Got really mad at the supermarket today

I think I might have replied to this early on to the same effect as everyone else - disgust..or maybe I read the post and thought it. Can't remember.
Anyways, I recently watched Food Inc on dvd. Have any of you seen it? I used to judge people severely what they put in their cart. Now I don't after watching that movie. It showed a family on there with a very limited budget shopping at a large grocery store. The little girl wanted a pear but her older sister made her put it back saying that they could get alot more boxed food for the same price as that one pear. The mom of the family said that while she wanted her family to eat better the fact of the matter is, they can feed their family of four on burgers and crap food at WalMart for pennies compared to what it cost to eat fresh foods and vegetables. (I'm majorly paraphrasing here)

An expert on the documentary said that if you took $1 to WalMart and tried to buy fruit and veggies, you would be lucky to get a handful of broccoli and carrots - maybe 250 calories worth of food. But if you took that same $1 to the processed food aisles, you could get over 1200 calories. For me that put it into perspective.

We wonder why people are fat in this country? Sure there are many people who are lazy and who choose to eat like crap. And then there is a vast majority of people out there that flat out can't afford to eat better. They have a family to feed and the most cost effective way to do that is with cheap processed foods.

This past weekend my husband, three year old and I went to a local butcher shop and bought organic, free range, hormone free meat and then we went and bought organic produce. I am unbelievably thankful that I can afford to do that right now. But I also remember that not six months ago I was working less than 40 hours a week and where did I shop for groceries because I had way less money? WalMart. What did I buy? A whole lot more processed foods. It is a vicious cycle.

I think I might have replied to this early on to the same effect as everyone else - disgust..or maybe I read the post and thought it. Can't remember.
Anyways, I recently watched Food Inc on dvd. Have any of you seen it? I used to judge people severely what they put in their cart. Now I don't after watching that movie. It showed a family on there with a very limited budget shopping at a large grocery store. The little girl wanted a pear but her older sister made her put it back saying that they could get alot more boxed food for the same price as that one pear. The mom of the family said that while she wanted her family to eat better the fact of the matter is, they can feed their family of four on burgers and crap food at WalMart for pennies compared to what it cost to eat fresh foods and vegetables. (I'm majorly paraphrasing here)

An expert on the documentary said that if you took $1 to WalMart and tried to buy fruit and veggies, you would be lucky to get a handful of broccoli and carrots - maybe 250 calories worth of food. But if you took that same $1 to the processed food aisles, you could get over 1200 calories. For me that put it into perspective.

We wonder why people are fat in this country? Sure there are many people who are lazy and who choose to eat like crap. And then there is a vast majority of people out there that flat out can't afford to eat better. They have a family to feed and the most cost effective way to do that is with cheap processed foods.

This past weekend my husband, three year old and I went to a local butcher shop and bought organic, free range, hormone free meat and then we went and bought organic produce. I am unbelievably thankful that I can afford to do that right now. But I also remember that not six months ago I was working less than 40 hours a week and where did I shop for groceries because I had way less money? WalMart. What did I buy? A whole lot more processed foods. It is a vicious cycle.

The DVD really does make you see things differently, you can see through the eyes of others what life for them is like, society can be so judgmental, we all are at times even if we don't mean to be.

........lots of energy on this thread, haven't kept up with the whole thing, some of it makes me a bit ill to see the battle of words, some are able to share straight up and seems others (not just on MFP <g>) have to put such strong emotion in there words to fight to be right.

There will always be various thoughts but to attack the op seems a bit vicious

Merely observation

I absolutely agree that a complete lack of education on nutrition is largely to blame and I know that it's already been discussed about it being a subject in schools, but my question is that if the First Lady and the national health organizations are so concerned with it, then why aren't we seeing a huge nationwide educational effort being made?

Remember in the 70's when they realized that kids didn't know their multiplication tables, grammar and history so they came out with the School House Rock cartoons - played them over and over and over and over during Saturday cartoons? (I don't know about you, but I can still sing most of the words to those lessons..."Conjunction Junction, what's your function?"...) How hard would it be to find a similar vehicle to teach kids about proper nutrition or how to read a food label or an ingredients listing?

Have you ever noticed how many of the same questions are asked on MFP and they are usually basic nutrition questions?? Why isn't there an area on this very website, which is dedicated to fitness (!) explaining a nutrition label or macronutrient ratios or heart-healthy choices, etc., etc. I'm sure that they can find plenty of folks who belong to this site with a professional nutrition and/or medical backgrounds that could help get a section like this together! Why not start here?

