the myth, starvation mode, and dont eat before bed.

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  • krissybug72
    krissybug72 Posts: 35 Member
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    Not to offend...but you know what momma always says "Stupid is as stupid does"....

    reference Forest Gump.....I can back this source up LOL
  • heather0416
    heather0416 Posts: 118 Member
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    well to each their own.. ive lost over 40lbs so im OBVIOUSLY doing something right!!
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
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    well to each their own.. ive lost over 40lbs so im OBVIOUSLY doing something right!!

    That's what matters, getting results. Congratulations.
  • heather0416
    heather0416 Posts: 118 Member
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    Not to offend...but you know what momma always says "Stupid is as stupid does"....

    reference Forest Gump.....I can back this source up LOL

    I love that movie.. good quote by the way:wink:
  • minchk1n
    minchk1n Posts: 11
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    I'd like to comment on the issue of eating at night time. I have always eaten late at night (eating less in the day time so I have calories available) I eat right up until I go to bed and always have something carb filling to see me through the night. I also suffer from night eating syndrome where I get up semi-conscious and eat without realising (just try to make sure I have healthy foods to hand) and I have lost over ONE HUNDRED POUNDS. So the whole thing of not eating after a certain time is a waste of time in my experience.

    The myth that long term dieting will slow down your metabolism is also rubbish in my experience too. I weigh 170lbs now and can lose 3lbs a week eating 1800 calories per day. I think as long as you maintain an active life (I have an active job and like to exercise) and are aware of what is going in your body you will be okay.
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
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    I'd like to comment on the issue of eating at night time. I have always eaten late at night (eating less in the day time so I have calories available) I eat right up until I go to bed and always have something carb filling to see me through the night. I also suffer from night eating syndrome where I get up semi-conscious and eat without realising (just try to make sure I have healthy foods to hand) and I have lost over ONE HUNDRED POUNDS. So the whole thing of not eating after a certain time is a waste of time in my experience.

    The myth that long term dieting will slow down your metabolism is also rubbish in my experience too. I weigh 170lbs now and can lose 3lbs a week eating 1800 calories per day. I think as long as you maintain an active life (I have an active job and like to exercise) and are aware of what is going in your body you will be okay.

    all i have to say is a lot of praise for you, and you did a great job.
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
    Options
    I'd like to comment on the issue of eating at night time. I have always eaten late at night (eating less in the day time so I have calories available) I eat right up until I go to bed and always have something carb filling to see me through the night. I also suffer from night eating syndrome where I get up semi-conscious and eat without realising (just try to make sure I have healthy foods to hand) and I have lost over ONE HUNDRED POUNDS. So the whole thing of not eating after a certain time is a waste of time in my experience.

    The myth that long term dieting will slow down your metabolism is also rubbish in my experience too. I weigh 170lbs now and can lose 3lbs a week eating 1800 calories per day. I think as long as you maintain an active life (I have an active job and like to exercise) and are aware of what is going in your body you will be okay.

    all i have to say is a lot of praise for you, and you did a great job.
  • minchk1n
    minchk1n Posts: 11
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    Thanks. I just hope that others can take from my experience. Seriously, I broke every myth going on my journey and I still managed it. I weighed every day (big no no!), skipped breakfast, eat at night etc etc... I think the best advice to give is to find out what works individually and go with it - one set of rules can never work for everyone (this rigid attitude is why certain plans dont work long term).
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
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    Thanks. I just hope that others can take from my experience. Seriously, I broke every myth going on my journey and I still managed it. I weighed every day (big no no!), skipped breakfast, eat at night etc etc... I think the best advice to give is to find out what works individually and go with it - one set of rules can never work for everyone (this rigid attitude is why certain plans dont work long term).

    Haha the scale, personally I wouldn't recommend it. I feel the best thing for people is do what works for them, you can't argue with results. If you're getting results in a healthy safe manner keep doing what you're doing despite what anyone says.
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
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    AGREED!! I started P90x.. and read that you should eat 3 hours before bed for the reason you stated.. and ive since lost about 4 lbs in the last two weeks.. i use to eat before bed all the time.. not anymore.. and i think its helping with my weight loss journey!

    This is actually one of the worst diet myths.


    3 hours + 7-8 hours of sleep equals a 10-11 hour fast. You body and your brain need calories all night long and bodyfat can not be used to feed your brain. So guess where the glucose comes from?
    Sleeping without adequate energy supply causes the brain to stress and release cortisol which will catabolize your muscles and convert them to glucose to feed your system.

