you have a group which follows you or you follow them and hit every thread making sure it isn't a positive experience. So many on here are trying to avoid the bites you and your clique take at us. If it stopped, this would probably be a really nice place to be where people didn't have to be afraid to ask questions. So many of us are trying to learn and to grow by using these boards, yet we also try to avoid, that 'one group' who does the trolling, the laughing, the sarcasm.
For one, I have three questions I would really like to ask the board to help with my progress, but I don't dare, because I am afraid you and your group will invade and tear me up for asking "dumb questions" just because "you know the answers and I don't". I am not even sure it is worth it.0 -
Re GMO foods, no there isn't evidence showing harm to humans. However, there is an very important caveat to that: Because researchers must get the GMO foods or their seeds from Monsanto and other companies that create and sell them, the researchers must sign agreements under which Monsanto gets to keep their work from being published if it doesn't like what the research shows. See this article from Scientific American:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=do-seed-companies-control-gm-crop-research
Outside the issue of human safety from consumption, there are very robust studies about environmental harm caused by GMO crops, and the creation of Roundup-resistant superweeds. Last year, there was a study that shows the role that the heavy use of Roundup for GMO crops is having on the monarch butterfly because it's killing the milkweed that the butterfly depends on:
http://www1.umn.edu/news/features/2012/UR_CONTENT_378473.html
Here's something on the superweeds. there are more and other environmental issues, but enough's enough.
http://www.enveurope.com/content/24/1/24/abstract
One last issue on GMO foods. the companies control ownership very carefully. Farmers who buy their seed can't use seed from those crops to plant again. The Supreme Court recently heard a case on this issue. From 80-95% of our corn, soy and canola are genetically engineered; what is the long-term social implication of allowing a couple of corporations to own the rights of some of our most commonly eaten crops? And what happens if those corporations are bought in the future by hostile interests?0 -
I am not aware of problems relating to GMO to people, but there are issues with GMO crops, namely gene transfer from the crops to weeds, instigating a sort of arms race, to make ever more powerful herbicides as the "weeds" become as resistant to it as the crops are. The herbicides have environmental effects, sometimes pretty severe.0
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So you don't think if you didn't have them so often you might increase your life span????
Not really
Consumption of sucrose and high fructose corn syrup does not increase liver fat or ectopic fat deposition in muscles http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/pdf/10.1139/apnm-2012-0322
Causes of type 2 diabetes
Development of type 2 diabetes is usually multifactorial - that is, several factors combine to cause it. The most important of these is genetics. Children of people with type 2 diabetes have a one in three chance of developing the condition themselves.
In this type of diabetes, the receptors on cells in the body that normally respond to the action of insulin fail to be stimulated by it. This is known as insulin resistance.
In response to this, more insulin may be produced and this overproduction exhausts the insulin-manufacturing cells in the pancreas. There is simply insufficient insulin available and the insulin that is available may be abnormal and so doesn't work properly.
The following risk factors increase the chances of someone developing type 2 diabetes:
•Increasing age
•Obesity
•Physical inactivity
In regards to HFCS (High Fructose Corn Syrup), its molecular makeup is essentially identical to sucrose (table sugar) - it is composed of glucose and fructose in nearly identical quantities as sucrose. Just as with sucrose, consumption in excess (creating a caloric surplus) can lead to weight gain - but there is nothing "dangerous" about HFCS, any more so than with glucose, fructose or sucrose.0 -
SO you think people get illnesses and disease just by chance?
Since when was genetics "chance" ....0 -
So you don't think if you didn't have them so often you might increase your life span????
Not really
Consumption of sucrose and high fructose corn syrup does not increase liver fat or ectopic fat deposition in muscles http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/pdf/10.1139/apnm-2012-0322
Causes of type 2 diabetes
Development of type 2 diabetes is usually multifactorial - that is, several factors combine to cause it. The most important of these is genetics. Children of people with type 2 diabetes have a one in three chance of developing the condition themselves.
In this type of diabetes, the receptors on cells in the body that normally respond to the action of insulin fail to be stimulated by it. This is known as insulin resistance.
