Bye Bye Death Penalty
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I'm not sure I'm completely for as I know some innocent people get the death penalty however it burns me to know that my tax dollars feed, cloth and put a roof over some of these low lifes...0
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ONe thing for sure: Because America does have the death penalty, we also have the LOWEST RE-OFFENDING RATES too. You can't reoffend if you're put to death. That kind of simplifies and puts it into very clear perspective for for me.
Scandanavia has only approx. 25,000,000 people. America has 325,000,000. Huge difference. Small countries have less crime, for obvious reasons, so no comparison is possible.
When you have that small a population, of COURSE it becomes easier to rehab criminals.
Can you imagine the U.S. trying tp rehab every single violent criminal out there? OUr country would go broke under the weight of the costs, as if we don't already have an issue keeping ourselves out of debt... We just don't have the time to spend mollycoddling every little pansy that walks through the door with an impulse control problem.
I'm for it.
Well, that's ONE way to look at it. Another way to look at it would be for the US to look at the flaws in its society that create so many violent criminals and make changes to rehabilitate its society as a whole, thus creating less violent killers. Scandinavia and the US have vastly different crime statistics per capita, not in real numbers, which renders that part of your argument also invalid.
Or, you could just say USA! USA! USA! and forget that societal influences play a large part in creating criminals.
Again, considering the high cost of living in the world today, where is the money coming from to do all that??
Oh, yea, that's right, we'll do what Europe does and TAX everyone at literally 40% of their gross income. T
hat;'ll fix everything.
Blame 'society'. Blame the victim. That means you blame ME, and I apologize, I'm not taking the blame for someone's mental illness which may or may NOT be attributable to SOCIETY..
Neither are most of the people in this country. AS far as I'm concerned, the system we have is as good as it's going to get. The only thing I would alter is to NOT allow deathrow inmates 30+ years to appeal. THAT would be abolished.
I consider these men and women to be collateral damage. That is the way EVERY country operates. You only don't hear about it in your country because they're better at HIDING it from their public.
So you're against the death penalty. Can you tell me your stance on abortion?
Watch carefully what you say. You could be on the verge of being a hypocrite.....0 -
Sicker than you being raped and married? Sicker than your mother and father's house being broke into and them shot at point blank range by some hoodlums all for the jewels in the jewelry box? Sicker than you daughter walking home late at night and your neighbor taking her into basement, raping her, beating her, starving her then letting her die a slow and painful death while he rapes her degrading body every night before he goes to bed and wakes up to wave good morning to you in the driveway?
The crimes FAR outweigh the idea or thought of punishing someone by killing them. Sorry it does. If you think it is sick to kill someone because they harmed innocent people. Well, then I think you are sick.
I think it's sick to torture and brutally murder someone as part of my country's legal code. I'm for capital punishment, but your eye for an eye plan is heinous torture, which is in direct violation of the constitution (not to mention my own moral code, not that that should matter). And you want the victim's families to do that, which could cause irreparable psychological trauma to them. Killing someone is relatively easy. Living with it after isn't always so easy.
:laugh: again....arguing like this about to become law.
You aren't going to change my personal opinion. I'd kill the SOB in his tracks.0 -
I don't know what the specifics are for the places I've lived...you know, since I've never been on death row, I haven't been compelled enough to research it.
BUT I believe that the person should not ONLY BE KILLED if they take someone's life....they should be killed in the same manner!
Shooting, stabbing, choking, burning, beating, dismembering, decapitation....whatever the case may be.
I bet won't like it either.
and this ^ I totally agree, I think there are some real sick freaks out there and they deserve the same pain and torture that they gave out.
Without going into how disturbing this whole comment is..... I would like to point out the keyword in it: SICK.
Sicker than you being raped and murdered? Sicker than your mother and father's house being broke into and them shot at point blank range by some hoodlums all for the jewels in the jewelry box? Sicker than your daughter walking home late at night and your neighbor taking her into the basement, raping her, beating her, starving her then letting her die a slow and painful death while he rapes her degrading body every night before he goes to bed and wakes up to wave good morning to you in the driveway?
The crimes FAR outweigh the idea or thought of punishing someone by killing them. Sorry it does. If you think it is sick to kill someone because they harmed innocent people. Well, then I think you are sick.
Oops you just missed the point completely. Yes those things are sick, that is my point exactly. The person committing them is sick. They need medical care and to be kept away from others they might be of harm to. Not killed.0 -
The controversy isn't about "there are some people who deserve to die vs nobody deserves to die".
It's about executing someone who turned out to be innocent. It's happened before, and DNA evidence only makes it that much easier to convincingly frame someone. So saying something like 'I only support the death penalty if there is 100% DNA evidence to support the charges..." does not mean innocent people will not be executed.
If an innocent person is executed their blood is not just on the hands of the jury members, it's on the hands of all the citizens of that state whose taxes enabled the execution. Morally speaking, one of the worst things a person can do is be accountable for the death of another innocent person, and just because we voted on it as a group doesn't make it moral.
