DEEP THOUGHTS
Replies
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sorry but you picked the most convenient difference among our views - god - cuz its easy to dismiss god.
Our main difference is this:
math is universal, science is temporary and localized. science as you know it doesnt exist outside of the known universe.
the god debate is not for this thread.
I'm sorry, you kept using religion as a comparison to science. I thought perhaps you were speaking about religion.
Perchance I was wrong and you weren't thinking religion when you continually kept mentioning?
Please scroll up and see my post where I explicitly say that,
religion <> God
Let me then clarify my beliefs. I believe in math and I believe in God. I do not believe in religion and I believe that science is localized although very beneficial to the human condition.
And by known universe I mean a place where you can perform an experiment. It does not include what the Hubble saw several million light years away. I am talking the one universe we live, in not other universes, asserting that our science does not even exist in our own universe outside of our immediate surroundings.0 -
Not corrupt but biased.
Also get this mind boggling thing in mind
Religion <> God
religion is biased and painted and abused..
God cannot be.
I think we've discovered our main difference here. You believe in god, or some sentient being of creation. I do not. That is similarly going to influence our views. I still say god or not, a semi-hits you, you're going to feel it. God will not prevent the sensation - that's written in indelible code by science. (You might not die, but this is where our credit for not dying will diverge. Others will credit luck and science, some will credit god.)
How does one rationalize the existence of matter. Either someone made it, a creator, or it just is and can't be explained as to how it came to be no "matter" how many big bangs happened. Is there another version that we have not chanced upon ?
I go with the creator route as it is the only way my mind can rationalize how things came into existence. This is a model based upon our own existence that we ourselves make things, so likewise other things were made. I myself cannot grasp the concept of matter just being there and so far our science is unable to do the same. However, each to their own and all respects to you. It's a good thread !!!!0 -
If the sun explodes and destroys Earth, will God cease to exist? Think about it.
That's the whole "if a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" query. (I.e - does god exist if those who think of him cease to think of him?) Fun stuff to think about.
Try reading American Gods by Neil Gaiman. In this book, the gods are real, and came to America when their followers migrated here. But they are disappearing as people stop performing the old traditions and ways. Good book!
If you know Gaiman then you may be aware of this too. Terry Pratchett, in his Discworld novels, has interesting things to say about belief, in that it's a 2 way street. The gods themselves need belief to exist, otherwise they will slowly diminish into almost-nothingness. (this is particularly addressed in his novel Small Gods)
Also, if you like Gaiman and have never read Pratchett try Good Omens, they coauthored it.
Yeah - read those too :-) All good books!
I'm a self admitted terry Pratchett addict, lol0 -
Not corrupt but biased.
Also get this mind boggling thing in mind
Religion <> God
religion is biased and painted and abused..
God cannot be.
I think we've discovered our main difference here. You believe in god, or some sentient being of creation. I do not. That is similarly going to influence our views. I still say god or not, a semi-hits you, you're going to feel it. God will not prevent the sensation - that's written in indelible code by science. (You might not die, but this is where our credit for not dying will diverge. Others will credit luck and science, some will credit god.)
How does one rationalize the existence of matter. Either someone made it, a creator, or it just is and can't be explained as to how it came to be no "matter" how many big bangs happened. Is there another version that we have not chanced upon ?
I go with the creator route as it is the only way my mind can rationalize how things came into existence. This is a model based upon our own existence that we ourselves make things, so likewise other things were made. I myself cannot grasp the concept of matter just being there and so far our science is unable to do the same. However, each to their own and all respects to you. It's a good thread !!!!
Yes, I should have used the word 'creator' instead of 'god' which is linked too strongly to religion.
And yes, I am just putting my beliefs out there, which are not as well formed as some other people. I respect all views. I am impressed that there are so many people on here who ate my lunch in school.0 -
You may not be religious, but you believe in a sentient power. That is taking the god route of explaining things.
