Judging people and their weight
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One problem I see, (and it's a big one for me) is that people live to eat. Instead of eating to live.0
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But the person is still making a choice to take the medication, because the benefits of taking it outweigh the consequences. It may not be a good choice, or a fair choice. It may be the case that no sane person would choose not to take the medication, regardless of how much weight gain it causes, but it's still a choice.Unfortunately what the doctor is saying is true. Being overweight or obese is self inflicted. No one is forcing someone to eat more than they should. Food to some is just as addicting as tobacco is to smokers. How many people truly feel sorry for someone who gets lung cancer after smoking for decades? Not many. How many people truly feel sorry for someone who is considered obese that dies, or contracts a related disease associated with their weight. Again not many.
Medication that causes weight gain is not self-inflicted.0 -
One problem I see, (and it's a big one for me) is that people live to eat. Instead of eating to live.
Yep, and the simple fact that America is very accepting of obesity.0 -
I will agree that my choices have put me in this position of needing to lose almost 100 lbs.
I chose to drink excessive amounts of soda, eat excessive amounts of junk food, and eat excessive amounts of high fat/high calorie foods while not bothering to consume more healthy options.
I did choose not to exercise, though I will say that having plantar fasciitis does cause incredible foot pain and yeah, it's next to impossible to exercise until the plantar fasciitis is healed. I had to sleep with foot braces for several months before I felt like normal, and for over a year I could not wear any shoes but Crocs - no sneakers either - without causing my feet to flare up in pain....so someone saying their feet hurt may very well be legit and not BS.
I was very frustrated because I wanted to walk my dog - and I couldn't even walk through the supermarket shopping for groceries without being in agony.
Now that my feet are completely healed, and I can wear sneakers and other shoes besides crocs, I AM able to exercise and I do, for some reason, really WANT to do it - I never wanted to in the past...and I was frustrated when I had the plantar fasciitis and I WANTED to walk but couldn't.0 -
The doctor was right. The way he put it was wrong, but I think the meaning was that being fat is something that can be changed, so if you're fat and you hate it, then why don't you try to change it. I don't think he meant it as, people that are fat love being fat, but just people that are fat have the ability to change that whereas people with certain other physical things wrong can't change that.
That sounds right.
I do think one reason people stay fat is that they don't believe they have the ability to change it, and one great thing about places like MFP is that it provides the tools.
I remember back when I was in my early 20s and would complain about how I was too fat (I was probably 125 or so, yes I know that makes me back then obnoxious or overly insecure). Instead of the usual "no, you are fine," a friend of mine said "why don't you lose weight, then?" and it struck me that I'd never really tried to do so (and had no idea how, although I was pretty good at figuring out all kinds of other things). I didn't actually bother figuring out how to lose until I gained a bunch more weight, but that always stuck with me despite my (inaccurate) feelings that my weight was beyond my control.0 -
Bull****. Obesity is a structural problem, a public health problem, owing to many factors beyond our control such as food system design, city design, work schedules, commute time, and so forth. People weren't skinnier a hundred years ago because they wanted it more, they were skinnier because it was easy. Healthy weight has gone from the default, to something you must strive for, to something you must spend hours every day working for.
For myself, the biggest change in my weight is not due to dieting or working harder. It is because I moved to a place where I can run right from my front door. Not everyone has that option.
The people on this forum put in a lot of work to try to be healthy. Good for them, more power to them. But they cannot be blamed for the problem to begin with, nor can people who aren't able to put in this much effort be condemned.0 -
This topic came up on the side of my page and I should have ignored it. But now I have to chime in after reading all these comments. Food is not the only reason people gain weight and to think that is very narrow-minded. I personally gained weight from medication. And by medication, I mean birth control pills. I gained when I switched pills twice, and then I gained again when I stopped taking them all together. I don't overeat, I eat extremely healthy, I exercise. And I've led this lifestyle for many years but have still gained the weight for reasons beyond my control. So, no, it isn't a choice to be fat as most of you think. It was my choice to take that medication, but not have a reaction to it. So judging people based on circumstances that you don't know or understand makes you, simply, a jerk.0
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Some of us don't choose to be fat or exhibit behaviour allowing to be and remain fat. I was an athlete from the age of 5.
