Coronavirus prep
Replies
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I read recently that it's better to wait a bit to get the shot (i.e. late September or October for us in the northern hemisphere) because the immunity doesn't last that long, so if you get it early (August) it may not still be protective in February or March.1
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This is the latest in flu vaccines. And I was also told by my doctor to wait until the end of September or early October to get it so the immunity last longer. The flu season usually picks up after the first of the year (2021 in this case)
1) High-dose flu vaccine: four more the antigen specificity that the standard flu vaccine: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/qa_fluzone.htm
2) Flu vaccine with adjuvant or FLUAD: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/adjuvant.htm. This last one is highly recommend for adults over 65 .
This from Dr. Sanjay Gupta
Why it's more important than ever to get a flu shot
The first shipments of this year’s flu vaccine are going out -- and it's more important than ever that you get a flu shot this flu season. Public health experts are concerned that this year’s flu season will coincide with an increase in Covid-19 infections -- and that could mean added stress to our hospital systems.
Getting a flu shot can help you either avoid the flu, or at least lessen the severity of your flu symptoms. Also, because symptoms of the flu such as fever, cough or fatigue can be mistaken for Covid-19, getting a flu shot can potentially help rule out influenza if you do start getting sick.
And if you need more reasons to get vaccinated this year, new research from the University of Texas Health Science Center at Houston finds that getting a flu shot can also reduce your risk of developing dementia. The researchers examined the records of more than 9,000 patients over the age of 60 and found that people who got vaccinated just once had a 17% reduction in Alzheimer's incidence. Those who were vaccinated more than once over the years saw an additional 13% reduction in incidence. And that protective association increased the earlier in your life you got your first flu shot.
A lot of work still needs to be done to understand the why, but some researchers believe that getting vaccinated can prevent viral infections that can have cascading effects on our immune systems and inflammatory pathways that can trigger Alzheimer’s-related decline.
Of course, talk to your doctor and find out what is best for you, but do get the flu vaccine this year please!
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MikePfirrman wrote: »Diatonic12 wrote: »Our local radio station just announced that everyone should get their flu shot early, now or by the end of September or early October to prevent a twindemic. @spiriteagle99 That's bravery on their part. Hope it all works out for them and us.
I don't usually get the flu shot but plan on doing it this year. The only concern I've got with them doing the flu shot early is that normally means they won't be as accurate on which strain is hitting us that year. But they do say it's better to get one even if it's the wrong strain and, I believe, that's likely even more important this year.
I usually wait to get mine, too, but not because the shot is updated during the season (never heard of that - do pharma companies do that?) but because the protection lasts longer in younger people. I'm 55, so I wait until I need more protection (usually right before the holidays). Flu season is usually worse after the holidays than before the holidays in my area, so getting the shot early risks losing efficacy while the flu season is peaking.
In my long experience (decades) of giving flu vaccines to people - No, never - the pharma companies never do that.
The year's vaccine comes out in late March/Early April (in Southern hemisphere) and is the same vaccine all year long.
there is some merit in timing of flu vaccines - govt here does not release them earlier than above times even if they have it in stock because we want people getting it so its efficiency is at its peak at the peak of the flu season - ie in winter
The private market - ie for people who pay for it privately because they do not meet govt critieria for free vaccine - is usually available slightly earlier - not because it is a different vaccine but because sellers want to get customers before anyone else does and are less concerned about best timing than govt dept's who have no profit motive.
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We usually wait until late Sept, early Oct. for our flu shots, but kept hearing to make sure to get them, so we got them yesterday. Hope it wasn’t too early.3
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janejellyroll wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »Diatonic12 wrote: »Our local radio station just announced that everyone should get their flu shot early, now or by the end of September or early October to prevent a twindemic. @spiriteagle99 That's bravery on their part. Hope it all works out for them and us.
I don't usually get the flu shot but plan on doing it this year. The only concern I've got with them doing the flu shot early is that normally means they won't be as accurate on which strain is hitting us that year. But they do say it's better to get one even if it's the wrong strain and, I believe, that's likely even more important this year.
I am not an expert, but if I understand correctly they didn't choose the strain/vaccination contents early, they're just encouraging us to get it early this year. The timeline for evaluating the evidence and choosing the strains we should be vaccinated against happened in the same timeline has it has for previous years.
For the Northern hemisphere, IMU, there's a February conference where flu strains are selected for the next season's vaccines. (September conference for Southern hemisphere.) CDC says it takes around 6 months to produce the vaccines, but some companies start growing strains in January based on expectations. However, it's normally encouraged not to get the vaccine super early (like July) because benefits decline after 4-6 months especially for older folks.