I DO believe that things "just came to be", because science does not require a sentient being for it to work. Life continues - birth, death, evolution - all today, along the lines of science, no creator nesscary.
The idea that we need something to "set in motion" because it is all too grand to work on its own seems silly to me. Things continue as they are - before we were here and will after we vanish from the galaxy. No concept of a creator is nesscary for the continuation of these things.
And no, science does not yet have the answers. But it will someday.
To quote someone, "If you showed an ancient person a light switch today, they would think it's magic. They would attribute godly or supernatural causes for it. Today, we know it is a matter of electricity."
Our questions are merely light switches. We can point to god for those questions, but one day, we will learn that it's a perfectly explainable phenomena, just as electricity is today.0 -
Everything that our minds have convinced us that we are sensing are merely blurred perceptions of the truth. Our senses are nothing more than meager reflections of the greater truth, which is so great that the human mind is neither developed enough nor enlightened enough to perceive. Everything that we touch, taste, see, hear, and smell is merely a small piece of what each "thing" we are perceiving is.
Some people are more enlightened and can perceive more of each "thing," while others are merely relegated to understanding what each "thing" perceived is by the second-hand, or third-hand, description of another; and even when perceiving first-hand, the perception is a deception created by each individual mind based on each individual's capacity to comprehend. And no more.
Therefore it is impossible to know the truth of anything. However, it is the pursuit of this unattainable knowledge that makes mankind great.
That's my deep thought of the day.0 -
Everything that our minds have convinced us that we are sensing are merely blurred perceptions of the truth. Our senses are nothing more than meager reflections of the greater truth, which is so great that the human mind is neither developed enough nor enlightened enough to perceive. Everything that we touch, taste, see, hear, and smell is merely a small piece of what each "thing" we are perceiving is.
Some people are more enlightened and can perceive more of each "thing," while others are merely relegated to understanding what each "thing" perceived is by the second-hand, or third-hand, description of another; and even when perceiving first-hand, the perception is a deception created by each individual mind based on each individual's capacity to comprehend. And no more.
Therefore it is impossible to know the truth of anything. However, it is the pursuit of this unattainable knowledge that makes mankind great.
That's my deep thought of the day.
I think, therefore I am. Fun stuff!0 -
How about some dark matter0
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Everything that our minds have convinced us that we are sensing are merely blurred perceptions of the truth. Our senses are nothing more than meager reflections of the greater truth, which is so great that the human mind is neither developed enough nor enlightened enough to perceive. Everything that we touch, taste, see, hear, and smell is merely a small piece of what each "thing" we are perceiving is.
Some people are more enlightened and can perceive more of each "thing," while others are merely relegated to understanding what each "thing" perceived is by the second-hand, or third-hand, description of another; and even when perceiving first-hand, the perception is a deception created by each individual mind based on each individual's capacity to comprehend. And no more.
Therefore it is impossible to know the truth of anything. However, it is the pursuit of this unattainable knowledge that makes mankind great.
That's my deep thought of the day.
I think, therefore I am. Fun stuff!
there are schools of thought along the lines of the teachings of Echkhart Tolle, that totally dismiss this notion of , I think, therefore, I am.0 -
Everything that our minds have convinced us that we are sensing are merely blurred perceptions of the truth. Our senses are nothing more than meager reflections of the greater truth, which is so great that the human mind is neither developed enough nor enlightened enough to perceive. Everything that we touch, taste, see, hear, and smell is merely a small piece of what each "thing" we are perceiving is.
Some people are more enlightened and can perceive more of each "thing," while others are merely relegated to understanding what each "thing" perceived is by the second-hand, or third-hand, description of another; and even when perceiving first-hand, the perception is a deception created by each individual mind based on each individual's capacity to comprehend. And no more.
Therefore it is impossible to know the truth of anything. However, it is the pursuit of this unattainable knowledge that makes mankind great.
That's my deep thought of the day.