    It's not so much when you eat, but how much over 24 hours or several days. So if you'd prefer to eat more at night and before bed then just do it. I just highly recommend NOT going to bed hungry.

    I eat about 60-70 % of my daily calories at night and up to bed time, and this is how I got down to 8% bodyfat.

    Studies on eating late versus early

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3508745

    "A higher lipid oxidation and a lower CHO oxidation were again demonstrated with the meal at 18 hr."

    These participants were fed once a day, either at 10am or 6pm, and the ones fed at 6pm high higher levels of fat burning for energy.


    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10967612


    "The high-energy breakfast induced a strong inhibition of fat oxidation throughout the day."

    So this one is stating that if we have a high energy/carb breakfast we strongly reduce our body's ability to burn fat all day long.


    It's not so much that you lose more weight by eatiing carbs later, but it's where the weight comes from. Eating later casues more fat to be burned and saves muscle mass.

    That's an interesting post...and I do eat at night (meaning within the 3hrs before bed), often right before bed if I'm hungry or if it was a heavy workout day. I just keep it to protien or fiber based snacks. I don't like a LOT of carbs to begin with, and the last thing I want is a bunch of carbs being digested when I have no ability to utilize them lol.
  • Shash27
    Shash27 Posts: 172
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    <---- this is what eating 6 times a day might do to you....

    It might be possible to get better results doing a form of IF.

    LOL.

    Ok. So, I follow tried and true principles. I eat and work out in a way that makes sense intuitively. I get predictable results, which I have been happy with. But let me drop everything now and switch up to IF because somebody says "it might be possible to get better results".

    What does "better results" mean? Progress would be faster? Why not just take steroids?

    Clap Clap Clap Clap Clap.

    Thank you.
  • cheryl3660
    cheryl3660 Posts: 182 Member
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    Apparently cavemen weren't Diabetic.

    Thank you!

    My take on all of this is that everyone is different. I never accepted that "a calorie is a calorie no matter where it comes from" or a "carb is a carb, no matter where it comes from" line of thinking. I call BS because, for me, it is different. I was up and down with my weight loss until I started eating something for breakfast within an hour of waking. It's what works for me. May not work for others. I also have a very low metabolism and I didn't lose weight on 1200 calories a day. At 1300, however, my body says fine.

    So I don't think either line of thinking is wrong per se, it just depends on the person. As you say, you have to go from personal experience and not because someone else says so. There are so many corporations and people pushing a personal agenda, that it is hard to know what to believe. It's all about research based on your personal circumstances and finding what works for you.

    I agree with finding what works for you. That's the best advice anyone can give. Is it possible your breakfast consisted mostly of protein?

    For the most part, all of my meals consist mostly of protein because of my need to keep my carbs lower; so yes, mostly protein for breakfast, but not always. I find that as I am losing weight I can tolerate more carbs, so sometimes I'll have oatmeal or a granola type bar. I avoid most granola bars because they are just sugar masked as health food, but there are a few I can eat without my blood sugar going through the roof.

    And it doesn't have to be much, just something to let my body know that it's not starving and it's time to wake up and start metabolising something. I drink a protein shake every morning when I get to work as my actual "breakfast." My body has become quite good at keeping all it's fat stores, so any way necessary to coax it into releasing fat is good for me. Like I said, I had trouble losing at 1200 calories, but lose at 1300. I don't know if that counts as "starvation mode" or just my body being overly efficient and stocking up for winter. I just know that's my personal experience. There are so many "health experts" out there who have personal agenda's for why they promote a particular health theory, that I try to never take anything for fact just because someone says it is. I research it for myself until I find a credible argument and then try it out for myself. I will tend to give more credence to others who have proven they will do their own research as well.
  • Russellb97
    Russellb97 Posts: 1,057 Member
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    AGREED!! I started P90x.. and read that you should eat 3 hours before bed for the reason you stated.. and ive since lost about 4 lbs in the last two weeks.. i use to eat before bed all the time.. not anymore.. and i think its helping with my weight loss journey!

    This is actually one of the worst diet myths.


    3 hours + 7-8 hours of sleep equals a 10-11 hour fast. You body and your brain need calories all night long and bodyfat can not be used to feed your brain. So guess where the glucose comes from?
    Sleeping without adequate energy supply causes the brain to stress and release cortisol which will catabolize your muscles and convert them to glucose to feed your system.

    It's not so much when you eat, but how much over 24 hours or several days. So if you'd prefer to eat more at night and before bed then just do it. I just highly recommend NOT going to bed hungry.

    I eat about 60-70 % of my daily calories at night and up to bed time, and this is how I got down to 8% bodyfat.

