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How do you feel about fasting?
Replies
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I am amazed at the backlash given to LeeshaSeal for giving her own account of IF and how it is helping her. I read through every post and never heard her say once that she "knows everything" or that "her way is the only right way" or that "IF cures cancer." In fact, she has been very open about the fact that while she is new to IF, she has done her research and provided information that she learned...seems to me like those attacking her are the ones hell bent on convincing everyone that she is wrong and they are right. I came to this thread because I have been interested in IF because it legitimately sounds like a lifestyle change that would fit my routine...not because I think I am going to lose 100 pounds in 6 months. We are all here to better ourselves and if IF works for you, then so be it. If it doesnt, then trash it and try something else. I know I follow Terry Crews on Instagram and he is a huge proponent for IF. He totes it as bringing him into the best shape of his life and he has never been in BAD shape. I dont think Crews is a kook...certainly not everyone that has something good to say about it could be. Too bad people can't be more supportive of one another...especially on a platform like this.
She's repeatedly mentioned preventing cancer.LeeshaSeal wrote: »IF helps with calorie restriction only. It has no specific health benefits. If you log your intake adequently and exercise, and you’re at or below your daily calories, IF isn’t needed. I tried IF (16:8 ratio) awhile back and I found I was eating MORE later because I felt famished. Eating 3 times a day has eliminated that.
That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.LeeshaSeal wrote: »johnslater461 wrote: »LeeshaSeal wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »pinggolfer96 wrote: »LeeshaSeal wrote: »IF helps with calorie restriction only. It has no specific health benefits. If you log your intake adequently and exercise, and you’re at or below your daily calories, IF isn’t needed. I tried IF (16:8 ratio) awhile back and I found I was eating MORE later because I felt famished. Eating 3 times a day has eliminated that.
That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
I actually think this is more of a false statement. you can't outrun thermodynamics. 2500 cals in your eating window is 2500 cals regardless. also autophogy and sparked more so by extended caloric restriction and deprivation, not fasting. if fasting helps you to create a deficit, then yes, its helping, but not causing. I would love to see those studies that prove it from credible legit sources. because I have credible proven meta analysis studies and articles on hand to negate a "10 person study" or a bodybuilding .com article.....
fasting does not promote weightless, caloric deficits do. I've been a test subject myself just to disprove people.
The one time I looked for autophagy after people touted it as this amazing thing that's going to save your life thanks to fasting, I have not found any sources besides, I think, studies done in worms. That's also a problem.
I don't think you looked very hard. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3106288/
So mice, then.
That changes nothing.
That depends on how you look at things. The process of autophagy is only recently discovered and studied. It's the beginning of something that can be truly promising. All studies have to start somewhere and typically, they have to be successful on animals before moving to human trials. Weight loss aside, the idea that a process we can initiate can contribute to cancer, alzeihmers, Parkinsons, etc. prevention is inspiring to me. But if you want to dumb the whole thing down to a who's right and who's wrong about weight loss conversation, that's up to you.9 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »duskyjewel wrote: »LeeshaSeal wrote: »
The orginal post asked how one feels about intermittent fasting. I explained what the benefits and nuances are as I understand them. I cited multiple sources. I did not accuse anyone of being wrong by stating that the current methodology is not working for me. What I don't want to engage in is a who's right and who's wrong debate, which is exactly where many of your reaponses have gone. I'm more than willing to continue to expand my ideas and read more. I also welcome you to follow my journey. Hope that clears up the confusion.
When something is wrong, it is wrong. When something is right, it is right. If you repeatedly post woo that has been debunked by actual scientists, people are going to point that out and provide legitimate peer reviewed research. They don't do it for the fun of proving you wrong, they do it to prevent people from getting sucked into false promises that can be costly in both money and health.
Again, you're expressing opinion about what you and others agree to be the truth, including those in the scientific community. There are large communities of peers and scientists that believe in other methods to achieve health and weight loss. The Earth was once flat... I'm not sure what your little lecture was supposed to do. I have had others here that have actually provided insightful information, which I gladly read or marked for reading later.
There are still people who believe the Earth is flat. Belief =/= reality.11 -
Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?24
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Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?