I think, therefore I am. Fun stuff!
there are schools of thought along the lines of the teachings of Echkhart Tolle, that totally dismiss this notion of , I think, therefore, I am.
I've not heard of him! Could you point me to some good websites? Stuff that speaks in laymen's terms - academic writing agitates me to no end with its sheer pretentiousness.0 -
You may not be religious, but you believe in a sentient power. That is taking the god route of explaining things.
I DO believe that things "just came to be", because science does not require a sentient being for it to work. Life continues - birth, death, evolution - all today, along the lines of science, no creator nesscary.
The idea that we need something to "set in motion" because it is all too grand to work on its own seems silly to me. Things continue as they are - before we were here and will after we vanish from the galaxy. No concept of a creator is nesscary for the continuation of these things.
And no, science does not yet have the answers. But it will someday.
To quote someone, "If you showed an ancient person a light switch today, they would think it's magic. They would attribute godly or supernatural causes for it. Today, we know it is a matter of electricity."
Our questions are merely light switches. We can point to god for those questions, but one day, we will learn that it's a perfectly explainable phenomena, just as electricity is today.
If you live in a house that you or someone has built, you must repair it or deal with the consequences. Science is a matter of human observation and what our senses can discern. We believe in certain laws of physics, such as Newton. Things are in a state of rest until acted upon by some external force. Likewise the house we or someone build is acted upon by external forces. The idea of creator is a leap of science and faith in which the universe is a home and in that sense, those that live in that home make changes of effect repairs. We today change the planet earth and could be considered god like. The "Leap of faith" exists if you believe there is a higher intellect out (creator or god)there that can and has caused the catalysts in a way to change the "natural" courses of the universe for their own needs. I for one don't take the notion as silly, but mereley believeing that human beings are not the smartest in the universal pool. And if we can do it here, so can someone else(but of course, there has to be someone else).
The light switch example - the switches didn't just appear out of nowhere, they were created,- perfectly explainable to the ancients0 -
Everything that our minds have convinced us that we are sensing are merely blurred perceptions of the truth. Our senses are nothing more than meager reflections of the greater truth, which is so great that the human mind is neither developed enough nor enlightened enough to perceive. Everything that we touch, taste, see, hear, and smell is merely a small piece of what each "thing" we are perceiving is.
Some people are more enlightened and can perceive more of each "thing," while others are merely relegated to understanding what each "thing" perceived is by the second-hand, or third-hand, description of another; and even when perceiving first-hand, the perception is a deception created by each individual mind based on each individual's capacity to comprehend. And no more.
Therefore it is impossible to know the truth of anything. However, it is the pursuit of this unattainable knowledge that makes mankind great.
That's my deep thought of the day.
I think, therefore I am. Fun stuff!
there are schools of thought along the lines of the teachings of Echkhart Tolle, that totally dismiss this notion of , I think, therefore, I am.
I've not heard of him! Could you point me to some good websites? Stuff that speaks in laymen's terms - academic writing agitates me to no end with its sheer pretentiousness.
he is only the most commercialized spiritual guru of all time. look him up on google or amazon. I dont claim to follow his teaching. i am reading up on sufism these days.0 -
The theory that time is circular and that everything that has happened will happen again (and all that hasn't happened has already occurred) has always intrigued me.
But the deepest thought of all has to be this - what's sexy about the person above you?
Ok, so somebody obviously watched Battlestar Galactica.
But since we're on the subject of time travel. Traveling through time might change your existence in a time, but not position in the universe. And since the Earth is contantly moving, and the solar system is constantly moving, and the universe is constantly moving. Where would we end up if time trave were possible. So, since we have no idea where we'd end up, and no idea of how to get back to Earth, why would we need it?
Actually, I've never seen Battlestar Galactica - I read it in a book called "Einstein's Dreams."
