Coronavirus prep
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Hey all, Jumping in and we'll see what I can add to the conversation.
Flu shot - got mine last friday. At the exit door of my Stop and Shop, there was a station all set up with a nurse and no one in line. I was done in under 5 minutes. I had been planning to make an appointment at walgreens, but I grabbed the opportunity. Hubby has a walgreens apt tomorrow.
COVID - I am so sick of this virus. I hate what it is doing to everyone - from people being medically damaged, financially damaged, psychologically damaged. I am a new-ish grandma and I hate that I have rarely touched my grandson since his birth last January. Likewise, my parents have become virtual hermits. They seem relatively happy despite this, but eating and watching TV have been their main activities these months and I worry that that is shortening their life expectancy another way. At the same time that I hear the devastating stories of some who are effected, the 3 (likely 4) positive friends have had literally nothing as their symptoms (one had headache eventual loss of smell, second had headache and was a "bit tired", third had "some phlegm", the likely 4th had the same headache as his wife a few days earlier). I think some of the societal difficulties with this disease is the disparity in its impact. If every single infected individual became equally sick, maybe rules and compliance would be less of an issue.
Holidays, travel and family responsibilities - Again, I hate Covid. I am sitting here in limbo trying to figure out how to do everything right. Right meaning safe, kind to others, and kind to myself and my husband. For starters, my MIL has been a widow for almost a year. Though, she lives alone, she is still our responsibility. We all primarily live in Mass. and she up here now, but her preferred home is Florida. She cannot travel alone. So hubby will be flying to florida with her Oct 15. Opening her home and getting her set up safely and then exposing himself to fly back home. THEN, do I quarentine him???? Should my MIL quarantine in Florida??? (which we know she will not, as we could not control her up here either) Then comes Thanksgiving. Do we? Don't we? If we do, who do we include and who gets excluded and the repercussions. Then Xmas, it repeats. Somewhere along the way, hubby and I would like to use the Florida condo we purchased in 2019. But if we go down, how does one fly up for "brief" visits with the kids and grandkids? That is certainly not happening as everyone will make us quarentine 14 days even if we had only planned to visit 3 days.
COVID vaccine - Boy my moods swing. One minute I have the urge to contract COVID just to get it over with and live with the repercussions. Then of course I don't because that is stupid. Then the vaccine, I have been in the "not me" camp. Then I got the flu shot friday and my mood shifted and now I am thinking "take the d@mn shot and get it over with". I have no idea what I will do once the opportunity comes my way.
I could go on and on and I'd fill your thread.
Anyhow, some very interesting writings here. I'll try and catch up!
Maybe you've already considered this, but it may be an option to get him tested on the way home, and at least limit concern that way. I know that results take time, and I don't know how long in your area. I recently had a drive-through Covid test (pre-outpatient medical procedure) and the results were available to me online the next day.
If something like that is an option for you, you'd still have the option to quarantine him (but for less than the normal 2 weeks, assuming a negative test) or not quarantine him but (again, assuming a negative test) have a data point relatively soon that might be calming psychologically . . . or - as I would never wish for anyone - if a positive test, then you know as soon as practical to take appropriate actions.
I know that there can be false negatives, but it's all about the odds. A negative test gives you pretty good odds he's not infected, as opposed to just waiting tensely to see if symptoms turn up.
The rest of that? I sympathize, sincerely.1 -
Oh, and I would like to add something I heard and am curious what response you all might have.
I was listening to a podcast, and the topic was the worst food one can consume during COVID times. (The positive qualities of green tea made me remember hearing this.) The food was fructose was the worst, and the claim was that fructose forms and "armor like coating" around the COVID virus and protects it. I have never heard this even once, but wondering what anyone else might have heard.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=a4zfWkvbBaw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4zfWkvbBaw
"COVID-19 Update 83 with Roger Seheult, MD of https://www.medcram.com
Oxidative stress may play a key role in the severity of COVID-19 infection. A variety of studies have demonstrated how high sugar intake (and fructose in particular - such as high fructose corn syrup) contributes not only to oxidative stress but to the inactivation of a usable form of vitamin D as well. Join Dr. Seheult for illustrations of how these pathways work."
