Paleo?
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What's your point? He specifically addressed protein powders and you're trying to counter that specific point with his general guidelines? That's asinine.
So he doesn't really believe anything he writes? Either he thinks added sugars are a poison or they aren't, same with processed foods. You can't say well these are terrible terrible things, then say but this product I sell is alright cause I happen to sell it.0 -
Warning, Long Post!
I've been eating a paleo/primal diet for the last 2 years and I have had terrific results both in weight loss and weight control but the real differnce for me was in how eating natrual, nutrition dense, whole foods and cutting out processed, refined, starchy foods altered how much and how often I need to eat.
I have never had problems loosing weight when I decide I want to do it. The problem is that I would gain weight till I got fed up with it and then loose it then gain it then loose it. The proverbial dieting roller coaster. I was looking for a way that I could eat and enjoy so that I didn't gain the weight in the first place hoever, I had given up hope because once I turned 13 I turned into a human garbage disposal. I consumed amazingly large quantities of food all the time because I was always hungry! I was sick and tired of being hungry all the time and I was looking for something new.
I read a book by Gary Taubs called Good Calories, Bad Calories that changed my view of nutrition. In the book he makes the argument that it is resitance to insilin that is the cuase of weight gain and the source of the obesity epidemic in America. I won't go into it too much, you can read the book or get the smaller version called Why Do We Get Fat which is a summary of his previous work. Control Insilin and you control your weight is the bottom line.
I gave it a shot and began eliminating surgar in all its forms from my diet. I didn't do it all at once. I started with the obious Sugar, then moved to starchy foods like pasta, then to bread, so on and so forth until the only carbohydrates that I was consuming came from fruit and vegetables. I added alot more fat making up 70% of my daily calories and moderated my protein intake to 1gram per 1lb of lean body weight wich for me is 80 grams of protein a day or about 30% of my daily calories. You can set these in myfitnesspal to the levels that you want.
I began to loose weight emediately which was fine, I'd lost weight in the past by not eating sugar for a while, no big deal. What surprised me though was when I had eliminated most of the carbohydrates from my diet I noticed that I was not as hungry all the time. The longer I went with the reduced carbohydrate diet the less violent my hunger became. I also noticed that I didn't have to eat as much at my meals to feel full and satisfied.
After I had done all of this I was introduced to the Paleo/Primal diet and thought it was interesting that it so closely resembled what I had done already. High fat, moderate protein, and low carbohydrate just like what I had discoved for myself.
A year later I am able to easily keep my weight regulated. As of this writing I hadn't gotten on a scale in a month or two so I just checked and I'm holding steady at my ideal body weight.
What I would recomend is doing some homework outside of the message boards and find out what is going to work for you. Start with small changes, they add up over time and are way easier to maintain than big sweeping changes that have you feeling like you have deprived yourself of something.
Some places I would recomend to start your study on Primal/ Paleo are:
www.marksdailyapple.com
www.eatingacademy.com
www.garytaubes.com
Lost of information on those pages to help you understand the Paleo/ Primal diet and how it works and why it works and what it may or may not do for you. Then go out and experiment. You know your body best.
Good Luck
Wade
"I read a book by Gary Taubs called Good Calories, Bad Calories that changed my view of nutrition. In the book he makes the argument that it is resitance to insilin that is the cuase of weight gain and the source of the obesity epidemic in America. I won't go into it too much, you can read the book or get the smaller version called Why Do We Get Fat which is a summary of his previous work. Control Insilin and you control your weight is the bottom line."
Why didn't you also eat low protein and low carb, both are insulinogenic. Whoopsie0 -
OP - ini the end it is up to you to do what you want…
here is what I will say
1. paleo has nothing to do with what our paleolithic brethren ate…
2. paleo is not some magical fat burning process that is superior to others…
3. you can eat in a 500 calorie per day deficit, work out/move more, eat the foods that YOU like, and you will lose just as much weight/fat as you would on paleo…
if you want to do it because you think you might like it, then by all means do it ….but don't go into thinking that after two months of paleo you are going to lose more fat then you would on a calorie deficit …..
pretty solid.
You know what I like about the paleo craze- it gives you recipes you can google by adding 'paleo' that you know will have a restricted ingredient list- for someone who is lazy as ballz and doesn't like to cook excessively complicated meals- it works out great.
My ice cream and oreo obsessions lands me squarely in the "not paleo" category- but if you look at what people who are serious BB eat- look at their diet - it's hysterically close to paleo while they are cutting- but none of them are paleo- but the macro's you need for certain things- it works out well.
