Of refeeds and diet breaks

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  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
    I had the same negotiations with a parking lot on Wednesday. The kicker being they had blokes at the entrance directing people in when clearly there weren't enough spaces. And I pissed someone off because I think I nabbed their space by swinging down a one way system the wrong way for a space two in from the end (so I barely went the wrong way). As I was just pulling in a big 4x4 hit his horn and then camped out behind me for a few minutes. Sorry mate, snooze you lose!

    I have set my alarm for tomorrow morning so I can get in and out of the supermarket as early and as easily as possible. I really wish I didn't care and could be content with frozen veg but nope, I have to go into the fray two days before Christmas because I need my fresh veg. And a pudding. Got to have pudding. Sorry, dessert. I'm a commoner, I eat pudding (which isn't a specific thing like in the US, it's a catch all).

    I don't know if it's the same where you are, but around here, a good majority of the people who drive 4x4's act and drive as if they think that having such a vehicle grants them special privileges. Usually, the more expensive the 4x4 is, the more apparent this effect is.

    Absolutely the same, especially given we are not a nation designed for giant cars given the age of our roads, they were not meant for ridiculous oversized vehicles! And yet they grow ever more in popularity, never seeing so much as a muddy puddle.
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
    So, Nony's dress pictures got me to get up the courage to post this one. I'm doing Rent the Runway for the dress that I'm wearing to Hamilton next week (OMG I get to see Hamilton in London!), and while I never do anything this slinky, OMG I love it. I can't tell if it makes my hips look big, or just actually gives me a waist, but oh, it does look fantastic. (And no apologies for the unmade bed. ;)

    nv2sxr7us5de.jpg

    Oh, that's lovely and looks great on you. I really like that color too. Lucky you seeing Hamilton in London!

    The color is the entire reason I got it. They sent out a promo email about jewel holiday colors, and I saw the dress, and had that moment of "I need to have this now."

    I am very very jealous of you seeing Hamilton. If I wasn't a horrible agoraphobic public transport anxietyer I'd make a much more concerted effort to see it but hopefully I'll get there eventually! I finally got to see Book of Mormon and Curious Incident so there is hope.
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
    And I am probably not going to go up to my friend for Christmas day, the combination of a two hour round trip and putting on a face (to very lovely people who don't bat an eye at little orphan me gatecrashing family gatherings!) mean it's just not something I can do and guarantee I am safe doing that driving.

    But I have a stonking meal planned, including bread sauce I made earlier this week (and will portion and freeze for continued consumption) and I shall no doubt be pleasantly sozzled whilst watching the rest of Feud.
  • Christine_72
    Christine_72 Posts: 16,049 Member
    I had the same negotiations with a parking lot on Wednesday. The kicker being they had blokes at the entrance directing people in when clearly there weren't enough spaces. And I pissed someone off because I think I nabbed their space by swinging down a one way system the wrong way for a space two in from the end (so I barely went the wrong way). As I was just pulling in a big 4x4 hit his horn and then camped out behind me for a few minutes. Sorry mate, snooze you lose!

    I have set my alarm for tomorrow morning so I can get in and out of the supermarket as early and as easily as possible. I really wish I didn't care and could be content with frozen veg but nope, I have to go into the fray two days before Christmas because I need my fresh veg. And a pudding. Got to have pudding. Sorry, dessert. I'm a commoner, I eat pudding (which isn't a specific thing like in the US, it's a catch all).

    I don't know if it's the same where you are, but around here, a good majority of the people who drive 4x4's act and drive as if they think that having such a vehicle grants them special privileges. Usually, the more expensive the 4x4 is, the more apparent this effect is.

    Absolutely the same, especially given we are not a nation designed for giant cars given the age of our roads, they were not meant for ridiculous oversized vehicles! And yet they grow ever more in popularity, never seeing so much as a muddy puddle.