In response to this, more insulin may be produced and this overproduction exhausts the insulin-manufacturing cells in the pancreas. There is simply insufficient insulin available and the insulin that is available may be abnormal and so doesn't work properly.
The following risk factors increase the chances of someone developing type 2 diabetes:
•Increasing age
•Obesity
•Physical inactivity
In regards to HFCS (High Fructose Corn Syrup), its molecular makeup is essentially identical to sucrose (table sugar) - it is composed of glucose and fructose in nearly identical quantities as sucrose. Just as with sucrose, consumption in excess (creating a caloric surplus) can lead to weight gain - but there is nothing "dangerous" about HFCS, any more so than with glucose, fructose or sucrose. Context and dosage is relevant (but widely ignored by those with an axe to grind).
One typical pop tart:
Vitamin A 10% RDA
Thiamin 10% RDA
Riboflavin 10% RDA
Niacin 10% RDA
Iron 10% RDA
Vitamin B 10% RDA
Vitamin B 10% RDA
Poly and monounsaturated fats 2.5g
Carbs 36g
Protein 2g
SO you think people get illnesses and disease just by chance?
Genetic disposition would be more of a cause I'd think. I haven't had even a cold in a decade.0 -
I went to look at sweet'n'low and I noticed they removed the "this causes cancer in lab rats" clause. Guess it's safe now
I believe that. I think they now use MSG to give test rats cancer so they can test cancer treatments on the rats. that's messed up.0 -
So you don't think if you didn't have them so often you might increase your life span????
Not really
Consumption of sucrose and high fructose corn syrup does not increase liver fat or ectopic fat deposition in muscles http://www.nrcresearchpress.com/doi/pdf/10.1139/apnm-2012-0322
Causes of type 2 diabetes
Development of type 2 diabetes is usually multifactorial - that is, several factors combine to cause it. The most important of these is genetics. Children of people with type 2 diabetes have a one in three chance of developing the condition themselves.
In this type of diabetes, the receptors on cells in the body that normally respond to the action of insulin fail to be stimulated by it. This is known as insulin resistance.
In response to this, more insulin may be produced and this overproduction exhausts the insulin-manufacturing cells in the pancreas. There is simply insufficient insulin available and the insulin that is available may be abnormal and so doesn't work properly.
The following risk factors increase the chances of someone developing type 2 diabetes:
•Increasing age
•Obesity
•Physical inactivity
In regards to HFCS (High Fructose Corn Syrup), its molecular makeup is essentially identical to sucrose (table sugar) - it is composed of glucose and fructose in nearly identical quantities as sucrose. Just as with sucrose, consumption in excess (creating a caloric surplus) can lead to weight gain - but there is nothing "dangerous" about HFCS, any more so than with glucose, fructose or sucrose. Context and dosage is relevant (but widely ignored by those with an axe to grind).
One typical pop tart:
Vitamin A 10% RDA
Thiamin 10% RDA
Riboflavin 10% RDA
Niacin 10% RDA
Iron 10% RDA
Vitamin B 10% RDA
Vitamin B 10% RDA
Poly and monounsaturated fats 2.5g
Carbs 36g
Protein 2g
SO you think people get illnesses and disease just by chance?
Genetic disposition would be more of a cause I'd think. I haven't had even a cold in a decade.
nearly identical is not identical. It just seems clear to me that the rise in high fructose corn syrup consumption matches the rise in type 2 diabetes and obesity.0 -
Personally insulting me does not change the fact that's your statements were incorrect.
You don't understand. I didn't want to mention any names so you didn't feel insulted but you weren't understanding.
What i said, was directly related to the people in the little clique you hang around with. Knowing that, my statement is correct. That's who the entire topic was directed at.
I am pretty sure "those people" haven't been severely obese, and really can't help someone who is. You guys give cookie cutter
answers. 20% cut, 1g of protein minimum of LBM. Fat 0.35 per lbs fill the rest with carbs.
What if someone is so fat you can't even measure their BF within reason? What if they never exercised one day in their life? If they're constantly binging? If they can't even walk 5mins.? Protein or carb sensitive?
I hope my assumption is wrong, but i assume you guys wouldn't even know where to begin.
