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What are your unpopular opinions about health / fitness?
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That beer is bad for you.
Completely incorrect - its really good for you. More beer the better.
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Noreenmarie1234 wrote: »deannalfisher wrote: »does that take into account that over the years - clothing sizes have gotten more vain and what used to be a size 10 is now a size 4-6? (in the Navy, we make a joke about the fact that the women's uniforms haven't been re-designed/sized since the 1970's...in those I wear a size 14, in everything else I wear a 6-8)
I have a few of my moms size 4/6 skirts and clothes from the 80s and they fit me all perfectly, even a little snug and I fit into 00/0 in clothing lol
At 120-125 I am generally a size 4. I recall when I first hit that size after being overweight for a while I was excited to try on my first expensive adult interview suit, which I bought in 1993. It is a size 8. It was a little tight. And I'd been all sure (since I didn't weigh myself ever at the time I wore that suit) that I must be thinner than I was then. Nope.
Sizes are weird, though -- I can be easily a 2-4 in pants and a 6 or so in suit jackets.1 -
I don't know about unpopular 'opinions' but as a coach I have taken actions that were unpopular for sure. The way I view it is this:
If I'm your coach and you have a competition coming up, my job is to expect a lot, to move you outside of your comfort zone, to challenge your body, to develop your skills and to keep you psychologically hungry. My job is to know your weaknesses, to develop your strengths, to read your opponent and help you execute a strategy to counter his. My job is to bind your wounds and maybe make a difficult decision to pull you out of competition if I believe you will get badly injured. If you do lose, my job will be to help you understand what went wrong, where and why and how you can overcome a similar challenge in the future. My job is to be a calm voice in your corner that you can rely on when you get scared or discouraged.
My job is to care about you and believe in you. But while we are training, make no mistake, my job is NOT to be your friend. It is not my job to let you rest when your opponent isn't resting, nor is it to blow smoke up your *kitten* or give you un-earned compliments or to say you're doing well when you're not. If anything, I will hit you over the head with reality.11 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Even if we take manufacturers out of the equation, why is it not okay for two hypothetical women who are the exact same shape and height to have different preferences? What makes size 12 not okay, bar health problems? Few are obese at that size.
It's okay to have preferences, but I can tell you that very short women are usually obese at a size 12. I know I was, I know my sister is currently.
Then we would be talking individuals, not averages. If going by the individual, some people of normal weight are at an increased risk because of their body shape (visceral fat) and some overweight people are at a reduced risk for similar reasons. Then there's genetics, family history, current health conditions that may be worse/better with extra weight...etc. My point is that the average itself is not scary. It's a size 12 woman who is slightly overweight, and aiming for that is okay bar health problems or significantly increased risk of health problems. What's scary is the obesity rate.4 -
ttippie2000 wrote: »I don't know about unpopular 'opinions' but as a coach I have taken actions that were unpopular for sure. The way I view it is this:
If I'm your coach and you have a competition coming up, my job is to expect a lot, to move you outside of your comfort zone, to challenge your body, to develop your skills and to keep you psychologically hungry. My job is to know your weaknesses, to develop your strengths, to read your opponent and help you execute a strategy to counter his. My job is to bind your wounds and maybe make a difficult decision to pull you out of competition if I believe you will get badly injured. If you do lose, my job will be to help you understand what went wrong, where and why and how you can overcome a similar challenge in the future. My job is to be a calm voice in your corner that you can rely on when you get scared or discouraged.
My job is to care about you and believe in you. But while we are training, make no mistake, my job is NOT to be your friend. It is not my job to let you rest when your opponent isn't resting, nor is it to blow smoke up your *kitten* or give you un-earned compliments or to say you're doing well when you're not. If anything, I will hit you over the head with reality.
^^^^^All day!!!!
I have a trainer/coach. It's a love/hate thing. I curse him out throughout my entire workout, because of how hard I am pushed. I curse him out the next day because my everything is sore. I love the results and wouldn't have it any other way. He's awesome!!! I've only ever won one argument with him: that chest day does not happen the day after legs, doing bench work with DOMS just sucks, so we switched days.0 -
"You need other weight-loss friends to motivate you and be accountable."