    I hate 4'wds, they block people in normal cars view, they're a frickan menace! But the biggest annoyance is, why buy one when your monstrous car will never see a dirt track and you have no intention of ever going 4 wheel driving?? :rage:
  • collectingblues
    collectingblues Posts: 2,541 Member
    So, Nony's dress pictures got me to get up the courage to post this one. I'm doing Rent the Runway for the dress that I'm wearing to Hamilton next week (OMG I get to see Hamilton in London!), and while I never do anything this slinky, OMG I love it. I can't tell if it makes my hips look big, or just actually gives me a waist, but oh, it does look fantastic. (And no apologies for the unmade bed. ;)

    nv2sxr7us5de.jpg

    Oh, that's lovely and looks great on you. I really like that color too. Lucky you seeing Hamilton in London!

    The color is the entire reason I got it. They sent out a promo email about jewel holiday colors, and I saw the dress, and had that moment of "I need to have this now."

    I am very very jealous of you seeing Hamilton. If I wasn't a horrible agoraphobic public transport anxietyer I'd make a much more concerted effort to see it but hopefully I'll get there eventually! I finally got to see Book of Mormon and Curious Incident so there is hope.

    I feel so lucky about it. I'd checked just on a whim -- a friend had posted about the lottery -- and there was a ticket at a decent price for my last night there. I figured the cost would be the same as a tour ticket in 2018, so it was really a once in a lifetime opportunity.
  • GottaBurnEmAll
    GottaBurnEmAll Posts: 7,722 Member
    I had the same negotiations with a parking lot on Wednesday. The kicker being they had blokes at the entrance directing people in when clearly there weren't enough spaces. And I pissed someone off because I think I nabbed their space by swinging down a one way system the wrong way for a space two in from the end (so I barely went the wrong way). As I was just pulling in a big 4x4 hit his horn and then camped out behind me for a few minutes. Sorry mate, snooze you lose!

    I have set my alarm for tomorrow morning so I can get in and out of the supermarket as early and as easily as possible. I really wish I didn't care and could be content with frozen veg but nope, I have to go into the fray two days before Christmas because I need my fresh veg. And a pudding. Got to have pudding. Sorry, dessert. I'm a commoner, I eat pudding (which isn't a specific thing like in the US, it's a catch all).

    I don't know if it's the same where you are, but around here, a good majority of the people who drive 4x4's act and drive as if they think that having such a vehicle grants them special privileges. Usually, the more expensive the 4x4 is, the more apparent this effect is.

    Absolutely the same, especially given we are not a nation designed for giant cars given the age of our roads, they were not meant for ridiculous oversized vehicles! And yet they grow ever more in popularity, never seeing so much as a muddy puddle.

    I hate 4'wds, they block people in normal cars view, they're a frickan menace! But the biggest annoyance is, why buy one when your monstrous car will never see a dirt track and you have no intention of ever going 4 wheel driving?? :rage:

    I will say that at least where I live, some of the people with them do go off roading, and their cars show evidence of this. However, this isn't true of the majority of the vehicle owners and it's certainly not true of the luxury models.

    Vintage, I know of what you speak regarding streets not designed for such things just from seeing trucks driving around Philadelphia. And now, you have these big huge 4x4's trying to navigate around city bus service and sanitation trucks on narrow streets (some still lined with cobblestones) that were laid out when people rode on horses. It's ridiculous.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    T illustrate why Turtle could not be mine, he and Indie got in a fight one time (not the only time), I managed to separate them and get Turtle to depart, turned around and saw blood on the ground, said 'oh Indie, you made Turtle bleed!', then looked at Indie to see blood literally spouting out of his jugular. I have never moved so fast in my life. Grabbed the cat, put my hand over his throat, ran inside, grabbed a cloth to apply pressure, standing in my kitchen with a limp cat in my arms, wondering how the hell I was going to get him to the vet's whilst still applying pressure. Luckily, his fur smooshed over the hole provided an excellent temporary stopper, and the vet was only a three minute drive away. So, fair enough that Indie had some issues with Turtle after that.