    Studies on eating late versus early

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3508745

    "A higher lipid oxidation and a lower CHO oxidation were again demonstrated with the meal at 18 hr."

    These participants were fed once a day, either at 10am or 6pm, and the ones fed at 6pm high higher levels of fat burning for energy.


    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10967612


    "The high-energy breakfast induced a strong inhibition of fat oxidation throughout the day."

    So this one is stating that if we have a high energy/carb breakfast we strongly reduce our body's ability to burn fat all day long.


    It's not so much that you lose more weight by eatiing carbs later, but it's where the weight comes from. Eating later casues more fat to be burned and saves muscle mass.

    That's an interesting post...and I do eat at night (meaning within the 3hrs before bed), often right before bed if I'm hungry or if it was a heavy workout day. I just keep it to protien or fiber based snacks. I don't like a LOT of carbs to begin with, and the last thing I want is a bunch of carbs being digested when I have no ability to utilize them lol.

    Carbs can and will be utilized overnight for brain function and glycogen storage. Many ways work, it's just false to say eating late will make you fat.
  • kaypee65
    kaypee65 Posts: 120 Member
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    Great job on your weight loss!
    Seriously, I broke every myth going on my journey and I still managed it. I

    I have a different interpretation of your experience. It's not that starvation and altered metabolism from yo-yo dieting are myths that can be broken. They are simply possible outcomes that you didn't experience. That in no way invalidates those concepts for other people.

    Of course when you added the caveat about finding what works for you, that applies to every alleged myth...
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
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    It's not that starvation and altered metabolism from yo-yo dieting are myths that can be broken.

    Starvation mode, exist in certain conditions and don't in others. It's about macro nutrient ratios. If your diet is low in calories and high in carbohydrates. You can suffer from the "starvation mode theory". The way this work is, you need amino acids which are results of protein break down to support the immune system. If you're not consuming enough protein it will break down your muscles get amino acids from that.

    On the other hand if you eat enough protein, this won't happen, exercise, specifically resistance training is also a critical factor in muscle retention. Berry Sears PhD. Recommends eating protein at around .7 x your LBM(pure muscle mass) that is adequate protein . He talks about "feed the muscle starve the fat." Which makes sense, Most people eat 1gram of protein per lbs of body weight. I am not going to say it's excessive , I am just saying we can probably get by with very little amounts.
  • shelly650
    shelly650 Posts: 319
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    This debate will continue for ever, but the way I see it is......eat what your body needs not what you want!! When I first joined MFP I was eating 1200 calories a day and not eating back my exercise calories! After about two months I was noticing I was experiencing dizzy spells and also my weight wouldnt budge! People were advising me to eat more calories......so I did and the dizziness stopped and I began losing weight again!!

    Do what works for you! I'll be honest, I try not to listen to too much scientific stuff, because if you were to go by everything they say, there are very little things you can do in life that wont threaten your life in some way, shape or form!!

    "Eat what your body NEEDS, not what you WANT!"
  • minchk1n
    minchk1n Posts: 11
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    Im not saying starvation mode doesnt exist, it does in my experience, but in the short term, I more meant that it wont cause long term damage to the metabolism. Saying that, I dont think I was extreme in my eating, I have always had a healthy appetite. I never went below 1400 calories.

    Doing what works individually is not about any myth, its about seeing what works for you and go with it. For example, I weigh daily and it keeps me accountable. Any time I dont weigh daily I fall off my plan very fast. I have a personality that needs constant accountability but others may work the other way and get depressed weighing daily. When I say do what works for you I am not refering to any specific dieting rule. I just know, for me, unneeded pressure makes it too difficult.
  • kenzietea
    kenzietea Posts: 614 Member
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    I think I see what you are trying to say, I just don't think you are very good an coming up with credible arguments. And yes, steroids are bad and have very serious side effects. Medicating to lose weight and gain muscle is an idiotic idea. Especially when you experience lack of libido, acne, emotional outbursts (especially in the form of rage), and other not so pleasant side effects. And yes, HGH is a very popular steroid, and is sold on the black market. I will not flood you with articles because of this handy tool called google. I read your profile and you said it yourself you have issues with keeping weight off after you lose it... Maybe it is because your dieting method is simply not working. I can't say for certain I will keep the weight I have lost off once I have reached my goal because I have never attempted weight loss before - but I do know it seems absolutely like a reasonable and seemingly easy task by eating when I am hungry, stopping when I am full, making healthier choices and making exercise a part of my new lifestyle. Yes heart disease and diabetes- and other obesity related diseases- have certainly increased in the United States and other countries in the past ten years- but so have trendy crash diets that cause the yo-yo effect of weight gain and muscle loss. There are many, many factors that have caused that increase and I would be willing to place money on a bet that it has absolutely zero to do with your incredibly outdated and irrelevant article. I also am well aware that of course you will lose weight on a diet that extremely low in calories. Have you seen someone suffering from anorexia? They are extremely thin. But also malnourished. I am done arguing with you considering you actually rhetorically inquired about steroid use, because its hilarious to me you actually find nothing wrong with using them. Please, do your 800 calorie/day diet you sent me, show me results, and then keep the weight off for a minimum of 1 year. If you can do this and look healthy, I will bow to you sir.

