Why Calories In and Calories Out... It really ISN'T that simple.....
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CICO is an umbrella. If you are counting calories, you are following CICO. If you don't count calories, you are still following CICO. CICO is overarching and never goes away. How you get there is your own preference.
If you think otherwise you have some "learnin" to do.
How many midichlorians are there in a protein shake?
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CICO is an umbrella. If you are counting calories, you are following CICO. If you don't count calories, you are still following CICO. CICO is overarching and never goes away. How you get there is your own preference.
If you think otherwise you have some "learnin" to do.
How many midichlorians are there in a protein shake?
More than A.S.
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I'm fine with CICO, however I have just changed Garmin watches, now got the vivoactive which is ace, but run's that gave me 900kcal usage previously now give 600..... (both using the same HR band) can I believe either of them, need more when I do exercise or I feel rubbish but how much is annoying me.0
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coreyreichle wrote: »mrs_justice wrote: »Dr. Mark Hyman... maker of the movie Fed Up (you need to see it if you haven't) addresses the real reason that NOT ALL CALORIES ARE THE SAME....
"Fed Up!" was a whole bunch of bunkum, wrapped in delusion.
I'm sorry, but to be a proper description one needs three layers. For example, a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma. Or a chicken, wrapped in a duck, inside a turkey.
As you made a lovely start, I nominate bunkum, wrapped in delusion, inside a fallacy. But you could go with stinking pile of greed.0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, however, you are not entitled to your own facts.
All calories are equal from an energy standpoint is a fact. All foods are not created equal from a nutritional standpoint is also a fact.
The OP posting a link to a pseudoscience clickbait article from a source widely known for his woo filled claims is not helpful to anyone, particular people who are new to this site like yourself. There are so many false, unnecessary claims about weight loss prevalent in today's society. That the veterans on this site want to refute them and make sure that people like you have access to the most reliable scientific information possible in order to make your experience here successful does not make them negative and immature. In fact, quite the opposite.
To add to your comment, there is a real cost to the pseudoscience and deceptive practices. A financial cost, in that people waste money on scams that don't work, an emotional cost in that people experience reinforced failure which makes it harder to start again, and sometimes some real physical costs because of the effects these useless supplements and scam diets have on the body.
It's immature and passive-aggressive to whine about the "meanness" of others rather than directly confront those with whom you disagree with factual counter arguments.
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Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »Of_Monsters_and_Meat wrote: »Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »Jehovah's Witness bread
Were can I pick up a loaf of this?
From the woo aisle at Whole Foods!
Snap.
But that doesn't really narrow it down, does it?
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Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Preventing the spread of misinformation is important, especially for people who are new to weight loss and may be easily discouraged by all the arbitrary "rules" set forth by the various diet cults.
CICO is all that is required to lose weight. Everyone should start there.
How does CICO guarantee adherence?
I agree CICO is king but it is hardly the be all, end all. If it was just "eat less, move more" would end the issues of obesity everywhere.
There are real barriers to eating less. As important as CICO is, it is also important to address personal adherence to achieve long term success. Everyone should start with CICO and methods to achieve adherence.0 -
MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
That people are entitled to their own opinions (which just means what? people can think what they like?) certainly must not mean that assertions of fact (or alleged fact) should not go unchallenged if incorrect. If so, whatever happens to that idea of the marketplace of ideas, where good ideas win out and poor ideas die? For that matter, how do we ever discuss anything? Candidate A makes an assertion that another candidate disagrees with, and he or she merely says "well, of course that's a brilliant thought and I could never disagree with someone else's opinion?" A lawyer gets up to argue before the SC and the justices just say "oh, yes, absolutely right!" and the lawyer for the other side refuses to disagree.
What is the world coming to when being polite apparently means that you can never disagree with anything someone says, because they might feel bad.
Not to mention that I wouldn't want people just to nod and smile when I said something false or mistaken. I'd like to know or hear the opposing idea.
Back when I was in college this was typically assumed (and when people forgot it, they were argued with strongly). That was the adult way, not the idea that people's feelings were so sensitive they couldn't handle the notion that they were wrong.0 -
I believe there are two aspects of the living healthy equation - there is the calories in and calories out and then there is the nutrient dense vs the mindful portion control eating...
lets all be honest, we can all argue that our way is the best but not two people are the same, what works for you might not work for me - me eating healthy means going to a restaurant ordering what ever I want then asking for a to go plate as soon as my order is out so I can make sure I don't eat what is meant to be for 2-3 people in one sitting - for other it is avoiding going out all together because the food is not organic nor grass fed or whatever else - to each their own... does eating nutrient dense foods bare way more benefits than eating the processed food - hell ya, is it the only way to maintain fit and even healthy, HELL NO.