Sounds like they're trying to get more of us vaccinated in the optimal time range this year, vs. procrastinating until season starts.
Sources:
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/vaccine-selection.htm
https://www.health.harvard.edu/vaccinations/whats-the-best-time-of-year-for-a-flu-shot
Thanks, useful information there.
I usually get the flu vaccine anywhere between mid September and mid October, depending on when my company health plan issues the vouchers for free flu vaccines and how soon after that I can find a relatively non-busy time at a pharmacy that accepts the vouchers.
They just issued the vouchers today, which to my memory is about two weeks earlier than they ever have. I'm thinking of going tomorrow.0 -
This is the latest in flu vaccines. And I was also told by my doctor to wait until the end of September or early October to get it so the immunity last longer. The flu season usually picks up after the first of the year (2021 in this case)
1) High-dose flu vaccine: four more the antigen specificity that the standard flu vaccine: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/qa_fluzone.htm
2) Flu vaccine with adjuvant or FLUAD: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/adjuvant.htm. This last one is highly recommend for adults over 65 .
This from Dr. Sanjay Gupta
Why it's more important than ever to get a flu shot
The first shipments of this year’s flu vaccine are going out -- and it's more important than ever that you get a flu shot this flu season. Public health experts are concerned that this year’s flu season will coincide with an increase in Covid-19 infections -- and that could mean added stress to our hospital systems.
Getting a flu shot can help you either avoid the flu, or at least lessen the severity of your flu symptoms. Also, because symptoms of the flu such as fever, cough or fatigue can be mistaken for Covid-19, getting a flu shot can potentially help rule out influenza if you do start getting sick.
[snipped for length]
This really doesn't make sense. Since the flu vaccine isn't 100% effective, ruling out influenza in patients with flu symptoms just because they have been vaccinated doesn't seem like a good idea, anymore than the ruling out of covid in patients without a known covid contact back in the early spring was a good idea.
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Flu shot is usually mandatory to keep my job in the hospital. They require we get it by Oct 31 every year1
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »This is the latest in flu vaccines. And I was also told by my doctor to wait until the end of September or early October to get it so the immunity last longer. The flu season usually picks up after the first of the year (2021 in this case)
1) High-dose flu vaccine: four more the antigen specificity that the standard flu vaccine: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/qa_fluzone.htm
2) Flu vaccine with adjuvant or FLUAD: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/adjuvant.htm. This last one is highly recommend for adults over 65 .
This from Dr. Sanjay Gupta
Why it's more important than ever to get a flu shot
The first shipments of this year’s flu vaccine are going out -- and it's more important than ever that you get a flu shot this flu season. Public health experts are concerned that this year’s flu season will coincide with an increase in Covid-19 infections -- and that could mean added stress to our hospital systems.
Getting a flu shot can help you either avoid the flu, or at least lessen the severity of your flu symptoms. Also, because symptoms of the flu such as fever, cough or fatigue can be mistaken for Covid-19, getting a flu shot can potentially help rule out influenza if you do start getting sick.
[snipped for length]
This really doesn't make sense. Since the flu vaccine isn't 100% effective, ruling out influenza in patients with flu symptoms just because they have been vaccinated doesn't seem like a good idea, anymore than the ruling out of covid in patients without a known covid contact back in the early spring was a good idea.
FYI any patient that goes to the hospital with COVID-19 symptoms also get tested for the flu, at least in most hospital if they follow protocol. And I am sure that between the fall and early spring, when the flu is more prevalent, that protocol will/should be followed. Flu testing is easily available and fast. COVID still has ways to go.
I understand your concern, and I encourage you to talk to Dr. Gupta about it
. However, there are many symptoms very unique to Covid-19 that are not part of the flu spectrum, and maybe that can help the hospital staff to make a better diagnosis, besides testing for both.
Edited to add that a person can be affected by both and that is no good. So get vaccinated for the flu.
https://www.cnet.com/health/how-to-tell-if-you-have-the-flu-or-the-coronavirus/5 -
We both got our flu shots onTuesday. Mostly because of schools opening, Labor Day gatherings, (and all the fall holidays) and to avoid rushes in getting it done. I usually don’t get one, my husband gets one yearly. He’s a cancer survivor and we’re both in our late 60’s. I’m concerned about educators, with schools, colleges and universities opening, all their exposure to colds and flu. Any respiratory illness could increase susceptibility to Covid 19. Cooler weather setting in, more inside activity. Very important to remain vigilant about hand washing, social distancing, and face coverings.3
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I want to get my flu vaccine... I just don't know how it will happen this year. Usually my job does free vaccines on site for a couple weeks. Well, a lot of us are still work from home (and some of us, like myself, will remain so). I'm not too keen on driving downtown just to get the vaccine. I do have a doctor's appointment next week so I may ask if they can just do it when I am there. If not, then I guess as soon as I see them available at the pharmacy?4
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Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!4
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SummerSkier wrote: »Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!