I don't call myself paleo- for a lot of reasons- (because it' wacky) but if you look at what I eat regularly- it's very primal/paleo-ish- lots of steak, chicken and veggies, salads and bacon and eggs. milk and yogurt are staples and then- chili and black bean soup are my big legume thing- but that's only winter time.
You can eat like something and not ascribe to the cult.
Not everything needs a frigging label.
My experience seems to be different. Whenever I see a paleo recipe, it seems the list of ingredients is not only long, but also full of uber expensive ingredients, stuff I'd have to go to the "health food" store to even purchase. We are clearly looking in different places.
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What's your point? He specifically addressed protein powders and you're trying to counter that specific point with his general guidelines? That's asinine.
So he doesn't really believe anything he writes? Either he thinks added sugars are a poison or they aren't, same with processed foods. You can't say well these are terrible terrible things, then say but this product I sell is alright cause I happen to sell it.
:drinker:0 -
Right now I'm doing a 'paleo' thing called Whole30 - I'm genuinely interested in how certain foods make me feel, and the restrictive psychological component is a nice reset button for me. I have very, very poor impulse control with chips and sweets lately so when my game isn't working I change the game - temporarily. So far it's helped my acid reflux a bit more, made me more regular (and pain free) and I've been viewing food as more of a fuel than anything. I'm happy with that.
The idea is to reintroduce 'noncompliant' foods slowly after you're done with the 30 days of restricted eating to see how they make you feel. If they make you feel like dog**** then you reduce or eliminate them.
All I know is - counting the days for chickpeas to come back
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The Mac Daddy Sisson also explains that when you have a high carb "cheat" day every so often it resets certain hormone levels and is actually good for you, resets hormone levels that burn fat so you get leaner.
ETA: The hormone reset research appears extensively in this book: The Man 2.0: Engineering the Alpha.
The Mac Daddy Sisson... I like that... I'm going to roll with it...
Doesn't "Mac Daddy Sisson" also sell a processed protein supplement... to go along with his anti-processed food campaign?
Seems like he's mostly just looking to make money off of a fad.
The Mac Daddy sure does sell protein and a few supplements. I've never used it, but for all the free help along the way I've gleamed from his articles, website, blog and books I borrowed from the library, I sure do hope someone buys the supplements and that he earns a buck for his efforts.
Unlike a lot of programs, there is no monthly fee or anything like that related to using the site, forums, recipes, or books (some books are on the website free as a PDF).
Because I'd been using the program for years with no monetary compensation, I didn't mind at all making my only purchase from the site, a T-shirt for my boyfriend on Valentines day that says "Get Primal".
ETA: I get my protein from a shopper's club Sam's in bulk because it's cheap, but if I could afford it, I would certainly love to try his Primal stuff.
You have a very bastardized definition of paleo and primal. Why are you supplementing at all? Shouldn't the well-defined list of foods provide everything you need without resorting to highly processed products like a protein powder? Kind of seems to completely go against the underlying principles of the diet.
It does (regards foods you eat offering everything you require - maybe with the exception of additional omega 3 and vit d - but that's the same in most diets) You are not required to buy supplements to do the diet. In fact in the blogs and podcasts it's not mentioned (except for number 7 podcast) which is talking about supplements as a whole.
He owns a supplement business and sells them - he doesn't push his supplements on people that follow his diet plan - what's the problem.
As far a bastardised version of primal - I'm not sure I follow! Do you know much about the primal blueprint? I would agree that the primal blueprint is a bastardised version of the strict paleo diet - but no one is saying otherwise.0 -
I love bread and bacon0
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I find the "verbal gymnastics" that people do to fit paleo into their lifestyle rather amusing...Like well I am going to do Paleo 80% of the time during the week, but then on weekends I will have a "non-paleo day" and then be back at it on Monday"
or how there are like thirty different variations of it..
all rather amusing...
Assuming there were any benefits to Paleo, why the heck would you not just commit to it 100%?
I am at least 40% paleo because I eat plenty of meat. :bigsmile:0 -
The Mac Daddy Sisson also explains that when you have a high carb "cheat" day every so often it resets certain hormone levels and is actually good for you, resets hormone levels that burn fat so you get leaner.
ETA: The hormone reset research appears extensively in this book: The Man 2.0: Engineering the Alpha.
The Mac Daddy Sisson... I like that... I'm going to roll with it...
Doesn't "Mac Daddy Sisson" also sell a processed protein supplement... to go along with his anti-processed food campaign?
Seems like he's mostly just looking to make money off of a fad.
The Mac Daddy sure does sell protein and a few supplements. I've never used it, but for all the free help along the way I've gleamed from his articles, website, blog and books I borrowed from the library, I sure do hope someone buys the supplements and that he earns a buck for his efforts.
