Holy sexism, batman!

TR0berts

Feeling threatened is subjective. Was it not sexist of her to assume the worst about two guys who were standing outside of a building, simply because they were male? She admitted that she changed her demeanor before they ever engaged her in any way. Now, do I necessarily blame her for doing that or think it is ok that they made rude comments? Absolutely not. But she made a choice and changed her actions based on gender, which is sexist. She probably wouldn't have done that if it were two women.

The guys coming out of the elevator were drunk, and didn't do anything but walk by and look at her. They didn't engage her in any way. Did they look at her inappropriately, or did she just feel that way because of the previous encounter? If she could see they were drunk, who knows what they were thinking. They could have been trying to figure out if they knew her. Not sexism.

I'd also like to point out that she herself had been drinking, which could have affected her perception of the situations. Would the guys still have yelled something? Probably; some people are just jerks. I'm sorry that happened to the OP, I've been there myself. I've even crossed the street to avoid walking past a group of guys and had them yell at me for doing so, but hey, I made a choice based on my comfort level and my own sexist biases.

Yeah - this was pretty much my reaction to this.

MM_1982

How is this sexism?

Maybe it's slight harassment, but I don't see any sexism.

1PatientBear

whatever happened to people just being plain old A-holes….why do we have to extrapolate it to sexism, racism, or whatever the flavor of the day is???

the dudes were a bunch of D-bags…it happens, they are out there, deal with it...

This. Not everything is an "-ism." To quote a philosopher from the 80's:

Not that I condone fascism, or any -ism for that matter. -Ism's in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an -ism, he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon, "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me." Good point there. After all, he was the walrus. I could be the walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off people.

As for what happened to the OP, that ain't sexism and that ain't harassment. That's just a couple of guys being jackholes.

LiftAllThePizzas

Assuming every male wants to attack you is sexist.

amyfullbrook

I wouldn't particulaly call this sexism...even though I do believe sexism still exists in the world. I'd call this plain old harrassment, men being pigs and thinking they are 'hard' by making a woman feel uncomfortable.
Hope you are ok, it's not nice especially when you are on your own or it's dark outside.
I would always recommend walking straight, shoulders back, head up and make direct eye contact. This way they know they are not intimidating you...in my experience they either look away with an embarrassed expression or just smile and walk off.

W0rthless_Her0

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine.

Call me crazy but different people have different perception of what goes on in the world around them even without alcohol. (Theres always multiple sides to a story).

If you can't feel safe walking around your own home, there's a problem.

Normally in a community people learn to recognize each other from daily comings and goings. Its not good that you dont really feel safe in a place you live. If you cant feel safe there, then where can you feel safe? In addition, maybe the feelings you have about living in your particular area became more apparent after having a couple of drinks? Is there area you live in bad?

MyChocolateDiet

Since this is a motivation and support thread I realize my responses to this post are limited to motivation and support:grumble: .

I too am motivated by wine. :drinker: I support your decision to close the doors on those guys. :flowerforyou: That's all I am allowed to say within the parameters of this thread as per where it's posted. I have a LOT more to say though, but I will refrain. I would however like to counsel OP to tell her story to BF and mama and heed any advice they have to give, no matter how sexist or controlling it may seem on the face of it. :huh: Also there has been some very good non-victimey advice given here which I support not as a guarantee, but more as just a strengthening of your odds not to become a statistic.

suelegal

The fact that a woman can't go about her business in the evening without feeling threatened is a sign that sexism is alive and well. Why would she feel threatened by guys 'just looking' or 'admiring' if there weren't too many men with a habit of harassing and assaulting women? Look up the figures for the proportion of women who have been assaulted anywhere in the world. Of course if we were being entirely logical, the fear should be directed more towards acquaintances, but that's not the way fear and intimidation work.

How come everyone is suggesting self-defence classes/body-language cues for the woman or trying to downplay the guys' demeanour without addressing how to make men socialise with women appropriately without making them fearful for their safety?

It infuriates me that this woman had to tell her mother and boyfriend where she was going just to leave her house. You may claim that she is being oversensitive or fearful but we all know that her reactions are entirely reasonable.

How come no one seems to be saying of the men above: if you'admire' a woman, don't choose one trying to get into her house in the evening in a quiet stairwell, don't cat call, and don't stand there gawking/drooling openly as how is she supposed to work out what your next move may be?

For what it is worth, I am rarely the subject of this kind of behaviour and the few times it has happened I have rarely felt worried about my safety because I am more than capable of looking after myself and handling idiots. Nevertheless, it is still nauseating, degrading and disturbing. There is no sense of self-esteem to be gained from being viewed/treated like a piece of meat.

^this!

MyChocolateDiet

Assuming every male wants to attack you is sexist.

Ummm, I like yer rubik's cubes...

ianthamfyolek

And this is why I'm a feminist.

Sorry this had to happen to you - I know it sucks.

Let's be honest; you don't have to be at your goal weight to get attention. You don't need to have a Baywatch bod to turn heads. You don't even need to be looking for attention to get it.