Back in 2009/2010 when swine flu was a thing, a friend got the flu first, then right after getting better from that, got the swine flu vaccine. She got really bad side effects from it and it ended up feeling like having a bad flu for a couple of weeks. Then, since it took a few weeks for the vaccine immunity to fully form, she also got the actual swine flu before getting immunity, so she got three different flus or flu-like sicknesses in a row that all lasted a couple of weeks. She was a high school senior when this happened, too.1 -
SummerSkier wrote: »Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!
Must be individual reaction. I had the first shingles shot, no big deal at all.
Did it burn a bit at first, maybe but nothing that I would be thinking about more than 30 minutes later.2 -
Heard the new projections this morning that now most models are saying over 400K dead by the first of the year. Honestly, that sounds about right. That's why I said it wouldn't surprise me if we reached Herd Immunity before we had a vaccine proven to work. I can't see 1M dying, but I can certainly see the Fall/Winter being God awful and then tapering away into Spring as life slowly gets back to normal.
Hearing about reinstated lockdowns in college areas all over the US.
@Athijade -- I think you can make appointments at most Walgreens to get the flu vaccine.3 -
We got ours at the grocery pharmacy where I get medicine. They even have "drive up" shots during certain times. Not sure how they do that, tho, we went inside.1
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MikePfirrman wrote: »Heard the new projections this morning that now most models are saying over 400K dead by the first of the year. Honestly, that sounds about right. That's why I said it wouldn't surprise me if we reached Herd Immunity before we had a vaccine proven to work. I can't see 1M dying, but I can certainly see the Fall/Winter being God awful and then tapering away into Spring as life slowly gets back to normal.
Hearing about reinstated lockdowns in college areas all over the US.
@Athijade -- I think you can make appointments at most Walgreens to get the flu vaccine.
Our college town has put in some emergency home rule orders regarding limiting gatherings etc but the school has over 20% positive rate and in the top 10 for number of cases so horse has already left the barn.4 -
Walmart offers flu shots. When we picked up a prescription yesterday, they asked if we wanted a shot. I've only ever had one flu shot, the year I got my Shingles vaccines. Since my husband is at high risk, I plan on getting another this year, even though we are isolated.
I would think that if people are following safe Covid practices - hand-washing, masks, distance, isolation of the vulnerable, the flu season could be pretty mild.5 -
Russian vaccine update: https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/04/health/russia-vaccine-immune-response-intl/index.html
Sounds like side effects are problematic, not sure I would get this vaccine since it sounds like it is basically the same as getting the virus.3 -
Walked with friends again this morning, one lady invited another lady and when it turned to COVID it was 3 vs. 1 in terms of viewpoints (myself being the one). All 3 very anti mask, the new lady referred to mask wearers and others being cautious still as “COVID crazies”
*sigh*
I stay quiet because they are “passionate” about their views, and the other 90% of the time it’s a nice time together with friends, but those snippets aren’t fun...20 -
moonangel12 wrote: »Walked with friends again this morning, one lady invited another lady and when it turned to COVID it was 3 vs. 1 in terms of viewpoints (myself being the one). All 3 very anti mask, the new lady referred to mask wearers and others being cautious still as “COVID crazies”
*sigh*
I stay quiet because they are “passionate” about their views, and the other 90% of the time it’s a nice time together with friends, but those snippets aren’t fun...
You are too good, I wouldn't put up with that non-sense BS, and I would be more passionate and forceful with my scientific views than them. That is the problem when we are quite, we let the other side of the equation get the upper hand in order to keep the peace, making them believe that their ideas are superior, and getting away with that. Not in my book!!
Did they walk without a mask? I hope that they were were a mile away from you if they did.7 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »Diatonic12 wrote: »Our local radio station just announced that everyone should get their flu shot early, now or by the end of September or early October to prevent a twindemic. @spiriteagle99 That's bravery on their part. Hope it all works out for them and us.
I don't usually get the flu shot but plan on doing it this year. The only concern I've got with them doing the flu shot early is that normally means they won't be as accurate on which strain is hitting us that year. But they do say it's better to get one even if it's the wrong strain and, I believe, that's likely even more important this year.
I usually wait to get mine, too, but not because the shot is updated during the season (never heard of that - do pharma companies do that?) but because the protection lasts longer in younger people. I'm 55, so I wait until I need more protection (usually right before the holidays). Flu season is usually worse after the holidays than before the holidays in my area, so getting the shot early risks losing efficacy while the flu season is peaking.
I usually wait until October because my understanding is that protection wears off over time. I don't want to get it too early and be stuck with waning protection at peak flu season months later. I had the flu once many years ago. It wasn't just a simple cold. It wasn't no big deal. And I was a healthy, fit and young 20-something at the time. I had a 104 fever and was near delirious. I felt like crap (like not getting out of bed) for over a week. I haven't had the flu once since getting vaccinated. I usually feel kinda hot and like I'm coming down with something for the first evening after getting it (normal immune response to the vaccine) but never like I'm really sick, it's pretty mild. I'm definitely getting it again this year.5 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »I would think that if people are following safe Covid practices - hand-washing, masks, distance, isolation of the vulnerable, the flu season could be pretty mild.
This is what I’ve been hoping for too. I’m not too worried about the flu itself from either personal or company (HR) perspective other than knowing it sucks and I hope nobody gets it. The extra thing this year is that since all flu symptoms have to be considered potential covid cases, the strain of testing, quarantining and stressing about it all will be immense on all levels: individual, household, healthcare system. The company (my employer) would be affected too, since covid testing costs money, sick leaves cost money (both salaries and lost revenue), and stressed somewhat sick quarantined remote workers are probably not as happy and productive as healthy remote workers.
The company pays for both flu shots and covid testing, and I’m pretty sure the flu shots are cheaper. The fabric masks I bought for all employees might be the best investment of company money I’ve made all year.
ETA: getting the flu shot is voluntary, even though the company pays for it. It’s a perk. Same with the masks.2 -
moonangel12 wrote: »Walked with friends again this morning, one lady invited another lady and when it turned to COVID it was 3 vs. 1 in terms of viewpoints (myself being the one). All 3 very anti mask, the new lady referred to mask wearers and others being cautious still as “COVID crazies”
*sigh*
I stay quiet because they are “passionate” about their views, and the other 90% of the time it’s a nice time together with friends, but those snippets aren’t fun...
Sounds toxic to me. I wouldn't be friends with people like that. They are essentially mocking you to your face. You are a "COVID crazy" to them. Not sure 90% "nice time" is worth the 10% abuse.16 -
SummerSkier wrote: »Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!
I typically have bad reactions to vaccinations so I avoid them but I begged for the shingles vaccine back when it was a single shot (and now I hear it wasn't as effective) because my mum and a coworker both had nightmare shingles. I ended up with a lump roughly the size and texture of a hockey puck in my arm at the injection site that lasted a week, and several days of random sudden-onset vomiting. Not sure I'd want to do a series.
To add insult to injury, my drug plan covers the vaccination itself but not the cost of administering it, so I have to pay $20 to get it injected.1 -
T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Russian vaccine update: https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/04/health/russia-vaccine-immune-response-intl/index.html
Sounds like side effects are problematic, not sure I would get this vaccine since it sounds like it is basically the same as getting the virus.
Well, except for the whole being on a ventilator, dying, permanently altered sense of smell and taste, myocarditis in more than a third of previously healthy athletes who had mild cases, yes it’s just like the virus! Seriously, a little fever and some body aches are a good trade off for people like you and me who have a substantial risk of dying.
The thing I’m concerned about is that in the case of reinfection with a different strain, certain viruses like dengue fever cause a worse infection in vaccinated people than if you hadn’t been vaccinated at all. Also, Covid seems to cause long term brain injury due to inflammation, sometimes even in very mild cases - will the vaccine end up causing the same long term problems? There are unfortunately good reasons it takes years to bring a vaccine to market normally.13 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »This is the latest in flu vaccines. And I was also told by my doctor to wait until the end of September or early October to get it so the immunity last longer. The flu season usually picks up after the first of the year (2021 in this case)
1) High-dose flu vaccine: four more the antigen specificity that the standard flu vaccine: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/qa_fluzone.htm
2) Flu vaccine with adjuvant or FLUAD: https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/adjuvant.htm. This last one is highly recommend for adults over 65 .
This from Dr. Sanjay Gupta
Why it's more important than ever to get a flu shot
The first shipments of this year’s flu vaccine are going out -- and it's more important than ever that you get a flu shot this flu season. Public health experts are concerned that this year’s flu season will coincide with an increase in Covid-19 infections -- and that could mean added stress to our hospital systems.
Getting a flu shot can help you either avoid the flu, or at least lessen the severity of your flu symptoms. Also, because symptoms of the flu such as fever, cough or fatigue can be mistaken for Covid-19, getting a flu shot can potentially help rule out influenza if you do start getting sick.
[snipped for length]
This really doesn't make sense. Since the flu vaccine isn't 100% effective, ruling out influenza in patients with flu symptoms just because they have been vaccinated doesn't seem like a good idea, anymore than the ruling out of covid in patients without a known covid contact back in the early spring was a good idea.
FYI any patient that goes to the hospital with COVID-19 symptoms also get tested for the flu, at least in most hospital if they follow protocol.
[snip the parts I'm not responding to]
As I said, it was not a good idea that early in the spring patients with covid symptoms who had not traveled and who had no known covid contacts were not tested for covid -- including some who had negative tests for influenza and other common respiratory diseases. Referring to the current protocol (protocols have changed multiple times) has no relevance to my statement.2 -
rheddmobile wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Russian vaccine update: https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/04/health/russia-vaccine-immune-response-intl/index.html
Sounds like side effects are problematic, not sure I would get this vaccine since it sounds like it is basically the same as getting the virus.
Well, except for the whole being on a ventilator, dying, permanently altered sense of smell and taste, myocarditis in more than a third of previously healthy athletes who had mild cases, yes it’s just like the virus! Seriously, a little fever and some body aches are a good trade off for people like you and me who have a substantial risk of dying.
The thing I’m concerned about is that in the case of reinfection with a different strain, certain viruses like dengue fever cause a worse infection in vaccinated people than if you hadn’t been vaccinated at all. Also, Covid seems to cause long term brain injury due to inflammation, sometimes even in very mild cases - will the vaccine end up causing the same long term problems? There are unfortunately good reasons it takes years to bring a vaccine to market normally.
This is based on a sample group if 76. It would be pretty easy to find a group of 76 healthy people who got Covid and experienced the same symptoms. A larger sample group may just as easily had some healthy people die.
ETA: Unhealthy people like me may experience the same risk of severe illness as the virus.0 -
I want to get my flu vaccine... I just don't know how it will happen this year. Usually my job does free vaccines on site for a couple weeks. Well, a lot of us are still work from home (and some of us, like myself, will remain so). I'm not too keen on driving downtown just to get the vaccine. I do have a doctor's appointment next week so I may ask if they can just do it when I am there. If not, then I guess as soon as I see them available at the pharmacy?
Here they’re available anyplace there’s a pharmacy. We got ours at Walgreens. No appointment was necessary, but I did call to check first. Check with your employer, but most health insurance covers it 100%.5 -
SummerSkier wrote: »Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!
I typically have bad reactions to vaccinations so I avoid them but I begged for the shingles vaccine back when it was a single shot (and now I hear it wasn't as effective) because my mum and a coworker both had nightmare shingles. I ended up with a lump roughly the size and texture of a hockey puck in my arm at the injection site that lasted a week, and several days of random sudden-onset vomiting. Not sure I'd want to do a series.
To add insult to injury, my drug plan covers the vaccination itself but not the cost of administering it, so I have to pay $20 to get it injected.
Not much of an insult. We are on a high deductible plan, the shingles shot was $190.2 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »SummerSkier wrote: »Oh my! Can you imagine having the FLU and COVID19 at the same time? YIKES... I had the flu in 2018 Jan and it knocked me for a loop. Have gotten 2 flu shots at work each year since with not even a pinch. Now do NOT ask me about the series of Shingles shots. If you have not gotten them yet you are in for a lovely lovely time. Hint: they BURN just going in..... But again. Better than shingles for sure for sure for sure!!!!
I typically have bad reactions to vaccinations so I avoid them but I begged for the shingles vaccine back when it was a single shot (and now I hear it wasn't as effective) because my mum and a coworker both had nightmare shingles. I ended up with a lump roughly the size and texture of a hockey puck in my arm at the injection site that lasted a week, and several days of random sudden-onset vomiting. Not sure I'd want to do a series.
To add insult to injury, my drug plan covers the vaccination itself but not the cost of administering it, so I have to pay $20 to get it injected.
Not much of an insult. We are on a high deductible plan, the shingles shot was $190.
Whoa! You win.3
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