Diet Soda
Replies
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Using rats as an example of a product causing cancer in humans is a bit laughable. Rats and mice are used in cancer studies because it's incredibly easy to give them cancer. Then the scientists can use the cancer-ridden rats to experiment on with different potential cancer-curing drugs over and over again. For example, they've cured brain cancer in mice hundreds of times, it just never carries over in human trials because the human brain is so much more complex. Pet rats die of cancerous tumors pretty much all the time; they don't die of old age.
Saying that aspertame causes cancer is rats so it's going to in humans doesn't have much scientific merit.0 -
skullshank wrote: »emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »Don't mess with my diet coke!! You can't prove it's unhealthy!! I'm not addicted, I can stop anytime I want!! You are ignorant if you disagree!! (sarcasm)
so your "research" gets trounced, your "agree to disagree" cop out fails...
this is what you resort to?
impressive.
Thank you!! Hilarious!!0 -
Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.0
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Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
Thank you!!
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You are going to have to do better than that. You came in here proposing that the stuff is unhealthy, and were asked to provide evidence backing your claim. You were unable to do so, thus you appear to revert to mockery to try to prove your point.
So far in this thread you have commited the following logical fallacies:
Ad Hominem
Appeals to Authority
Appeals to Popularity
Bandwagoning
I am sure there are others but these are the ones jumping to mind immediately
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I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.0 -
Have been for 25 years now. Still no toxicity in my blood.Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
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emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
Thank you!!
What's the poison?
Is this like to toxic chicken thread?
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Anecdotes aren't evidence though. Unless you tracked everything they consumed from when they started to when they quit, then it's just speculation. Could they have PKU? Could they have EPI? Correlation doesn't always equal causation.I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.
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Anecdotes aren't evidence though. Unless you tracked everything they consumed from when they started to when they quit, then it's just speculation. Could they have PKU? Could they have EPI? Correlation doesn't always equal causation.I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.
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PKU is pretty serious - its a genetic disorder and would affect someone from birth.
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Enjoying my cherry coke zero at my desk. So geeeewd.0
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The aspartame alone should be reason enough not to drink it. Drink water, juice, and milk. Organic milk that is, or any alternative of it (almond, hemp, coconut, flax). I no longer drink soda anymore, I quit last year. Water everyday for me now, unless I'm having granola with milk or oatmeal with milk or protein shakes.0
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festerguts wrote: »The aspartame alone should be reason enough not to drink it. Drink water, juice, and milk. Organic milk that is, or any alternative of it (almond, hemp, coconut, flax). I no longer drink soda anymore, I quit last year. Water everyday for me now, unless I'm having granola with milk or oatmeal with milk or protein shakes.
Maybe you should read the thread....
Nothing wrong with Aspartame...because...science.0 -
festerguts wrote: »The aspartame alone should be reason enough not to drink it. Drink water, juice, and milk. Organic milk that is, or any alternative of it (almond, hemp, coconut, flax). I no longer drink soda anymore, I quit last year. Water everyday for me now, unless I'm having granola with milk or oatmeal with milk or protein shakes.
Almond milk etc. don't actually contain any milk nor do they have anything to do with milk apart from the name, you know?0 -
Using rats as an example of a product causing cancer in humans is a bit laughable. Rats and mice are used in cancer studies because it's incredibly easy to give them cancer. Then the scientists can use the cancer-ridden rats to experiment on with different potential cancer-curing drugs over and over again. For example, they've cured brain cancer in mice hundreds of times, it just never carries over in human trials because the human brain is so much more complex. Pet rats die of cancerous tumors pretty much all the time; they don't die of old age.
Saying that aspertame causes cancer is rats so it's going to in humans doesn't have much scientific merit.
Or it could be that mice and rats reproduce quickly and have a short life span so several generations can be observed in a short amount of time. Or it could be that they're inexpensive and can be bought in large quantities. Perhaps the fact that they're generally mild-tempered and docile so they're easy to handle? Or they're inbred so that they're almost genetically identical to help with the results of trials. OR their biological behavior characteristics closely resemble those of humans and many human symptoms can be replicated in mice and rats.