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I'm fine with CICO, however I have just changed Garmin watches, now got the vivoactive which is ace, but run's that gave me 900kcal usage previously now give 600..... (both using the same HR band) can I believe either of them, need more when I do exercise or I feel rubbish but how much is annoying me.
Have you changed the settings on either device? Why not use both at the same time and then post a thread.
A different thread.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
That people are entitled to their own opinions (which just means what? people can think what they like?) certainly must not mean that assertions of fact (or alleged fact) should not go unchallenged if incorrect. If so, whatever happens to that idea of the marketplace of ideas, where good ideas win out and poor ideas die? For that matter, how do we ever discuss anything? Candidate A makes an assertion that another candidate disagrees with, and he or she merely says "well, of course that's a brilliant thought and I could never disagree with someone else's opinion?" A lawyer gets up to argue before the SC and the justices just say "oh, yes, absolutely right!" and the lawyer for the other side refuses to disagree.
What is the world coming to when being polite apparently means that you can never disagree with anything someone says, because they might feel bad.
Not to mention that I wouldn't want people just to nod and smile when I said something false or mistaken. I'd like to know or hear the opposing idea.
Back when I was in college this was typically assumed (and when people forgot it, they were argued with strongly). That was the adult way, not the idea that people's feelings were so sensitive they couldn't handle the notion that they were wrong.
MICROAGGRESSOR!0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Preventing the spread of misinformation is important, especially for people who are new to weight loss and may be easily discouraged by all the arbitrary "rules" set forth by the various diet cults.
CICO is all that is required to lose weight. Everyone should start there.
How does CICO guarantee adherence?
I agree CICO is king but it is hardly the be all, end all. If it was just "eat less, move more" would end the issues of obesity everywhere.
There are real barriers to eating less. As important as CICO is, it is also important to address personal adherence to achieve long term success. Everyone should start with CICO and methods to achieve adherence.
Of course, but I'm sure Alyssa's point is that once you realize CICO is the answer, you will have the freedom to figure out what works for you to achieve it. There's not one size fits all answer as to how to achieve a calorie deficit. (For example, much as many people poo-poo the importance of exercise for weight loss, for me it is very important in how I maintain a calorie deficit.)
I think that the barriers to CICO -- figuring out why you are having trouble maintaining a deficit -- are much easier to address when you give up the idea that there's some mystical combinations of foods that will cause weight gain, no matter what, and some that will let you eat unlimited amounts, and realize it's a matter of figuring out how to keep your own calories in check. (I also think many people are resistant to the idea it's about calories, because they don't want to admit they've been eating too much.)0 -
I'm fine with CICO, however I have just changed Garmin watches, now got the vivoactive which is ace, but run's that gave me 900kcal usage previously now give 600..... (both using the same HR band) can I believe either of them, need more when I do exercise or I feel rubbish but how much is annoying me.
I switched to the Vivoactive and also found my burns much lower. So I'm going to go with trusting the lower burn. I used to not eat all my exercise calories as I suspected they were inflated. Now I do eat them because they're much more reasonable.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Preventing the spread of misinformation is important, especially for people who are new to weight loss and may be easily discouraged by all the arbitrary "rules" set forth by the various diet cults.
CICO is all that is required to lose weight. Everyone should start there.
How does CICO guarantee adherence?
I agree CICO is king but it is hardly the be all, end all. If it was just "eat less, move more" would end the issues of obesity everywhere.
There are real barriers to eating less. As important as CICO is, it is also important to address personal adherence to achieve long term success. Everyone should start with CICO and methods to achieve adherence.
While I see what you're saying, regardless of the methods that you adhere to, if you're losing weight, you're following CICO.
CICO is, and always will be, all that is needed to lose weight. I feel like there is value in knowing that if you choose to follow low carb, high carb, moderate carb, IIFYM, BeachBody, or the cabbage soup diet, if you are losing weight, you are losing weight because of CICO. Perhaps understanding that will steer some away from a silly fad or wasting money on snake oil, or keep someone from feeling like a failure because they enjoyed some greasy pizza, or had a few beers, or ate a doughnut.0 -
Don't try to argue with the "True Believers" on this one...do what works for you and is nutritionally sound...for those those who can't take on a higher level of complexity than CI-CO, it'll work for them until it doesn't.nuttynanners wrote: »Ooooh, I wouldn't say a single word against CICO on MFP.....
