All pills are not snake oil
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I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on here say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that no one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
ETA: Spelling fails. Although, I'm sure I left enough for the OP to be able to discredit my whole post.0 -
smhWoo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?
THANK YOU!! I think most people just read the thread title and decided I was an obese person who was looking for a magic pill. Thanks for reading before commenting!!
like two people said/agreed with that. If you're going to attribute thoughts to people that they haven't said. Well. A lot of things will likely needlessly make you angry then. Whether they're true or not
People at the bottom of the class often defend themselves by citing the number of people who also didn't understand something. You're like "only 2 people got it" lol and?
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Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?
THANK YOU!! I think most people just read the thread title and decided I was an obese person who was looking for a magic pill. Thanks for reading before commenting!!
Many of us have read the entire thread and commented. Unfortunately, you have chosen to not like what the rest of us are saying, so you make wild and unfounded assumptions that we do not read your thread. The fact that you have ignored the rest of us, clearly shows you are not interested in understanding reality of the situation regarding supplements and would rather just want to complain about people who don't share your thoughts.
+1
+20 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.0 -
Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?
THANK YOU!! I think most people just read the thread title and decided I was an obese person who was looking for a magic pill. Thanks for reading before commenting!!
like two people said/agreed with that. If you're going to attribute thoughts to people that they haven't said. Well. A lot of things will likely needlessly make you angry then. Whether they're true or not
People at the bottom of the class often defend themselves by citing the number of people who also didn't understand something. You're like "only 2 people got it" lol and?
On the other hand, if only 2 people "understood," the problem really *is* with the teacher/methodology and not the students. (Coming from POV of a teacher, here!!). Maybe the one delivering the misunderstood message needs to re-evaluate delivery method and clarify. Clarify, not just defend.
And, I have to say, most of us commenting seem to have read the entire thread, not just the title.
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rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do because that's the truth.0 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
It. Doesn't. Work. There is as much conversation to be had as there is about the tiger repelling prowess of skittles.0 -
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
YES!!
Eat less, move more. Stop chasing diet pills. When does it end?
There will be people explaining in the same topic how this and that diet pill worked for them, but they're doing you a disservice if they do not at least encourage you to pursue a long term plan that doesn't involve diet pills
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rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do.
+1
Thanks for answering for me!
I really can't deal with the OP anymore anyway.
!!!!!!!!!!! S M H !!!!!!!!!!10 -
Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?
THANK YOU!! I think most people just read the thread title and decided I was an obese person who was looking for a magic pill. Thanks for reading before commenting!!
like two people said/agreed with that. If you're going to attribute thoughts to people that they haven't said. Well. A lot of things will likely needlessly make you angry then. Whether they're true or not
People at the bottom of the class often defend themselves by citing the number of people who also didn't understand something. You're like "only 2 people got it" lol and?
On the other hand, if only 2 people "understood," the problem really *is* with the teacher/methodology and not the students. (Coming from POV of a teacher, here!!). Maybe the one delivering the misunderstood message needs to re-evaluate delivery method and clarify. Clarify, not just defend.
And, I have to say, most of us commenting seem to have read the entire thread, not just the title.
If that was the case you wouldn't have given me the life story of diet pills, since no where did i ask for it, and by giving answers that imply that i somehow advocate diet pills and so called magic pills it shows you didn't read it. If you tell someone they dress like a prostitute and i tell you that wasn't nice, and you give me the definition of a prostitute, you missed the point.0 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do because that's the truth.
Thank you for agreeing with me even though you don't want to admit it. I've obviously seen the latter enough to comment on it but people don't get it. Which is fine. Some people just aren't empathetic, or detail oriented, or good with communication in general. But it's frustrating when people claim to be interested in helping people when their approach and refusal to self reflect clearly shows they care more about trying to sound superior.0 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
The fact is, though, that any success with xyz was most likely placebo. Any success with abc will likely be placebo. And potential side effects can be worrisome (that's the 'too jittery' part). I don't need to have tried abc (or xyz, or qrs either) to confidently tell someone that they will probably be better off in the long run by using the free tools provided here, along with a $20 food scale and some means of exercise.
I mean, if someone is looking to lose weight for the long term, wouldn't it be advantageous for them to hear that they can do it themselves (self-empowerment!) without spending a lot of money on something they don't need?0 -
PLEASE. MAKE. IT. STOP
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rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do because that's the truth.
Thank you for agreeing with me even though you don't want to admit it. I've obviously seen the latter enough to comment on it but people don't get it. Which is fine. Some people just aren't empathetic, or detail oriented, or good with communication in general. But it's frustrating when people claim to be interested in helping people when their approach and refusal to self reflect clearly shows they care more about trying to sound superior.
I add there are no magic pills to 98% of my posts because that is the truth. People have no obligation to sugar coat information or act how you want them to act or respond. The sooner you learn that the easier life becomes. Honestly, just move on.
I'm a little surprised a mean people thread has been allowed to stand for 9 pages.0 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do because that's the truth.
But it's frustrating when people claim to be interested in helping people when their approach and refusal to self reflect clearly shows they care more about trying to sound superior.
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rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
I work in pharmacovigilance and manage the adverse events people experience when taking prescription drugs, nutritionals, and supplements so have a much larger view of the damage caused by the supplement industry than most.
Yes I believe stating facts - objective evidence, is much better than entertaining the notion that supplement xyz will have any sort of impact on weight loss. Most of these have no impact other than lightening your wallet; however interactions, overdoses, etc. continually happen thanks to the staggering amount of disinformation out there from the supplement industry that distracts people from the simple basics of CICO.0 -
Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?Woo. Lots of it.
I understand OPs point of changing approach. Why don't we stay on topic of it instead of battling over who's criticizing who/what...lol.