If time travel is a possibility, how far back would you be able to go? Could you only go back as far as the time device that transports you existed (i.e. I built my time machine five days ago, so I can't go any further back than five days)? And lastly, time travel is real - we all travel through it, we just can't determine how we travel... yet.
Excellent point! Can we travel back in time to before we existed? I still hold what I said about time travel to be a truth. Hop on a plane in the US, and fly to Australia. You've just crossed the time continuum and are now in the future - as it is the next day for you. Turn back around, hop back on the plane and flight right back, and you're now in Australia's future tomorrow's yesterday. All this within 48 hrs of flight. SHEEEEEEE -DANG!
I gotta say --- GREAT POSTS EVERYONE!!0 -
Not corrupt but biased.
Also get this mind boggling thing in mind
Religion <> God
religion is biased and painted and abused..
God cannot be.
I think we've discovered our main difference here. You believe in god, or some sentient being of creation. I do not. That is similarly going to influence our views. I still say god or not, a semi-hits you, you're going to feel it. God will not prevent the sensation - that's written in indelible code by science. (You might not die, but this is where our credit for not dying will diverge. Others will credit luck and science, some will credit god.)
How does one rationalize the existence of matter. Either someone made it, a creator, or it just is and can't be explained as to how it came to be no "matter" how many big bangs happened. Is there another version that we have not chanced upon ?
I go with the creator route as it is the only way my mind can rationalize how things came into existence. This is a model based upon our own existence that we ourselves make things, so likewise other things were made. I myself cannot grasp the concept of matter just being there and so far our science is unable to do the same. However, each to their own and all respects to you. It's a good thread !!!!
Nobody can explain the creation of matter, therefore it is entirely a subjective point of argument. And if we could identify it, then wouldn't that make us damn near all knowing? Hence, according to religion "God Like".0 -
The theory that time is circular and that everything that has happened will happen again (and all that hasn't happened has already occurred) has always intrigued me.
But the deepest thought of all has to be this - what's sexy about the person above you?
Ok, so somebody obviously watched Battlestar Galactica.
But since we're on the subject of time travel. Traveling through time might change your existence in a time, but not position in the universe. And since the Earth is contantly moving, and the solar system is constantly moving, and the universe is constantly moving. Where would we end up if time trave were possible. So, since we have no idea where we'd end up, and no idea of how to get back to Earth, why would we need it?
Actually, I've never seen Battlestar Galactica - I read it in a book called "Einstein's Dreams."
If time travel is a possibility, how far back would you be able to go? Could you only go back as far as the time device that transports you existed (i.e. I built my time machine five days ago, so I can't go any further back than five days)? And lastly, time travel is real - we all travel through it, we just can't determine how we travel... yet.
Excellent point! Can we travel back in time to before we existed? I still hold what I said about time travel to be a truth. Hop on a plane in the US, and fly to Australia. You've just crossed the time continuum and are now in the future - as it is the next day for you. Turn back around, hop back on the plane and flight right back, and you're now in Australia's future tomorrow's yesterday. All this within 48 hrs of flight. SHEEEEEEE -DANG!
I gotta say --- GREAT POSTS EVERYONE!!
Yes Yes Yes - I thank the OP for the great opportunity to make my day and this great thread. :flowerforyou:0 -
The theory that time is circular and that everything that has happened will happen again (and all that hasn't happened has already occurred) has always intrigued me.
But the deepest thought of all has to be this - what's sexy about the person above you?
Ok, so somebody obviously watched Battlestar Galactica.
But since we're on the subject of time travel. Traveling through time might change your existence in a time, but not position in the universe. And since the Earth is contantly moving, and the solar system is constantly moving, and the universe is constantly moving. Where would we end up if time trave were possible. So, since we have no idea where we'd end up, and no idea of how to get back to Earth, why would we need it?
Actually, I've never seen Battlestar Galactica - I read it in a book called "Einstein's Dreams."