If we don't use them then please tell me what we are supposed to use for testing of new drugs. Humans? I doubt that would go over well.
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I know. Just responding that unless her relatives were tested for it, they may unknowingly have it and that could be the culprit to her relatives problems. We don't know, but symptoms like that are attributed to PKU.
Anecdotes aren't evidence though. Unless you tracked everything they consumed from when they started to when they quit, then it's just speculation. Could they have PKU? Could they have EPI? Correlation doesn't always equal causation.I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.
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PKU is pretty serious - its a genetic disorder and would affect someone from birth.
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I'll counter by saying you don't need dairy in the diet. Our bodies just do fine without it as long as calcium need is met. So why do you need dairy? I'm not against it since I eat yogurt, cheese and ice cream, but how to you justify it as a reason to actually drink it if it's not needed by the body?festerguts wrote: »The aspartame alone should be reason enough not to drink it. Drink water, juice, and milk. Organic milk that is, or any alternative of it (almond, hemp, coconut, flax). I no longer drink soda anymore, I quit last year. Water everyday for me now, unless I'm having granola with milk or oatmeal with milk or protein shakes.
Aspartame is one of the most studied additives ever. In moderate dosage, it's safe and peer reviewed clinical study after study supports it. Lots of "natural" proponents are against it's use and cherry pick excerpts of conversion (formaldehyde) for example without truly be honest. By that I mean that they don't mention that eating citrus fruits also results in formaldehyde formation, but they won't tell you that.
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Anecdotes aren't evidence though. Unless you tracked everything they consumed from when they started to when they quit, then it's just speculation. Could they have PKU? Could they have EPI? Correlation doesn't always equal causation.I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.
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That is true we did not document every single thing that they ate or drank over the couple of years. I can tell they do not have PKU or EPI. We assumed that it was the diet soda because the fact that that is all the drank all day long every day. It was the thing that was constant in their diet that never change. The doctor suggested that they remove it and see what would happen. It was kind of like when you have a child and you are trying to see what they are allergic to. Once we removed the diet soda slowly the symptoms disappeared. So that is what assumed what it was.0 -
HaggisWhisperer wrote: »An interesting paper came out in Nature quite recently that showed that some artificial sweetners led to changes in the gut bacteria which in turn led to the development of glucose intolerance/metabolic effects - showing a potential mechanism for why the use of diet drinks/artificial sweetners don't appear to aid weight loss. This was just a mouse study (and there are a couple of comments at the end of the article poking holes in the study) but unfortunately I can't get the full text as it is too expensive (I'd love to see the detail) but I think it is something worth following as more research is carried out. The abstract of the full paper is
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v514/n7521/full/nature13793.html
There is also a discussion of the paper on Science Daily
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/09/140917131634.htm
This is a really interesting study and gut microbiome work like this is on the cutting edge of research right now. It's truly amazing the things that we are finding may be affected when gut flora is altered one way or another. It's been implicated in everything from obesity and diabetes to cognitive deficiencies. There's obviously a lot of research ahead to get the whole story, but I think it's absolutely worth continuing to follow. In fact, any research involving the gut microbiome is worth reading if you are interesting in obesity research.0 -
I have flowers in my tummy. Is that where the butterflies land when they quit fluttering?0
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...but...but if the dieter hasn't got the macros under control, this is all quibbling. I have eighty pounds gone that say so. I eat a lot less than I used to. I pick complex carbohydrates over simple more often, and lean meats over fatty ones more often, but it is all about eating less.