Now I am a middle age mom, have seen doctors, naturopaths, nutritionists who find nothing wrong with me. I track everything I eat, no junk food, no cola, no fried food, lots of fruit and vegetables and water. I exercise: spin, dance, run, play tennis and golf. Yet, I gain weight. My BMI is borderline obese.
It is hurtful when I hear comments about choosing to be fat or not to change eating habits to lose weight.
I wish I could find the reason why I look the way I do. Wish I could find the solution.0 -
I see this every day being a nurse. People don't WANT to get Diabetes Type II and have limbs cut off but they didn't WANT to do anything about it when they had the chance in their 20's and 30's. They decided being sedentary and eating all those processed foods and carbs were more important to them than exercise and diet. It's the price you pay for letting your health decline. And before I get the hate comments about injuries and not being able to work out....that's just total BS. If you have an injury (aside from being paralyzed from the neck down) you can still do plenty of exercises like swimming, walking, body weight exercises and weight training.
Look at the guys in wheel chair body building....they achieved goals beyond their disability. Much respect to them for not feeling sorry for themselves and withering away in denial.
P.S. Even medication that causes weight gain can be overcome. I am hyperthyroid and I take medication to slow down my thyroid production. In doing so, my metabolism is also slowed. Average weight gain with this medication is 20 lbs. I haven't gained any weight because I did my research and know how to counteract the weight gain with a clean diet and exercise. Where there is a will, there is a way.0 -
Bull****. Obesity is a structural problem, a public health problem, owing to many factors beyond our control such as food system design, city design, work schedules, commute time, and so forth. People weren't skinnier a hundred years ago because they wanted it more, they were skinnier because it was easy. Healthy weight has gone from the default, to something you must strive for, to something you must spend hours every day working for.
For myself, the biggest change in my weight is not due to dieting or working harder. It is because I moved to a place where I can run right from my front door. Not everyone has that option.
The people on this forum put in a lot of work to try to be healthy. Good for them, more power to them. But they cannot be blamed for the problem to begin with, nor can people who aren't able to put in this much effort be condemned.
You made some points but it doesn't explain why in the same city we see variety of sizes. I think it will still boil down to personal choice on life style and activity level. Yeah, envrionment makes it harder to make the right choice but it's not impossible.0 -
I agree with the injury excuse. Too easy. Because of my weight, I am obviously more prone to certain injuries and my personal issue is achilles tendonitis. That's when I cut down on running and switch to spinning. I don't want to stop working out, I would weigh a lot more if I did. I adapt. Still can't lose weight though...0
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It is amusing to see people who are "naturally thin" or really don't like food as much as others..judge people who are neither.
Some people think about and enjoy food more than other people. Many of the naturally thin people I know don't snack much..leave food on their plates and don't like high fat foods.
That's hardly a badge of honor..they're just lucky. I think that doctor is an idiot.0 -
Well .. honestly yeah it is a choice. You are quite right there. But for some people the choice is between being fat and sometimes happy and being thin and permanently in abject misery it's not really so simple a choice now is it.
It's not such an easy question to answer. Because there is both rightness and wrongness on both sides. On one hand yes fat people are treated like second class human beings. At the best they are comedy relief at the worst they are outright despised and bullied. This creates a self fulfilling prophecy of depression. A vicious cycle that is not so easy to break as the victims isolation from others forces them more and more into a corner until eating is literally the only thing they have left.
Then there is the legion of excuse makers. I got a slow metabolism. My whole family is fat. I got an injury. Lol I've got size 15 flat feet with terrible bunions (Try running on those for any length of time lol Or finding proper running shoes) A dodgy ankle and a dodgy knee and I still lost 7 stone.
Then on the other hand there are those that quite simply fall out with people. And lose the ability to tell the difference between encouragement to lose weight and being bullied for being fat. They get so defensive about it that any encouragement to be better is instantly taken as criticism. And they do this because honestly people have been treating them like dirt for ages and they have come to expect it.
