Coronavirus prep
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ladyreva78 wrote: »The Italian part of Switzerland is reaching a critical number of cases. If it continues as is, they'll be out of space in the intensive care units for critical cases by Monday at the latest. The doctors and nursing staff are exhausted and reaching breaking point. One doctor described the situation as a war zone. Between civil and military ambulances and helicopter transport, the stream of patients isn't slowing down.
They'll be transporting critical patients to other parts of the country, but there's no guarantee that those parts won't be hit hard either.
That we "only" have 27 deaths in 2700 odd cases is probably sheer luck. What's frightning is that more and more younger patients are being admitted to ICU because of how serious their condition is.
So far, we're in semi lock down. Most non-essential shops, museums, cinemas etc are closed. We'll probably soon follow France into a complete lock down.
Sadly, you're our twin. Wishing you the best. It's hard to watch those numbers.4 -
Our ER doctor is in ICU with tested/confirmed corona.
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snowflake954 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »
The US surgeon general said this on Monday.
I've heard others saying it for quite a bit longer. It's one of those "tomorrow will never come" stories, right? As long as you say "2 weeks" every day for the next several months, it can never be proven wrong.
What they've been saying is that we are following Italy's track, which of course has changed over time. I've seen nothing that disputes that.
Re the Monday statement from the surgeon general:
US surgeon general: US cases are where Italy was 2 weeks ago
by: Associated Press
Posted: Mar 16, 2020 / 09:44 AM CDT / Updated: Mar 16, 2020 / 09:44 AM CDT
WASHINGTON — The U.S. surgeon general said Monday that the number of coronavirus cases in the United States has reached the level that Italy recorded two weeks ago, a sign that infections are expected to rise in America as the government steps up testing and financial markets continue to fall.
“We are at a critical inflection point in this country, people. We are where Italy was two weeks ago in terms of our numbers,” U.S. Surgeon General Dr. Jerome Adams told Fox News. “When you look at the projections, there’s every chance that we could be Italy.”
Two weeks ago, there were 1,700 cases of coronavirus in Italy and the country had reported 34 deaths. Now, Italy is reporting an estimated 25,000 cases and more than 1,800 people have died. There are about 3,800 cases reported in the United States and so far, more than 65 people have died from coronavirus.
Read more: https://wgntv.com/news/coronavirus/us-surgeon-general-us-cases-are-where-italy-was-2-weeks-ago/
And now we've got over 30,000 cases, over 3,000 dead, over 2,500 recovered. They are going to try blood transfusions from recovered to critical cases. I'm not being precise on the numbers because they're changing rapidly.
Interesting. I presume they are hoping that the transfusions would allow some immune support.3 -
snowflake954 wrote: »Our numbers today are scary--I'll spare you. You can get them online. They helicoptered 50 grave patients from North to South yesterday because there is no more space in the Northern hospitals. One died on the way. A doctor died yesterday. China is sending us doctors and supplies--hugs to them. The US is putting up a tent ER in Cremona. It's a hospital group called "Good Samaritans" I think. I know many of you are thinking "but we need them at home!" and this is true. However, they will see first hand how the Italians are coping and will then go back better prepared for you. I'm proud of my country for doing this.
The Italians are fighting this tooth and nail, and I'm proud of them too. I used to post from the front lines--you guys are almost there, so soon all of you will be taking over. Hugs to all--stay strong.
I am so, so sorry for what all of you are going through. I noticed that your number of new cases seems to have leveled off--a week after you went into national lockdown (3/10). Does that sound correct to you? I will be praying for all of you.
Has your government announced any plans to help people who are completely out of work and will not be getting paid anytime soon? If so, what have they said and do folks in Italy expect it to work?
Yes, we've had rollout on 2 different economic packages. They will be spending millions to right the economy when we can raise our heads. Some say it isn't enough and want a tax moratorium for 2020. Don't worry, your governments will too--they will have to. There will be help for businesses, families, transport, rent, ...... it's a long list. I'm reading posts about people desperate about their jobs. Try not to worry - just fight the virus for now. When the dust settles there will be help. Our richest citizens and companies are also stepping up. Italy has a high debt now, and this will push it higher, but the capital infusion that is to come may just start our engines. Fingers crossed. However, I'm also an optimist by nature.12 -
@snowflake954 Appreciate your reporting from the "front" ! It looks like the US is tracking pretty closely to Italy. We are in for some crappy reality very soon.