    Another time I separated them I ended up at the emergency room at 4am with several to the bone punctures through the top section of my thumb from Indie biting me. That was fun.
  • VictoriaMonique26
    VictoriaMonique26 Posts: 15 Member
    I've been on a diet break for 3 months now
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    edited December 2017
    First dinner salad with lettuce (buttercrunch) instead of baby spinach and no lemon juice, just oil. Pleasantly surprised that it was just fine :). I can totally do this. Still pissed about chocolate though.

    I am going to need to come up with new snack ideas though. Chocolate was a daily staple and handy for extra cals (as was dark choc PB in my protein shakes). I haven't gotten any vanilla protein powder yet, b/c it involves going to the next town, and we've already discussed my feeling on that until after Christmas. Would ordinary peanut butter work with vanilla? I guess if not I could do PB with the plain protein powder.

    Oh, wait, peanuts are off the menu. Hmmmm.
  • Christine_72
    Christine_72 Posts: 16,049 Member
    Nony, Peanut butter goes with EVERYTHING :lol:
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Nony, Peanut butter goes with EVERYTHING :lol:

    I know, but none for me :(
  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 14,237 Member
    OK, Nony, hold on there. I realize you're like desperately looking for an answer here. But, like, aren't you eliminating a few too many things? And if the things you've eliminated already haven't fixed the issue... why have you not re-introduced them?

    Also: what is your procedure to establish, firmly, if something is actually causing the issue or it just coincidentally gets removed at the same time that your issue goes on remission? You can't do double blind. Heck you can't even do single blind testing here!

    Isn't a dermatologist supposed to be able to run a skin test panel or something and already know which items you're likely to react to? Have you already done that? I realize your doctor trusts you; but, are you sort of relieving her of the responsibility of trying to figure out what ails you?
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    PAV8888 wrote: »
    OK, Nony, hold on there. I realize you're like desperately looking for an answer here. But, like, aren't you eliminating a few too many things? And if the things you've eliminated already haven't fixed the issue... why have you not re-introduced them?

    Also: what is your procedure to establish, firmly, if something is actually causing the issue or it just coincidentally gets removed at the same time that your issue goes on remission? You can't do double blind. Heck you can't even do single blind testing here!

    Isn't a dermatologist supposed to be able to run a skin test panel or something and already know which items you're likely to react to? Have you already done that? I realize your doctor trusts you; but, are you sort of relieving her of the responsibility of trying to figure out what ails you?

    Histamine intolerance won't show on skin patch tests, it's a 'pseudo allergy'. There are tests, but whether or not they are actually useful is up for debate. The whole thing is up for debate, there have been studies, but not enough, and there is an unholy amount of woo around it, because people with chronic conditions get desperate. I am ignoring the woo sites (and you should see the lists of things they say to cut out!).

    There may be no fixing the issue, but there may yet be things that help. Cutting out eggs, tomatoes, and gluten all helped (hence why they haven't been reintroduced). And I have tested those since. Eggs seem to be a tolerance level thing, I can probably have a couple and be okay, but I probably can't do that every day. I don't avoid egg in things. Tomatoes, unsure, I'm okay with cooked tomato it seems, at least on the eczema front (remember, this is eczema and hay fever). Gluten, nope, not even a bit.

    The way I see if something is causing the issue is cut these things out for two weeks, reintroduce them one at a time. If I react in some way, it goes again. The list I'm doing is not that extensive - high histamine foods: spinach, easily replaced with lettuce; cheese, well that sucks but doable (note, the older/more fermented anything is, the higher the histamine in it, so I may be okay with young cheeses); eggplant, I'll survive, not a big part of my diet unless I'm making ratatouille; tomato, already out; alcohol, barely ever drink now anyway; vinegar, again hardly ever use it, won't miss it; foods that possibly cause histamine release: citrus, annoying because I use both lemon and lime juice, but survived today eating the things they usually go in just fine; strawberries, yeah that's annoying because I just planted some; nuts, annoying because easy high cals, but almonds are not nuts ;), peanuts, as previous, especially annoying because of the dark choc peanut butter; chocolate, we all know my thoughts on that; egg white, already cut eggs, I can be more mindful of egg in things; additives, I mostly make from scratch anyway; spices, I'll survive.