I disagree... sure that's part of the argument... but on a more basic level the controversy lies in whether or not other people have the right to see to the death of someone simply because they might deserve to die.0 -
You REALLY are arguing this like there's proposed legislation to enact this! :laugh:
You're the one who said it, I think it's stupid and that this line of conversation is what gives folks who are against the death penalty more of an argument against it. I will vehemently oppose any suggestions along that line of thinking.0 -
We all should have learned it by kindergarten: two wrongs don't make a right. It works for big stuff too.
You are so right. We should just have murderers sit in the corner!!!
isn't that what prison is?
Exactly! Repeating a punishment that didn't work when they were 5, but at a HUGE expense to the taxpayers.
I'd rather them be in jail than the people in there for drug offenses. Let's just think about how much money the "war on drugs" costs and how the jails are overcrowded because of it and then talk about cost cutting in the prison system
Yes as a different subject, the war on drugs is beyond stupid. We should legalize drugs and realistically the crime associated with it, along with the cost disappears almost overnight.
I still think that those that are willing to go out and commit horrible acts against innocent people should be punished harshly, up to and including death.0 -
Best post I've read so far:I don't have a problem with abolishing the death penalty, although doing so is not at the top of my priority list. My reasons against the death penalty are a combination of what I consider the practical and the personal.
1. The death penalty does not work as a deterrent--never has in any society and it never will.
2. There is no way to administer the death penalty that is 100% error-free. This is not a situation where 90%, 95% or even 99% accuracy is good enough. If taking a human life for unjustified reasons is such a heinous act that it deserves the death penalty, then there is NO circumstance in which mistakenly executing someone can be allowable. Ever. Especially since there is no practical justification for the death penalty.
3. I respect that it is possible that those who support the death penalty can do so for sincere reasons, even though I know few death penalty supporters that I respect.
4. I think it is important for society to model the behaviors that are expected in others. I think it sends a conflicting message to say that taking a human life is a horrible act and then justify society's taking of a human life. Instead of reaching for a higher level of moral behavior, we give in to our more base emotions, and I think that demeans our culture (I fully admit that this is a personal opinion, not supported by any data whatsoever).
5. By supporting the death penalty, we ally ourselves morally more with countries like Saudi Arabia, Iran, China, Cuba, the Sudan, etc. Is that really the moral standard we want to set for the US? Shouldn't we aspire to more?
I would also like to make it clear that being against the death penalty has NOTHING to do with being "soft on crime" or not recognizing the seriousness of the crime. That is a pernicious lie that seems to come up in every death penalty discussion.0 -
Two of my favourite quotes:
"Why do people, kill people, who kill people, to show that killing people is wrong?"
"An eye for an eye and we'd all be blind..."
I work in a high secure hospital, and I don't condone the death penalty, but I can empathise with those that agree. I see a lot of people saying 'what if it was your friend/family raped or murdered?'... well what if it was your friend/family up for the death penalty?
Anyway, I'm glad it's abolished in the UK - death is almost an easy option... lack of freedom and having your needs reduced and not met is real punishment!
But i guess instead of stock piling/ warehousing people alive above the soil, they choose to do it beneath...
TWO WRONGS DON'T MAKE A RIGHT PEOPLE!0 -
Every state should not only have the death penalty, but like Ron White says, they should put it in "the express lane".0
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...Well, then I think you are sick.
I'm advocating putting that sick SOB to death. In my IDEAL world, it would be in the manner in which they killed their victims.
I think your ideal world is sick.
My ideal world wouldn't have that kind of crime in the first place.0 -
I live in Britain where we do not have the dealth penalty, but I believe that in the circumstances where it can be proven that the person actually did commit the crime (notably murder, paedophilia, rape etc) that they should have the option to put them to death. I still remember what two ten year old boys did to a two year old (they didn't just murder him, they beat and tortured him then left his dead body on the railway tracks for a train to bisect). Were they put away for life (which was their jail term)? Oh no, they were put in "young offenders units" and and probably learnt a whole deal more crime then were released when they were about 19 WITH NEW IDENTITIES!!!!!!! One of whom reoffended within 2 years of being freed (caught with child porn). To think of what they were capable of at 10 and then to find out that one of them anyway has not been in any way rehabilitated proves that they should not have been allowed to live. In this day and age we have enough scientific ability to basically prove to almost 100% if that person comitted the crime, so there would be less likelihood of the wrong person being executed.0
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I think they should all be forced to watch The View until they kill themselves!
Or listen to Justin Bieber 24 hours a day
Ok that is taking it a bit too far! :sad:0 -
We all should have learned it by kindergarten: two wrongs don't make a right. It works for big stuff too.
You are so right. We should just have murderers sit in the corner!!!
isn't that what prison is?
Exactly! Repeating a punishment that didn't work when they were 5, but at a HUGE expense to the taxpayers.