Calling me a troll is a personal insult. Also, I hear a lovely guy called Ed loves ice cream - you know the one who was over 500lb and has lost over 300lb.
He didn't call you a "troll". He said you "troll" (as in an action). Not "troll" as in name calling. Many see you as someone who does this and you have a group which follows you or you follow them and hit every thread making sure it isn't a positive experience. So many on here are trying to avoid the bites you and your clique take at us. If it stopped, this would probably be a really nice place to be where people didn't have to be afraid to ask questions. So many of us are trying to learn and to grow by using these boards, yet we also try to avoid, that 'one group' who does the trolling, the laughing, the sarcasm.
For one, I have three questions I would really like to ask the board to help with my progress, but I don't dare, because I am afraid you and your group will invade and tear me up for asking "dumb questions" just because "you know the answers and I don't". I am not even sure it is worth it.
Well put. This could be a nice supportive site without the trollers.0 -
For one, I have three questions I would really like to ask the board to help with my progress, but I don't dare, because I am afraid you and your group will invade and tear me up for asking "dumb questions" just because "you know the answers and I don't". I am not even sure it is worth it.
You should go ahead and ask your questions. You know who the trollers are, and you can predict their snarky remarks. Just ignore them. You will get genuine answers too.
You could also target your questions to specific group boards. For example, if it's a low carb kind of question, there are groups on MFP specific to that where you will get actual helpful responses.
Good luck.0 -
Yes i do agree genetic disposition is a big part of it, but I believe it's not the full picture.
If someone had a genetic disposition to a disease, you think they will more likely get the disease eating a "cleaner" diet, or more of a "junk food diet?"
Of course these terms are slightly relative.
Not everything has a clear cut single cause. It's probably a variety of factors, genetics being one of them. It's pretty clear that there is a subsection of the population that is more prone to type 2 than others. I have a parent with type 2, but I have celiac disease which actually is related to the genetics involved with type 1. And of course, wheat is one of the culprits involved with celiac, but there is a variety of factors going on because not everyone gets it who has the genetics for it. One of those factors that you would not ordinarily think of: breast feeding. Breast fed infants have a lower risk than bottle fed. Which points at the population of gut bacteria as a large part of the pathogenesis. (fun fact, bacteria outnumber your own cells 10 to 1)
Eating "clean" is one of these extremely vague notions that means something different to everyone who says it. So I avoid it like plague. I believe that cooking is a good thing in general though... but not every food additive is necessarily bad for you.0 -
Personally insulting me does not change the fact that's your statements were incorrect.
You don't understand. I didn't want to mention any names so you didn't feel insulted but you weren't understanding.
What i said, was directly related to the people in the little clique you hang around with. Knowing that, my statement is correct. That's who the entire topic was directed at.
I am pretty sure "those people" haven't been severely obese, and really can't help someone who is. You guys give cookie cutter answers. 20% cut, 1g of protein minimum of LBM. Fat 0.35 per lbs fill the rest with carbs.
What if someone is so fat you can't even measure their BF within reason? What if they never exercised one day in their life? If they're constantly binging? If they can't even walk 5mins.? Protein or carb sensitive?
I hope my assumption is wrong, but i assume you guys wouldn't even know where to begin.
Calling me a troll is a personal insult. Also, I hear a lovely guy called Ed loves ice cream - you know the one who was over 500lb and has lost over 300lb.
He didn't call you a "troll". He said you "troll" (as in an action). Not "troll" as in name calling. Many see you as someone who does this and you have a group which follows you or you follow them and hit every thread making sure it isn't a positive experience. So many on here are trying to avoid the bites you and your clique take at us. If it stopped, this would probably be a really nice place to be where people didn't have to be afraid to ask questions. So many of us are trying to learn and to grow by using these boards, yet we also try to avoid, that 'one group' who does the trolling, the laughing, the sarcasm.
For one, I have three questions I would really like to ask the board to help with my progress, but I don't dare, because I am afraid you and your group will invade and tear me up for asking "dumb questions" just because "you know the answers and I don't". I am not even sure it is worth it.
I would like you to go through my posts and tell me that I do not try to help a lot of people with solid advice. I may joke occasionally but please take the time to actually look to these accusations. Talk is cheap as they say.0
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