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Why do people keep defending sugar?
purplebobkat
Posts: 68 Member
in Debate Club
Sugar (& other highly processed carbs) has no nutritional benefits, so why are so many people defending it?
Fruit & veg are good for you because they have high levels of nutrition, and the fibre content helps to mitigate the bad effects of the sugar content.
So although a lot of people lose weight while keeping their sugar levels high, is this something to be applauded or a reason to defend sugar?
Fruit & veg are good for you because they have high levels of nutrition, and the fibre content helps to mitigate the bad effects of the sugar content.
So although a lot of people lose weight while keeping their sugar levels high, is this something to be applauded or a reason to defend sugar?
25
Replies
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who is defending sugar? Maybe people who think sugar = love, and don't know that sugar = death?16
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Carbs are a macro nutrient so how can you say they have no nutritional benefit?
That would be the same as saying fat has no nutritional benefit!
Maybe also consider that providing energy is a vital part of your diet which carbs (including sugar) do very well.60 -
Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.63
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It's hard to discuss this issue in a forum IMO. There is so much information out there, telling us the whys of it being bad, plus hard to share our POV without reading added messages between the lines. KWIM? Natural vs. added, the good carbs vs. bad carbs. All we can do is share our own opinions and the way we eat/don't eat sugar.
Ideally, I wouldn't eat any added sugar but also happen to like sweet coffee as opposed to plain. I like maple syrup and honey and sugar while I know the added empty calories aren't beneficial. I eat fruit without worrying about natural sugars because I know they're not simply empty calories.
I believe there IS a huge difference between foods loaded down with added sugars as opposed to foods...........uh, not loaded down with added sugars?
I don't like the fact that foods are loaded with sugar, salt, fats, to enhance taste and increase consumption.
There is always good vs. bad whether it's fats, carbs, calories, and even sugars. We all just need to do what's right for our own needs, a sustainable health(ier) way of eating and our own individual health needs.
Yes, carbs are important but do they need to have so much added sugar.
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snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.25 -
https://www.britannica.com/science/ketosisabove is the definition of being in ketosis: With starvation or fasting, there is less sugar than normal in the blood and less glycogen (the storage form of sugar) in the cells of the body, especially the liver cells; fat accumulates in the liver, as do amino acids, from which the liver can produce more glycogen.
So from my understanding (and someone who is much more knowledgeable and coming from a non-biased viewpoint can correct me please if I'm off base), if there isn't enough sugar in the blood stream for the body to use to fuel itself, then the liver will turn fat into the storage form of sugar to make it available for the body to use - so ketosis is taking fat and turning it into a form of sugar that can then be used by the body.
Sugar is not evil; it's not some evolutionary by product poison left over from eons ago when our supposed ancestors used it, its not the devil, its not poison; its something the body needs and uses, but like many other things, it needs it in moderation, and it should be combined with other things that the body can also use for optimal health. Too much sugar, just like too much fat, too much vitamin D, too much calcium, etc, can be harmful, yes, but in correct levels, its perfectly fine and actually needed by the body.
And frankly, even using table sugar, or those "empty sugars" to make something that is healthy more palatable (I'm thinking my oatmeal, for instance), as long as its in moderation and not making up a large portion of my calories per day, isn't a bad thing, either. If you area healthy individual, a little added sugar isn't going to hurt you.
So disagree all you want, but I'm in the camp with @snowflake954 @sijomial and @sardelsa48 -
They can pry my fruit from my cold sticky hands!23
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psychod787 wrote: »They can pry my fruit from my cold sticky hands!
Nothing wrong with fruit, it's an important source of many vitamins, minerals & fibre.10 -
This is - and wil remain a very polarized conversation.
- I will not take sides here but will encourage everyone who wants to take on the debate whether sugars (refined or otherwise) carbohydrates are unhealthy to read a book in physiology and see what happens to sugar and carbohydrates in our bodies when we ingest them
- When you read about the fate of carbohydrates - make sure you read what happens to your insulin levels and what that does to the carbohydrates.
- If you think the discussion regarding carbs is new - you should know the earliest mention of the benefit of low carbs was in the mid 18 century - in the 19th Century there is the famous "letter on corpulence" by William Banting. Sir Wiliam Osler (the father of modern medicine) wrote about it ... .7 -
snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.7 -
Carbs are a macro nutrient so how can you say they have no nutritional benefit?
That would be the same as saying fat has no nutritional benefit!
Maybe also consider that providing energy is a vital part of your diet which carbs (including sugar) do very well.
Actually I said sugar has no nutritional value. Carbs can be healthy, but sugar is not healthy. So why are so many defending it?
(Just curious)5 -
purplebobkat wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.
You mentioned that fibre helps lessen the bad effects.
Without sugar I would probably be underweight and not look the way I do so I have no problem defending it.22 -
purplebobkat wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.
I thought my post answered your question. What didn't you understand?18 -
snowflake954 wrote: »purplebobkat wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.
I thought my post answered your question. What didn't you understand?