Unlike a lot of programs, there is no monthly fee or anything like that related to using the site, forums, recipes, or books (some books are on the website free as a PDF).
Because I'd been using the program for years with no monetary compensation, I didn't mind at all making my only purchase from the site, a T-shirt for my boyfriend on Valentines day that says "Get Primal".
ETA: I get my protein from a shopper's club Sam's in bulk because it's cheap, but if I could afford it, I would certainly love to try his Primal stuff.
You have a very bastardized definition of paleo and primal. Why are you supplementing at all? Shouldn't the well-defined list of foods provide everything you need without resorting to highly processed products like a protein powder? Kind of seems to completely go against the underlying principles of the diet.
It does. You are not required to buy supplements to do the diet. In fact in the blogs and podcasts it's not mentioned (except for number 7 podcast) which is talking about supplements as a whole.
He owns a supplement business and sells them - he doesn't push his supplements on people that follow his diet plan - what's the problem.
As far a bastardised version of primal - I'm not sure I follow! Do you know much about the primal blueprint? I would agree that the primal blueprint is a bastardised version of the strict paleo diet - but no one is saying otherwise.
The problem is that it's hypocritical. Don't eat processed foods and additive sugars... but you can eat it if it's in my product.
And I've read extensively about both.
Eating McDonald's and using protein powder is not PALEO or PRIMAL on any level. Also, why even track what you eat? That also goes against paleo and primal ideology.0 -
I don't know why people pooh-pooh Paleo/Primal or keto so much on this site. They're all valid paths to the same place -- i.e. healthier living. Some appear to be threatened by the existence of equally valid paths. Still boggles my mind.
Because PB&J with a glass of chocolate milk is awesome, whether you are four or forty. :smokin:0 -
Alright, I've been a little afraid to post this because I heard it will start "forum flame wars," but I've just heard different things about it and I was wondering exactly what it is and why it may be good/bad for you. What are the pros/cons? Have any of you tried it?
Sorry in advance for any arguments this thread may cause....
i dont understand why it should start any wars anyway. we are all here for a common goal of weight loss and/or getting healthy. there are 1,001 meal plans out there. The main focus, just in my opion, is that we should eat REAL/UNPROCESSED foods and that is the focus of Paleo mostly. I have only read up on it a little, so I'm no expert, but I know people that do it and love it. I have tried a few plans that are VERY similar such as the Virgin Diet and 21 Day Tummy. Both focus on REAL foods and help identify some foods that 1. Our bodies are not intended to digest or 2. Food is NOT made like it used to be by REAL farmers and there is SO SO SO much junk in it. Period.
CLEAN EATING - FOCUS ON THAT IF YOU CAN.
DISCLAIMER - i am not a doctor. just another lady that has tried several things and so far the best is.... CLEAN 'REAL FOOD' EATING! :-)
wars - why do we get into wars when we all the the same goal? HA.
Define clean.0 -
I don't think Sisson is against protein powder. Like many of the traditional non-paleo things he discusses, he evaluates the nutritional value and then renders a decision based on that. From what I've seen, he doesn't get very ideological, but sticks to the nutritional make-up as guiding his decision. He certainly says you don't need protein powder, but he acknowledges that protein powder can have legitimate value in your regimen.
"Whey protein powder is proven to be effective, and it’s ubiquitous and inexpensive. Protein powder in general can help athletes recover from training, and it doesn’t have to be dairy-based, if you’re sensitive. There’s nothing wrong with dabbling (or even throwing yourself into) in alternative protein powders, and in the case of casein and egg whites, you might even see added benefits by incorporating them into your whey regimen.
But that doesn’t mean you need protein powder.
Take your time and evaluate your diet. You may find that you don’t need powder supplements. I certainly don’t need any myself, but that doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy a big whey shake after an intense workout session from time to time, just for the anabolic effects if not for the convenience and taste. If you’re not getting enough protein, or you can’t find the time to cook every single meal, try some protein powder. Otherwise, eat a steak."
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-egg-white-casein-pea-hemp-rice-protein-powder-supplement/#axzz2GmXjl246
Sisson states here, http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-primal-blueprint/#axzz1paFnnSML
"Avoid exposure to chemical toxins in your food (pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, etc) and on your skin. But also try to avoid the hidden poisons in foods like sugars, grains, processed foods, trans and hydrogenated fats, and mercury in certain fish."
Got that? sugars and processed foods are hidden poisons in foods
But then we look at his Primal Fuel
And look at that it's processed and contains sugars, including man made sugar, ewwwww
And Whey.