    It's two weeks. It may come to nothing. But if reducing the histamine load gives even a bit of relief in terms of eczema and/or hay fever, then it's worth it.

    And unless the pattern of the previous two years changes, I won't see any significant reduction in symptoms until Autumn. It will be manageable a lot of the time so long as I'm diligent, and at other times it won't, no matter what I do. But it's getting steadily worse each year, so something's got to give. Dermatologist, allergy shots for hay fever, etc, all that is on the cards, but it's hella expensive. This I can do for free.

    And hell, I was actually ready to go full on elimination diet, nothing but rice early in the year (came to my senses, cut gluten, bad eczema cleared), so this is nothing.
  • Rickster1967
    Rickster1967 Posts: 485 Member
    Going to make wild mushroom risotto next week when I get home from my brothers' house.

    Mmmmm
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,011 Member
    @Nony_Mouse Darn it, good luck with the elimination thing. My dad has suffered from Restless Leg for decades and now that he's in his 70s his medication isn't cutting it. He has refused elimination diet of any kind for any of his issues until now, but his dr pushed and long story short the trigger was alcohol. My dad has had 2 beers with dinner every night for I'd guess 55 years. But it seems feeling like your body is trying to drive you bat kitten crazy is strong motivation because he's done really well at (mostly) cutting it out but it's tough.

    Between dad's RL and my mom's rheumatoid arthritis I knock on wood every day I've made it this far with a fairly cooperative body.

    So I hope you find its just one more thing at least! And is the possible trigger peanuts specifically or all nuts? A friend has a peanut allergy and almond butter is pretty yummy too.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    @Nony_Mouse Darn it, good luck with the elimination thing. My dad has suffered from Restless Leg for decades and now that he's in his 70s his medication isn't cutting it. He has refused elimination diet of any kind for any of his issues until now, but his dr pushed and long story short the trigger was alcohol. My dad has had 2 beers with dinner every night for I'd guess 55 years. But it seems feeling like your body is trying to drive you bat kitten crazy is strong motivation because he's done really well at (mostly) cutting it out but it's tough.

    Between dad's RL and my mom's rheumatoid arthritis I knock on wood every day I've made it this far with a fairly cooperative body.

    So I hope you find its just one more thing at least! And is the possible trigger peanuts specifically or all nuts? A friend has a peanut allergy and almond butter is pretty yummy too.

    The research review specified nuts and peanuts (cos they're not nuts, they're legumes). Some other stuff I've seen says peanuts, cashews, walnuts. I figure almonds are okay because technically not a nut (and actually related to the peach!).

    High histamine food lists are tricky, because the histamine level can vary wildly depending on the freshness of the food. So, anything fermented is going to be higher than its fresh counterpart (yoghurt is up for debate, seems to depend on the cultures used, I'm going with mine is fine), the riper the fruit or vege, the higher the histamine, cooking can also increase histamine. So, eat as fresh as possible, basically. Which I mostly do anyway.

    This is the review paper, if anyone is interested: http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/85/5/1185.long

    The other aspect of course, as @PAV8888 rightly pointed out, is that I haven't had skin patch tests done yet, so I could cut something out, find relief, but it's actually a real allergy, not a histamine thing. In all likelihood, I will end up doing skin patch tests in the not to distant future anyway. Who needs a PhD fund anyway, right? But as with gluten, which I cut out on my own, I don't really give a toss what the underlying pathology is. Other than I maybe sound a little less whackadoo having proof from a dermatologist :tongue:

    I absolutely do have allergies to various pollens, I know that (even without testing), the question is really is my body also not breaking down histamine properly, and is therefore overloaded because of ingested histamine. Working hypothesis is that if that is the case, and I lower the histamine load from foods, I will have an easier time of it with hay fever, at least.
  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 14,237 Member
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    @Nony_Mouse Darn it, good luck with the elimination thing. My dad has suffered from Restless Leg for decades and now that he's in his 70s his medication isn't cutting it. He has refused elimination diet of any kind for any of his issues until now, but his dr pushed and long story short the trigger was alcohol. My dad has had 2 beers with dinner every night for I'd guess 55 years. But it seems feeling like your body is trying to drive you bat kitten crazy is strong motivation because he's done really well at (mostly) cutting it out but it's tough.