Perhaps the part that IF has nothing to do with what you do or don't eat? Only when you do or don't eat it.9 -
Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?
@angel7747 Since IF is when you eat not what you eat how does it "prevent" cancer? So eating within 8 or less hours makes things that are normally carcinogenic fine?11 -
I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.10
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I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
Use the quote button under the post you wish to respond to.0 -
I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
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Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!20
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To OP's original question - "How do you feel about fasting?" I'm not a big fan because I like to eat when I feel like it and not on some pre-ordained schedule of IF. I only fast (some years) during Lent because I feel the need for a personal sacrifice and that's how I view fasting. As a sacrifice and indicator of personal control. Even then, Lenten fasting is not going without all food - just a much smaller amount for a day. That's about all I'm interested in.
Although this thread has become a bit of a debate, I can see valid of points on different sides. To the person with the very-thin-voracious-eating husband, mine is much the same. After years of eating large amounts of food and not much exercise and never gaining, it is finally catching up to him somewhat now that he's in his 50's. He's maybe MAYBE 10 pounds heavier than 40 years ago when we met. My father was the same, as is our youngest son. All healthy with normal blood work, no thyroid issues. I don't think all metabolisms are created equal and as @CharlieBeansmomTracey said, as a result not all caloric needs are the same. That especially changes for women when they reach menopause because hormones change drastically and that affects metabolism. For weight-loss, gain, or maintaining I believe it still comes down to CICO but individual needs can vary greatly and change as we age. I think the jury is still out on what effect fasting might have on cells, hormones, our glandular system, the brain. Science is ever evolving, so unless you are a physiologist and it's your area of expertise, it's mostly conjecture and opinion. Even so, you will find scientists with interpretations of study results on both ends of the spectrum. I don't believe we know everything about anything, so what's the harm in entertaining different possibilities?
Just a point about fasting in general over time. Our ancestors were often either feasting or fasting. When food was plentiful they ate much more, when food was scarce they conserved and ate much less. Food preservation was limited, so they had to eat while they could. The human body adapted somehow to keep people alive for quite some time even during the leanest times. I have no clue what the physiology was, but the human body is a strange and wonderful thing as enough of these people survived long enough to pro-create and now here we are.
Also, daily periods of fast was the most common way of eating for many centuries past. Even the Romans believed that eating more than once a day was a form of gluttony. The concept of 3 squares a day wasn't even a thing until after the Industrial Revolution where people started eating breakfast before going off to work long days. During the middle ages and even much later many people did not break their fast until after morning mass, so would normally not eat until mid-morning at the earliest and then might only have one additional evening meal (but not always). The wealthy often had more frequent meals than the common-folk just because they could. Personally, I'm glad I have the ability to eat as many times a day as I wish (while usually staying under my calorie goal).
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Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.17 -
snickerscharlie wrote: »I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
I agree with what you are saying as i do believe in CICO. But I also agree that things are only unsubstantiated until they arent and from what I can see, from studies that have been performed, they did find benefits such as reducing insulin resistance, therefore lowering your risk of Type 2 Diabetes..albeit these study groups were admittedly smaller in size. I am not saying she is right in everything she was saying..but she also wasnt the one making those claims. She was getting those from other cited sources. I was just disappointed in seeing so many people attacking her based on information that she didn't make up herself.12 -
snickerscharlie wrote: »I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
I agree with what you are saying as i do believe in CICO. But I also agree that things are only unsubstantiated until they arent and from what I can see, from studies that have been performed, they did find benefits such as reducing insulin resistance, therefore lowering your risk of Type 2 Diabetes..albeit these study groups were admittedly smaller in size. I am not saying she is right in everything she was saying..but she also wasnt the one making those claims. She was getting those from other cited sources. I was just disappointed in seeing so many people attacking her based on information that she didn't make up herself.
Vetting sources is a very important skill.9 -
singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.14 -
singingflutelady wrote: »snickerscharlie wrote: »I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
I agree with what you are saying as i do believe in CICO. But I also agree that things are only unsubstantiated until they arent and from what I can see, from studies that have been performed, they did find benefits such as reducing insulin resistance, therefore lowering your risk of Type 2 Diabetes..albeit these study groups were admittedly smaller in size. I am not saying she is right in everything she was saying..but she also wasnt the one making those claims. She was getting those from other cited sources. I was just disappointed in seeing so many people attacking her based on information that she didn't make up herself.