Obesity isn't just going to go away by people bleating about it. It is a very huge problem (absolutely no pun intended!) The word needs to get out and it needs to happen anywhere and everywhere possible.

Remember in the 70's when they realized that kids didn't know their multiplication tables, grammar and history so they came out with the School House Rock cartoons - played them over and over and over and over during Saturday cartoons? (I don't know about you, but I can still sing most of the words to those lessons..."Conjunction Junction, what's your function?"...) How hard would it be to find a similar vehicle to teach kids about proper nutrition or how to read a food label or an ingredients listing?

I like the concept, but the problem is that educating kids about healthy foods only goes so far. Their parents are the nutritional gatekeepers, who make all the purchase decisions. If they aren't getting the message or can't afford the good stuff, you've just deadended. On top of that, nutrition is a complex science that we still don't fully understand, and obesity in America is really tied up in political and socioeconomic issues. Fixing it is going to take dramatic overhauls in a lot of areas: stop the subsidies on corn and soy; prevent food marketing to children; improve standards for school lunch programs; create a basic, adaptable nutrition education program to go with the Presidential fitness tests; and fix the way the government subsidizes food for the poor in America.

I think the best bet would be something like schoolhouse rock movers - little 5 or 10 minute cartoons aired every so often that encourage kids to get active instead of just sitting there for 3 hours straight. Kids have little to no control over what they get to eat, but how much activity they get is up to them.

Remember in the 70's when they realized that kids didn't know their multiplication tables, grammar and history so they came out with the School House Rock cartoons - played them over and over and over and over during Saturday cartoons? (I don't know about you, but I can still sing most of the words to those lessons..."Conjunction Junction, what's your function?"...) How hard would it be to find a similar vehicle to teach kids about proper nutrition or how to read a food label or an ingredients listing?

I like the concept, but the problem is that educating kids about healthy foods only goes so far. Their parents are the nutritional gatekeepers, who make all the purchase decisions. If they aren't getting the message or can't afford the good stuff, you've just deadended. On top of that, nutrition is a complex science that we still don't fully understand, and obesity in America is really tied up in political and socioeconomic issues. Fixing it is going to take dramatic overhauls in a lot of areas: stop the subsidies on corn and soy; prevent food marketing to children; improve standards for school lunch programs; create a basic, adaptable nutrition education program to go with the Presidential fitness tests; and fix the way the government subsidizes food for the poor in America.

I think the best bet would be something like schoolhouse rock movers - little 5 or 10 minute cartoons aired every so often that encourage kids to get active instead of just sitting there for 3 hours straight. Kids have little to no control over what they get to eat, but how much activity they get is up to them.

I don't think that how much activity they get is up to them. Children are little sponges, and they follow by example. If mom is sitting on the futon eating chips and watching TV that is what her kids are doing. Life skills are learned. Eating as well as exercise is also learned. Have you ever seen an obese 3 year old who's mother is fit and at prime weight? I haven't.

Yep it's a problem, us being a Fat:ohwell: nation, the First Lady took on that issue yesterday....wonder if anyone is listening or if it will make a difference.

Laura

I completely share this anger with you. The office I worked at over the summer had several women of different health backgrounds. One with thyroid cancer (who snacks on junk all day), one who was thinning out but but eating nothing but "diet" granola bars and diet coke, and another who was obese and insulin dependent who always has a soda or cheetos in hand All of these women criticized our CFO for monitoring his childrens' food and choosing organic when possible. I was infuriated. Don't they realize that feeding their children, and themselves, all of this over processed crap is what has led them to this place to begin with? I couldn't believe how narrow minded they were. I eat organic dairy products at the very least to limit hormone intake since I have fatigue issues as well as ovarian cysts. What goes in is fuel for you body, if you put in crap, well what do you expect. At our winter party I saw the daughter of the insulin dependent diabetic was severely over weight for a 5 year old and I felt so sad for her because she isn't in control of the grocery cart. Parents are supposed to look out for their childrens' wellbeing, and that includes what goes in their mouths.

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain."– Maya Angelou

lovely quote! I agree, of course when I go shopping I NEVER buy the full fat ice-cream always 1/2 fat if I do buy ice cream. I'm not much of a snacker try to get full off meals.