A somber note. My husband's coworker texted him last night. She lives in a rural part of OK and her 2 parents are older (70s) Dad was not in great health as it was. He has Corona. They took him to the small rural hospital and they attempted to treat him. She texted us and told my spouse that the hospital sent them home as they did not have a bed in ICU with a respirator available for him. This is what is coming. Doctors will be deciding who gets the scarce resources.22 -
@snowflake954 Appreciate your reporting from the "front" ! It looks like the US is tracking pretty closely to Italy. We are in for some crappy reality very soon.
A somber note. My husband's coworker texted him last night. She lives in a rural part of OK and her 2 parents are older (70s) Dad was not in great health as it was. He has Corona. They took him to the small rural hospital and they attempted to treat him. She texted us and told my spouse that the hospital sent them home as they did not have a bed in ICU with a respirator available for him. This is what is coming. Doctors will be deciding who gets the scarce resources.
So sorry, when it hits someone you know, it hurts. Stay safe.7 -
pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).8 -
pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
I think I can answer that. I wear them grocery shopping, put them on just before entering and take off just after paying--then throw away. I pay cash. Also take off, rolling inside out. Wearing gloves is discouraged for the general populace because it gives a false sense of safety (people touch their faces, reuse the gloves......) and can lead to contamination. Now that's what we were told, but there might be another explanation.1 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.2 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
Yes, it is airborne for a minimum of 4 to 5 ft. That's why--masks. On a bus in China a man without a mask, who had the virus, sat in one of the back rows. People in the front of the bus were contaminated. The bus was not crowded. People wearing masks on the bus did not get the virus. The Chinese did extensive testing on this.11 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
There are lots of articles about this. Here are a few. Feel free to find one from a source you trust.
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/16/who-considers-airborne-precautions-for-medical-staff-after-study-shows-coronavirus-can-survive-in-air.html
https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/coronavirus-disease-2019-vs-the-flu8 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »
The US surgeon general said this on Monday.
I've heard others saying it for quite a bit longer. It's one of those "tomorrow will never come" stories, right? As long as you say "2 weeks" every day for the next several months, it can never be proven wrong.
What they've been saying is that we are following Italy's track, which of course has changed over time. I've seen nothing that disputes that.
Re the Monday statement from the surgeon general:
US surgeon general: US cases are where Italy was 2 weeks ago
by: Associated Press
Posted: Mar 16, 2020 / 09:44 AM CDT / Updated: Mar 16, 2020 / 09:44 AM CDT
WASHINGTON — The U.S. surgeon general said Monday that the number of coronavirus cases in the United States has reached the level that Italy recorded two weeks ago, a sign that infections are expected to rise in America as the government steps up testing and financial markets continue to fall.
“We are at a critical inflection point in this country, people. We are where Italy was two weeks ago in terms of our numbers,” U.S. Surgeon General Dr. Jerome Adams told Fox News. “When you look at the projections, there’s every chance that we could be Italy.”
Two weeks ago, there were 1,700 cases of coronavirus in Italy and the country had reported 34 deaths. Now, Italy is reporting an estimated 25,000 cases and more than 1,800 people have died. There are about 3,800 cases reported in the United States and so far, more than 65 people have died from coronavirus.
Read more: https://wgntv.com/news/coronavirus/us-surgeon-general-us-cases-are-where-italy-was-2-weeks-ago/
And now we've got over 30,000 cases, over 3,000 dead, over 2,500 recovered. They are going to try blood transfusions from recovered to critical cases. I'm not being precise on the numbers because they're changing rapidly.
Interesting. I presume they are hoping that the transfusions would allow some immune support.
Here is some information on how that works
https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/03/13/covid-19-antibody-sera-arturo-casadevall/2 -
I'm not sure gloves indoors would be much of a protection. Gloves in public transit, absolutely (although I have thankfully been able to quit public transit, likely later than I should have). But a lot of the issue is touching your face after touching something, and that would probably be as easy or even easier with gloves, and people wearing gloves would seem likely not to wash their hands (gloved, I guess) as often.2
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Yesterday I requisitioned some some regularly ordered and used items, as it was that time, again.
Pump hand sanitizer for our admitting desk, amount received? Zero.
Ordered five boxes of Medium nitrile gloves. Received? Three.