    Between dad's RL and my mom's rheumatoid arthritis I knock on wood every day I've made it this far with a fairly cooperative body.

    So I hope you find its just one more thing at least! And is the possible trigger peanuts specifically or all nuts? A friend has a peanut allergy and almond butter is pretty yummy too.

    The research review specified nuts and peanuts (cos they're not nuts, they're legumes). Some other stuff I've seen says peanuts, cashews, walnuts. I figure almonds are okay because technically not a nut (and actually related to the peach!).

    High histamine food lists are tricky, because the histamine level can vary wildly depending on the freshness of the food. So, anything fermented is going to be higher than its fresh counterpart (yoghurt is up for debate, seems to depend on the cultures used, I'm going with mine is fine), the riper the fruit or vege, the higher the histamine, cooking can also increase histamine. So, eat as fresh as possible, basically. Which I mostly do anyway.

    This is the review paper, if anyone is interested: http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/85/5/1185.long

    The other aspect of course, as @PAV8888 rightly pointed out, is that I haven't had skin patch tests done yet, so I could cut something out, find relief, but it's actually a real allergy, not a histamine thing. In all likelihood, I will end up doing skin patch tests in the not to distant future anyway. Who needs a PhD fund anyway, right? But as with gluten, which I cut out on my own, I don't really give a toss what the underlying pathology is. Other than I maybe sound a little less whackadoo having proof from a dermatologist :tongue:

    I absolutely do have allergies to various pollens, I know that (even without testing), the question is really is my body also not breaking down histamine properly, and is therefore overloaded because of ingested histamine. Working hypothesis is that if that is the case, and I lower the histamine load from foods, I will have an easier time of it with hay fever, at least.

    Wuz gonna say peanuts are legumes not nuts; but you're still including them! But then I see you saying they're specifically included. GRRR.

    I hope you find relief. I have to say that I have a much much much milder case which seemed to religiously raise its ugly head in early September and October. Never could figure out ANYTHING that truly conclusively could be linked to it as a trigger. Has subsided, substantially, with weight loss.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    PAV8888 wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    kimny72 wrote: »
    @Nony_Mouse Darn it, good luck with the elimination thing. My dad has suffered from Restless Leg for decades and now that he's in his 70s his medication isn't cutting it. He has refused elimination diet of any kind for any of his issues until now, but his dr pushed and long story short the trigger was alcohol. My dad has had 2 beers with dinner every night for I'd guess 55 years. But it seems feeling like your body is trying to drive you bat kitten crazy is strong motivation because he's done really well at (mostly) cutting it out but it's tough.

    Between dad's RL and my mom's rheumatoid arthritis I knock on wood every day I've made it this far with a fairly cooperative body.

    So I hope you find its just one more thing at least! And is the possible trigger peanuts specifically or all nuts? A friend has a peanut allergy and almond butter is pretty yummy too.

    The research review specified nuts and peanuts (cos they're not nuts, they're legumes). Some other stuff I've seen says peanuts, cashews, walnuts. I figure almonds are okay because technically not a nut (and actually related to the peach!).

    High histamine food lists are tricky, because the histamine level can vary wildly depending on the freshness of the food. So, anything fermented is going to be higher than its fresh counterpart (yoghurt is up for debate, seems to depend on the cultures used, I'm going with mine is fine), the riper the fruit or vege, the higher the histamine, cooking can also increase histamine. So, eat as fresh as possible, basically. Which I mostly do anyway.

