Spa owner yells at Mom of Autistic child-Facebook Firestorm

Your examples don't match up though. Those other causes are all illegal and not part of normal development.

Part of living in a community is living with others. Sure we have societal expectations. I just think it is sad that many in this thread are so rigid in those expectations given something that is developmentally appropriate to the community members they are mingling with.

Swerving to avoid a dog resulting in an accident probably isn't illegal, but just to be sure pretend I said swerving to avoid an out of control schoolbus of schoolchildren and nuns carrying emergency relief funds to impoverished third-world countries. :laugh:

But even if we take the disability out of it and just focus on a crying 2 year old, I find it sad that we definitely have a lot of ageism here (whether it is a protected class or not) to the point that we can't deal with NORMAL behavior without having tantrums of our own, internal or otherwise. Again, a little patience goes a long way.

It's not so much that I can't deal with it. I can deal with a lot of things. But I don't have to like it. And, if there is an option available, I would prefer not to deal with it. So it's like... okay, let's say your 2-year old cries 24/7 for some reason. But you have to bring him on a plane to visit your deceased whatever like said above. Well that sucks for me but... you gotta do what you gotta do, right? So I can have a corresponding amount of understanding and compassion.

But what if you're bringing him to a spa -- a real spa with towels wrapped around heads and cucumber slices on the eyes and people wearing fluffy slippers to get away from the grind. And you decide to bring your crying 2-year old. You don't gotta do that so much! So not as much understanding and very little compassion from me.

I find it interesting that the children are expected to forgo individuality and even normal reflexes because they are expected to conform to community standards and basic be perfect mini adults (even though adults aren't) but adults are expected to have things catered to them as individuals even though they live in a community. We as a society fluctuate on a continuum of individualistic stance vs. community stance. Regardless of where in the continuum you place your ideologies, both exist.

(I'm not sure the last paragraph conveys what I'm trying to say so if you pick it apart, I'm okay. It might add clarity, even if I don't agree with everyone's stance in this continuum).

I get what you're saying, but it's situational. See above. Kids can be kids in places where kids are supposed to be kids. But if you're bringing a kid to an adult environment, they should behave like adults... or not be there. The exact same applies with adults. An adult at a football game is not the same as an adult meeting the CEO of a Fortune 500 company is not the same as an adult at the playground with his kid.

I disagree completely with what you, and other posters, say about how somehow adults are excluded from these rules. They are not. To take just one example, adults that are disruptive on planes are also removed. I fail to see where there is "catering" to adults that somehow isn't situationally dependent. If I were to walk into an arcade or theme park and demand that all the children be quiet, I doubt anyone would cater to me.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2013/05/14/woman-removed-from-plane-for-refusing-to-stop-singing-a-whitney-houston-song/

As one of said former special needs child(epilepsy , adrenal hyperplasia, and fused kidneys), I blame both parties. The owner was way out of line to yell at the childs mother like that. If it was already known by staff and owner the child was on the spectrum then plans should of been made to make said child as comfy as possible. At the same time it was the moms job to do the same for her child. The child could of been taken into a quieter space for his hair cut. He could of been given the first or last time slot. Both the mom and salon owner acted stupidly in their own way.

My mother advoided places with flashing lights with me when possible because I was moderately photo sensetive when small. Why? Common sense , avoid the big flashy trigger.

Joocey, I actually don't disagree with the situational factor. I don't see it nearly as rigid as some do, but in the case of an upscale spa with no children services offered, etc., I agree with your point.. From what I read, despite the name, this is not really one of those places. Furthermore, from what I understand, there were children services offered as part of the business services. There was also mentions of this not being the first child the woman was rude to, despite her business offerings. I don't live there though. I can't see the signs to verify.

Ok since people don't want to handle this reasonably I'm going to be blunt. Was the owner an *kitten*? Yes. Was her behavior unacceptable? Yes. Could something pf been done to put the kid in a less stimulating enviorement for his hair cut ? Most likely. Should it of been offered by the staff or requested by the mother? Deffinitly. Could the kid of been given a closing or opening slot if nothing else? Yes! But some of this blame lays on the mother as well.

Just like my mother knew that certain things triggered my seizures and them worse so did this mother know that things can trigger her sons freaking out. My room had to have an AC during summer, and up until I was 8 flashing lights were an expose at your own risk thing. Did I go to chuckee cheese like a normal 90's baby? Yup, I sure did. But if either heat or flashing lights made my seizures worse my mother took responsablity. She was the one who controled my enviorment so it was up to her to make the right choices till I was old enough to help. And dispite this I got to go camping, fishing, ride bikes, play baseball and basket ball with our neihbores and climb trees.

It is is both the same and different for a child on the spectrum. The poor kid already has senses that are hyper aware of everything in the extreme. And a lot of kids like that are mute. The easiest way I can explain it is that the child is like a sentinal from the series of the same name, only mute. And without the ability to control their senses.

Maybe the spa owner was having a bad day, or was unaware that the child was autistic. When events like this are blown out of proportion, it's harder, not easier, for the actual human beings involved to admit their mistakes, and maybe, just possibly, make amends.