In fact there are as many cases as there are people everyone's story is different. And THAT is really why what this doctor says is stupid. Because he generalizes about a point which changes so dramatically depending on the circumstances of the person involved and their individual psychology and history.
Yes there are people that don't really want to be fat but fall into it through a vicious cycle of depression loneliness and an eating disorder.
Yes there are lazy bums that make excuse after excuse for why they can't stop stuffing their face.
Yes there are people who have been fit and healthy all their lives and treat anyone fatter than them like scum.
Yes there are fit and healthy people who try and help the overweight only to have defensive excuse laden bile shoved back in their faces.
My point is that there is no right and wrong here. Generalization doesn't work whatever you do. For me It's sad to admit that I just didn't care about my health or about living a long time. As a fat person who was also foreign I was totally ostracized and bullied and worse in my younger years. And I lost faith in humanity. I stayed fat because being healthy just was not worth it. All that effort just to live on this planet a few more miserable years. All I wanted to do was stuff my face and smoke pot like nobodies business and giggle at puerile crap. I just dived into anything that would give me any fleeting happiness. That fleeting happiness was honestly all that kept me on this earth. And I think somewhere deep down I hoped it would destroy me.
Obviously that isn't how I feel now. And there's a long story between then and now that I really don't care to tell so casually. But yes being fat was my choice but as you can see. My choice was not so simple yes?0 -
I never *wanted to be fat*....
but I also didn't want to do what it really requires to get fit and healthy.
I think it is mostly semantics ~ what he's saying is mostly true. Yes, there are occasional legitimate reasons why someone is obese and remains as such, but truly that is a tiny percentage overall.
I myself used all the excuses to stay fat.
Menopause.
Slow metabolism.
Arthritis.
Couldn't afford 'healthy' food.
Couldn't afford the cost of swimming.
I don't have the time.
Really, I don't eat that much!
Etc..
What it finally took was a great doctor that gave me the honest truth. My obesity was slowly killing me. It was the reason why my knee got so bad. There was only one way to improve my health: lose weight.
Some people though do come off as having no empathy or compassion for obese people. I just ignore them.0 -
Just watched a show on TV where this "Doctor" is saying that people are fat because they want to be. That is such BS. I don't know one person, including myself, who wakes up every morning and says...."Hey, I want to stuff my face and be fat, so that people can stare at me, and judge me". Some of these doctors are complete idiots. Being fat is NOT the problem with most people. It's just a symptom of the problem. Many people eat excessively because of emotional issues, depression, loneliness, to find comfort etc. It makes me angry that people are so quick to judge others without knowing their story or walking even a block in their shoes. Hate it!
Can you source this?0 -
It is amusing to see people who are "naturally thin" or really don't like food as much as others..judge people who are neither.
Some people think about and enjoy food more than other people. Many of the naturally thin people I know don't snack much..leave food on their plates and don't like high fat foods.
That's hardly a badge of honor..they're just lucky. I think that doctor is an idiot.
I love food, I love to cook, bake. I read food magazines and think about food a lot. I've never been over weight, in 43 years, not because I'm naturally thin but because I choose not to have big portions of what I love. I choose not to snack. I choose not to bake every day and when I do I adjust the rest of my diet so I can enjoy what I've made.
When I do notice a bit of weight gain I stop and do something about it. I'm not lucky I just made that choice.0 -
Name one single person that doesn't have an issue that they're dealing with. The point is ALL women go through menopause, anyone can blame a slow metabolism as the reason they're fat, skinny people have arthritis too, and the I can't afford to eat healthy is B.S. You're right, all too often people use these type of excuses (to do nothing about their weight.). And no one buys into these excuses, especially doctors.
By over eating, people are making a choice to be fat.I never *wanted to be fat*....
but I also didn't want to do what it really requires to get fit and healthy.
I think it is mostly semantics ~ what he's saying is mostly true. Yes, there are occasional legitimate reasons why someone is obese and remains as such, but truly that is a tiny percentage overall.
I myself used all the excuses to stay fat.