Might emphasis on "good" and "bad" foods, fear of additives and on and on turn in to big noise, preventing a newbie from noting the obvious?0 -
Just putting in that artificial sweeteners are consumed all over the world. If that is the possibility according to the study, then logically any country that's consuming it should have the same issues with obesity and metabolic disorders. We'll just have to see what more research says. At this point I'm not convinced since studies on artificial sweeteners have been out for decades now.HaggisWhisperer wrote: »An interesting paper came out in Nature quite recently that showed that some artificial sweetners led to changes in the gut bacteria which in turn led to the development of glucose intolerance/metabolic effects - showing a potential mechanism for why the use of diet drinks/artificial sweetners don't appear to aid weight loss. This was just a mouse study (and there are a couple of comments at the end of the article poking holes in the study) but unfortunately I can't get the full text as it is too expensive (I'd love to see the detail) but I think it is something worth following as more research is carried out. The abstract of the full paper is
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v514/n7521/full/nature13793.html
There is also a discussion of the paper on Science Daily
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/09/140917131634.htm
This is a really interesting study and gut microbiome work like this is on the cutting edge of research right now. It's truly amazing the things that we are finding may be affected when gut flora is altered one way or another. It's been implicated in everything from obesity and diabetes to cognitive deficiencies. There's obviously a lot of research ahead to get the whole story, but I think it's absolutely worth continuing to follow. In fact, any research involving the gut microbiome is worth reading if you are interesting in obesity research.
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emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
Thank you!!
What's the poison?
Is this like to toxic chicken thread?
You're thinking of McDonald's chicken nuggets 0 -
emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
Thank you!!
What's the poison?
Is this like to toxic chicken thread?
You're thinking of McDonald's chicken nuggets
No - apparently KFC is toxic also because it has baking soda in it.
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You should address them properly. It's McNuggets. And I'll take 6 with some hot mustard sauce.emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »emmanuel4everjackson wrote: »Torontonius wrote: »Feel free to poison yourselves with your frankendrinks. I'll stick to my water.
Thank you!!
What's the poison?
Is this like to toxic chicken thread?
You're thinking of McDonald's chicken nuggets
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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I didn't say it causes cancer for sure it's a possibility. The reason I know that if you have an autoimmune system you shouldn't have aspartame is because I have two family members who have lupus. The become heavy and drank soda. They wanted to lose weight so they switched to diet and artificial sugars. After a couple years of doing this it they started having headaches, nausea, and their lupus progressed. After many doctor appointments because of abnormalities. They stopped drinking diet sodas. Slowly things become better. I am not say yay or nay on diet soda its a personal choice just like everything, but I am just sharing my experience.
If you feel fine drinking Diet soda and it works for you that is great.
I'm sure it had nothing to do with anything else in their dietary regimen. Anecdotal evidence is as good as no evidence at all.0 -
The point being that everything is bad for you in excess and most things we ingest have some additional additive unless you own your own farm, grow your own fruits, vegetables and have your own animals. Even then your probably still ingesting the toxins that your animals ingested and fruits and vegetables absorbed from the soil. You'll most likely die in a car accident than from cancer caused by aspartame. Why worry so much about it?0
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claygirl1518 wrote: »I may catch a lot of upset for posting contrary to most people's responses, but from my experience, it's not a great idea. I used to drink between 4-8 coke zeros a day (ridiculous I know). I cut them out as well as "splenda" and "equal". When I was drinking sodas I had headaches pretty much everyday, but attributed it to other things. So far, I'm feeling SO much better. No headaches, and my weight has dropped almost 4 lbs in the last 5 days. I actually decided to drop the sodas for my health and because I was stalled in weight loss for 2 months (working out 45 mins 3 days a week and eating 1350 cals a day, on plan the whole time) and now all the sudden with this change it's coming off again. I still have espresso in the morning, to make sure I don't go through caffeine withdrawal, and I drink Perrier as well, for a bubbles fix.
I wonder if your weight loss is due more to a reduction in your sodium intake rather than the splenda or whatever artificial sweetener. Those bevvies have a TON of sodium!
Glad your headaches went away, though.
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Diet soda can increase your risk of developing type 2 diabetes and metabolic syndrome.0
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FatFreeFrolicking wrote: »Diet soda can increase your risk of developing type 2 diabetes and metabolic syndrome.
About as much as breathing oxygen can, or blinking your eyes more often than usual.
If you are going to make extraordinary claims you need to back those up with actual evidence.
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This discussion has been closed.
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