As much as I agree that higher quality foods are going to be better for weight loss in the long run, MFP forums are not the place for that kind of thinking. They just don't want see it from that perspective.Tedebearduff wrote: »mrs_justice wrote: »Dr. Mark Hyman... maker of the movie Fed Up (you need to see it if you haven't) addresses the real reason that NOT ALL CALORIES ARE THE SAME....
Why I will choose....
100 calories of almonds vs. a processed 100 calorie granola bar.......
100 calories of berries vs. 100 calories of sugar added yogurt.......
drhyman.com/blog/2014/04/10/calories-dont-matter/
Without reading this, I've been saying this for years because your body has hormonal responses to food and there are no studies on this. Anytime I say anything I always get yelled at by the IIFYM crowd here, I hardly ever post anymore... because you know, I know nothing and IIFYM = life. Hopefully there is some decent info here!Floridaman789 wrote: »Yes your body knows the difference between natural sugar and processed sugar
CICO is scientifically sound. The quotes here show a lack of understanding of basic science.MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Backlash against incorrect information is the only logical reaction. Anything else is endorsing something that is wrong. People have a right to their own opinion but not to their own facts.
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EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Preventing the spread of misinformation is important, especially for people who are new to weight loss and may be easily discouraged by all the arbitrary "rules" set forth by the various diet cults.
CICO is all that is required to lose weight. Everyone should start there.
How does CICO guarantee adherence?
I agree CICO is king but it is hardly the be all, end all. If it was just "eat less, move more" would end the issues of obesity everywhere.
There are real barriers to eating less. As important as CICO is, it is also important to address personal adherence to achieve long term success. Everyone should start with CICO and methods to achieve adherence.
How does any method guarantee adherence? At least with CICO it's as simple as it gets, for me it would seem to be the easiest of methods to try and adhere to.
Psychological issues around food will always be there regardless and need to be addressed alongside everything else. I have found it easier to address my emotional relationship with food by keeping the method simple.0 -
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I'm still waiting for the super humans that can make ingested energy disappear (black hole metabolism, ermagerd I ate over my caloric balance with vegan, keto etc. and lost weight), and the ones that can create energy from nothing (perpetual energy, ermagerd I ate a single processed food and gained 5lbs overnight).0
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Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Alyssa_Is_LosingIt wrote: »MaggieAustin15 wrote: »All this back lash and negative energy is not getting anywhere, why go against what someone says everyone is entitled to their own opinion. We are on here tying to stay healthy and record our food and exercise as well as encourage others and help them meet their goals. It is only my third day using this cite and all have seen is a bunch of adults acting like Junior High Kids in regards of going against others own opinions and virtues. Let people speak their mind on their own accords. I'm only 18 and have more dignity and respect then most adults that I know.
Preventing the spread of misinformation is important, especially for people who are new to weight loss and may be easily discouraged by all the arbitrary "rules" set forth by the various diet cults.
CICO is all that is required to lose weight. Everyone should start there.
How does CICO guarantee adherence?
I agree CICO is king but it is hardly the be all, end all. If it was just "eat less, move more" would end the issues of obesity everywhere.
There are real barriers to eating less. As important as CICO is, it is also important to address personal adherence to achieve long term success. Everyone should start with CICO and methods to achieve adherence.
While I see what you're saying, regardless of the methods that you adhere to, if you're losing weight, you're following CICO.
CICO is, and always will be, all that is needed to lose weight. I feel like there is value in knowing that if you choose to follow low carb, high carb, moderate carb, IIFYM, BeachBody, or the cabbage soup diet, if you are losing weight, you are losing weight because of CICO. Perhaps understanding that will steer some away from a silly fad or wasting money on snake oil, or keep someone from feeling like a failure because they enjoyed some greasy pizza, or had a few beers, or ate a doughnut.
Yes, I guarantee you that I know all that. And yet the name of the game is long term loss and adherence to that loss. CICO is an equation - you need more than just the math to assure adherence. It remains the lever of success but not without adding a few elements that make just as much sense.
Let's say it was "all that is needed". Accordingly I could stop eating and be successful in my weight loss? No, rate of loss, balancing moderation and deficit matter.
Weight loss success means achieving long term methods to avoid yoyoing, binging, etc. While I obviously adhere to CICO the majors people should focus include macros, satiety and a lifestyle that will be in line with the expectations one has on the results weight loss will achieve. CICO is the band leader, one still needs to address some of the details. People should consider macros and satiety. Often enough on the boards we see people that try to crash diet their way because "CICO" - clearly you don't support that?0
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