I'd rather them be in jail than the people in there for drug offenses. Let's just think about how much money the "war on drugs" costs and how the jails are overcrowded because of it and then talk about cost cutting in the prison system
This opens up a WHOLE other can of worms with the extremely inefficient and profitable prison system. And the war on drugs should be the start of a new thread. I'd like to debate that. Ridiculous, in one word. AND it has massively created the prison system into a profitable market, which IT SHOULD NOT BE!0 -
We all should have learned it by kindergarten: two wrongs don't make a right. It works for big stuff too.
You are so right. We should just have murderers sit in the corner!!!
isn't that what prison is?
Exactly! Repeating a punishment that didn't work when they were 5, but at a HUGE expense to the taxpayers.
I'd rather them be in jail than the people in there for drug offenses. Let's just think about how much money the "war on drugs" costs and how the jails are overcrowded because of it and then talk about cost cutting in the prison system
Yes as a different subject, the war on drugs is beyond stupid. We should legalize drugs and realistically the crime associated with it, along with the cost disappears almost overnight.
I still think that those that are willing to go out and commit horrible acts against innocent people should be punished harshly, up to and including death.
think of all the money that would flow into the economy is drugs were legalized and regulated like alcohol and tobacco. I think I just solved the economic crisis :laugh:0 -
I don't know what the specifics are for the places I've lived...you know, since I've never been on death row, I haven't been compelled enough to research it.
BUT I believe that the person should not ONLY BE KILLED if they take someone's life....they should be killed in the same manner!
Shooting, stabbing, choking, burning, beating, dismembering, decapitation....whatever the case may be.
I bet won't like it either.
and this ^ I totally agree, I think there are some real sick freaks out there and they deserve the same pain and torture that they gave out.
Without going into how disturbing this whole comment is..... I would like to point out the keyword in it: SICK.
Sicker than you being raped and murdered? Sicker than your mother and father's house being broke into and them shot at point blank range by some hoodlums all for the jewels in the jewelry box? Sicker than your daughter walking home late at night and your neighbor taking her into the basement, raping her, beating her, starving her then letting her die a slow and painful death while he rapes her degrading body every night before he goes to bed and wakes up to wave good morning to you in the driveway?
The crimes FAR outweigh the idea or thought of punishing someone by killing them. Sorry it does. If you think it is sick to kill someone because they harmed innocent people. Well, then I think you are sick.
Oops you just missed the point completely. Yes those things are sick, that is my point exactly. The person committing them is sick. They need medical care and to be kept away from others they might be of harm to. Not killed.
Not everyone that commits crimes is sick mentally in such a manner that they can be treated. Some people, whether some of you choose to believe it or not are just plain evil.
While bumping the scale up to 11, I'm sure that nobody would disagree that Hitler was evil, and he deserved to die (unfortunately by his own hand), though people that just think murders and rapists are sick would probably have tried to rehabilitate him and let him out early for good behavior. :explode:0 -
I believe all rapists, child molestors, and people who kill innocent people should be put to death. I think people who oppose the death penalty are naive. Hopefully you are never touched by violent crime.. and then what? Beg for the perpetrator to be allowed to live? Really?0
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I'm against the death penalty - there have been some cases when the person hasn't been guilty.
Killing for killing = wrong IMO.
Names?????
Johnny Frank Garrett
Wayne Felker
Thomas and Meeks Griffin
Timothy Evans
Derek Bentley
Chipita Rodriguez
just for a few.
Not to mention that DNA evidence has allowed the exoneration and release of more than 15 death row inmates since 1992. The Death Penalty Information Center has published a list of 8 inmates "executed but possibly innocent". At least 39 executions are claimed to have been carried out in the U.S. in the face of evidence of innocence or serious doubt about guilt.
I notice that the same people who don't trust the government enough to levy taxes are the same people that trust the government enough to put citizens to death...that's sorta funny.0 -
I was born in Texas, that should about sum up my view on the subject.
Yep, saves my tax dollars!!!0 -
We all should have learned it by kindergarten: two wrongs don't make a right. It works for big stuff too.
You are so right. We should just have murderers sit in the corner!!!
isn't that what prison is?
Exactly! Repeating a punishment that didn't work when they were 5, but at a HUGE expense to the taxpayers.
I'd rather them be in jail than the people in there for drug offenses. Let's just think about how much money the "war on drugs" costs and how the jails are overcrowded because of it and then talk about cost cutting in the prison system
Yes as a different subject, the war on drugs is beyond stupid. We should legalize drugs and realistically the crime associated with it, along with the cost disappears almost overnight.
I still think that those that are willing to go out and commit horrible acts against innocent people should be punished harshly, up to and including death.
think of all the money that would flow into the economy is drugs were legalized and regulated like alcohol and tobacco. I think I just solved the economic crisis :laugh:
It's TRUE! I am willing to bet that most people, given the choice would prefer to go buy a joint from the local store than deal with a pot dealer. Leagalize it and regulate it like alcohol. It's so stupid to claim that one person's vice (alcohol, tobacco) is better than another, especially when the crime is all involved with the posession of said drug.
Meth however is a different story, THAT is some scary ****.0
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