Menopause.
Slow metabolism.
Arthritis.
Couldn't afford 'healthy' food.
Couldn't afford the cost of swimming.
I don't have the time.
Really, I don't eat that much!
Etc..
What it finally took was a great doctor that gave me the honest truth. My obesity was slowly killing me. It was the reason why my knee got so bad. There was only one way to improve my health: lose weight.
Some people though do come off as having no empathy or compassion for obese people. I just ignore them.0 -
what bothers me the most is people that have excuses....I dont have time to exercise, my back hurts. my feet hurt, I have this and that wrong with me...all bs
Eh, wrong. Not all medical issues are BS. Some individuals actually do have exercise limitations and/or are not allowed to exercise all together.
Just curious what percentage you would assign to the population you describe? The poster you responded to did say 'most' not 'all'.
He said "What bothers me the MOST."
You got me... I should learn to read more carefully.
But I'd still be interested in knowing what percentage you would assign to the 'legitimate medical condition' population. I'd put it somewhere < 1%.
Most conditions can be worked around... For example, I'm hypothyroid, but I'm medicated, I work around it. I could easily throw up my hands and say 'I'm hypothyroid and doomed to be fat', but I don't. This site is full of truly inspirational people who have worked with/through all sorts of legitimate medical conditions.
So you're right - not *all* excuses are BS... but most of them are.0 -
Often people see explanations as excuses. Just because someone explains why they gained weight doesn't mean that they are trying to make excuses for themselves. (Yes, many do but just as many do not).0
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Getting fat is not wanting to or needing to......it is a sickness........the simple fact is we eat too much for the the burn rate........we want to eat, not get fat.....we are conditioned to eat when we see foods.......television commercials or advertising........food is everywhere and very attractive packaging......beer ads with skinny young people....that is BS.......we do make excuses because we are afraid of failing........my wife has now joined me on our weight loss journey......she lost 15 pounds without excercise.....other than walks....we will get there.0
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what bothers me the most is people that have excuses....I dont have time to exercise, my back hurts. my feet hurt, I have this and that wrong with me...all bs
Eh, wrong. Not all medical issues are BS. Some individuals actually do have exercise limitations and/or are not allowed to exercise all together.
Just curious what percentage you would assign to the population you describe? The poster you responded to did say 'most' not 'all'.
He said "What bothers me the MOST."
You got me... I should learn to read more carefully.
But I'd still be interested in knowing what percentage you would assign to the 'legitimate medical condition' population. I'd put it somewhere < 1%.
Most conditions can be worked around... For example, I'm hypothyroid, but I'm medicated, I work around it. I could easily throw up my hands and say 'I'm hypothyroid and doomed to be fat', but I don't. This site is full of truly inspirational people who have worked with/through all sorts of legitimate medical conditions.
So you're right - not *all* excuses are BS... but most of them are.
I'm not talking about endocrine disorders… as I have plenty of those myself and can be easily treated. I'm mainly talking about heart problems, where a person has limitations to exercise or isn't able to workout at all.0 -
This is true - to an extent. This discussion is based on the idea that these choices are at the same level of difficulty for everyone. However, and there is plenty of scientific research to back this up, it's likely, statistically speaking, that people who are chronically overweight also are dealing with certain additional struggles: (1) metabolic dysfunction which makes them more likely than others to store fat; (2) pleasure circuits in their brain which are wired to get as much pleasure from eating unhealthy food as other people do from addictive drugs; (3) economic hardship - remember that bad food is cheaper than good food in the US; (4) a history of depression or significant psychological trauma. None of these issues, with the possible exception of #3, are that person's fault, they are NOT a choice. And even #3 is usually a combination of personal choices and structural circumstances.
I am lucky enough to have friends who never judge me for what I look like but also welcome and support the idea of me getting healthier - they know I don't "choose" to be unhealthy, even though sometimes I make bad food or exercise choices. My thinner friends also make bad health choices, like smoking or drinking too much, but they don't wear those bad choices on their body in the same way that I do.