(This video was recorded June 12, 2020).
This is one MD's video talking about how Fructose may increase damage due to getting Covid-19 and how it can knock out Vit D3 from being converted the active form of Vit D required to work in the body increasing the risk of getting Covid-19 in the first place.
@SModa61 thanks for sharing this info about fructose increasing serious risks associated with Covid-19.0 -
@AnnPT77
Hey Ann, yes, thank you for the suggesting of the testing. We have played around with all sorts of ideas regarding traveling, not traveling, careful timing for quarantining, as well as the testing. Up until last weekend, we thought the testing would be our solution. THEN, I came across an MIT article: https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/when-should-i-be-tested
Yes, it was from July, so maybe it is no longer accurate and reflective of the current testing capabilities. But the comment that caught my eye were:
-The diagnostic test, known as a “PCR test,” works by detecting genetic material from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, in the nose and upper throat. A study that examined false-negative rates post-exposure, found that during the four days of infection prior to symptom onset, the probability of a false negative on the PCR test went from 100 percent on Day 1 to 67 percent on Day 4. And even on the day individuals began showing symptoms, the false negative rate was still 38 percent, dropping to 20 percent three days after symptom onset. Of course, much depends on the sensitivity of the particular test being used. MIT Medical is using a test that has been shown to have a false-negative rate of less than 5 percent five days post exposure.
-All of this is why we’re not recommending that people make decisions about their activities or contacts based on the results of a negative test shortly after possible exposure. For example, it’s not a good idea to fly into Boston on a crowded flight, get a COVID-19 diagnostic test within a day or two of arrival, and then, based on a negative result, visit your elderly grandparents. The only thing that negative test can tell you is that, at that particular moment in time, your sample did not show viral levels high enough to be reliably measured. It does not mean you were not exposed and infected during your travels. It does not mean you were not exposed and infected after your arrival. Do you want to visit your grandparents after flying into Boston? Self quarantine for 14 days first.
two other interesting article on testing were:
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/06/how-does-covid-19-antigen-test-work
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/08/did-we-have-covid-194 -
@GaleHawkins
Thanks for the video. Very interesting and it certainly shows a reason to find fructose concerning as it relates to COVID. Certainly, does not describe a protective armor that the podcast woman mentioned. But I am glad that she said what she said or I would have never some across the information you shared in this video.
After watching, I tried doing my own searches and the best I could add was this: https://www.lakanto.com/blogs/news/sugar-causes-physical-health-complications
Maybe I should tell my husband to stop eating his Jujubes.
Especially on the plane! 1 -
@AnnPT77
Hey Ann, yes, thank you for the suggesting of the testing. We have played around with all sorts of ideas regarding traveling, not traveling, careful timing for quarantining, as well as the testing. Up until last weekend, we thought the testing would be our solution. THEN, I came across an MIT article: https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/when-should-i-be-tested
Yes, it was from July, so maybe it is no longer accurate and reflective of the current testing capabilities. But the comment that caught my eye were:
-The diagnostic test, known as a “PCR test,” works by detecting genetic material from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, in the nose and upper throat. A study that examined false-negative rates post-exposure, found that during the four days of infection prior to symptom onset, the probability of a false negative on the PCR test went from 100 percent on Day 1 to 67 percent on Day 4. And even on the day individuals began showing symptoms, the false negative rate was still 38 percent, dropping to 20 percent three days after symptom onset. Of course, much depends on the sensitivity of the particular test being used. MIT Medical is using a test that has been shown to have a false-negative rate of less than 5 percent five days post exposure.