No. I love talking nutrition and enjoy this MFP community but when I've worked out with my husband or friend in the past and they try to "motivate" me in the gym or make comments about what I'm eating....I want to go Game of Thrones on their a** and go straight for the throat. I don't know why this makes me so crazy LOL I lone-wolf it in the gym and on my weight loss journey ¯\_(ツ)_/¯9 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Even if we take manufacturers out of the equation, why is it not okay for two hypothetical women who are the exact same shape and height to have different preferences? What makes size 12 not okay, bar health problems? Few are obese at that size.
It's okay to have preferences, but I can tell you that very short women are usually obese at a size 12. I know I was, I know my sister is currently.
Agree. I'm now a size 12 (previously a 16/18) and my BMI is still a 30.2. I'm 5'6 so I'm not short at all.
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myheartsabattleground wrote: »I believe WLS is cheating.
Yasssss. Very rarely it might be medically necessary but it absolutely disgusts me how easily doctors will approve this as necessary so the person can WLS covered by insurance. My sister-in-law used this as a cop out for eating healthier and exercise because it was a faster fix than learning about her body and nutrition. She still eats crap food but is slowly losing weight, however her two perfect boys are now seriously obese. It just infuriates me.
"Hard decisions, easy life.....Easy decisions, hard life."2 -
Its complete *kitten*. I'm only here because .... I don't know.0
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amusedmonkey wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Even if we take manufacturers out of the equation, why is it not okay for two hypothetical women who are the exact same shape and height to have different preferences? What makes size 12 not okay, bar health problems? Few are obese at that size.
It's okay to have preferences, but I can tell you that very short women are usually obese at a size 12. I know I was, I know my sister is currently.
Then we would be talking individuals, not averages. If going by the individual, some people of normal weight are at an increased risk because of their body shape (visceral fat) and some overweight people are at a reduced risk for similar reasons. Then there's genetics, family history, current health conditions that may be worse/better with extra weight...etc. My point is that the average itself is not scary. It's a size 12 woman who is slightly overweight, and aiming for that is okay bar health problems or significantly increased risk of health problems. What's scary is the obesity rate.
Well, I agree with you that as far as size worn/weight goes, it's individual.
I was just saying that for short women, a size 12 is indeed obese.
I do disagree with the original post, because sizing is a poor proxy for health.1 -
VeronicaA76 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I'm not challenging what you're saying, your comment just makes me think of how ridiculous it is to measure someone by 'size X'. Not that I think you were doing this, but it also bugs me when people say size X is too big for a healthy person. Sorry, but body type, skeletal structure, and height go a long way towards size - not just how much fat a person happens to have.
I still have about 20ish (maybe 25) pounds to lose, but I can guarantee you that a size 12 will look much different on me at 5'7" than it will on someone who is 5'4" (for example). It will probably look much different on me at 5'7" than it would on someone with a more slender build who is also 5'7". I have wide shoulders and hip bones that balance out my proportions no matter what my size better than some women who have narrower body types. Size 'X' is meaningless as a comparative tool.
Size 12 may be the average woman in the US, and it's perfectly acceptable for many, many women. FWIW, even at a near normal BMI at my lowest weight, I was a size 12 in some things *shrug*.
Yeah, all this.
I look awful when a size 12 (US sizes, and even the US sizes of my early adult years), but that doesn't mean other women don't fit in them when at a healthy weight.
Very true. Musculature matters a lot. I am into weight lifting so my shoulders are wider than average and my quads/glutes are well developed. I need a larger size than my waist suggests, not because I am not fatter, just built different. Note that I usually have to get something that looks good belted, is stretchy on the waist (so it forms), or have it tailored. Height also plays a huge factor. A woman who is 5'3" and a size 12 is a vastly different shape than a woman who is 5'10" and a size 12.
you know a size for woman's jeans doesn't just pertain to the waist right??? a size 6 (what I wear normally) is bigger all around...not just the waist.1 -
rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I'm not challenging what you're saying, your comment just makes me think of how ridiculous it is to measure someone by 'size X'. Not that I think you were doing this, but it also bugs me when people say size X is too big for a healthy person. Sorry, but body type, skeletal structure, and height go a long way towards size - not just how much fat a person happens to have.
