All pills are not snake oil
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kshama2001 wrote: »
A placebo is something that doesn't work (an inactive or inert substance). When there's a placebo effect, it means there was a beneficial effect.
The benefit is the belief, not coming from the substance.
The substance which made a company money. The belief came from the person. It was free.
Don't the ethics of this situation bother you?
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So if I wanted to say strength training builds muscle, am I obligated to compare it to other exercises for completeness, like compared to sprint, or yoga?kshama2001 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Cant the supplement industry be bad regardless of the status of the pharmaceutical industry? "I know you are, but what am I" isn't very persuasive.kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
What about the bad things that happen from the regulated products like Phen/Fen? Please include a comparison!
See also http://www.un.org/esa/coordination/CL12.pdf
What? Nowhere did I say that Rx drugs were risk free.
Wait, a comparison of what?
And Phen/Fen was taken off the market...because it killed people. So...
I hear more news stories about dangerous regulated pharmaceuticals than dangerous unregulated supplements but am allowing for the possibility of a confirmation bias. I just don't think it's fair to dump on the supplement industry without a comparison of the pharmaceutical industry.
(Or we can go back to @senecarr 's Latin version.)
Dissing an unregulated industry while failing to enumerate the failings of the regulated industry is rather incomplete.
You forgot kegels!0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »
Not when the regulated industry isn't the topic. Then, it's just irrelevancy to shift the focus away from what is the topic.kshama2001 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Cant the supplement industry be bad regardless of the status of the pharmaceutical industry? "I know you are, but what am I" isn't very persuasive.kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
What about the bad things that happen from the regulated products like Phen/Fen? Please include a comparison!
See also http://www.un.org/esa/coordination/CL12.pdf
What? Nowhere did I say that Rx drugs were risk free.
Wait, a comparison of what?
And Phen/Fen was taken off the market...because it killed people. So...
I hear more news stories about dangerous regulated pharmaceuticals than dangerous unregulated supplements but am allowing for the possibility of a confirmation bias. I just don't think it's fair to dump on the supplement industry without a comparison of the pharmaceutical industry.
(Or we can go back to @senecarr 's Latin version.)
Dissing an unregulated industry while failing to enumerate the failings of the regulated industry is rather incomplete.
Tell that to all the people talking about just using MFP in the gastric bypass thread
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kshama2001 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Cant the supplement industry be bad regardless of the status of the pharmaceutical industry? "I know you are, but what am I" isn't very persuasive.kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
What about the bad things that happen from the regulated products like Phen/Fen? Please include a comparison!
See also http://www.un.org/esa/coordination/CL12.pdf
What? Nowhere did I say that Rx drugs were risk free.
Wait, a comparison of what?
And Phen/Fen was taken off the market...because it killed people. So...
I hear more news stories about dangerous regulated pharmaceuticals than dangerous unregulated supplements but am allowing for the possibility of a confirmation bias. I just don't think it's fair to dump on the supplement industry without a comparison of the pharmaceutical industry.
(Or we can go back to @senecarr 's Latin version.)
Dissing an unregulated industry while failing to enumerate the failings of the regulated industry is rather incomplete.
I'd like to be clear what sort of supplements you're defending to appropriate adjust my response.
There are supplements and then... there are supplements.
What sorts of things are you talking about?
Also? Topic? Sticking to it?
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I'm off to weed.
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kshama2001 wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
What about the bad things that happen from the regulated products like Phen/Fen? Please include a comparison!
See also http://www.un.org/esa/coordination/CL12.pdf
What? Nowhere did I say that Rx drugs were risk free.
Wait, a comparison of what?
And Phen/Fen was taken off the market...because it killed people. So...
I hear more news stories about dangerous regulated pharmaceuticals than dangerous unregulated supplements but am allowing for the possibility of a confirmation bias. I just don't think it's fair to dump on the supplement industry without a comparison of the pharmaceutical industry.
Supplements... as in vitamins or fat burners/appetite suppressants? What exactly are you defending here?
I doubt most people here would call a multivitamin or supplemental minerals snake oil.
I responded to this post, which refers to supplements and supplement industry rather than fat burners/appetite suppressants.I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
Okay, but, here's the thing... on the boards, the only supplements referred to as snake oil are fat burners/appetite suppressants.
That's what you're defending. Because that's what the OP was complaining about, the use of the term snake oil.
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I'm still going to advocate barbell resistance training over static contraction for all muscles.Liftng4Lis wrote: »
So if I wanted to say strength training builds muscle, am I obligated to compare it to other exercises for completeness, like compared to sprint, or yoga?kshama2001 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
Cant the supplement industry be bad regardless of the status of the pharmaceutical industry? "I know you are, but what am I" isn't very persuasive.kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »UltimateRBF wrote: »I have a background and education in pharmacy. I've seen some bad things happen from some supposedly harmless supplements. Also read some even scarier things about the shocking lack of real regulation in the supplement industry. I should try to dig up some stuff later when I'm not super busy and avoiding work
What about the bad things that happen from the regulated products like Phen/Fen? Please include a comparison!