-All of this is why we’re not recommending that people make decisions about their activities or contacts based on the results of a negative test shortly after possible exposure. For example, it’s not a good idea to fly into Boston on a crowded flight, get a COVID-19 diagnostic test within a day or two of arrival, and then, based on a negative result, visit your elderly grandparents. The only thing that negative test can tell you is that, at that particular moment in time, your sample did not show viral levels high enough to be reliably measured. It does not mean you were not exposed and infected during your travels. It does not mean you were not exposed and infected after your arrival. Do you want to visit your grandparents after flying into Boston? Self quarantine for 14 days first.
two other interesting article on testing were:
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/06/how-does-covid-19-antigen-test-work
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/08/did-we-have-covid-19
The question IMO isn't whether it's 100% certain-sure. It's only partially indicative. A *positive* test would be actionable. A negative one *might* be *somewhat* calming. That was my point. Yes, he could get Covid on the plane on the way home, so higher likelihood of false positive. He could get it on the way down, while in Florida . . . etc., with different probabilities of detection on arrival at home. It's a data point, a flawed one, for sure not a panacea.
I'm not trying to trivialize your dilemmas, not at all. It's not "a solution". I was trying to be clear that I thought it was a probabilistic data point, maybe worth having in the mix for decision-making. For certainty? Quarantine would be the closest bet. But that's pretty inconvenient/unpleasant.2 -
I didn't think I'd seen this information here, but this was new information to me on covid and what might be involved that seemed to be worth keeping track of. Just to see if this information ends up being important later.
The three big things that stood out to me were:
- the prevalence severe covid infections matches the estimates of mast cell activation disorder prevalence.
- Drugs inhibiting mast cells (MCs) and their mediators show promise in Covid-19.
- None of the treated MCAS patients studied- so those who are taking drugs that inhibit mast cells - had severe cases of covid OR death. This is really unusual, because with MCAS patients, they are more likely to die or have severe case of whatever disease they have. So not doing that with covid, whatever the reason, looks like it could be helpful for research, you know?
"Covid-19 Hyperinflammation and Post-Covid-19 Illness May Be Rooted in Mast Cell Activation Syndrome" in the International Journal of Infectious Diseases.
https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30732-3/fulltext
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@AnnPT77
I appreciate all you are suggesting as help for me. The issue with the written word is how I write and someone reads may not be the same. In an individual situation basis I am not per se "concerned" to the level that my paragraph would imply. I know my husband will take all possible precautions and I know airlines are making concerted efforts to keep passengers healthy and therefore maintain what remains of their industry. I am 99% certain that he will be fine. What I meant to convey was my stress/frustration with the everything that we/I are getting hit with due to COVID. We have all these new expectations that we have to impose on each other to stay safe and healthy and have altered our realities of less than 8 months ago. Nothing is normal, predictable or as easy as it previously was. I am likely whining as hubby and I have been comparatively fortunate throughout these months. Hopefully I did not make you crazy trying to solve my issues.
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Diatonic12 wrote: »This thing seems like a cluster of diseases. Rheumatic fever, TB, SARS, EBV. How long does a TB vax last. Does that mean we'll need a booster if it's been longer than 15 years.
Not an area where I'm well informed, but I think the point is related to a specific TB vax (BCG), not to just any TB vax. I don't know, but would suspect that there have been various TB vaxes over the decades, maybe even multiples currently.
I think there is only one TB vaccine. I would imagine they are still working on this. I could be wrong, but I couldn't find a different TB vaccine other than BCG.3 -
Oh, and I would like to add something I heard and am curious what response you all might have.
I was listening to a podcast, and the topic was the worst food one can consume during COVID times. (The positive qualities of green tea made me remember hearing this.) The food was fructose was the worst, and the claim was that fructose forms and "armor like coating" around the COVID virus and protects it. I have never heard this even once, but wondering what anyone else might have heard.
If it worked that way, wouldn't the COVID virus all end up in your liver instead of in your lungs? I admit biology is not my field of expertise, but when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me, I tend to question it and informaton from the same source (meaning the podcast, not you).6 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »Oh, and I would like to add something I heard and am curious what response you all might have.
I was listening to a podcast, and the topic was the worst food one can consume during COVID times. (The positive qualities of green tea made me remember hearing this.) The food was fructose was the worst, and the claim was that fructose forms and "armor like coating" around the COVID virus and protects it. I have never heard this even once, but wondering what anyone else might have heard.