So, we didn't evolve to consume milk, but somehow we evolved to consume *some* parts of milk. How did that happen?0 -
I don't think Sisson is against protein powder. Like many of the traditional non-paleo things he discusses, he evaluates the nutritional value and then renders a decision based on that. From what I've seen, he doesn't get very ideological, but sticks to the nutritional make-up as guiding his decision. He certainly says you don't need protein powder, but he acknowledges that protein powder can have legitimate value in your regimen.
"Whey protein powder is proven to be effective, and it’s ubiquitous and inexpensive. Protein powder in general can help athletes recover from training, and it doesn’t have to be dairy-based, if you’re sensitive. There’s nothing wrong with dabbling (or even throwing yourself into) in alternative protein powders, and in the case of casein and egg whites, you might even see added benefits by incorporating them into your whey regimen.
But that doesn’t mean you need protein powder.
Take your time and evaluate your diet. You may find that you don’t need powder supplements. I certainly don’t need any myself, but that doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy a big whey shake after an intense workout session from time to time, just for the anabolic effects if not for the convenience and taste. If you’re not getting enough protein, or you can’t find the time to cook every single meal, try some protein powder. Otherwise, eat a steak."
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-egg-white-casein-pea-hemp-rice-protein-powder-supplement/#axzz2GmXjl246
Sisson states here, http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-primal-blueprint/#axzz1paFnnSML
"Avoid exposure to chemical toxins in your food (pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, etc) and on your skin. But also try to avoid the hidden poisons in foods like sugars, grains, processed foods, trans and hydrogenated fats, and mercury in certain fish."
Got that? sugars and processed foods are hidden poisons in foods
But then we look at his Primal Fuel
And look at that it's processed and contains sugars, including man made sugar, ewwwww
I see what you are saying. That it's I'm off primal and hitting the cakes tonight.
Sugar in his protein shakes. And at such high levels.
Thanks for pointing that out and saving my soul.
Oh wait on reflection there's not much sugar in it and the Mac Daddy didn't say to never eat sugar, just to eat a little as possible.
Also his customer base for the protein shakes are a wider audience than people who eat LCHF so it's probably a shrewd business decision to make the shakes taste okay (don't know what they taste like so I can't comment too much on that front).
No decision reversed - steak tonight!0 -
Good question ACG67.
I signifigantly lowered my protein intake becase of the insulin response to high amounts of protein. The recomendation that I had seen was for .8 to 1 gram per pound of lean body weight so I started there. This amount of protein is considered sufficient for your protein needs without triggering an insulin response. I didn't tinker with it very much as I was getting the results that I wanted. The 1 gram per/lb of LBW seems to be working for me right now. I've considered lowering it but have honestly been lazy around tinkering with my diet. I guess I'm taking a break from experimentation for a while.0 -
I don't think Sisson is against protein powder. Like many of the traditional non-paleo things he discusses, he evaluates the nutritional value and then renders a decision based on that. From what I've seen, he doesn't get very ideological, but sticks to the nutritional make-up as guiding his decision. He certainly says you don't need protein powder, but he acknowledges that protein powder can have legitimate value in your regimen.
"Whey protein powder is proven to be effective, and it’s ubiquitous and inexpensive. Protein powder in general can help athletes recover from training, and it doesn’t have to be dairy-based, if you’re sensitive. There’s nothing wrong with dabbling (or even throwing yourself into) in alternative protein powders, and in the case of casein and egg whites, you might even see added benefits by incorporating them into your whey regimen.
But that doesn’t mean you need protein powder.
Take your time and evaluate your diet. You may find that you don’t need powder supplements. I certainly don’t need any myself, but that doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy a big whey shake after an intense workout session from time to time, just for the anabolic effects if not for the convenience and taste. If you’re not getting enough protein, or you can’t find the time to cook every single meal, try some protein powder. Otherwise, eat a steak."
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-egg-white-casein-pea-hemp-rice-protein-powder-supplement/#axzz2GmXjl246
Sisson states here, http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-primal-blueprint/#axzz1paFnnSML
"Avoid exposure to chemical toxins in your food (pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, etc) and on your skin. But also try to avoid the hidden poisons in foods like sugars, grains, processed foods, trans and hydrogenated fats, and mercury in certain fish."
Got that? sugars and processed foods are hidden poisons in foods
But then we look at his Primal Fuel
And look at that it's processed and contains sugars, including man made sugar, ewwwww
And Whey.
So, we didn't evolve to consume milk, but somehow we evolved to consume *some* parts of milk. How did that happen?