    This is the review paper, if anyone is interested: http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/85/5/1185.long

    The other aspect of course, as @PAV8888 rightly pointed out, is that I haven't had skin patch tests done yet, so I could cut something out, find relief, but it's actually a real allergy, not a histamine thing. In all likelihood, I will end up doing skin patch tests in the not to distant future anyway. Who needs a PhD fund anyway, right? But as with gluten, which I cut out on my own, I don't really give a toss what the underlying pathology is. Other than I maybe sound a little less whackadoo having proof from a dermatologist :tongue:

    I absolutely do have allergies to various pollens, I know that (even without testing), the question is really is my body also not breaking down histamine properly, and is therefore overloaded because of ingested histamine. Working hypothesis is that if that is the case, and I lower the histamine load from foods, I will have an easier time of it with hay fever, at least.

    Wuz gonna say peanuts are legumes not nuts; but you're still including them! But then I see you saying they're specifically included. GRRR.

    I hope you find relief. I have to say that I have a much much much milder case which seemed to religiously raise its ugly head in early September and October. Never could figure out ANYTHING that truly conclusively could be linked to it as a trigger. Has subsided, substantially, with weight loss.

    I had eczema as a kid, wool was a definite trigger then (thanks for dressing me in woollen tights and jerseys anyway, Mum), only the occasional bad flare as an adult (like, don't even need a whole hand to count them), up until two years ago. Mid Jan 2015 actually, so weight definitely not a factor. The first summer I put down to stress (there was a boy...) and heat, because it was nutso hot. Subsided considerably in mid Autumn, never even thought there might be food triggers. Came back with a vengeance last December, heat not really a factor cos our summer sucked. Established eggs and tomato, which were my staple lunch, replaced with bread, okay initially, then inner elbows flared massively. Could not get it under control (like, if I hadn't been putting emollient on every half hour, they'd have been cracked and bleeding). That's when I almost went full potato elimination, but decided to cut the most recently increased thing first (bread/gluten). Hey presto. Never really fully settled over autumn/winter, though better than summer for the most part. And you guys know the story of the last couple of months, so...


    Just got the last box of Christmas crackers in my little town. Disney Princess :D We're just gonna roll with it. Not like we're taking this whole thing particularly seriously anyway!

    Oh, and I have clearly adjusted to the heat somewhat. Kayla was like 'omg, so hot' shortly before I dropped her back at the train. I said 'really? I thought it was quite pleasant!'. It's 27 C. But overcast and a bit humid.

    Pavlova is in the oven doing its cooling thing, not really any other food prep to do today. Tidy the house, put fern fronds on the garden, assemble the BBQ (and clean the plate if required). There's more garden weeding I could do, but I really don't need any more cuts and scrapes (bit of a mess after yesterday, particularly bad abrasion above my knee where the Toetoe (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austroderia) got me.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Just so everyone knows I'm not suffering too much, just had black doris plum and creme fraise ice cream for afternoon tea. Still living the flexible eating dream, just subbing some old stuff for new ;)
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  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    JerSchmare wrote: »
    Update: I’m eating at maintenance plus exercise calories, and I lost 2 lbs this week. Eating at a deficit, I tend to gain, or barely be able to lose.

    So many questions...but, I wonder if it has to do with stress. I’ve been off work the last week. Or, maybe my “maintence” eating is really a deficit. So, confused now.

    If you were not seeing losses at what should have been a deficit, then my money is on dropping some cortisol-related water weight (so yes, stress).
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Mere Kihirimete from NZ everyone!!!!!!

    I think Pav may have been on the money with some of my weight drop being loss of exercise-related water weight. Two days of being a busy beaver plus decent evening walks and I've popped up a bit. Huzzah!! Actually been at an accidental deficit the past two days due to not really planning for those big TDEEs (2800 and 2700). I'm sure that will be rectified today.

    I'm not sure I'm going to bother to try to track, what with a lot of the food being nibbly stuff. I'm certainly not sitting there with my phone logging every time I pop a chocolate or a corn chip in my mouth! Would love the data, and even just out of sheer curiosity, but meh.
  • Nony_Mouse
    Nony_Mouse Posts: 5,646 Member
    Yay! Good choice @laurenebargar :)