    Thank you.

    Here's the problem though...you can't argue with an idiot...because they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. Intelligent people eventually give up...and then the idiot that's posting the misinformation ends up with free reign to do and say as he pleases, post his garbage information wherever he pleases, and in the end, confuse and possibly hurt a lot of innocent people who are just trying to lose weight in a comfortable, safe manner.

    In my opinion, this is where moderators should step in. When it comes to peoples safety...it should be bannable. I've been an admin/moderator on MANY automotive forums, as well as bladesmithing forums. Each forum I was with, implemented a clause into the agreement that if you were banned, and you tried to rejoin under a false name or email...you could be sued for stupid amounts of money for breaking the agreement.

    it worked.

    To Ascriminal:

    Go back and read all your posts. You change your stance so many times it's not even funny...and I don't care if YOU think you have it straight in YOUR head...your method of communicating it to others is flawed at best. One second you're exclaiming that starvation mode isn't real...then that it's real but misunderstood...then that it's a lie...wtf man? Do YOU even know what the hell you're talking about?

    Once again...a plea to the moderators to please do something about this guy?

    Cris

    Lol! So true!
    And yeah, the only reason I felt the need to speak up is because if people actually take his advice they could easily damage their body. But I have realized it is certainly a waste of time. A moderator should take action at this point. This site DOES think starvation mode exists, or it would not recommend eating a certain amount of calories/day- therefore it should not tolerate someone telling individuals the contrary.
  • kenzietea
    kenzietea Posts: 614 Member
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    I think I see what you are trying to say, I just don't think you are very good an coming up with credible arguments. And yes, steroids are bad and have very serious side effects.
    Medicating to lose weight and gain muscle is an idiotic idea. Especially when you experience lack of libido, acne, emotional outbursts (especially in the form of rage), and other not so pleasant side effects.
    I don't agree with a medical approach to weight loss.I have known many people who taken steroids, with out the side effects you mentioned. I knew some professional body builders. One of my friends just retired from body building. He told me "the amount of steroids you need to take to be a pro is ridiculous" I don't EVER recall of pro bodybuilder dying due to steroid usage. Yes sometimes they die when they do stupid stuff like try to dehydrate their body to get a more lean look on stage.

    Like I said, you can drown in a inch of water, does that make water dangerous? Depends on how use it.
    And yes, HGH is a very popular steroid, and is sold on the black market.
    I posted a few links above about GH. There are tricks you can do to trigger a natural release of GH from the body, it's very powerful for burning fat, it's also very critical for cell growth. You know one method to trigger it to release? Hunger will release Growth hormone. Oh about it being a steroid, no it's not. AS(anabolic steroids) mimic the effect of testosterone. Growth Hormone doesn't do this. It's not classified as an anabolic steroid.

    I read your profile and you said it yourself you have issues with keeping weight off after you lose it... Maybe it is because your dieting method is simply not working. I can't say for certain I will keep the weight I have lost off once I have reached my goal because I have never attempted weight loss before - but I do know it seems absolutely like a reasonable and seemingly easy task by eating when I am hungry, stopping when I am full, making healthier choices and making exercise a part of my new lifestyle.
    Yeah you're right eating 6 times a day wasn't working for me. Spent way too much time in the kitchen. On a more serious note. This is actually the first time I am combining everything I know in to one dietary approach. The results are fantastic, it's very easy.

    For a beginner, I wouldn't recommend other wise. If a beginner told me they wanted to lose weight, I'd just tell them. "make sure you're getting enough protein it's critical for cell growth.Base your diet around that, make healthy food choices and exercise." Not complicated.
    Yes heart disease and diabetes- and other obesity related diseases- have certainly increased in the United States and other countries in the past ten years- but so have trendy crash diets that cause the yo-yo effect of weight gain and muscle loss. There are many, many factors that have caused that increase and I would be willing to place money on a bet that it has absolutely zero to do with your incredibly outdated and irrelevant article.
    You keep on talking about this "outdated" article. If i posted a study done 200 years ago where it states humans breathe air you would also say it's out dated. Our biology has worked pretty much the same in the last 10yrs. Fasting has been linked to many health benefits. Maybe if people incorporated fasting in to their daily lives we wouldn't have this issue.
    I am done arguing with you considering you actually rhetorically inquired about steroid use, because its hilarious to me you actually find nothing wrong with using them.