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case. Everything's great until I get home, and on the walkway to the building is some guy. No big deal. Across the way on the grass is another guy. Now it's kind of a deal. But still, head down, keep marching, and don't look like you're asking for trouble, right? Wrong. Catcalling. Not flattering. I never pull the door closed on anyone, but tonight I made an exception, both for the outer and inner (key access only) doors. Once I'm in, two inebriated guys come out of the elevator. No catcalls, just uncomfortable looks. You know the kind when you're coveting a fancy dress or plate of food? Not the look anyone is supposed to give a stranger. I walk in a wide arc around, then get in the elevator and lay on the "close doors" button, just in case. My heart doesn't stop pounding until I'm behind the locked door of my apartment, and even then, I keep an ear out just in case anyone saw my floor from the lobby.

Say what you want. Say sexism is a myth, and feminism is redundant because women have no reason to feel marginalized. If you can't feel safe walking around your own home, there's a problem.

Not looking for pity or attention, just a little positive support.

tmauck4472

The truth of the matter is she should be able to walk where she damn well pleases without being harassed by anyone, as well as anyone else out there that wants to walk down the road and mind their own business. But we all know in our society we have those people who seem to think they have the right to harass others, even berate them, even do bodily harm to them. Freedom of speech should NOT lend its self to harassing others for any reason.

I suggest if your going to continue to walk down the street at night alone you learn to protect yourself and carry a weapon of sorts. A GUN would be my first choice, either a stun gun or one that shoots bullets. MS is open carry and honestly when I move I will be purchasing myself a gun and using my right to do so. I'm also going to get the permit to conceal carry. Although at this point I'm not getting any catcalls or even a second look, not sure if I should be thankful or upset....:laugh: Hey I'm old so yeah!!!

W0rthless_Her0

You wanna know whats sexist? The title of the thread. Why batman?

Why not batgirl?



Now THATS sexist!

Illini_Jim

This is why I don't look at women.

Wait, what? Does not compute...

wiscck

She got catcalled and harassed because she was a woman. Chances are those guys wouldn't have done it to a man. That makes it sexism.

Check out the Twitter account @EverydaySexism for more examples. It's horrifying and disturbing, but it's important that everyone realizes that this still goes on, and it happens no matter how women are dressed or what their posture is. FFS, telling the OP that she wouldn't have been catcalled if she had been standing up straight just feeds into the whole culture that allows this to happen.

MyChocolateDiet

And this is why I'm a feminist.

Sorry this had to happen to you - I know it sucks.

Let's be honest; you don't have to be at your goal weight to get attention. You don't need to have a Baywatch bod to turn heads. You don't even need to be looking for attention to get it.

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case. Everything's great until I get home, and on the walkway to the building is some guy. No big deal. Across the way on the grass is another guy. Now it's kind of a deal. But still, head down, keep marching, and don't look like you're asking for trouble, right? Wrong. Catcalling. Not flattering. I never pull the door closed on anyone, but tonight I made an exception, both for the outer and inner (key access only) doors. Once I'm in, two inebriated guys come out of the elevator. No catcalls, just uncomfortable looks. You know the kind when you're coveting a fancy dress or plate of food? Not the look anyone is supposed to give a stranger. I walk in a wide arc around, then get in the elevator and lay on the "close doors" button, just in case. My heart doesn't stop pounding until I'm behind the locked door of my apartment, and even then, I keep an ear out just in case anyone saw my floor from the lobby.

Say what you want. Say sexism is a myth, and feminism is redundant because women have no reason to feel marginalized. If you can't feel safe walking around your own home, there's a problem.

Not looking for pity or attention, just a little positive support.

I'm sorry I guess I just don't see how this would make one conclude to become a feminist? Also I'm not sure if that word means what you think it means, or offers the protections you think it does?

WhoHa42

I only like girls, so I only hit on girls. Am I sexist?

msf74

I'd rather acknowledge the fact that the world is what it is and conduct myself accordingly.

I consider this to be an exceptionally good strategy.

I think that really this type of situation is something the OP and most women in reality will have to handle as they lose weight. Life presents you with another type of reality you have to learn to deal with when you lose weight.

It's not fair, or right or just however.

Loss4TheWin

I can understand the cat calls being annoying. The guys that catcalled didn't have the best execution. Catcalling doesn't work. Also, OP was not specific as to what the catcalls actually were. That's key information.

Also, two guys walked past her. Many times two guys have walked past me and I've felt weird. This is not a big deal.

I would not mind a night that involved some ladies in the immediate vicinity of my place leering at me, so long as they are good looking ladies.

Can't tell if troll or...or....I don't even know what the "or" would be. Some mixture of clueless, insensitive, boorish, chauvinist....

dbmata

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

MyChocolateDiet

She got catcalled and harassed because she was a woman. Chances are those guys wouldn't have done it to a man. That makes it sexism.

Check out the Twitter account @EverydaySexism for more examples. It's horrifying and disturbing, but it's important that everyone realizes that this still goes on, and it happens no matter how women are dressed or what their posture is. FFS, telling the OP that she wouldn't have been catcalled if she had been standing up straight just feeds into the whole culture that allows this to happen.