If it worked that way, wouldn't the COVID virus all end up in your liver instead of in your lungs? I admit biology is not my field of expertise, but when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me, I tend to question it and informaton from the same source (meaning the podcast, not you).
That makes sense because fructose is processed in the liver, but my understanding is that this virus enters cells with ACE2 receptors, which is a lot of different cells. Specifically, the virus relies upon glycosylation of the ACE2 receptors, so an increased glucose level makes it easier for the virus to enter. Fructose causes increased glucose, as do most all carbs. That doesn't work as a "coating" around the virus, though.2 -
I didn't think I'd seen this information here, but this was new information to me on covid and what might be involved that seemed to be worth keeping track of. Just to see if this information ends up being important later.
The three big things that stood out to me were:
- the prevalence severe covid infections matches the estimates of mast cell activation disorder prevalence.
- Drugs inhibiting mast cells (MCs) and their mediators show promise in Covid-19.
- None of the treated MCAS patients studied- so those who are taking drugs that inhibit mast cells - had severe cases of covid OR death. This is really unusual, because with MCAS patients, they are more likely to die or have severe case of whatever disease they have. So not doing that with covid, whatever the reason, looks like it could be helpful for research, you know?
"Covid-19 Hyperinflammation and Post-Covid-19 Illness May Be Rooted in Mast Cell Activation Syndrome" in the International Journal of Infectious Diseases.
https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30732-3/fulltext
What I find interesting about this is that the most common treatment drugs for MCAS are strong antihistamines. Quercetin is also getting a lot of attention. It's also a natural antihistamine. Quercetin combined with Stinging Nettle and Vitamin C is a very effective, all natural antihistamine. Some say bromelain makes it more effective.3 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »If it worked that way, wouldn't the COVID virus all end up in your liver instead of in your lungs? I admit biology is not my field of expertise, but when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me, I tend to question it and informaton from the same source (meaning the podcast, not you).
Hey Lynn, I get your thoughts and definitely odd to not find sources. Anyhow, I was at a loss for where I heard it, but was 100% certain that I had. Then I remembered I was talking with DD about it and I had sent her the link to the youtube/postcast.
Anyhow, here is the link, for your own perusal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yHzXWCLCiI&feature=youtu.be
and then here is a cut and paste from her recap/sources:
1. FRUCTOSE
PROBLEMS:
1.increases oxidative stress
-leading to more cardiovascular disease & diabetes
-countries with higher availability to HFCS have more diabetes
-US is at the top
2.inhibits the enzyme that turns vit D into a bioavailable active form
3.inhibits glutathione production that helps repair the damage of oxidative stress
4.coats the coronavirus and camouflages it from human cell detection
5.allows virus to occupy ace-2 receptor site which is the entry point for the virus to the cell
-receptors found in gut, kidney, lung, and liver
https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/10/coronavirus-ace-2-receptor/
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.06.11.146522v1
https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m22372 -
Using the recap phrasing from above here was an article discussing the Biorvix paper: https://phys.org/news/2020-06-sugar-coating-coronavirus-infection.html
0 -
Everybody at our local elementary school has been in a panic since sending 17 students home with Covid symptoms. One test came back positive. Or that's the news that was going around from the school. But the school was not told it was a "presumed positive".
As it turned out, the person was given a retest and it came back negative. As if anyone needed more panic. 
I don't have a lot of faith in communication and test results at this point. Anywhere, not just in my small podunk town.7 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »If it worked that way, wouldn't the COVID virus all end up in your liver instead of in your lungs? I admit biology is not my field of expertise, but when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me, I tend to question it and informaton from the same source (meaning the podcast, not you).
Hey Lynn, I get your thoughts and definitely odd to not find sources. Anyhow, I was at a loss for where I heard it, but was 100% certain that I had. Then I remembered I was talking with DD about it and I had sent her the link to the youtube/postcast.