    You know what I think is funny, you think they are dangerous because you have absolutely no experience with them what so ever. You just blindly follow what people say. Isn't that what this entire topic is about? Guess what, asprin is dangerous too. This is a perfect example of you jumping to conclusions with out any evidence. Your only education on the subject is from the media.

    Just because I don't shove 'credentials' in everyone's face when talking about why 'my way is right', does not mean I have no experience. Sorry but I am done arguing, you just are wrong and its that simple. Like I said, talk to me when you are fit and healthy. Also, you can get a NASM certification online... anyone can do it. You don't even have to be in shape.
  • registers
    registers Posts: 782 Member
    Options
    I think I see what you are trying to say, I just don't think you are very good an coming up with credible arguments. And yes, steroids are bad and have very serious side effects.
    Medicating to lose weight and gain muscle is an idiotic idea. Especially when you experience lack of libido, acne, emotional outbursts (especially in the form of rage), and other not so pleasant side effects.
    I don't agree with a medical approach to weight loss.I have known many people who taken steroids, with out the side effects you mentioned. I knew some professional body builders. One of my friends just retired from body building. He told me "the amount of steroids you need to take to be a pro is ridiculous" I don't EVER recall of pro bodybuilder dying due to steroid usage. Yes sometimes they die when they do stupid stuff like try to dehydrate their body to get a more lean look on stage.

    Like I said, you can drown in a inch of water, does that make water dangerous? Depends on how use it.
    And yes, HGH is a very popular steroid, and is sold on the black market.
    I posted a few links above about GH. There are tricks you can do to trigger a natural release of GH from the body, it's very powerful for burning fat, it's also very critical for cell growth. You know one method to trigger it to release? Hunger will release Growth hormone. Oh about it being a steroid, no it's not. AS(anabolic steroids) mimic the effect of testosterone. Growth Hormone doesn't do this. It's not classified as an anabolic steroid.

    I read your profile and you said it yourself you have issues with keeping weight off after you lose it... Maybe it is because your dieting method is simply not working. I can't say for certain I will keep the weight I have lost off once I have reached my goal because I have never attempted weight loss before - but I do know it seems absolutely like a reasonable and seemingly easy task by eating when I am hungry, stopping when I am full, making healthier choices and making exercise a part of my new lifestyle.
    Yeah you're right eating 6 times a day wasn't working for me. Spent way too much time in the kitchen. On a more serious note. This is actually the first time I am combining everything I know in to one dietary approach. The results are fantastic, it's very easy.

    For a beginner, I wouldn't recommend other wise. If a beginner told me they wanted to lose weight, I'd just tell them. "make sure you're getting enough protein it's critical for cell growth.Base your diet around that, make healthy food choices and exercise." Not complicated.
    Yes heart disease and diabetes- and other obesity related diseases- have certainly increased in the United States and other countries in the past ten years- but so have trendy crash diets that cause the yo-yo effect of weight gain and muscle loss. There are many, many factors that have caused that increase and I would be willing to place money on a bet that it has absolutely zero to do with your incredibly outdated and irrelevant article.
    You keep on talking about this "outdated" article. If i posted a study done 200 years ago where it states humans breathe air you would also say it's out dated. Our biology has worked pretty much the same in the last 10yrs. Fasting has been linked to many health benefits. Maybe if people incorporated fasting in to their daily lives we wouldn't have this issue.
    I am done arguing with you considering you actually rhetorically inquired about steroid use, because its hilarious to me you actually find nothing wrong with using them.

    You know what I think is funny, you think they are dangerous because you have absolutely no experience with them what so ever. You just blindly follow what people say. Isn't that what this entire topic is about? Guess what, asprin is dangerous too. This is a perfect example of you jumping to conclusions with out any evidence. Your only education on the subject is from the media.

    Just because I don't shove 'credentials' in everyone's face when talking about why 'my way is right', does not mean I have no experience. Sorry but I am done arguing, you just are wrong and its that simple. Like I said, talk to me when you are fit and healthy. Also, you can get a NASM certification online... anyone can do it. You don't even have to be in shape.

    blah blah blah blah blah, state something worth reading and something with meaning.

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