I don't think anyone told her she wouldn't have gotten catcalled but only that it might have made her less likely to suffer other problems that might ensue.

I sincerely believe that NOT ONE single person so far offering advice has done so with the intention of subjugating OP her remanding her to a role of second class citizen as a woman. I have read some of these posters before and sincerely feel they were offering these suggestions out of concern for OP's safety in the future if heading out at night alone is common practice that she intends to repeat.

sjohnny

And this is why I'm a feminist.

Sorry this had to happen to you - I know it sucks.

Let's be honest; you don't have to be at your goal weight to get attention. You don't need to have a Baywatch bod to turn heads. You don't even need to be looking for attention to get it.

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case. Everything's great until I get home, and on the walkway to the building is some guy. No big deal. Across the way on the grass is another guy. Now it's kind of a deal. But still, head down, keep marching, and don't look like you're asking for trouble, right? Wrong. Catcalling. Not flattering. I never pull the door closed on anyone, but tonight I made an exception, both for the outer and inner (key access only) doors. Once I'm in, two inebriated guys come out of the elevator. No catcalls, just uncomfortable looks. You know the kind when you're coveting a fancy dress or plate of food? Not the look anyone is supposed to give a stranger. I walk in a wide arc around, then get in the elevator and lay on the "close doors" button, just in case. My heart doesn't stop pounding until I'm behind the locked door of my apartment, and even then, I keep an ear out just in case anyone saw my floor from the lobby.

Say what you want. Say sexism is a myth, and feminism is redundant because women have no reason to feel marginalized. If you can't feel safe walking around your own home, there's a problem.

Not looking for pity or attention, just a little positive support.

You're a feminist because guys stare at drunk women? What a deep and meaningful reason for the label you have applied to yourself.

ladymiseryali

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

Um, where did it say she drove a car? It sounds to me like she walked.

sjohnny

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

Where did it say she was driving?

msf74

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

Have you been drinking?

dbmata

The truth of the matter is she should be able to walk where she damn well pleases without being harassed by anyone, as well as anyone else out there that wants to walk down the road and mind their own business. But we all know in our society we have those people who seem to think they have the right to harass others, even berate them, even do bodily harm to them. Freedom of speech should NOT lend its self to harassing others for any reason.

I suggest if your going to continue to walk down the street at night alone you learn to protect yourself and carry a weapon of sorts. A GUN would be my first choice, either a stun gun or one that shoots bullets. MS is open carry and honestly when I move I will be purchasing myself a gun and using my right to do so. I'm also going to get the permit to conceal carry. Although at this point I'm not getting any catcalls or even a second look, not sure if I should be thankful or upset....:laugh: Hey I'm old so yeah!!!

... so you'd shoot someone for catcalling you? Seems legit.

Thanks for giving moonbats, idiot libtards, and dems fuel against us gun owners.

dbmata

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

Um, where did it say she drove a car? It sounds to me like she walked.

That will be the out, for sure. However if you read how it was written, it's apparent that she drove, particularly with telling her boyfriend, and parsing location by time not distance. There are cues there that are really apparent.

ladymiseryali

The truth of the matter is she should be able to walk where she damn well pleases without being harassed by anyone, as well as anyone else out there that wants to walk down the road and mind their own business. But we all know in our society we have those people who seem to think they have the right to harass others, even berate them, even do bodily harm to them. Freedom of speech should NOT lend its self to harassing others for any reason.

I suggest if your going to continue to walk down the street at night alone you learn to protect yourself and carry a weapon of sorts. A GUN would be my first choice, either a stun gun or one that shoots bullets. MS is open carry and honestly when I move I will be purchasing myself a gun and using my right to do so. I'm also going to get the permit to conceal carry. Although at this point I'm not getting any catcalls or even a second look, not sure if I should be thankful or upset....:laugh: Hey I'm old so yeah!!!

... so you'd shoot someone for catcalling you? Seems legit.

Thanks for giving moonbats, idiot libtards, and dems fuel against us gun owners.

"libtards"? What are you, 12?

ladymiseryali

Earlier tonight: I've had a few glasses of wine. I head to the liquor store 10 mins away at 9:00 pm, alone, but made sure my mum and boyfriend knew what was up just in case.

So you were drunk driving? Everything after that has no credibility. You were drunk and paranoid you'd get popped for what you did, you then took said paranoia and projected it towards men.

That is sexist, but not in the way you're trying to craft the narrative. Please stop drinking and driving.

Um, where did it say she drove a car? It sounds to me like she walked.

That will be the out, for sure. However if you read how it was written, it's apparent that she drove, particularly with telling her boyfriend, and parsing location by time not distance. There are cues there that are really apparent.

Um, I read it with the impression that she walked. Are you trolling or something?

RllyGudTweetr

"No one, is to look at anyone else, ever, again!" - paraphrased from Bill Cosby.

dbmata

Have you been drinking?

Woo boy, now THAT was clever. Just... amazingly clever. You, you need a trophy or something.



GFY, YMMV