I just looked up the calories for Kraft Mac & Cheese and Spaghettios, they are not that bad, just about 250-280 for a meal which is good, in my opinion.

Also, it's not polite to judge.

For what I know about nutrition, it is not so much about the calories in the food, but the content of it...................Kraft Mac and Cheese and Spaghettios are nothing but chemicals, preservatives and empty, nutritionally void carbs.

Do you know how much veggies and fruit and protein that child could eat and stay full on 250-280 calories??? Quite a bit.

I whole heartedly agree with SHBoss regarding these comments and I feel the US needs to start doing like Canada and European countries do and start taking children out of the homes for child endangerment and child neglect.

Growing up my mom did not allow us to have soda, chips, candy, cookies, cakes, etc...............unless it was a very special occasion and then we were allowed a VERY small portion.

We ate full fat bacon, sausage, pork, beef, chicken, eggs, cheese, WHOLE milk (straight from the cow), lots of fresh fruit and veggies, raw nuts.................

We hardly ever ate bread, crackers, etc.............

I got away from eating like this and I am back on the low carb band wagon. Growing up I didn't even know we were eating a controlled carb meal. I just knew we were eating everything all natural, unprocessed and most things came straight from the farm.

SHBoss1673 ~ how do you make spaghetti squash in 15 mins? Please tell me! I love that stuff but it takes me like an hour to bake it. I'm new here so if you could contact me directly with your reply I'd appreciate it, since I don't know if I will see your reply here. But if that's not possible, no worries!

thx

cut it in half, put about 1/2 an inch of water in the bottom of a microwave dish, and microwave it for about 8 to 12 minutes. Comes out the same as if you bake it.

Cool! Do you think it would work with eggplant?

It is easy to look at someone else and judge them based on a single observation, or to make moral judgments in the abstract, based on information that may or may not be accurate and on a wide range of emotions and biases.

The vast majority of people--including the vast majority of people on MFP--have little or no formal nutritional education or training. Our knowledge about nutrition comes from a variety of sources--and the quality of those sources ranges from excellent to horrific. From comments I have read, there seems to be a notion among many people that there is a universal consensus on what constitutes "healthy" eating, and that those consensus guidelines are not only simple and obvious, but readily available. In the general public, people who consider themselves "knowledgeable" will proceed to make statements about the "benefits" of eating practices such as "low carb" and "organic" as though these were accepted "truths", when in fact there is considerable controversy as to whether they are beneficial at all.

Heck, just look at the nonsense about protein that is spewed out on these forums on an almost continuous basis.

Even setting national nutritional guidelines is not that simple. Even if they were based solely on science, there is not universal agreement on the science, and, they are almost never based solely on science. Setting national nutritional guidelines is as much about politics as it is anything else--and by "politics", I mean in the larger sense of a dispute about ideas, not just between political parties. Lobbyists for various interest groups--across the ideological spectrum--play a large role in how consensus guidelines are developed.

Then, when you have some guidelines, like the USDA pyramid type stuff, getting that information out is a huge task in itself. Food companies spend literally Billions of dollars and use some of the most sophisticated market research and advertising methods ever invented to sell their products. The average person faces a bewildering array of choices in the grocery store and even many people who consider themselves knowledgeable and educated have difficulty making good food choices. How is the average person supposed to know that most of the "lo-cal", "low-fat", "lean cuisine", "healthy" type foods in the store are pretty crappy and filled with sugar, sodium and an encyclopedia full of chemicals?

Other people have mentioned the social and financial components. Many urban areas in this country are considered "food deserts" in which fresh fruits and vegetables are not readily available. Someone already mentioned that eating healthy can be relatively expensive--it is a LOT cheaper to eat off the Dollar Menu at McDonalds than it is to prepare nutritious meals made from healthy ingredients. And lest we think the bad choices are restricted to the poor and uneducated, some of the greatest resistance to introducing healthy foods in schools comes from parents in wealthy school districts. And don't even get me started on the people who think they are superior because they shop at places like Whole Foods.

Bottom line, it's a complicated issue with no easy solutions--and I haven't even touched on the psychological issues. My opinion is that, while I understand the emotional responses and am not above having them myself, I would ask people to step back, take a larger view, have some empathy, and not rush to judgment when you see someone doing something you disagree with.

Chances are, they are looking at you and thinking the same thing.