See also http://www.un.org/esa/coordination/CL12.pdf
What? Nowhere did I say that Rx drugs were risk free.
Wait, a comparison of what?
And Phen/Fen was taken off the market...because it killed people. So...
I hear more news stories about dangerous regulated pharmaceuticals than dangerous unregulated supplements but am allowing for the possibility of a confirmation bias. I just don't think it's fair to dump on the supplement industry without a comparison of the pharmaceutical industry.
(Or we can go back to @senecarr 's Latin version.)
Dissing an unregulated industry while failing to enumerate the failings of the regulated industry is rather incomplete.
You forgot kegels!
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OP, please show me where people have told those on prescribed medications for medical conditions to stop taking their (not at all snake oil) snake oil supplements? I've never witnessed it. Nor have I seen people told not to take vitamin and mineral supplements if they are still working on getting all they need through diet (I take some supplements myself).
What I do see is a lot of people advising others not to spend their hard earned money on things that are proven not to work to aid weight loss, whether it's a cleanse, raspeberry ketones, teatox, green tea, whatever. Just because you're still clinging onto the false hope that you don't just have to get a grip on your calorie intake doesn't make these products any less snakey or oily.0 -
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Did the OP ever come back to have that discussion about the pros and cons or was this a drvie-by scolding?0
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diannethegeek wrote: »Did the OP ever come back to have that discussion about the pros and cons or was this a drvie-by scolding?
I suspect drive by0 -
Nopediannethegeek wrote: »Did the OP ever come back to have that discussion about the pros and cons or was this a drvie-by scolding?
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My big question is..when i read this kinda post...when you believe in all these kinda magic pills..why joining a calorie counting site and agreeing with the TOS?
And saying but i count and log too...is no excuse. Because the pills must do the work, not the counting0 -
You know what they call alternative medicine that works?
Medicine.
Yeah I like that.
I think too many diet pills rely on placebo effects or require a healthy diet and lifestyle to work, but if you have a healthy diet and lifestyle all of a sudden, is it the pill working its magic or just you making a lifestyle change.
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On the topic of placebos
You can be aware that something is inert and it still frackin works!
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/dec/22/placebo-effect-patients-sham-drug
So don't waste your money of expensive and ultimately pointless diet pills. Go buy yourself a bottle of vitamin C tabs, write "weight loss" on the side and go at it!0 -
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I've been taking Snake oil for the last two years. To this I credit it to my "Cobra" like Traps. However I now smell with my tongue and crawl around on my belly. You have to take the rough with the smooth.0
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My sister lost a ton of weight with a prescription appetite suppressant, but when she stopped taking it, the gained it all back and then some. Weight loss pills can and do work, but if you're not learning how to cover your nutritional needs without overeating, they'll do you no good in the long run.0
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I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise0 -
christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
And the side effects....0 -
Prescribed pills by a doctor for a health issue............not snake oil.
Advertised pills for weight loss...............all snake oil.
Does placebo effect happen? Of course. But don't pay $49.99 for a 4 week supply for it.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
You probably lost wallet weight.0 -
did OP ever come back..?0
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christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
You probably lost wallet weight.
yes indeedy!christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
And the side effects....
None, that i noticed. They could have been sugar pills for all I know..
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christinev297 wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
You probably lost wallet weight.
yes indeedy!christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
And the side effects....
None, that i noticed. They could have been sugar pills for all I know..
OH DEAR GOD!!! NOT THE EVIL SUGAR PILLS!!!
hehehe0 -
snickerscharlie wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
You probably lost wallet weight.
yes indeedy!christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
And the side effects....
None, that i noticed. They could have been sugar pills for all I know..
OH DEAR GOD!!! NOT THE EVIL SUGAR PILLS!!!
hehehe
They would have magically made me pack on the weight, no?
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snickerscharlie wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
You probably lost wallet weight.
yes indeedy!christinev297 wrote: »I have tried:
Garcinia Cambogia
Green coffee bean extract
Green tea extract
CLA
Plexus
Fibre slim
and a few others I cant remember the names of..
Not one of them helped one single bit. The only thing that I have lost weight doing is counting my calories and exercise
And the side effects....
None, that i noticed. They could have been sugar pills for all I know..
OH DEAR GOD!!! NOT THE EVIL SUGAR PILLS!!!
hehehe
Sugar?
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This discussion has been closed.
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