Good and bad is relative. Too much of many things is not "good" for someone, IMHO. It is just very contextual. For someone trying to maintain a weight loss, cutting back "added" sugars can help decrease caloric intake and pushes people toward more filling foods. For someone who is doing large amounts of "explosive" train... I.E. Sprints or hypertrophy weight lifting, it can help performance. It has to be looked at in the line of the individuals goals and life experiences.19 -
purplebobkat wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.
You mentioned that fibre helps lessen the bad effects.
Without sugar I would probably be underweight and not look the way I do so I have no problem defending it.
My bad I did in fact mention the bad effects (in passing), so thank you.
However your comment about being underweight without sugar is curious.3 -
purplebobkat wrote: »purplebobkat wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »Sugar is neither to defend or demonize. It depends on your nutritional needs. If those are met and you have calories left over sugar can fill some of that gap. Overuse will cause problems, as will almost anything else. Why is moderation such a difficult concept for some? Athletes, people that burn a lot of calories may need that energy and quickly. Sugar has it's place.
Agree with all this. I use sugar/candy for quick energy before my lifting sessions. While it may not be nutritious I find it very beneficial (vegetables or fruit even would not have the same effect), so OP those "bad" effects you speak of are actually the effects I seek.
I made no mention of the bad effects of sugar (although they are numerous), I just asked why people defend sugar so much.
I consume too much sugar (like most people), but I understand it's bad for me & would never defend it. I just wondered why so many on this app are constantly doing so.
You mentioned that fibre helps lessen the bad effects.
Without sugar I would probably be underweight and not look the way I do so I have no problem defending it.
My bad I did in fact mention the bad effects (in passing), so thank you.
However your comment about being underweight without sugar is curious.
Without sugar it would significantly limit the foods I chose to eat, my calorie intake is very high right now at least above 3K to maintain (and this is with zero cardio) I also increase my fat intake but carbs and sugar help so much to get the calories in without causing discomfort, bloating and upset stomach. The only side effect is so much energy which can cause more calories burned so I just have to be mindful of that.18 -
purplebobkat wrote: »Sugar (& other highly processed carbs) has no nutritional benefits, so why are so many people defending it?
Fruit & veg are good for you because they have high levels of nutrition, and the fibre content helps to mitigate the bad effects of the sugar content.
So although a lot of people lose weight while keeping their sugar levels high, is this something to be applauded or a reason to defend sugar?purplebobkat wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »They can pry my fruit from my cold sticky hands!
Nothing wrong with fruit, it's an important source of many vitamins, minerals & fibre.
But fruit can also be a large source of sugar.
I'm not sure what you're saying here - that added sugar is bad, but inherent/naturally occurring sugar is fine?
How much added sugar is indefensible?- Are you with the WHO, which says people should keep their added sugar (which they call "free sugar") to 10% or less of their daily calories, with more health benefits realized if that is reduced to 5%? https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2015/sugar-guideline/en/
- Or do you think ALL added sugar is bad?
I tried to keep added sugar at 5% for a while, which lead me to make weird sacrifices which were ultimately unsustainable to me. I probably do best at no more than 10% added sugar.
The problem with added sugar (for me) is that it can also come with lots of calories from fat (ex: ice cream), and often flour (ex: baked goods) and these calories crowd out room for foods that keep me satiated for less calories, like protein.
However, the 3 g of sugar I put in my tea 3 x per day and the 9 g of sugar in my chocolate protein powder, etc., is not a problem for me.18 -
kshama2001 wrote: »purplebobkat wrote: »Sugar (& other highly processed carbs) has no nutritional benefits, so why are so many people defending it?
Fruit & veg are good for you because they have high levels of nutrition, and the fibre content helps to mitigate the bad effects of the sugar content.
So although a lot of people lose weight while keeping their sugar levels high, is this something to be applauded or a reason to defend sugar?purplebobkat wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »They can pry my fruit from my cold sticky hands!
Nothing wrong with fruit, it's an important source of many vitamins, minerals & fibre.
But fruit can also be a large source of sugar.
I'm not sure what you're saying here - that added sugar is bad, but inherent/naturally occurring sugar is fine?
How much added sugar is indefensible?- Are you with the WHO, which says people should keep their added sugar (which they call "free sugar") to 10% or less of their daily calories, with more health benefits realized if that is reduced to 5%? https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2015/sugar-guideline/en/
- Or do you think ALL added sugar is bad?
I tried to keep added sugar at 5% for a while, which lead me to make weird sacrifices which were ultimately unsustainable to me. I probably do best at no more than 10% added sugar.
The problem with added sugar (for me) is that it can also come with lots of calories from fat (ex: ice cream), and often flour (ex: baked goods) and these calories crowd out room for foods that keep me satiated for less calories, like protein.
However, the 3 g of sugar I put in my tea 3 x per day and the 9 g of sugar in my chocolate protein powder, etc., is not a problem for me.
It's actually a really interesting question, of how much sugar is bad for you, and something that I can't see being answered anytime soon.