Proper nutrional education is not offered to the poor. I have seen classes offered, but they are not made known to the public. And those classes are not truly about proper nutrition. I've taken them, they involve boxed foods, canned veggies, etc. If you were to go to a local food bank for food, thats exactly what you would get. Most people who are poor enough to need food stamps do not have a reliable internet/cable access to learn the way we have. They also are most likely more concerend with keeping the heat and lights on than if the Kraft Mac n' Cheese is a poor choice.


I think that in order to get food stamps, you should have to take a nutrition and budgeting class. Most people on food stamps have kids on medicaid and medicaid pays for you to see a dietician. That is a benefit that no child should miss out on. It would save so much money in the long run, for both the family and the tax payers.

JMO
Holly

Ok, I'm only halfway through this thread but I had to comment on a few things you wrote. I work with low income families - they have to be under the federal poverty guidelines to qualify. Anyway, there are a lot of free nutrition classes offered - our program has a nutritionist that will meet with families 1-on-1 for FREE and work with them as much as needed. Guess what? Nobody wants to. It's not that the information isn't there or the people are not there - they are not willing to learn and change. Of course not everybody is like that but the vast majority that I've worked with it like that. And I totally disagree that people poor enough to be on food stamps don't have access to internet or cable - I go into homes and am always amazed at their choices - flat screen TV's, xbox 360, ps3, always have cell phones, etc. etc. All the while they are telling me that they can't pay their utility bill and it is getting shut off and wondering where to go for help. This is is a whole other topic though and I know there are a lot of factors at play but you can't just say that the education isn't offered. It's like a PP said - her insurance company won't cover it because 90% of the people won't even use it.

I totally agree with your last paragraph though. But for whatever reason, it is not connecting. I mean, I see parents forced to take parenting classes all the time because of custody issues and it doesn't actually benefit them, kwim?

I absolutely agree that a complete lack of education on nutrition is largely to blame and I know that it's already been discussed about it being a subject in schools, but my question is that if the First Lady and the national health organizations are so concerned with it, then why aren't we seeing a huge nationwide educational effort being made?

I can only repeat that the amount of $$$ that government health agencies have to promote healthy eating is only a tiny, tiny, tiny fraction of the dollars that food manufacturers have to promote and market junk foods. And only a small fraction of what diet/supplement/exercise/informercial hucksters have to promote their products.

I don't go by the guidelines that the government agencies put out and don't get me started on that stupid food pyramid put together by the USDA.

The FDA has the Big Pharma companies in their pocket and the USDA has the CRA (corn refiners of america) in their pocket........This way they can keep selling HFCS to the food manufacturers keeping us fat and sick so the Big Pharma and the CRA get richer and Americans get fatter and sicker...........

I rely on getting my own information from my own resources, not from the government as they don't have my best interest at heart.

And you mentioned that eating low carb or organic is controversial in having any benefits????

You tell me how eating a grilled chicken breast or a ribeye steak along with a serving of steamed broccoli and a salad is unhealthy? That is what eating low carb and probably organic is about.

You could not pay me any amount of money to eat beef, chicken, eggs, pork, or fish from a mainstream grocery store. I would rather starve to death than to eat food that comes from factory farming where the animals are fed way out of their natural habitat. Given grains they don't need to fatten them up and make them grow faster, given food meal that contains hormones, anti-biotics, etc..........my body does not need that crap in it.

Proper nutrional education is not offered to the poor. I have seen classes offered, but they are not made known to the public. And those classes are not truly about proper nutrition. I've taken them, they involve boxed foods, canned veggies, etc. If you were to go to a local food bank for food, thats exactly what you would get. Most people who are poor enough to need food stamps do not have a reliable internet/cable access to learn the way we have. They also are most likely more concerend with keeping the heat and lights on than if the Kraft Mac n' Cheese is a poor choice.


I think that in order to get food stamps, you should have to take a nutrition and budgeting class. Most people on food stamps have kids on medicaid and medicaid pays for you to see a dietician. That is a benefit that no child should miss out on. It would save so much money in the long run, for both the family and the tax payers.