Also placed my regular order for disinfecting wipes, my usual order of ten (which holds us for about two non-pandemic months; we order bulk because we have room for it and I am not a huge fan of our requisition process, LOL). Received only four, and not our regular brand, but Caviwipes, which we hadn't used in years.
I understand that we need to conserve, but I also know that this isn't going to get us through an entire four weeks. These are items that can't NOT be cleaned; wheelchairs, stretchers and patient lift equipment. We keep one at admitting for the wheelchairs and common surfaces, one in storage for the stretchers, and two in our regular area. We will make do and adjust to the new normal.
We have, as a facility, started screening visitors at the remaining available entrances to the building; Sick go to ED entrance, visitors go around to the main entrance, PT goes to that area, and Diagnostics and Infusion Therapy can come in through Admitting.
I think I mentioned that our Cafeteria stopped allowing any self-serve on Monday. Monday evening TPTB closed it to the public (keeping it available for employees and registered guests), and tonight will start closing at 6:30. It's a ghost town in there, too.
All elective surgeries stopped effective today (announced yesterday) and they have cut staffing in surgical services to only accommodate the need, so I have friends sitting home today.
Our facility is supposed to start screening incoming employees as we arrive tomorrow, so I've told my team to prep for possible lines coming in and plan accordingly to be on time.
As I've been hearing much of the morning, *kitten* just got real in my little corner of NC.
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I just found a great Washington Post article with simulators showing the advantages of social distancing: https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/world/corona-simulator/4
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pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
I know others have advanced good thoughts about this . . . but when you asked, I started having dark thoughts of not-very-science-savvy people wearing their employer-provided free gloves in the subway, and keeping the same ones on in the office through the work day, thinking they were protecting themselves. 😬11 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
A critical care doctor working with COVID-19 patients addressed this in a video recently. It's "airborn" in certain hospital situations - primarily because of nebulizer use and the high pressure ventilation systems in hospitals. There was something else - something to do with how venitlators work? However, he cautioned that this information would be misunderstood by the media and general public.
"The notion of viral particles hanging in the air, ready to infect passersby, may seem scary, but to become an aerosol, droplets containing viral particles must first be transformed into a light mist, thin enough to be supported by the air. By definition, aerosols are less than 0.0002 inches (5 microns) in diameter, while typical respiratory droplets exceed this size.
"Based on what we know about other respiratory viruses, we don't think that SARS-CoV-2 gets aerosolized in everyday settings," Morris said. "Rather, aerosolization, if it happens at all for SARS-CoV-2, is likely to happen in health care settings," according to recent studies, Morris said.10 -
nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
Agreed. It is still considered aerosol droplet. I haven't heard any evidence that it stays airborne.2 -
snowflake954 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
Yes, it is airborne for a minimum of 4 to 5 ft. That's why--masks. On a bus in China a man without a mask, who had the virus, sat in one of the back rows. People in the front of the bus were contaminated. The bus was not crowded. People wearing masks on the bus did not get the virus. The Chinese did extensive testing on this.
That isn't airborne. It seems pedantic, but there's a difference between aerosol and airborne.8 -
snowflake954 wrote: »nutmegoreo wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »pitbullpuppy wrote: »My office has started dispensing latex gloves for the commute. We are asked not to wear them in the office. Most people are working from home already.
What is their logic in not having employees wear gloves in the office? I'm asking sincerely, I'm not sure how to word it without sounding confrontational.
It's airborne and we don't have enough gloves and masks for our first responders, do they don't want people panic buying them. The general public can wash their hands and not touch their faces. We NEED the docs, nurses, people that do X-Rays, hospital workers and first responders to have these for now. I see us in a couple of months having them for the general public (older and immuno compromised first).
What is your evidence for it being airborne? I have seen nothing to suggest this.
Yes, it is airborne for a minimum of 4 to 5 ft. That's why--masks. On a bus in China a man without a mask, who had the virus, sat in one of the back rows. People in the front of the bus were contaminated. The bus was not crowded. People wearing masks on the bus did not get the virus. The Chinese did extensive testing on this.
That isn't airborne. It seems pedantic, but there's a difference between aerosol and airborne.
Oh--thanks. I'm not at all sciencey and don't know the terms. Thanks for the correction. Just as long as people realize why we need "social distancing".6
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