Also, why isn't there differing terms for the prescribed or proven supplements that are needed vs the snake oil stuff?
THANK YOU!! I think most people just read the thread title and decided I was an obese person who was looking for a magic pill. Thanks for reading before commenting!!
like two people said/agreed with that. If you're going to attribute thoughts to people that they haven't said. Well. A lot of things will likely needlessly make you angry then. Whether they're true or not
People at the bottom of the class often defend themselves by citing the number of people who also didn't understand something. You're like "only 2 people got it" lol and?
On the other hand, if only 2 people "understood," the problem really *is* with the teacher/methodology and not the students. (Coming from POV of a teacher, here!!). Maybe the one delivering the misunderstood message needs to re-evaluate delivery method and clarify. Clarify, not just defend.
And, I have to say, most of us commenting seem to have read the entire thread, not just the title.
If that was the case you wouldn't have given me the life story of diet pills, since no where did i ask for it, and by giving answers that imply that i somehow advocate diet pills and so called magic pills it shows you didn't read it. If you tell someone they dress like a prostitute and i tell you that wasn't nice, and you give me the definition of a prostitute, you missed the point.
??
I can only assume that by "you," you are referring to the general responses in this thread, since you just quoted the first time I replied.
But, here's where clarification comes in. You didn't actually straight up say "that's not nice." You saidBut some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous. I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
So ... people were responding to your defense of diet pills of possibly being good. And you're still defending yourself and claiming that we didn't read your post.
ETA: The fact still remains that if 98% of the people seem to not understand the message, the problem is most likely the delivery, not the understanding (or capacity) of the people.
I mean, I can say "I clearly taught my kids the difference between a b and a d. See, it's obvious, b is a line first then a circle, d is circle then line." But if all but 1 or 2 of my students are still confused, I can't say "well, obviously they just didn't listen well enough to get it. Because, see, these 2 are doing it right." I have to reassess how I taught and try again. Without trying to shame the students as poor learners (or in this thread, poor readers and meanies)0 -
rjmudlax13 wrote: »I'm sorry I just get annoyed that I've read so many questions about supplements, and people just cut and paste "only a calorie deficit works".
Can you provide specific examples? "Only a calorie deficit works" when it comes to purely weight loss is a 100% true statement.Or instantly post the thing doesn't work and is snake oil and will only lean your pockets.
Again, we need a specific example. There are about 1,000,452,506,130 threads on here asking whether green bean coffee extract and raspberry ketones work. There is very little scientific evidence, if any, that show these specific supplements actually do anything. Most of the regulars here know it, so they give the advice that it is useless and just a scam. Are you saying they should just shut up?People have posted about medical issues and that's the response without reading, i.e. "my doctor prescribed such and such for my bad liver. will it make me gain weight"? response: "there are no magic pills." smh.
And the broken record continues. Please give a specific example. I have never heard anyone on hear say that medication prescribed by a doctor is just a magic pill. I could be mistaken though. If someone did say this, it's probably someone on the fringe who has a mistrust of the medical industry as a whole.I realize there are no pills that you eat whatever you want and live on the couch and lose 50 pounds a day. But some supplements might effectively curb your appetite, or give you the energy to work out, etc. and even if it is a placebo effect on some of them, so what? If you're eating better and working out more and blame the pill, what's the harm unless it's actually dangerous.
Some supplements do work to curb appetite or give energy, etc. Caffeine and creatine to name a few. The benefits and side effects of the 2 specifics I mentioned are well documented and proven. I doubt any of the regulars here would call these snake oil. However, there are some reasonable and legitimate concerns on the efficacy and safety of these. If you need a placebo to motivate you then fine. However, I see no problem with someone suggesting that you can do it without the placebo and save some of your hard earned money too. In fact, I think it would be very good advice.I think posting that a supplement is snake oil without knowing anything about it is just as reckless as promoting something you know nothing about. Supplements obviously work for some people. I think it makes more sense to talk about specific research and what the pros and cons and potential dangers are rather than just jumping on people whenever they mention any sort of pill. If you don't know, you don't have to answer.
Again, specifics are needed. Most people here do not call a supplement snake oil without knowing anything about it. A lot of people here are very knowledgeable. Also, if someone promotes a supplement that know one knows about, the burden of proof is on the promoter. For example, I can say that monkey spit will burn body fat. I am perfectly entitled to that opinion. Also, others are perfectly entitled to criticize my opinion if they don't agree. However, it is up to me to provide the scientific proof that it works. I can't make the claim and then say "well if you don't think it works, prove me wrong." That would be illogical.
But I didn't read your post obviously. I just read the title and assumed you were obese. So my opinion can be discounted.
So if a new member comes here and posts "hey, guys, I'm new to the boards, looking for some support on this journey. I've had some success with xyz but it made me to jittery. My friend recommended abc and I'm wondering if anyone has tried it"
You think saying "there are no magic pills" is better than actually having a discussion about abc? And you think being sarcastic and condescending towards new posters is a good style for people here to learn? If you do, fine we disagree. If you don't then why are you arguing with me? I didn't ask for a supplement lesson.
If "ABC" has no science to support it or has potentially dangerous side effects your darn right I'm going to speak my mind and tell them the potential dangers of that supplement. and I will add there are no magic pills to my post.... just as I usually do because that's the truth.
Thank you for agreeing with me even though you don't want to admit it. I've obviously seen the latter enough to comment on it but people don't get it. Which is fine. Some people just aren't empathetic, or detail oriented, or good with communication in general. But it's frustrating when people claim to be interested in helping people when their approach and refusal to self reflect clearly shows they care more about trying to sound superior.
Hang on....but the above is exactly what everyone you have been calling out has been saying. So now we all actually agree with you?
I'm so confused.0
This discussion has been closed.
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