I still have about 20ish (maybe 25) pounds to lose, but I can guarantee you that a size 12 will look much different on me at 5'7" than it will on someone who is 5'4" (for example). It will probably look much different on me at 5'7" than it would on someone with a more slender build who is also 5'7". I have wide shoulders and hip bones that balance out my proportions no matter what my size better than some women who have narrower body types. Size 'X' is meaningless as a comparative tool.
Size 12 may be the average woman in the US, and it's perfectly acceptable for many, many women. FWIW, even at a near normal BMI at my lowest weight, I was a size 12 in some things *shrug*.
it is silly if the sizes are not equal.
But as a woman is used to say what you have but still wear a size 4-6 @ 145-150 lbs I can say you are incorrect...
and I agree with this poster the fact that a size 12 is average (I think it's 14-16 now) is scary...because it isn't healthy...regardless of how you feel your bones come into play.
When you hit a healthy BMI...that's a good indicator...and guess what it's a number and yes there are those who are outliers but most are not.
I still think it's ludicrous to judge health by a size. I'm not there right now, but I was a scooch over a normal BMI (less than 1 point) and wearing a size 12 in about 1/4 of my clothing with exemplary health markers based on blood work and running a ~16:30 two mile (which I get it is not a speed demon, but just adding it in there to demonstrate that my aerobic fitness was okay as well). I'm not trying to say that you can be of optimal health no matter the size in the long run, but to ascertain that size 12 (or x or whatever) isn't healthy is using a very broad brush to paint over a silly measure.
When I get down to my ultimate goal weight within 'normal' BMI, I will probably still be a size 10 (maybe 8 with the current sizing trend). That won't make me unhealthier than someone who is a size 6. And, I'm not using bone structure as any kind of excuse here. I was never 'big boned', I was more fat and now I am less so, and I still have broad shoulders, wide-ish hips and long limbs. Even now, most clothing that comfortably fits my shoulders is too big around the waist. And, I'm not exactly an outlier - there are plenty of other women with my general dimensions.
I think it's misguided to say that size 12 being average is 'scary'; Now, if you want to say that having over 32% or 34% or whatever is average (just throwing those numbers out there as I don't know what the real number it) body fat is "scary" or "unhealthy", that's probably a better argument.
Edit for clarification
It is scary because it's vanity sizing and chances are it's really a size 16...
My prom dress from 2000 is a size 10...fits me like a glove then and does now too...
My dresses I buy today are size 6 or 4 even...
I think if you are in a healthy BMI range you are healthier than if you were in a higher range...
given all things being equal...you are healthier if you are not considered fat/obese/over weight.4 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Even if we take manufacturers out of the equation, why is it not okay for two hypothetical women who are the exact same shape and height to have different preferences? What makes size 12 not okay, bar health problems? Few are obese at that size.
I think it would depend on how you/we are using "okay". If you simply mean it's okay for them and none of our business, then I'd agree it's okay.
I mean all kinds of okay. Being slightly overweight carries only marginally increased risk that could be considered okay. Not like by crossing the normal/overweight line even by one pound you are suddenly at risk for everything bad that you weren't at risk for before. I don't see people pushing the same doomsday predictions for those who are under 20 BMI but still a healthy weight, although they're statistically at a similar risk, or even slightly higher, than those who are slightly overweight.
The problem with the average being size 12/slightly overweight is not the number itself, but the fact that a high rate of true obesity is pushing the average above normal.
To the bolded: You might be surprised.
Having been both obese (BMI just over 30) and low-ish normal (BMI 19-20), I heard it at both ends of that continuum, but the message arrived very differently.