WOW the world would be way better if we all tried to get along, and everybody relized kids will be kids and adults should know better then have a tantrum because a child cries. My kids are grown and never has a child crying, tantrum or any other action has ever ruined my day of what ever i am doing. The only time someone can ruin your day is if you allow them to.

I would much rather put up with a child worst tantrum then to see a adult act like a child having a tantrum
children learn that it is not right and an adult should already know

Come on Adults lets be adults and those of you who think it should be your way grow up

But why should other people out enjoying their day have to put up with someone else's sex trophy acting like a wild animal?

I did not say children should be allowed to misbehave but most parents try to teach thier child it is not proper behavior and with the correct guidance the kids learn not to misbehave. Parents can not predict when thier child will act up. Believe me if they could we would see alot less kids crying and bisbehaving in public.
That being said I have seen way worse misbehaving from ADULTS who SHOULD know better and a much worse scene then a child ever could.
Ever go to a NICE restraunt and sit accross from a table where the ADULTS are all drunk and MISBEHAVING ? I have and tell you what would rather sit across from a CHILD on thier worst behavior, at least the parent will be trying to stop it. So who is going to stop the adult from making a scene interupting everyones meal and being very inappropriate in almost everyway? The manager? the Waitress? the Police?
most of the time a child can be calmed down or easily removed from the scene
a adult much harder and you don't have a parent trying to calm them down and about the only way to remove the adult is to get physical

I don't have a problem with asking the adult to shut their pie hole, try saying that to someone else's kid. My problem isn't with the parents who's kid cries or acts up and they attempt to correct it. My problem is with the kid that is acting like an untrained monkey and the parent just goes on about their day like nothing is happening.

O my word I can't stop :sad: :sad: :sad: How thoroughly DISGUSTING :mad: I think EVERYBODY who reads this should let this salon owner know how horrible she is! What an awful world we live in............................

How exactly will that help? Yes it is terrible. No, sadly I don't think it is all that unusual. But how will people raging from thousands of miles away impact that woman? Sharing it locally and with people who can impact her business - absolutely.

You're right, it is not all that unusual. That is why it is important to raise awareness of how people (not just children) with an invisible disability such as autism are treated in society.

We need to be more tolerant of people who display behaviour that may be considered "strange" by people who are neurotypical.

People who are autistic learn from the way they are treated. If they are treated in this way, they learn that it's OK to treat people like this. People with autism are amazing when you get to know them. They often build a wealth of knowledge of their "specialist subject" and can be incredibly intelligent even though they have communication difficulties.

Check out www.lottieharland.com. This young lady has Autism. One of her favourite sayings is "Autism is not a disability, it's a different ability". Another favourite saying is "Don't dis- my ability!" She not only represents her country in sport but is also an A student at school. However, at school she is often taunted with calls of "Retard" or other such vile names. She is a member of Mensa - the high IQ society.

Awareness must be raised of this all around the world so that it becomes unacceptable to ridicule anyone for behaviour that is just not considered "the norm".

Edited to add:
Having said that I don't think this was about the child having autism. It was about a child having a tantrum which usually happens at the most inopportune of moments (I'm sure most parents will agree). If the spa allowed children then it has to accept that occasionally a child will have a tantrum. If they don't want children in there, they should change the rules. IMO, owner was out of order. She should have just made a note to change the spa rules to not allow children in the future so that it doesn't happen again.

upscale spa, her business, her rules. dont bring kids...

You are 100% correct. In fact I won't go either. That should make her business a lot simpler to manage.

And to update: within less than a week, the Facebook firestorm has died down - I haven't seen any new posts

that's about how it goes... for a day or two everyone is enraged about it, then they are are tired of hearing about it, then everyone finds something new to be enraged in.

Oh my !

I had a woman yell at me to take my son and have him put down because she said he had hurt her little girl at preschool. he was not quite 3 years old at the time and the preschool staff were not aware that anything had happened, the little girl, who was older, had gone home to her Mum and said he hurt her, so the next day she met me in the entrance to the school and started yelling at screaming at him and me that he was an animal and various other things, I was so shocked and distraught I did not know what to do, so I left taking my terribly upset son, who is also autistic

When we got home he sat with his back to the front door so that 'bad lady' could not get him

I hope that karma comes her way big style

My son is now 20 years old and a very fine young man with a good job

How did a toddler crying on his mother's lap turn into a screaming, tantrum throwing, hethen? haha

Like others picked up on, the term "upscale" may be a bit exaggerated for this salon btw

Bottom line: the owner's actions were unacceptable

And to update: within less than a week, the Facebook firestorm has died down - I haven't seen any new posts

Thats because all FB is now is a bunch of fake crap for people to get riled up about.

WOW the world would be way better if we all tried to get along, and everybody relized kids will be kids and adults should know better then have a tantrum because a child cries. My kids are grown and never has a child crying, tantrum or any other action has ever ruined my day of what ever i am doing. The only time someone can ruin your day is if you allow them to.

I would much rather put up with a child worst tantrum then to see a adult act like a child having a tantrum
children learn that it is not right and an adult should already know

Come on Adults lets be adults and those of you who think it should be your way grow up

But why should other people out enjoying their day have to put up with someone else's sex trophy acting like a wild animal?