(And don't be all like "but it was hard for me too!" because of course it was. There are different degrees of hardship. Just because it was hard for you to lose weight doesn't mean it's not EVEN WORSE for someone else with a lot of these other factors going against them. We live in an obesogenic society. The only people who find it easy to lose weight are people who are unusually metabolically gifted, are slightly obsessive, or can afford a personal trainer.)
Excuses, Excuses, Excuses. And never any progress.0 -
what bothers me the most is people that have excuses....I dont have time to exercise, my back hurts. my feet hurt, I have this and that wrong with me...all bs
I understand where you are coming from. I got fat due to having my leg amputated. I got lazy and chose not to lose the weight for a few years. I am trying the best I can. It has been very tough for me and my family. I wake up some days just feeling like crap. Not all excuses are justified, however I wouldn't call bs on most people. You never know when something is gonna bite you on the *kitten* when you least expect it. Some of us have to deal with the mental issues before we can attack the physical issues.
Meant to say most peoples excuses0 -
why do we have to call BS on others? or judge others? why is there so much justifying going on? excuses, explanations - i don't owe any of it to anyone. we tend to judge ourselves much more harshly than others judge us. and maybe we should each be focusing on ourselves. i don't believe that ANYONE consciously, willingly chooses to be fat (discounting feeders and fetishists). i believe there are numerous contributing factors - mental, physical, societal, cultural - and there is no one answer to why people are fat. well, actually there is one - calories in versus calories out, right?
interesting topic, i suppose, but there's not going to be a right/wrong answer. people will cite different sources, share different experiences, and no one will change their mind.0 -
No such thing as naturally thin. No such thing as naturally fat. If you overeat you get fat. The only valid medical issue for obsesity isPrader-Willis and even then they're not fat because of the disease but the food they're eating.
Excuses about exercise are irrelevant. Losing weight doesn't need exercise. You can lose weight without exercising at all.
If you are overweight or obese you are eating too much. It is that simple. No study has been shown to disprove that. (Maintaining is harder and studies have shown that but it's still possible)0 -
It's food addiction, plain and simple. People can't stop putting calories in their mouths. Somehow the fact that food represents sustenance makes food addiction justifiable, worthy of self-pity, and a catalyst for "fat acceptance."
Repeat after me: My name is______________, and I am a food addict.0 -
You say where there's a will, there's a way. What would you have me do differently than I'm already doing? As I stated earlier, I eat very healthy (always have), don't overeat, and exercise. I repeat, I do not overeat. I even had tests done to determine if something was preventing me from losing weight but everything was perfect. Not just normal, but perfect. So there can't be excuses when you actually try. I've been trying for years. There is a will, but not a way.0
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You say where there's a will, there's a way. What would you have me do differently than I'm already doing? As I stated earlier, I eat very healthy (always have), don't overeat, and exercise. I repeat, I do not overeat. I even had tests done to determine if something was preventing me from losing weight but everything was perfect. Not just normal, but perfect. So there can't be excuses when you actually try. I've been trying for years. There is a will, but not a way.
For every person claiming to not be overeating and still not losing weight there is someone overeating. The studies have been done. Weigh and measure your food and record everything. If you're eyeballing, or estimating then you're overestimating.0 -
I have a scale. I measure out servings. I have a food diary and count calories, and fat, and all that jazz. So it's all been done.
Basically, as much as other people like to judge - especially when they make assumptions - no one will judge harder than oneself. So everyone should just stop judging others and worry about themselves. The world will still go round. If they are happy, let them be happy. If they aren't, either try to help (instead of criticizing) or let them be.0 -
No such thing as naturally thin. No such thing as naturally fat. If you overeat you get fat. The only valid medical issue for obsesity isPrader-Willis and even then they're not fat because of the disease but the food they're eating.
Excuses about exercise are irrelevant. Losing weight doesn't need exercise. You can lose weight without exercising at all.
If you are overweight or obese you are eating too much. It is that simple. No study has been shown to disprove that. (Maintaining is harder and studies have shown that but it's still possible)
You think that's the only "valid" medical issue for obesity? Think again. :laugh:0
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