When I was obese, I read a lot and heard a lot in media about how horrible obesity was, regarding both health and appearance. I know that some people are individually criticized (by family, SO, cat-calling strangers), but I never was. To the contrary: On the rare occasion when I'd refer to myself as "fat" because it was both true and relevant in the moment, I'd get "Oh, no, you're not fat!" or "Why would you say such an unkind thing about yourself?" (WTH!?!)
Once I was down near the lower bound of normal - with a narrow-pelvis, post-mastectomy build that can handle it and still have adequate body fat, trust me - there was nada to the negative in mass/general communications, but friends started freaking out: I heard worries about anorexia (WTH?!?) while eating 2000 calories a day, "Women your age should carry some extra weight" (I'm 61, BTW), " What if you get sick? You won't have any body fat to fall back on!" (I'd guess my BF% is mid-20s).
People who would never have criticized or cautioned fat me were perfectly happy to criticize sort-of-thin me. Sure, some of it is over-reaction to the shock of the change, but that "license to criticize personally" thing isn't all shock, IMO.
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Bry_Lander wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I wonder what the equivalent of this would be for men? The lack of a numeric system is problematic, it requires a number of different stats to make a comparison. Count us lucky
Pants sizes and suit jacket size?0 -
VeronicaA76 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I'm not challenging what you're saying, your comment just makes me think of how ridiculous it is to measure someone by 'size X'. Not that I think you were doing this, but it also bugs me when people say size X is too big for a healthy person. Sorry, but body type, skeletal structure, and height go a long way towards size - not just how much fat a person happens to have.
I still have about 20ish (maybe 25) pounds to lose, but I can guarantee you that a size 12 will look much different on me at 5'7" than it will on someone who is 5'4" (for example). It will probably look much different on me at 5'7" than it would on someone with a more slender build who is also 5'7". I have wide shoulders and hip bones that balance out my proportions no matter what my size better than some women who have narrower body types. Size 'X' is meaningless as a comparative tool.
Size 12 may be the average woman in the US, and it's perfectly acceptable for many, many women. FWIW, even at a near normal BMI at my lowest weight, I was a size 12 in some things *shrug*.
Yeah, all this.
I look awful when a size 12 (US sizes, and even the US sizes of my early adult years), but that doesn't mean other women don't fit in them when at a healthy weight.
Very true. Musculature matters a lot. I am into weight lifting so my shoulders are wider than average and my quads/glutes are well developed. I need a larger size than my waist suggests, not because I am not fatter, just built different. Note that I usually have to get something that looks good belted, is stretchy on the waist (so it forms), or have it tailored. Height also plays a huge factor. A woman who is 5'3" and a size 12 is a vastly different shape than a woman who is 5'10" and a size 12.
you know a size for woman's jeans doesn't just pertain to the waist right??? a size 6 (what I wear normally) is bigger all around...not just the waist.
If that were completely true, I wouldn't have to buy a larger size to fit my height, even though my waist fits a much smaller size. Because: women's sizing sucks! I swear, they think at a size 8 I must be a lot shorter than I am, even "long" length are iffy.1 -
GemstoneofHeart wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »Even if we take manufacturers out of the equation, why is it not okay for two hypothetical women who are the exact same shape and height to have different preferences? What makes size 12 not okay, bar health problems? Few are obese at that size.
It's okay to have preferences, but I can tell you that very short women are usually obese at a size 12. I know I was, I know my sister is currently.
Agree. I'm now a size 12 (previously a 16/18) and my BMI is still a 30.2. I'm 5'6 so I'm not short at all.
When I started out, I wore a 12. I'm 5'4" and weighed 145lbs which is just shy of overweight. I was carrying about 30% BF though so skinny fat at best. It is possible but not common and not really anything to celebrate.
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stevencloser wrote: »Bry_Lander wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I wonder what the equivalent of this would be for men? The lack of a numeric system is problematic, it requires a number of different stats to make a comparison. Count us lucky
Pants sizes and suit jacket size?