I did not say children should be allowed to misbehave but most parents try to teach thier child it is not proper behavior and with the correct guidance the kids learn not to misbehave. Parents can not predict when thier child will act up. Believe me if they could we would see alot less kids crying and bisbehaving in public.
That being said I have seen way worse misbehaving from ADULTS who SHOULD know better and a much worse scene then a child ever could.
Ever go to a NICE restraunt and sit accross from a table where the ADULTS are all drunk and MISBEHAVING ? I have and tell you what would rather sit across from a CHILD on thier worst behavior, at least the parent will be trying to stop it. So who is going to stop the adult from making a scene interupting everyones meal and being very inappropriate in almost everyway? The manager? the Waitress? the Police?
most of the time a child can be calmed down or easily removed from the scene
a adult much harder and you don't have a parent trying to calm them down and about the only way to remove the adult is to get physical

I don't have a problem with asking the adult to shut their pie hole, try saying that to someone else's kid. My problem isn't with the parents who's kid cries or acts up and they attempt to correct it. My problem is with the kid that is acting like an untrained monkey and the parent just goes on about their day like nothing is happening.

everytry to tell a drunk to shut there "pie hole"
have you ever asked a parent to keep there child quiet.
i would rather walk over hot coals then try and shut up a drunk or an adult who is having a tantrum.
yes there are some parents out there that think thier child can' do no wrong
but worse there are adults out there that think the world revolves around them
guess what those are probly the kids that the parents thought they could do no wrong

Listening to both sides of a story will convince you that there is more to a story than both sides.

I actually have told drunks that they are annoying and to please keep it down. They are people too, they can be spoken to even when they are drinking. I have also asked parents to keep their kid under control. The one that comes to mind is when a kid kept kicking me in line and I asked his dad to make him stop. After the third time I asked I told the dad that if he kicked me one more time that he (the dad, obviously not the kid) was gonna be eating some of his own teeth if his kid kicked me again. I didn't get kicked anymore.

All I know, is I would take a kid having a tantrum on a Greyhound bus over my underaged drunk/high partying neighbors I had live in the apartment below me during college...

Or the frat boys that lived above me... now that was "fun".... at least a kid in a public place is temporary...

It's pretty easy to call the cops on those people.

WOW the world would be way better if we all tried to get along, and everybody relized kids will be kids and adults should know better then have a tantrum because a child cries. My kids are grown and never has a child crying, tantrum or any other action has ever ruined my day of what ever i am doing. The only time someone can ruin your day is if you allow them to.

I would much rather put up with a child worst tantrum then to see a adult act like a child having a tantrum
children learn that it is not right and an adult should already know

Come on Adults lets be adults and those of you who think it should be your way grow up

But why should other people out enjoying their day have to put up with someone else's sex trophy acting like a wild animal?

I did not say children should be allowed to misbehave but most parents try to teach thier child it is not proper behavior and with the correct guidance the kids learn not to misbehave. Parents can not predict when thier child will act up. Believe me if they could we would see alot less kids crying and bisbehaving in public.
That being said I have seen way worse misbehaving from ADULTS who SHOULD know better and a much worse scene then a child ever could.
Ever go to a NICE restraunt and sit accross from a table where the ADULTS are all drunk and MISBEHAVING ? I have and tell you what would rather sit across from a CHILD on thier worst behavior, at least the parent will be trying to stop it. So who is going to stop the adult from making a scene interupting everyones meal and being very inappropriate in almost everyway? The manager? the Waitress? the Police?
most of the time a child can be calmed down or easily removed from the scene
a adult much harder and you don't have a parent trying to calm them down and about the only way to remove the adult is to get physical

I don't have a problem with asking the adult to shut their pie hole, try saying that to someone else's kid. My problem isn't with the parents who's kid cries or acts up and they attempt to correct it. My problem is with the kid that is acting like an untrained monkey and the parent just goes on about their day like nothing is happening.

everytry to tell a drunk to shut there "pie hole"
have you ever asked a parent to keep there child quiet.
i would rather walk over hot coals then try and shut up a drunk or an adult who is having a tantrum.
yes there are some parents out there that think thier child can' do no wrong
but worse there are adults out there that think the world revolves around them
guess what those are probly the kids that the parents thought they could do no wrong

Listening to both sides of a story will convince you that there is more to a story than both sides.

I actually have told drunks that they are annoying and to please keep it down. They are people too, they can be spoken to even when they are drinking. I have also asked parents to keep their kid under control. The one that comes to mind is when a kid kept kicking me in line and I asked his dad to make him stop. After the third time I asked I told the dad that if he kicked me one more time that he (the dad, obviously not the kid) was gonna be eating some of his own teeth if his kid kicked me again. I didn't get kicked anymore.

think most people will agree with me that most drunks cannot be reasoned with
last time i asked a drunk to quiet down I got beat by a tire iron was in the hospital for 2 weeks and physical therapy for 5 months
at least a child will not do that kind of damage thier behavior my be annoying at times but harmless