If time travel is a possibility, how far back would you be able to go? Could you only go back as far as the time device that transports you existed (i.e. I built my time machine five days ago, so I can't go any further back than five days)? And lastly, time travel is real - we all travel through it, we just can't determine how we travel... yet.
Excellent point! Can we travel back in time to before we existed? I still hold what I said about time travel to be a truth. Hop on a plane in the US, and fly to Australia. You've just crossed the time continuum and are now in the future - as it is the next day for you. Turn back around, hop back on the plane and flight right back, and you're now in Australia's future tomorrow's yesterday. All this within 48 hrs of flight. SHEEEEEEE -DANG!
I gotta say --- GREAT POSTS EVERYONE!!
Yes Yes Yes - I thank the OP for the great opportunity to make my day and this great thread. :flowerforyou:
You're welcome. I was worried this would come back to bite me in my existential *kitten*, but apparently it has gone well.0 -
That's not the way science works for me. To know how a cell works, how a plant grows, how a star forms - these are wondrous things. Knowing these things adds to the beauty of nature, not detracts from it. Every time I see a star and know that I made from star stuff, I get goose bumps.
But the thing that allows you to know you are star stuff IS science. In no way does the math and theories of it detract from that wonder. In fact, it can make it ever more amazing and beautiful because we've discovered it, we've named it, and we are continuing to explore it.
Science and wonder, definition and beauty - these are not mutually exclusive concepts.
Maybe I didn't word myself very well, but that was exactly what I meant.0 -
Its late so someone should start a 'Deep Throats' thread.0
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If Jesus came back down to earth and traveled cross country in a convertible, would He ever need to stop at a traffic light or stop sign?0
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Its late so someone should start a 'Deep Throats' thread.
Would that be nothing but 20 pages of gurgling sounds?0 -
Its late so someone should start a 'Deep Throats' thread.
Would that be nothing but 20 pages of gurgling sounds?
Kinda like.......well....this!!!0 -
Its late so someone should start a 'Deep Throats' thread.
Would that be nothing but 20 pages of gurgling sounds?
Kinda like.......well....this!!!
You mock the deep thoughts? Now, pardon me whilst I work on managing my gag reflex.
:laugh:0 -
Who decided it was okay to drink cow's milk? Did someone watch as a calf nursed and actually thought to himself: "Heyyyy, I gotta get me some of THAT!"??
funny i was thinking the same thing on the way home from work last night after a conversation about the pro's and cons of drinking milk (as well as what is best full,half or no fat) with a colleague0 -
When deaf people see people yawn do they think they are yelling? Hmmm...0
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Who decided it was okay to drink cow's milk? Did someone watch as a calf nursed and actually thought to himself: "Heyyyy, I gotta get me some of THAT!"??
funny i was thinking the same thing on the way home from work last night after a conversation about the pro's and cons of drinking milk (as well as what is best full,half or no fat) with a colleague
There's lots of foods like that for me. Think of an egg. Who is the first person who cracked one of those babies open and thought," Yum! "0 -
bump0
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if someone makes you feel special does it mean you are special or that they think you're special?0
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Who decided it was okay to drink cow's milk? Did someone watch as a calf nursed and actually thought to himself: "Heyyyy, I gotta get me some of THAT!"??
funny i was thinking the same thing on the way home from work last night after a conversation about the pro's and cons of drinking milk (as well as what is best full,half or no fat) with a colleague
There's lots of foods like that for me. Think of an egg. Who is the first person who cracked one of those babies open and thought," Yum! "
Someone who was really hungry!
Why is our species so insane? Since when is 'crazy' a valuable evolutionary survival trait?0 -
How do you know that your color blue is my color blue. What if colors were all different for everyone? Someone's blue was someone else's green?0
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How do you know that your color blue is my color blue. What if colors were all different for everyone? Someone's blue was someone else's green?
As a synesthete who sees colors in music, I can guarantee that many folks do not see the same colors as I do when I listen to music. My Middle C is forest green.0
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