Vetting sources is a very important skill.
Right back at ya!16 -
singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous.
It can be though. I have chronic illnesses and constantly get told bad advice from well meaning people who can cite sources (not good sources) that doing so and so would "cure" my diseases. The most frequent are keto,vegan and IF. All of those would be very bad for me so there is where the danger lies. I have seen people follow unsubstantiated "cures" or preventative diets and have rapid disease progression. When people are ill they are vulnerable and things you view as harmless can actually be dangerous.25 -
singingflutelady wrote: »snickerscharlie wrote: »I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
I agree with what you are saying as i do believe in CICO. But I also agree that things are only unsubstantiated until they arent and from what I can see, from studies that have been performed, they did find benefits such as reducing insulin resistance, therefore lowering your risk of Type 2 Diabetes..albeit these study groups were admittedly smaller in size. I am not saying she is right in everything she was saying..but she also wasnt the one making those claims. She was getting those from other cited sources. I was just disappointed in seeing so many people attacking her based on information that she didn't make up herself.
Vetting sources is a very important skill.
Right back at ya!
Just pointing out that not all sources are the same. You can find sources for just about anything online so just because you can cite something doesn't automatically make it reputable.16 -
singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.
The statements borders on the ridiculous. You may not understand how it comes off, so I'll tell you. At the age of 30, I was very active, between the sizes of 0-2, and I had what would be considered an extremely healthy diet. I never ate anything that would be considered "junk food". Never ate fast food, never touched soda...I did every "right". Yet I still got lymphoma. My doctors could not tell me ANYTHING I could have done differently that would have changed that. Not my diet, my exercise, my environment. They said, luck of the draw for me.
Now, I do IF, and I love it because it controls my appetite. That's it. So when I see these magical claims that changing your eating window from morning to night to just afternoon til night will prevent a cancer or reverse other diseases...it's insulting. It really is. Especially when IF is just a time frame and not a diet with rules of what to eat. You can eat jelly donuts all day on IF if you want, and that's not reversing any darn disease. You may think saying this stuff is harmless, but you are basically spouting medical advice has no validity. And as someone who has had one of those diseases, it is really, really irritating.
ETA: Right, you didn't make those statements, but as you were defending the other poster making those statements, just wanted to make clear why they were not helpful.22 -
YvetteK2015 wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.
The statements borders on the ridiculous. You may not understand how it comes off, so I'll tell you. At the age of 30, I was very active, between the sizes of 0-2, and I had what would be considered an extremely healthy diet. I never ate anything that would be considered "junk food". Never ate fast food, never touched soda...I did every "right". Yet I still got lymphoma. My doctors could not tell me ANYTHING I could have done differently that would have changed that. Not my diet, my exercise, my environment. They said, luck of the draw for me.
Now, I do IF, and I love it because it controls my appetite. That's it. So when I see these magical claims that changing your eating window from morning to night to just afternoon til night will prevent a cancer or reverse other diseases...it's insulting. It really is. Especially when IF is just a time frame and not a diet with rules of what to eat. You can eat jelly donuts all day on IF if you want, and that's not reversing any darn disease. You may think saying this stuff is harmless, but you are basically spouting medical advice has no validity. And as someone who has had one of those diseases, it is really, really irritating.
It is very irritating. I don't have cancer (cancer isn't one disease anyways). I have Crohn's and gastroparesis and everyone around me has instantaneously become doctors and dietitians. I was also thin, fit and ate carefully when I became ill. I didn't do anything to deserve or cause what happened. It just happened. Yes I have tried everything and I still lost my colon. Telling me that IF (or whatever) would cure it prevent what happened is insulting (as if I had just tried harder I would be well).20 -
duskyjewel wrote: »Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?LeeshaSeal wrote: »That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
These are doctrinaire statements asserted as if fact.
I do have research and studies that back those claims up but those were dismissed as false, woo, or quack here.17 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »duskyjewel wrote: »Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?LeeshaSeal wrote: »That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
These are doctrinaire statements asserted as if fact.