JMO
Holly

Ok, I'm only halfway through this thread but I had to comment on a few things you wrote. I work with low income families - they have to be under the federal poverty guidelines to qualify. Anyway, there are a lot of free nutrition classes offered - our program has a nutritionist that will meet with families 1-on-1 for FREE and work with them as much as needed. Guess what? Nobody wants to. It's not that the information isn't there or the people are not there - they are not willing to learn and change. Of course not everybody is like that but the vast majority that I've worked with it like that. And I totally disagree that people poor enough to be on food stamps don't have access to internet or cable - I go into homes and am always amazed at their choices - flat screen TV's, xbox 360, ps3, always have cell phones, etc. etc. All the while they are telling me that they can't pay their utility bill and it is getting shut off and wondering where to go for help. This is is a whole other topic though and I know there are a lot of factors at play but you can't just say that the education isn't offered. It's like a PP said - her insurance company won't cover it because 90% of the people won't even use it.

I totally agree with your last paragraph though. But for whatever reason, it is not connecting. I mean, I see parents forced to take parenting classes all the time because of custody issues and it doesn't actually benefit them, kwim?

Junipuni -

No one is making them attend a parenting, nutrition or budgeting class, so why would they sign up for something they don't have to sign up for????

From what I see, a lot of people on food stamps would rather spend their $$$$ on processed and quick, easy food than to spend it on foods they would actually have to spend some time preparing and cooking.

It is a shame the laziness this society has become. I had fallen victim to it, but NO more for me. I am no longer being lazy about it. If it needs to be done, then I am doing it. Making sure I have a clean house everyday, home cooked and nutritionally sound meals for me, hubby and our 2 dogs, exercise, etc....................

My whole mind set has changed as well as I believe that SHBoss mind set has changed also. That is why I commend him for creating this forum.

You will never succeed in keeping the weight off until you have a complete change in mind set. I firmly believe that.

Proper nutrional education is not offered to the poor. I have seen classes offered, but they are not made known to the public. And those classes are not truly about proper nutrition. I've taken them, they involve boxed foods, canned veggies, etc. If you were to go to a local food bank for food, thats exactly what you would get. Most people who are poor enough to need food stamps do not have a reliable internet/cable access to learn the way we have. They also are most likely more concerend with keeping the heat and lights on than if the Kraft Mac n' Cheese is a poor choice.


I think that in order to get food stamps, you should have to take a nutrition and budgeting class. Most people on food stamps have kids on medicaid and medicaid pays for you to see a dietician. That is a benefit that no child should miss out on. It would save so much money in the long run, for both the family and the tax payers.

JMO
Holly

Ok, I'm only halfway through this thread but I had to comment on a few things you wrote. I work with low income families - they have to be under the federal poverty guidelines to qualify. Anyway, there are a lot of free nutrition classes offered - our program has a nutritionist that will meet with families 1-on-1 for FREE and work with them as much as needed. Guess what? Nobody wants to. It's not that the information isn't there or the people are not there - they are not willing to learn and change. Of course not everybody is like that but the vast majority that I've worked with it like that. And I totally disagree that people poor enough to be on food stamps don't have access to internet or cable - I go into homes and am always amazed at their choices - flat screen TV's, xbox 360, ps3, always have cell phones, etc. etc. All the while they are telling me that they can't pay their utility bill and it is getting shut off and wondering where to go for help. This is is a whole other topic though and I know there are a lot of factors at play but you can't just say that the education isn't offered. It's like a PP said - her insurance company won't cover it because 90% of the people won't even use it.

I totally agree with your last paragraph though. But for whatever reason, it is not connecting. I mean, I see parents forced to take parenting classes all the time because of custody issues and it doesn't actually benefit them, kwim?

Junipuni -

No one is making them attend a parenting, nutrition or budgeting class, so why would they sign up for something they don't have to sign up for????

From what I see, a lot of people on food stamps would rather spend their $$$$ on processed and quick, easy food than to spend it on foods they would actually have to spend some time preparing and cooking.

It is a shame the laziness this society has become. I had fallen victim to it, but NO more for me. I am no longer being lazy about it. If it needs to be done, then I am doing it. Making sure I have a clean house everyday, home cooked and nutritionally sound meals for me, hubby and our 2 dogs, exercise, etc....................

My whole mind set has changed as well as I believe that SHBoss mind set has changed also. That is why I commend him for creating this forum.

You will never succeed in keeping the weight off until you have a complete change in mind set. I firmly believe that.

I don't disagree - I was responding to the comment that proper nutrition education is not offered to poor people and not made known to them.

Just continue to try to educate, one person at a time, and lead by example. Life is all about learning. I am sure that we are all not done with that!

So well spoken, I'm glad you added your thoughts!:flowerforyou: