Coronavirus prep
Replies
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MikePfirrman wrote: »There are now over 100 cases of Covid-19 in at least four states directly now linked to the Sturgis Motorcycle Rally.
People that refuse to help the rest of us are just garbage in my eyes. Most of them are the same people that will now go into a store that requires masks and you see it below their nose or they buy coffee to take it off while they are shopping (that irks me so bad that Fry's still has their Starbucks open inside the store and that people will buy coffee to just avoid wearing a mask).
The CDC now says that no Covid-19 testing is needed if someone is asymptomatic. That's a really odd and mysterious call. To me, this seems like a coverup of number of cases. Next, maybe they'll say that if we don't have women do mammograms, breast cancer has been cured.
Related to the friend conversation (that don't wear masks), we have some good friends that we haven't seen in months. They wear masks in public but have been going out to restaurants and sitting inside (most have been in AZ that do go out). We've chosen never to do that and only sit outside to minimize risk. We also have other friends in their 70s and don't want to take any chances. We do plan to go out with that couple that eats inside once the heat breaks and we can sit outside with them. The man will not eat outside when it's 100 or so and I can't blame him at all. It's hard to judge in that circumstance. We just miss our friends.
How do you know that they are buying coffee only to avoid wearing a mask exactly? We normally order our groceries these days (as a cost and time saving measure, not Covid related, we just spend way less when we can see our total as we go) but my Kroger has a Starbucks and I almost always do/would get a coffee to drink as we shopped normally. And judging by the line that's always been the case. It really seems like these days people are always ready to believe the worst about other people and it makes me sad.
Back in the before times, I almost always bought a coffee to sip while grocery shopping, either in-store if they had a coffee bar or from a nearby coffee shop if they didn't (in fact, back before there was a Starbucks on every corner, most of the grocery stores I went to had coffee vending machines, and I often bought a coffee from one of those). These days I don't do that, because it would mean pulling my mask down over and over. I really like my coffee, but this seems like a small sacrifice to try to control disease transmission and enable the reopening of the economy.19 -
missysippy930 wrote: »The event in Sturgis ended only 10 days ago. Not nearly enough time for all the people who got it there to show up positive. Lack of consideration for others, and selfishly, potentially, exposing others to something that could seriously affect anyone’s health, is appalling. Especially when it could have been avoided. The attitude that “it’s not so many” is resounding at colleges, universities, weddings, rallies and other get togethers throughout this country. If you can’t find a reason to do what’s right, think about the healthcare workers who deserve surcease from this. Compassion for others seems to be lacking over desire for a short time of fun. Much of it preventable through face coverings, social distancing, and basic hygiene. It’s not forever, just until they find a better treatment, or hopefully a vaccine. One preventable case is one too many. Lives matter. ❤️
Very well said, thank you.4 -
The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.7 -
gradchica27 wrote: »The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.
As a former soccer parent (I miss those days!), I can't imagine. The only thing you could do is eat at the food trucks that show up and sit in your car, maybe go to a mall inside masked. Yeah, the restaurant part is the scariest thing to me. Soccer kids and parents, jam packed at tables. I guess I would just bow out of that, despite the violent protests of my kids. I'd pick up carry out and eat in the car or SUV. Very hard for all parents with kids in sports right now. And for the kids too. I feel for you.4 -
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3519329/
Surge Capacity
Thinking about those caught in the storm surge and C19 surge/health care system surge.
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SMH a member of my family drives for miles to a laundromat because they deem it safer; our numbers are very low to begin with(we're lucky!). BUT they're going to a concert located in a place with much higher numbers.
Okaayyyy....
If that person mentioned above were a caregiver to an elderly very compromised relative, would you not allow them to come into contact for the 14 day period after the concert?
On an uplifting note today, I noticed at the grocery store they've got someone stationed by the carts checking people for masks. I've very glad BUT I do hope nobody gives her trouble about it.
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@ReenieHJ Is there anyone else who's willing to pick up the slack and step UP to the plate. I'm it. I'm taking care of 4 seniors.
Everyone else has flown over the chicken coop. They have no problem telling me how the cow ate the cabbage and how I should go about everything while they're out running around all over the country. I'm working my head off. Errands, shopping, cooking, cleaning, irrigating, mowing. The only place I have for myself is MFP. I return to the well and it gives me a second wind. I mill around and shoot the breeze. It's a source of encouragement and a shelter in a storm. With everything else that's going on...fires, hurricanes, 'Rona, I'm thinking this is earthquake weather. Extremes beget more extremes. Extreme temps bring wild storms and earthquakes, too.
All of that leads me to a song. Mama told me not to come.
This ain't the way to have fun
Open UP the window
Let some air into this room
This is the craziest party
That there could ever see be
Don't turn on the lights
'Cause I don't want to see
But we have to. Face the music every single day.
P.S.
One of the seniors said, "I've lived too long". "I'm a burden." Ahhhh, hail nooo, you're not. Don't you say that to me again. You see, it's the little things like that and I'm off and running.
I am a fighter and I will continue to give it all I've got for them and me. I'm bent on survival, we all are. So whoever needs to step UP to the plate for the seniors. Just do it.
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MikePfirrman wrote: »gradchica27 wrote: »The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.
As a former soccer parent (I miss those days!), I can't imagine. The only thing you could do is eat at the food trucks that show up and sit in your car, maybe go to a mall inside masked. Yeah, the restaurant part is the scariest thing to me. Soccer kids and parents, jam packed at tables. I guess I would just bow out of that, despite the violent protests of my kids. I'd pick up carry out and eat in the car or SUV. Very hard for all parents with kids in sports right now. And for the kids too. I feel for you.
I think we’re going to bring our tent and find a public park to eat in and bring some card games or a DVD player so we can relax between games. It’s going to be brutally hot, but oh well. I’ll have four sweaty boys and stinky soccer and cross country stuff in the car, so no way am I going to hang in there for hours! The stink alone might do me in.
I’m just thrilled mine only play outdoor sports—soccer, cross country, and baseball. A friend’s daughter plays volleyball and they have to wear masks while playing. She said it is so uncomfortable and gross bc the masks get sweaty and stuck to their faces and it’s hard to breathe through a wet mask.5 -
T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »moonangel12 wrote: »
I was thinking that as well, but I tend to stay quiet when they are ranting about masks and COVID regulations in general...lynn_glenmont wrote: »moonangel12 wrote: »I have posted a couple of times about the ladies I walk with and how we see this whole thing in a totally different light. At this point, they are in the boat that we should have just let it run it’s course and we could be done with it at this point. I said that no matter what was done, hindsight would likely have us asking “what if” questions.
Given how unclear it is whether and to what extent having covid-19 confers immunity against getting it again, their view that "we could be done with it at this point" has some serious holes.
A challenge for any of us - no matter which side of this particular debate we fall on - is trying to figure out whether and how to stay friends with people around us who are very, very vociferous about their views, and (in our own view) quite wrong-headed. 🙄
I am not longer in contact with some of them. Maybe after this nightmare is over they will comeback to their senses, but in the mean time I just stay quite and so far they have been doing the same. I think that since neither of us want to break the friendship, we all understand that we better stay in our own corners.
The interesting thing is that we always knew about our different ideas, but it never made a difference and it wasn't a concern either. But in the last year, and specially after COVID, things dramatically changed.
I may be different... I don't actually have any friends IRL that live close enough to see in person anyway without at least 5 hrs. drive. Mostly I stay in touch with people on social media, where I block anyone who is pig-headed and ridiculous about opposing views. I still have some friends with very different opinions, but they are reasonable even when we disagree. That hasn't changed with Covid. It is similar with family... I haven't talked to some family for years and may never again.
I wasn't referring to friends that I see regularly in person (I should have been more clear). I had to stop calling or e-mailing friends that do not live near by in order to avoid bad encounters due to their political and COVID uproars.
I am not on Facebook or in any other social media, with the exception of MFP. My life is much better for that.8 -
gradchica27 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »gradchica27 wrote: »The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.
As a former soccer parent (I miss those days!), I can't imagine. The only thing you could do is eat at the food trucks that show up and sit in your car, maybe go to a mall inside masked. Yeah, the restaurant part is the scariest thing to me. Soccer kids and parents, jam packed at tables. I guess I would just bow out of that, despite the violent protests of my kids. I'd pick up carry out and eat in the car or SUV. Very hard for all parents with kids in sports right now. And for the kids too. I feel for you.
I think we’re going to bring our tent and find a public park to eat in and bring some card games or a DVD player so we can relax between games. It’s going to be brutally hot, but oh well. I’ll have four sweaty boys and stinky soccer and cross country stuff in the car, so no way am I going to hang in there for hours! The stink alone might do me in.
I’m just thrilled mine only play outdoor sports—soccer, cross country, and baseball. A friend’s daughter plays volleyball and they have to wear masks while playing. She said it is so uncomfortable and gross bc the masks get sweaty and stuck to their faces and it’s hard to breathe through a wet mask.
I forgot about all that stench. When they take their shin guards off, it does make you throw up in your mouth just a little!
Someone I saw at an outside dance venue (the indoor dance hall moved outside) had a great idea. They took a garden sprayer -- like the kind for weeds and such -- and filled it with ice water. Great little portable cold water mister. If your guys get really hot, they might like that a lot. Plus, you might be able to spray some of that nasty sweat right off of them without them knowing that's your intent.6 -
Is it just me or does it frighten anyone else when our scientific institutions appear to be compromised for political benefit? CDC, FDA etc.. When I was a child I implicitly trusted anyone in authority. As I became an adult I realized that a uniform or Dr degree did not guarantee that that person was any more knowledgeable or trustworthy than anyone else and that in each instance there are both good and bad individuals so you cannot just assume that the office or authority will do the right thing. The older I get the more I see things as individuals vs the "clothes" they wear. And some of these changes and behaviors are just bizarre.18
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SummerSkier wrote: »Is it just me or does it frighten anyone else when our scientific institutions appear to be compromised for political benefit? CDC, FDA etc.. When I was a child I implicitly trusted anyone in authority. As I became an adult I realized that a uniform or Dr degree did not guarantee that that person was any more knowledgeable or trustworthy than anyone else and that in each instance there are both good and bad individuals so you cannot just assume that the office or authority will do the right thing. The older I get the more I see things as individuals vs the "clothes" they wear. And some of these changes and behaviors are just bizarre.
Yes, this is true. After moving more than a year ago, I finally ended up switching to a new endocrinologist (the only one in town where I live now). He is an idiot and obviously doesn't care about the long-term health of his patients. He wants me to run high all the time, at a level that greatly increases my risk for complications. So I do what is best for me and only rely on him for prescriptions. It's this type of thing, though, that is bothersome. Just because someone has a credential or title doesn't mean you can always trust them.9 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »gradchica27 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »gradchica27 wrote: »The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.
As a former soccer parent (I miss those days!), I can't imagine. The only thing you could do is eat at the food trucks that show up and sit in your car, maybe go to a mall inside masked. Yeah, the restaurant part is the scariest thing to me. Soccer kids and parents, jam packed at tables. I guess I would just bow out of that, despite the violent protests of my kids. I'd pick up carry out and eat in the car or SUV. Very hard for all parents with kids in sports right now. And for the kids too. I feel for you.
I think we’re going to bring our tent and find a public park to eat in and bring some card games or a DVD player so we can relax between games. It’s going to be brutally hot, but oh well. I’ll have four sweaty boys and stinky soccer and cross country stuff in the car, so no way am I going to hang in there for hours! The stink alone might do me in.
I’m just thrilled mine only play outdoor sports—soccer, cross country, and baseball. A friend’s daughter plays volleyball and they have to wear masks while playing. She said it is so uncomfortable and gross bc the masks get sweaty and stuck to their faces and it’s hard to breathe through a wet mask.
I forgot about all that stench. When they take their shin guards off, it does make you throw up in your mouth just a little!
Someone I saw at an outside dance venue (the indoor dance hall moved outside) had a great idea. They took a garden sprayer -- like the kind for weeds and such -- and filled it with ice water. Great little portable cold water mister. If your guys get really hot, they might like that a lot. Plus, you might be able to spray some of that nasty sweat right off of them without them knowing that's your intent.
Not 'rona related but smell related. I helped coach a kids YMCA outdoor inline hockey team. Games were on Saturday and each team had a day to practice. The YMCA bought 4-6 sets goalie pads/gloves due to the cost. There would be games Saturday from 8AM to 7PM during the summer. After games the kids would swap out the goalie equipment. At the end of the day it was all locked up in a shed at the rink.
The smell opening the shed on Monday after that stuff fermented almost 2 days in a closed up shed under a 90+ degree sun would knock a buzzard off a *kitten* wagon.6 -
moonangel12 wrote: »
My parents see that in Idaho as well - people from big city CA coming in droves for the small town life. They are buying up everything available, for cash. Makes it hard for anyone else to get a foot in the door.Diatonic12 wrote: »My community's been conducting wastewater testing since the 1st of May. We're on the cutting edge due to millions of tourists that pass through, increasing by a million every single year. Problem now, none of them are leaving. They're buying every parcel and acre they can get their hands on. Enormous homes going up everywhere you look. Big money folks are buying it all and moving from the coastal regions in droves.
Everyone wants what we have but they'll turn into what they've came from. It's hard for the locals to think about.
I can empathize. I'm from what was once a small rural community in California. It was beautiful. When I was a kid, gazillions of people from back East and the midwest started pouring in and whole regions were developed and built out. Trashed out and over-run, IMO. Now, a lot of those transplants and the kids of those transplants are moving on to "fresher" pastures. It's not "Californians" specifically wrecking the place. It's Americans in general - just people from all over the place moving in hoards to develop new places. California just happened to be the stop before yours...6 -
gradchica27 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »gradchica27 wrote: »The lack of a consistent, coordinated plan even within a city/county is frustrating. Each organization is trying to CYA, but in doing so may just push the problem on to others.
Case in point: local(ish) soccer tournament in a smaller city somewhat near me. Outside, spectators required to social distance, coaches/managers/players get temp checks and symptom check forms, no tents allowed, everyone to wear masks coming in and out of field, parents only allowed on field 5 min bf game time, players need to mask while sitting out (I’d say on the bench, but they took out all the benches, so instead of an easily cleanable metal one they make teams bring their own foldable fabric ones that aren’t easily sanitized). So, mostly making sense, trying to be as responsible as reasonably possible while putting on an event like this. Each group is pretty much keeping to itself, minus the players actually on the field.
What is not making sense is that we cannot stay at the (enormous) field complex bt games, even socially distanced and w our own household to rest/eat lunch. So instead of us staying to ourselves outside, all of those people will go where? To restaurants or to walk around shops to kill four or five hours indoors bc it’s hot as blazes and we aren’t allowed to park ourselves under a tent in the complex. So the tournament will likely report no infections, but the local McDonalds or Chili’s will have a sudden outbreak.
As a former soccer parent (I miss those days!), I can't imagine. The only thing you could do is eat at the food trucks that show up and sit in your car, maybe go to a mall inside masked. Yeah, the restaurant part is the scariest thing to me. Soccer kids and parents, jam packed at tables. I guess I would just bow out of that, despite the violent protests of my kids. I'd pick up carry out and eat in the car or SUV. Very hard for all parents with kids in sports right now. And for the kids too. I feel for you.
I think we’re going to bring our tent and find a public park to eat in and bring some card games or a DVD player so we can relax between games. It’s going to be brutally hot, but oh well. I’ll have four sweaty boys and stinky soccer and cross country stuff in the car, so no way am I going to hang in there for hours! The stink alone might do me in.
I’m just thrilled mine only play outdoor sports—soccer, cross country, and baseball. A friend’s daughter plays volleyball and they have to wear masks while playing. She said it is so uncomfortable and gross bc the masks get sweaty and stuck to their faces and it’s hard to breathe through a wet mask.
Somewhere (that seemed like a good source at the time, but absolutely can't remember where) I read that wet masks are not as effective. Like, really, really not as effective.3 -
moonangel12 wrote: »
My parents see that in Idaho as well - people from big city CA coming in droves for the small town life. They are buying up everything available, for cash. Makes it hard for anyone else to get a foot in the door.Diatonic12 wrote: »My community's been conducting wastewater testing since the 1st of May. We're on the cutting edge due to millions of tourists that pass through, increasing by a million every single year. Problem now, none of them are leaving. They're buying every parcel and acre they can get their hands on. Enormous homes going up everywhere you look. Big money folks are buying it all and moving from the coastal regions in droves.
Everyone wants what we have but they'll turn into what they've came from. It's hard for the locals to think about.
I can empathize. I'm from what was once a small rural community in California. It was beautiful. When I was a kid, gazillions of people from back East and the midwest started pouring in and whole regions were developed and built out. Trashed out and over-run, IMO. Now, a lot of those transplants and the kids of those transplants are moving on to "fresher" pastures. It's not "Californians" specifically wrecking the place. It's Americans in general - just people from all over the place moving in hoards to develop new places. California just happened to be the stop before yours...
Sounds like the East to West migration in reverse.0 -
I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.12
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missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
The rights of others seem to be overlooked more and more in this pandemic.4 -
missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
I believe there are a lot of things that are being determined that are potentially dangerous. The CDC also changed their guidelines on masks in public places the other day. Basically, they said if someone is angry, don't tell them to put on a mask. It was out of concern for the safety of workers (many times kids), because so many teenagers have been assaulted by people being told to put on a mask.
But what kind of message does this send to the wrong type of person? So if you come into a business angry, you don't need a mask? That's insane. I'm more for giving the people that have to ask customers to put on masks pepper spray when the customers get angry and violent.13 -
Saw this while working this morning. Looks interesting. They are looking at it coupled with Remdesivir as an antiviral therapeutic.
https://www.folio.ca/antiviral-used-to-treat-cat-coronavirus-also-works-against-sars-cov-2-u-of-a-researchers/1 -
missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
Unless there's been a recent dramatic reinterpretation, or there's something unusual about these businesses, they would not be "covered entities" under HIPAA. "Covered entities" are health care providers, related health care clearinghouses, and health plans. The privacy rules portion of HIPAA applies only to "covered entities".
I say this based on having been a participant in my employer's HIPAA implementation, so received a good deal of education about its provisions, but there is a summary here:
https://privacyruleandresearch.nih.gov/pr_06.asp
I can visualize *very unusual* situations where an employer might possibly have some HIPAA privacy rules obligations sort of as an employer, but IMU a normal employment situation isn't one of them. IMU, just being an employee of something like a health care provider wouldn't be enough, either, with respect to this "tell the co-workers or don't" stuff.
I'm not a deep legal expert on this stuff. If someone here is, they should speak up. However, it's a thing that I coincidentally needed to understand much more fully than Joe Average does.
For sure, in the current crisis, HIPAA is being used as an explanation for things that are howlingly ridiculous BS (like why a store can't ask if someone has a medical condition that prevents mask use).
I'm sure that it's 100% not true that because HIPAA is about "health care privacy", it must mean that anything about my health that I might want to be private (or that someone else wants to stay secret) must be protected by anyone or everyone, can't be asked about, etc.5 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »Saw this while working this morning. Looks interesting. They are looking at it coupled with Remdesivir as an antiviral therapeutic.
https://www.folio.ca/antiviral-used-to-treat-cat-coronavirus-also-works-against-sars-cov-2-u-of-a-researchers/
Remdisivir seems to have limited treatment profile, not very good for early infections. Desamethasone seems to be doing better.
COVID-19 Treatments: Remdesivir Disappoints, Antiviral SPL7013 And Monoclonal Antibodies Interesting For Prevention/Early-Stage Treatment
https://seekingalpha.com/article/43711552 -
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-08-27/covid-pandemic-u-s-businesses-issue-gag-rules-to-stop-workers-from-talking?utm_source=url_link
Here is the link to the story. Towards the end of the article it refers to HIPAA. Companies are trying to prevent employees from talking about Covid cases of infected employees because of what the employer claims are privacy/confidential issues. Legal or not, employers have been getting away with this. Many thousands of complaints have been filed with OSHA, and State Agencies. Understaffed agencies to investigate allegations.
0 -
SMH a member of my family drives for miles to a laundromat because they deem it safer; our numbers are very low to begin with(we're lucky!). BUT they're going to a concert located in a place with much higher numbers.
Okaayyyy....
If that person mentioned above were a caregiver to an elderly very compromised relative, would you not allow them to come into contact for the 14 day period after the concert?
On an uplifting note today, I noticed at the grocery store they've got someone stationed by the carts checking people for masks. I've very glad BUT I do hope nobody gives her trouble about it.
My mom is 82 and in good health, but she is not allowing anyone but me and my sister in the house.
Normally, she has a lot of guests in the summer but this year some of them are staying in a rental down the road, and she is only visiting with them outside, at least 6 feet away, and one couple also worn masks when they visited.
So no, I would not let the concert attendee near the elderly person for two weeks, and I would want a negative test result as well.8 -
missysippy930 wrote: »https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-08-27/covid-pandemic-u-s-businesses-issue-gag-rules-to-stop-workers-from-talking?utm_source=url_link
Here is the link to the story. Towards the end of the article it refers to HIPAA. Companies are trying to prevent employees from talking about Covid cases of infected employees because of what the employer claims are privacy/confidential issues. Legal or not, employers have been getting away with this. Many thousands of complaints have been filed with OSHA, and State Agencies. Understaffed agencies to investigate allegations.
I think employers are being deliberately obtuse about what HIPAA regulates, assuming employees don't know and won't look it up.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-08-27/covid-pandemic-u-s-businesses-issue-gag-rules-to-stop-workers-from-talking
In many cases, workers say their bosses have cited employee privacy to justify the gags, including federal privacy laws such as the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act of 1996. But such laws don’t require companies to silence employees on safety matters.
On the contrary, federal laws, including those that created OSHA and the NLRB, guarantee employees the right to communicate about and protest their job conditions.
The federal bodies have failed to make companies obey the law. Many thousands of OSHA complaints about coronavirus safety issues have yielded citations against just two companies—a health-care company and a nursing home—totaling about $47,000.3 -
missysippy930 wrote: »https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-08-27/covid-pandemic-u-s-businesses-issue-gag-rules-to-stop-workers-from-talking?utm_source=url_link
Here is the link to the story. Towards the end of the article it refers to HIPAA. Companies are trying to prevent employees from talking about Covid cases of infected employees because of what the employer claims are privacy/confidential issues. Legal or not, employers have been getting away with this. Many thousands of complaints have been filed with OSHA, and State Agencies. Understaffed agencies to investigate allegations.
The HIPAA mention in the article is fairly lukewarm. Reading it, I think this is more of a "work rules" issue.
IMU, employers can impose a surprising variety of rules on employees, including rules about what they may do in their private lives, and treat those as firing offences. I suspect it's possible that employers' "rights" in that regard may have weakened since I was involved with that sort of thing in my employment, but I don't know to what extent. Of course, what's legal, and what employers get away with, or try to get away with, are different things.
Perhaps one of our attorneys or HR professionals here will offer their more informed opinion about the permissible scope of employment rules that can be imposed on employees, and be firing offenses, these days - preferably someone in the US, since that's the context we're discussing.
0 -
missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
Unless there's been a recent dramatic reinterpretation, or there's something unusual about these businesses, they would not be "covered entities" under HIPAA. "Covered entities" are health care providers, related health care clearinghouses, and health plans. The privacy rules portion of HIPAA applies only to "covered entities".
I say this based on having been a participant in my employer's HIPAA implementation, so received a good deal of education about its provisions, but there is a summary here:
https://privacyruleandresearch.nih.gov/pr_06.asp
I can visualize *very unusual* situations where an employer might possibly have some HIPAA privacy rules obligations sort of as an employer, but IMU a normal employment situation isn't one of them. IMU, just being an employee of something like a health care provider wouldn't be enough, either, with respect to this "tell the co-workers or don't" stuff.
I'm not a deep legal expert on this stuff. If someone here is, they should speak up. However, it's a thing that I coincidentally needed to understand much more fully than Joe Average does.
For sure, in the current crisis, HIPAA is being used as an explanation for things that are howlingly ridiculous BS (like why a store can't ask if someone has a medical condition that prevents mask use).
I'm sure that it's 100% not true that because HIPAA is about "health care privacy", it must mean that anything about my health that I might want to be private (or that someone else wants to stay secret) must be protected by anyone or everyone, can't be asked about, etc.
I think if your employer "self-insures" to cover medical care for employees that they would be a covered entity (i.e., they don't provide medical insurance through an insurance company but instead pay claims for employees' medical services directly out of the company's pocket, and thus would be seeing the claims and listed services). I've never actually known of a company that did that, but it's a theoretical possibility.
Even before this crisis, I heard anecdotes of companies' using HIPAA as a reason not to be transparent about health risks to employees or customers. You already used the language I would have chosen (ridiculous BS), but you get extra points for "howlingly".
3 -
missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
Unless there's been a recent dramatic reinterpretation, or there's something unusual about these businesses, they would not be "covered entities" under HIPAA. "Covered entities" are health care providers, related health care clearinghouses, and health plans. The privacy rules portion of HIPAA applies only to "covered entities".
I say this based on having been a participant in my employer's HIPAA implementation, so received a good deal of education about its provisions, but there is a summary here:
https://privacyruleandresearch.nih.gov/pr_06.asp
I can visualize *very unusual* situations where an employer might possibly have some HIPAA privacy rules obligations sort of as an employer, but IMU a normal employment situation isn't one of them. IMU, just being an employee of something like a health care provider wouldn't be enough, either, with respect to this "tell the co-workers or don't" stuff.
I'm not a deep legal expert on this stuff. If someone here is, they should speak up. However, it's a thing that I coincidentally needed to understand much more fully than Joe Average does.
For sure, in the current crisis, HIPAA is being used as an explanation for things that are howlingly ridiculous BS (like why a store can't ask if someone has a medical condition that prevents mask use).
I'm sure that it's 100% not true that because HIPAA is about "health care privacy", it must mean that anything about my health that I might want to be private (or that someone else wants to stay secret) must be protected by anyone or everyone, can't be asked about, etc.
On the related subject of people claiming that HIPAA and the ADA give them the right to not wear a mask if they claim a disability, with such individuals often claiming it is illegal to even ask what the disability is.
The ADA has issued a statement which says that a business can indeed ask what the disability is for the purpose of making reasonable accommodations (for example, someone with a breathing issue would need different accommodations from someone who gets panic attacks when their face is covered or someone who needs to see lips to sight-read) and that in any case “reasonable accommodations” doesn’t mean you get to not wear a mask. An example of reasonable accommodations might include curb-side pickup, or having someone shop for you, or wearing a face shield instead of a mask. It never means the disabled person just gets to ignore the rule and endanger others.8 -
rheddmobile wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
Unless there's been a recent dramatic reinterpretation, or there's something unusual about these businesses, they would not be "covered entities" under HIPAA. "Covered entities" are health care providers, related health care clearinghouses, and health plans. The privacy rules portion of HIPAA applies only to "covered entities".
I say this based on having been a participant in my employer's HIPAA implementation, so received a good deal of education about its provisions, but there is a summary here:
https://privacyruleandresearch.nih.gov/pr_06.asp
I can visualize *very unusual* situations where an employer might possibly have some HIPAA privacy rules obligations sort of as an employer, but IMU a normal employment situation isn't one of them. IMU, just being an employee of something like a health care provider wouldn't be enough, either, with respect to this "tell the co-workers or don't" stuff.
I'm not a deep legal expert on this stuff. If someone here is, they should speak up. However, it's a thing that I coincidentally needed to understand much more fully than Joe Average does.
For sure, in the current crisis, HIPAA is being used as an explanation for things that are howlingly ridiculous BS (like why a store can't ask if someone has a medical condition that prevents mask use).
I'm sure that it's 100% not true that because HIPAA is about "health care privacy", it must mean that anything about my health that I might want to be private (or that someone else wants to stay secret) must be protected by anyone or everyone, can't be asked about, etc.
On the related subject of people claiming that HIPAA and the ADA give them the right to not wear a mask if they claim a disability, with such individuals often claiming it is illegal to even ask what the disability is.
The ADA has issued a statement which says that a business can indeed ask what the disability is for the purpose of making reasonable accommodations (for example, someone with a breathing issue would need different accommodations from someone who gets panic attacks when their face is covered or someone who needs to see lips to sight-read) and that in any case “reasonable accommodations” doesn’t mean you get to not wear a mask. An example of reasonable accommodations might include curb-side pickup, or having someone shop for you, or wearing a face shield instead of a mask. It never means the disabled person just gets to ignore the rule and endanger others.
Yes, there is an employee at my Walmart with a disability who wears a shield instead of a mask.2 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »I just read an article from Bloomberg Business week about some businesses instructing employees not to discuss cases of other employees who have Covid-19. This practice is being justified by employers because of hipaa regulations. I would think that employers would want other employees to be aware of coworkers that have the disease, so they can do everything humanly possible to prevent contracting Covid, and the spread in, and outside, the workplace. Instead, some employers are threatening “disciplinary actions”. The article sites the right for others to know about cases of infected coworkers as safety violations in the workplace and not covered by hipaa regulations. Some employers are telling employees with COVID-19, not to inform coworkers. This has been the trend across the country among employers. There have been thousands of complaints to OSHA regarding this. This concerns me and is a dangerous, for people in the workplace, as well as the general public.
Unless there's been a recent dramatic reinterpretation, or there's something unusual about these businesses, they would not be "covered entities" under HIPAA. "Covered entities" are health care providers, related health care clearinghouses, and health plans. The privacy rules portion of HIPAA applies only to "covered entities".
I say this based on having been a participant in my employer's HIPAA implementation, so received a good deal of education about its provisions, but there is a summary here:
https://privacyruleandresearch.nih.gov/pr_06.asp
I can visualize *very unusual* situations where an employer might possibly have some HIPAA privacy rules obligations sort of as an employer, but IMU a normal employment situation isn't one of them. IMU, just being an employee of something like a health care provider wouldn't be enough, either, with respect to this "tell the co-workers or don't" stuff.
I'm not a deep legal expert on this stuff. If someone here is, they should speak up. However, it's a thing that I coincidentally needed to understand much more fully than Joe Average does.
For sure, in the current crisis, HIPAA is being used as an explanation for things that are howlingly ridiculous BS (like why a store can't ask if someone has a medical condition that prevents mask use).
I'm sure that it's 100% not true that because HIPAA is about "health care privacy", it must mean that anything about my health that I might want to be private (or that someone else wants to stay secret) must be protected by anyone or everyone, can't be asked about, etc.
I think if your employer "self-insures" to cover medical care for employees that they would be a covered entity (i.e., they don't provide medical insurance through an insurance company but instead pay claims for employees' medical services directly out of the company's pocket, and thus would be seeing the claims and listed services). I've never actually known of a company that did that, but it's a theoretical possibility.
Even before this crisis, I heard anecdotes of companies' using HIPAA as a reason not to be transparent about health risks to employees or customers. You already used the language I would have chosen (ridiculous BS), but you get extra points for "howlingly".
FWIW, my "company" (a university) self insured. But - and I think this is common, maybe not universal - they used a health insurance company as an intermediary. The university paid the claims costs (and presumably some administrative fees, though I never read the contract), but the intermediary dealt with all the billing, medical billing codes, co-pays, provider network to the extent applicable, and all that specialized stuff. The U considered it financially advantageous to assume the risks (of fluctuating health costs, vs. paying a standard amount per employee for regular insurance, which transfers the risk to the insurance company), but the U didn't want to add the administrative complexity of handling all the billing details.
In that "self insured" scenario, the university was *not* a covered entity, even for most/all of what was involved on our side of the administrative processes. Obviously, this is very situation specific, so I can't speak for other scenarios' details. I did become aware of some other institutions who were also using 3rd party administrators/intermediaries in a similar way, but had no reason to look into wildly different cases.
The extent to which the U was a covered entity turned out to be much narrower than we had originally expected. Mostly, it was the clinical centers associated with the med schools, their pharmacies and similar health care support functions, and the student health center (basically a clinic).1
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