I do have research and studies that back those claims up but those were dismissed as false, woo, or quack here.
Can you provide the links to the human studies that conclude IF prevents cancer?9 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »duskyjewel wrote: »Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?LeeshaSeal wrote: »That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
These are doctrinaire statements asserted as if fact.
I do have research and studies that back those claims up but those were dismissed as false, woo, or quack here.
Here's an entire website dedicated to "research" proving that the Earth is flat: https://theflatearthsociety.org/home/
I've looked at it, but I'm not in any way convinced that the Earth is flat. Rather, I'm convinced that they're a bunch of loons and there are plenty of facts to conclusively prove them wrong.
Yeah, it's kinda like that. Quacks like Fung and Taubes fly in the face of established science and portray themselves as being on the cutting edge of research. So either they're right and all the rest of the evidence-based researchers are all screwed up, or vice-versa. They're the ones claiming "flat earth" in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.
Hearkening back to the OP's question: IF is one possible method to help with satiety and adherence. Works for some, doesn't work at all for others. There is absolutely no evidence that it assists with "cleansing the body" or "resetting your mechanisms" (whatever that may mean). There's nothing magical about what time you eat your meals.13 -
YvetteK2015 wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.
The statements borders on the ridiculous. You may not understand how it comes off, so I'll tell you. At the age of 30, I was very active, between the sizes of 0-2, and I had what would be considered an extremely healthy diet. I never ate anything that would be considered "junk food". Never ate fast food, never touched soda...I did every "right". Yet I still got lymphoma. My doctors could not tell me ANYTHING I could have done differently that would have changed that. Not my diet, my exercise, my environment. They said, luck of the draw for me.
Now, I do IF, and I love it because it controls my appetite. That's it. So when I see these magical claims that changing your eating window from morning to night to just afternoon til night will prevent a cancer or reverse other diseases...it's insulting. It really is. Especially when IF is just a time frame and not a diet with rules of what to eat. You can eat jelly donuts all day on IF if you want, and that's not reversing any darn disease. You may think saying this stuff is harmless, but you are basically spouting medical advice has no validity. And as someone who has had one of those diseases, it is really, really irritating.
ETA: Right, you didn't make those statements, but as you were defending the other poster making those statements, just wanted to make clear why they were not helpful.
This has gone completely out of line and out of control. I clearly will not voice an unpopular opinion again. I NEVER said that IF cures cancer. I'm sure you feel very strongly about it having cancer yourself and I respect that but quit slamming me. You can direct your anger towards the sources that I received that information from.20 -
I am leaving this thread because I do feel that most of your comments are coming from an angry place. I am happy to share my journey with you here. I will continue working out, monitoring the quality of my food, and measuring my body. I will continue to research IF and other health and wellness topics. I will engage in an open discussion with you BUT this has gone too far, especially that the one person who called out the behavior is now getting attacked as well.16
-
singingflutelady wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »snickerscharlie wrote: »I dont know how to respond to each of you personally..But Duskyjewel, in my post I no where brought up what your comment was about. I am not an expert on IF..nor am I guessing you are. If it works for people then it works. If it doesnt then it doesnt. I saw your previous comment that it has been debunked by reputable scientists...do you care to provide a link to that so I dont just take what you are saying as doctrinaire statements asserted as facts? For as many people say it works..just as many dont. I really dont have the time to go back and forth as it is clear you all could go all day.
IF is nothing to be an 'expert' about. All IF is is a way for some people to control their caloric intake by limiting eating to within a specific window of time. If it works, those using IF can achieve weight loss/management.
Consume too many calories in whatever your eating window is and - just like everyone else - you would gain weight.
All of the additional 'benefits' that have been assigned to IF of late are completely unsubstantiated.
PS: I've been doing IF for decades. There's no magic. It still all comes down to creating a calorie deficit or not.
I agree with what you are saying as i do believe in CICO. But I also agree that things are only unsubstantiated until they arent and from what I can see, from studies that have been performed, they did find benefits such as reducing insulin resistance, therefore lowering your risk of Type 2 Diabetes..albeit these study groups were admittedly smaller in size. I am not saying she is right in everything she was saying..but she also wasnt the one making those claims. She was getting those from other cited sources. I was just disappointed in seeing so many people attacking her based on information that she didn't make up herself.
Vetting sources is a very important skill.
Right back at ya!
Just pointing out that not all sources are the same. You can find sources for just about anything online so just because you can cite something doesn't automatically make it reputable.
Just so you know, I like to get my sources from multiple places, like books.9 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »duskyjewel wrote: »Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?LeeshaSeal wrote: »That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
These are doctrinaire statements asserted as if fact.
I do have research and studies that back those claims up but those were dismissed as false, woo, or quack here.
Here's an entire website dedicated to "research" proving that the Earth is flat: https://theflatearthsociety.org/home/
I've looked at it, but I'm not in any way convinced that the Earth is flat. Rather, I'm convinced that they're a bunch of loons and there are plenty of facts to conclusively prove them wrong.
Yeah, it's kinda like that. Quacks like Fung and Taubes fly in the face of established science and portray themselves as being on the cutting edge of research. So either they're right and all the rest of the evidence-based researchers are all screwed up, or vice-versa. They're the ones claiming "flat earth" in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.
I truly have appreciated your input. What I meant by that was that everyone thought the Earth was flat until it was proven otherwise.7 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »I am leaving this thread because I do feel that most of your comments are coming from an angry place. I am happy to share my journey with you here. I will continue working out, monitoring the quality of my food, and measuring my body. I will continue to research IF and other health and wellness topics. I will engage in an open discussion with you BUT this has gone too far, especially that the one person who called out the behavior is now getting attacked as well.
@LeeshaSeal giving unsubstantiated medical advice is going too far. Challenging someone giving that advice is not going too far. If you have peer reviewed studies that make those claims I will read them but you haven't provided them yet.16 -
singingflutelady wrote: »YvetteK2015 wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.
The statements borders on the ridiculous. You may not understand how it comes off, so I'll tell you. At the age of 30, I was very active, between the sizes of 0-2, and I had what would be considered an extremely healthy diet. I never ate anything that would be considered "junk food". Never ate fast food, never touched soda...I did every "right". Yet I still got lymphoma. My doctors could not tell me ANYTHING I could have done differently that would have changed that. Not my diet, my exercise, my environment. They said, luck of the draw for me.
Now, I do IF, and I love it because it controls my appetite. That's it. So when I see these magical claims that changing your eating window from morning to night to just afternoon til night will prevent a cancer or reverse other diseases...it's insulting. It really is. Especially when IF is just a time frame and not a diet with rules of what to eat. You can eat jelly donuts all day on IF if you want, and that's not reversing any darn disease. You may think saying this stuff is harmless, but you are basically spouting medical advice has no validity. And as someone who has had one of those diseases, it is really, really irritating.
It is very irritating. I don't have cancer (cancer isn't one disease anyways). I have Crohn's and gastroparesis and everyone around me has instantaneously become doctors and dietitians. I was also thin, fit and ate carefully when I became ill. I didn't do anything to deserve or cause what happened. It just happened. Yes I have tried everything and I still lost my colon. Telling me that IF (or whatever) would cure it prevent what happened is insulting (as if I had just tried harder I would be well).
Yes, that's exactly what it is! That ring of ...well if you just did this, that, or the other thing, you wouldn't have gotten sick. So infuriating.6 -
LeeshaSeal wrote: »LeeshaSeal wrote: »duskyjewel wrote: »Here they come! I LOVE that you all got THAT out of my post. Its like talking to a damn wall. I didnt miss that post...no where in there do I see that she said it "CURES CANCER." OR did YOU miss that post? Prevent Cancer...a process that we can control can contribute to cancer...these arent new ideas that what you put in your body can contribute to cancer...and its no secret that by avoiding things could prevent it. Again, please tell me what I missed?LeeshaSeal wrote: »That is a false statement. The benefits are numerous and there studies and research to prove it, which include weight loss, reducing inflammation, increasing muscle, reducing/eliminating type 2 diabetes, preventing cancer and alzheimers, to name a few. The 2016 Nobel Prize for Medicine went to a person that identified the process of Autophagy, which happens during a fasted-state. It's the process of your body cleaning out cellular junk and broken down proteins. Also, you were probably hungry because you were consuming something that released insulin and triggered digestion. It could have even been lemon in your water.
These are doctrinaire statements asserted as if fact.
I do have research and studies that back those claims up but those were dismissed as false, woo, or quack here.
Here's an entire website dedicated to "research" proving that the Earth is flat: https://theflatearthsociety.org/home/
I've looked at it, but I'm not in any way convinced that the Earth is flat. Rather, I'm convinced that they're a bunch of loons and there are plenty of facts to conclusively prove them wrong.
Yeah, it's kinda like that. Quacks like Fung and Taubes fly in the face of established science and portray themselves as being on the cutting edge of research. So either they're right and all the rest of the evidence-based researchers are all screwed up, or vice-versa. They're the ones claiming "flat earth" in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.
I truly have appreciated your input. What I meant by that was that everyone thought the Earth was flat until it was proven otherwise.
And maybe someday they'll discover that there are miraculous medical effects from IF. Or maybe they'll discover that it's deleterious to human health and decreases lifespan. Either way, we'll never know until it's proven - and making sweeping assumptions based upon a few quacks doing bad pseudoscience and trying to sell books is not useful. The current "evidence" is correlative and speculative at best.14 -
YvetteK2015 wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »YvetteK2015 wrote: »singingflutelady wrote: »Actually @singingflutelady, from what I read about it before coming to this thread, almost all stated that you should still stick to good food choices such as fruit, vegetables, lean proteins, etc, and that IF is NOT an excuse to stuff your face with poor food choices. Where are you seeing that an actual study said they could eat whatever they wanted? I am not going to get in an argument about IF...I am not going to go there with any of you because I am not an expert. My post was stating that this is supposed to be a platform where people motivate eachother and provide real life insight to things/ideas that worked for them. In my opinion thats what she was doing. I have had several friends that had great success with IF and my whole point was to give my opinion on how everyone else was labeling her as a know it all while themselves being the ones to try and push their word as the fact. Have a great night!
@angel7747 how is making unsubstantiated health claims supportive? Claiming something prevents cancer when there is no evidence that it does is pretty dangerous if you ask me.
Its not dangerous to try and do something good for yourself and your body. She didn't make those claims herself..she was citing other sources. And we can't even tell people what causes most cancers so believing that a certain lifestyle can help your health, whether unsubstantiated or not, is hardly dangerous. She's not out there telling people to drink a fifth and smoke a pack of cigs a day for petes sake.
The statements borders on the ridiculous. You may not understand how it comes off, so I'll tell you. At the age of 30, I was very active, between the sizes of 0-2, and I had what would be considered an extremely healthy diet. I never ate anything that would be considered "junk food". Never ate fast food, never touched soda...I did every "right". Yet I still got lymphoma. My doctors could not tell me ANYTHING I could have done differently that would have changed that. Not my diet, my exercise, my environment. They said, luck of the draw for me.
Now, I do IF, and I love it because it controls my appetite. That's it. So when I see these magical claims that changing your eating window from morning to night to just afternoon til night will prevent a cancer or reverse other diseases...it's insulting. It really is. Especially when IF is just a time frame and not a diet with rules of what to eat. You can eat jelly donuts all day on IF if you want, and that's not reversing any darn disease. You may think saying this stuff is harmless, but you are basically spouting medical advice has no validity. And as someone who has had one of those diseases, it is really, really irritating.
It is very irritating. I don't have cancer (cancer isn't one disease anyways). I have Crohn's and gastroparesis and everyone around me has instantaneously become doctors and dietitians. I was also thin, fit and ate carefully when I became ill. I didn't do anything to deserve or cause what happened. It just happened. Yes I have tried everything and I still lost my colon. Telling me that IF (or whatever) would cure it prevent what happened is insulting (as if I had just tried harder I would be well).
Yes, that's exactly what it is! That ring of ...well if you just did this, that, or the other thing, you wouldn't have gotten sick. So infuriating.
Victim blaming. I see this all the time. I follow some children with different cancers (mostly DIPG-check out the survival rate for it) and have seen "joe blow" writing have you tried such and such it cures cancer in response to the parents announcing the child is in hospice and has days to live.10
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