Anyhow, here is the link, for your own perusal:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yHzXWCLCiI&feature=youtu.be
and then here is a cut and paste from her recap/sources:
1. FRUCTOSE
PROBLEMS:
1.increases oxidative stress
-leading to more cardiovascular disease & diabetes
-countries with higher availability to HFCS have more diabetes
-US is at the top
2.inhibits the enzyme that turns vit D into a bioavailable active form
3.inhibits glutathione production that helps repair the damage of oxidative stress
4.coats the coronavirus and camouflages it from human cell detection
5.allows virus to occupy ace-2 receptor site which is the entry point for the virus to the cell
-receptors found in gut, kidney, lung, and liver
https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/10/coronavirus-ace-2-receptor/
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.06.11.146522v1
https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m2237
Again, questioning the message in the podcast, not you: 4 and 5 are self-contradictory. If fructose coats the virus in a way that camouflages it from human cell detection, how could the virus interact with the cell's ace-2 receptor sites?8 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »If it worked that way, wouldn't the COVID virus all end up in your liver instead of in your lungs? I admit biology is not my field of expertise, but when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me, I tend to question it and informaton from the same source (meaning the podcast, not you).
Hey Lynn, I get your thoughts and definitely odd to not find sources. Anyhow, I was at a loss for where I heard it, but was 100% certain that I had. Then I remembered I was talking with DD about it and I had sent her the link to the youtube/postcast.
Anyhow, here is the link, for your own perusal:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yHzXWCLCiI&feature=youtu.be
and then here is a cut and paste from her recap/sources:
1. FRUCTOSE
PROBLEMS:
1.increases oxidative stress
-leading to more cardiovascular disease & diabetes
-countries with higher availability to HFCS have more diabetes
-US is at the top
2.inhibits the enzyme that turns vit D into a bioavailable active form
3.inhibits glutathione production that helps repair the damage of oxidative stress
4.coats the coronavirus and camouflages it from human cell detection
5.allows virus to occupy ace-2 receptor site which is the entry point for the virus to the cell
-receptors found in gut, kidney, lung, and liver
https://www.statnews.com/2020/04/10/coronavirus-ace-2-receptor/
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.06.11.146522v1
https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m2237
Again, questioning the message in the podcast, not you: 4 and 5 are self-contradictory. If fructose coats the virus in a way that camouflages it from human cell detection, how could the virus interact with the cell's ace-2 receptor sites?
Agreed. #5 is something I've seen a lot already. #4 is not something I have seen much until the last day or so and it just doesn't fit.3 -
@ReenieHJ From the articles I read yesterday, if that one person actually got a positive test (not sure about this presumed positive junk) then odds are that they had COVID. As I understand, false positives are rare while false negatives have a number of causes. So i would assume that the positive first test was right and the second negative was wrong, unless "presumed" has some significance.
These are the articles I read yesterday:
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/07/when-should-i-be-tested
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/06/how-does-covid-19-antigen-test-work
https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2020/08/did-we-have-covid-191 -
@lynn_glenmont and @T1DCarnivoreRunner
I get both your positions, I brought it up initially as a "hmmmm" from something I remembered hearing last week. My giving the link and its references today was just to provide where I encountered it since there actually seemed to be interest in discussion its possible validity. At this point in time, I do not have the background to read that study (reference #2). Did either of you have better luck? I would have had to sit with a dictionary all day to even attempt it. The only comments I can add to this discussion are that a study was actually done, a doctor bothered to read and reference it (she had plenty to talk about without referencing it), and then an organization chose to write and article on the paper after reading it. It very well could be a case of garbage in garbage out, but it is worth a pause to see if there is anything of value in that study. I hope someone can actually read it!
1 -
Everybody at our local elementary school has been in a panic since sending 17 students home with Covid symptoms. One test came back positive. Or that's the news that was going around from the school. But the school was not told it was a "presumed positive". As it turned out, the person was given a retest and it came back negative. As if anyone needed more panic.
I don't have a lot of faith in communication and test results at this point. Anywhere, not just in my small podunk town.
My kid is on the spectrum; they're bringing all the special ed. kids back next week for 5-day, in-person instruction. They are not taking temperature checks unless they suspect they are sick. What gets me is, they are relying on self-report. Generally speaking, kids with special needs aren't the best with communication, especially when stressed or sick. I anticipate similar shenanigans. You're in my thoughts.10
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