I have no idea what size pants other men wear, what the average is, or wear I stand in comparison. Same with suits. It never crosses my mind. I don't think there is a commonly accepted metric for men similar to a woman's numeric size, which seems to be on their minds a lot.1 -
VeronicaA76 wrote: »VeronicaA76 wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I'm not challenging what you're saying, your comment just makes me think of how ridiculous it is to measure someone by 'size X'. Not that I think you were doing this, but it also bugs me when people say size X is too big for a healthy person. Sorry, but body type, skeletal structure, and height go a long way towards size - not just how much fat a person happens to have.
I still have about 20ish (maybe 25) pounds to lose, but I can guarantee you that a size 12 will look much different on me at 5'7" than it will on someone who is 5'4" (for example). It will probably look much different on me at 5'7" than it would on someone with a more slender build who is also 5'7". I have wide shoulders and hip bones that balance out my proportions no matter what my size better than some women who have narrower body types. Size 'X' is meaningless as a comparative tool.
Size 12 may be the average woman in the US, and it's perfectly acceptable for many, many women. FWIW, even at a near normal BMI at my lowest weight, I was a size 12 in some things *shrug*.
Yeah, all this.
I look awful when a size 12 (US sizes, and even the US sizes of my early adult years), but that doesn't mean other women don't fit in them when at a healthy weight.
Very true. Musculature matters a lot. I am into weight lifting so my shoulders are wider than average and my quads/glutes are well developed. I need a larger size than my waist suggests, not because I am not fatter, just built different. Note that I usually have to get something that looks good belted, is stretchy on the waist (so it forms), or have it tailored. Height also plays a huge factor. A woman who is 5'3" and a size 12 is a vastly different shape than a woman who is 5'10" and a size 12.
you know a size for woman's jeans doesn't just pertain to the waist right??? a size 6 (what I wear normally) is bigger all around...not just the waist.
If that were completely true, I wouldn't have to buy a larger size to fit my height, even though my waist fits a much smaller size. Because: women's sizing sucks! I swear, they think at a size 8 I must be a lot shorter than I am, even "long" length are iffy.
I only own one pair of jeans now and instead wear dresses and skirts, (layered with leggings in the cold months). I got fed up with how ridiculous sizing/fit is for jeans!0 -
Bry_Lander wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »Bry_Lander wrote: »rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I wonder what the equivalent of this would be for men? The lack of a numeric system is problematic, it requires a number of different stats to make a comparison. Count us lucky
Pants sizes and suit jacket size?
I have no idea what size pants other men wear, what the average is, or wear I stand in comparison. Same with suits. It never crosses my mind. I don't think there is a commonly accepted metric for men similar to a woman's numeric size, which seems to be on their minds a lot.
I believe that men's pants sizes directly correlate to the waist measurement, whereas women's sizes seem to correlate with the tide, the phase of the moon, the colour of the queen's corgi's breakfast and the number of blowflies which land on the windowsill of the designer that morning.29 -
rebbylicious wrote: »The idea that Size 12 is the average sized woman , so that must make it ok. (As a former size 12-14) is something I disagree with. I am currently a size 8 and know that my weight for height is actually on the high end of the healthy weight range.
I'm not challenging what you're saying, your comment just makes me think of how ridiculous it is to measure someone by 'size X'. Not that I think you were doing this, but it also bugs me when people say size X is too big for a healthy person. Sorry, but body type, skeletal structure, and height go a long way towards size - not just how much fat a person happens to have.
I still have about 20ish (maybe 25) pounds to lose, but I can guarantee you that a size 12 will look much different on me at 5'7" than it will on someone who is 5'4" (for example). It will probably look much different on me at 5'7" than it would on someone with a more slender build who is also 5'7". I have wide shoulders and hip bones that balance out my proportions no matter what my size better than some women who have narrower body types. Size 'X' is meaningless as a comparative tool.
Size 12 may be the average woman in the US, and it's perfectly acceptable for many, many women. FWIW, even at a near normal BMI at my lowest weight, I was a size 12 in some things *shrug*.
I would be near skeletal in a size 12. Just sayin'. Too much height, too much bust. In order for me to be a 12, I would have to be on the low end of a healthy BMI.3
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