But my theory is that if it's eaten as a whole food (e.g. an apple) then that seems sensible, but when I eat Haribo that's not very sensible & I would never defend it as a good idea. Just something that I understand is bad for me & have eaten anyway.
I asked this question because I have been reading other posts on mfp today (Self isolating) and found a huge number of people almost attacking others for saying sugar is bad. I wondered why.9 -
There always seems to be a type of disconnect in the communication line when discussing certain topics. Some people may defend it jokingly, or list cases when consuming it is beneficial, but most people are not exactly defending sugar. They're defending something entirely different. They're presenting a case for looking at nutrition as a whole and in context instead of nitpicking ingredients and nutrients.
Many people who demonize or idealize a single ingredient or nutrient tend to not see the forest for the trees and it can create some situations that make achieving their goals harder or cause them to regard their choices as morally superior. It can create stress and guilt. It can make them take measures that leave them feeling deprived.
I don't think sugar is evil. I don't think sugar is anything. In fact, I rarely give it much thought. I think it tastes good in some foods and doesn't taste good in others. Sometimes I eat it, sometimes I don't, and I'm happy with the way my nutrients are averaging out.
I have not seen sugar singled out as "bad" except in the context of tooth decay (which can be mitigated with good oral hygiene) and very specific health conditions which don't apply to me. Everything else is a correlation. Researchers trying to find a single element to help draft general rules aimed at calorie control in populations. For us calorie counters, we're already managing our calories and nutrients so we don't need to follow any blind rules. We change what and how much we eat based on the numbers we see. If I'm short on a nutrient I try to eat foods that contain more of it, which means eating a bit less of some other foods. If a food item is causing a problem I troubleshoot that problem. An individualized approach based on your wants and needs is always better than general rules drafted for populations.
Any problem you have with a food item (regardless if it has sugar or not) can be solved by troubleshooting and trying out different approaches until you find one that feels easiest. If you overeat chocolate, it's not because "sugar", it's because you tend to overeat chocolate - there, you've identified a problem. I'm pretty sure there are other foods that have sugar that you don't overeat, so focusing on sugar would be too broad of a definition for your problem and will not get you a specific enough (or sustainable enough) solution. The next logical step would be to find the most sustainable way to solve that particular problem (overeating chocolate). For some, it means giving up chocolate, for others it means eating it less often, and for others it means eating it more often but in smaller amounts. All 3 solutions solved the problem for those who found them sustainable. There was no need to fixate on sugar or feed anxiety and guilt.
46 -
purplebobkat wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »purplebobkat wrote: »Sugar (& other highly processed carbs) has no nutritional benefits, so why are so many people defending it?
Fruit & veg are good for you because they have high levels of nutrition, and the fibre content helps to mitigate the bad effects of the sugar content.
So although a lot of people lose weight while keeping their sugar levels high, is this something to be applauded or a reason to defend sugar?purplebobkat wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »They can pry my fruit from my cold sticky hands!
Nothing wrong with fruit, it's an important source of many vitamins, minerals & fibre.
But fruit can also be a large source of sugar.
I'm not sure what you're saying here - that added sugar is bad, but inherent/naturally occurring sugar is fine?
How much added sugar is indefensible?- Are you with the WHO, which says people should keep their added sugar (which they call "free sugar") to 10% or less of their daily calories, with more health benefits realized if that is reduced to 5%? https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2015/sugar-guideline/en/
- Or do you think ALL added sugar is bad?
I tried to keep added sugar at 5% for a while, which lead me to make weird sacrifices which were ultimately unsustainable to me. I probably do best at no more than 10% added sugar.
The problem with added sugar (for me) is that it can also come with lots of calories from fat (ex: ice cream), and often flour (ex: baked goods) and these calories crowd out room for foods that keep me satiated for less calories, like protein.
However, the 3 g of sugar I put in my tea 3 x per day and the 9 g of sugar in my chocolate protein powder, etc., is not a problem for me.
It's actually a really interesting question, of how much sugar is bad for you, and something that I can't see being answered anytime soon.
But my theory is that if it's eaten as a whole food (e.g. an apple) then that seems sensible, but when I eat Haribo that's not very sensible & I would never defend it as a good idea. Just something that I understand is bad for me & have eaten anyway.
I asked this question because I have been reading other posts on mfp today (Self isolating) and found a huge number of people almost attacking others for saying sugar is bad. I wondered why.
Because unless it is defined as an unhealthy use, sugar is not bad. Even then it's only bad when further defined as excess added sugars for extended periods of time. And even at that point, the impact is the greatest only when excess added sugars are crowding out other essentials for the body, such as fats, proteins, fiber, and all the micronutrients.
Most things which are demonized on the site are done so based on the argument that people do certain things to great excess.
There are a great number of people that eat things with added sugars on a regular basis yet have no health concerns at all.
Sugar is not bad at all.
People that eat just about anything to excess and allow it to crowd out other essentials are often increasing health risks just as much as excess consumption of sugar would do.23
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