PB has no issue with whey. Read up on the PB diet a bit more.0 -
I don't think Sisson is against protein powder. Like many of the traditional non-paleo things he discusses, he evaluates the nutritional value and then renders a decision based on that. From what I've seen, he doesn't get very ideological, but sticks to the nutritional make-up as guiding his decision. He certainly says you don't need protein powder, but he acknowledges that protein powder can have legitimate value in your regimen.
"Whey protein powder is proven to be effective, and it’s ubiquitous and inexpensive. Protein powder in general can help athletes recover from training, and it doesn’t have to be dairy-based, if you’re sensitive. There’s nothing wrong with dabbling (or even throwing yourself into) in alternative protein powders, and in the case of casein and egg whites, you might even see added benefits by incorporating them into your whey regimen.
But that doesn’t mean you need protein powder.
Take your time and evaluate your diet. You may find that you don’t need powder supplements. I certainly don’t need any myself, but that doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy a big whey shake after an intense workout session from time to time, just for the anabolic effects if not for the convenience and taste. If you’re not getting enough protein, or you can’t find the time to cook every single meal, try some protein powder. Otherwise, eat a steak."
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-egg-white-casein-pea-hemp-rice-protein-powder-supplement/#axzz2GmXjl246
Sisson states here, http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-primal-blueprint/#axzz1paFnnSML
"Avoid exposure to chemical toxins in your food (pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, etc) and on your skin. But also try to avoid the hidden poisons in foods like sugars, grains, processed foods, trans and hydrogenated fats, and mercury in certain fish."
Got that? sugars and processed foods are hidden poisons in foods
But then we look at his Primal Fuel
And look at that it's processed and contains sugars, including man made sugar, ewwwww
And Whey.
So, we didn't evolve to consume milk, but somehow we evolved to consume *some* parts of milk. How did that happen?
and we all know our paleo brethren loved blending up some whey protein shakes....rollz eyez...0 -
I don't think Sisson is against protein powder. Like many of the traditional non-paleo things he discusses, he evaluates the nutritional value and then renders a decision based on that. From what I've seen, he doesn't get very ideological, but sticks to the nutritional make-up as guiding his decision. He certainly says you don't need protein powder, but he acknowledges that protein powder can have legitimate value in your regimen.
"Whey protein powder is proven to be effective, and it’s ubiquitous and inexpensive. Protein powder in general can help athletes recover from training, and it doesn’t have to be dairy-based, if you’re sensitive. There’s nothing wrong with dabbling (or even throwing yourself into) in alternative protein powders, and in the case of casein and egg whites, you might even see added benefits by incorporating them into your whey regimen.
But that doesn’t mean you need protein powder.
Take your time and evaluate your diet. You may find that you don’t need powder supplements. I certainly don’t need any myself, but that doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy a big whey shake after an intense workout session from time to time, just for the anabolic effects if not for the convenience and taste. If you’re not getting enough protein, or you can’t find the time to cook every single meal, try some protein powder. Otherwise, eat a steak."
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/whey-egg-white-casein-pea-hemp-rice-protein-powder-supplement/#axzz2GmXjl246
Sisson states here, http://www.marksdailyapple.com/definitive-guide-primal-blueprint/#axzz1paFnnSML
"Avoid exposure to chemical toxins in your food (pesticides, herbicides, chemicals, etc) and on your skin. But also try to avoid the hidden poisons in foods like sugars, grains, processed foods, trans and hydrogenated fats, and mercury in certain fish."
Got that? sugars and processed foods are hidden poisons in foods
But then we look at his Primal Fuel
And look at that it's processed and contains sugars, including man made sugar, ewwwww
And Whey.
So, we didn't evolve to consume milk, but somehow we evolved to consume *some* parts of milk. How did that happen?
It's the gene expression. 0 -
Alright, I've been a little afraid to post this because I heard it will start "forum flame wars," but I've just heard different things about it and I was wondering exactly what it is and why it may be good/bad for you. What are the pros/cons? Have any of you tried it?
Sorry in advance for any arguments this thread may cause....
i dont understand why it should start any wars anyway. we are all here for a common goal of weight loss and/or getting healthy. there are 1,001 meal plans out there. The main focus, just in my opion, is that we should eat REAL/UNPROCESSED foods and that is the focus of Paleo mostly. I have only read up on it a little, so I'm no expert, but I know people that do it and love it. I have tried a few plans that are VERY similar such as the Virgin Diet and 21 Day Tummy. Both focus on REAL foods and help identify some foods that 1. Our bodies are not intended to digest or 2. Food is NOT made like it used to be by REAL farmers and there is SO SO SO much junk in it. Period.
CLEAN EATING - FOCUS ON THAT IF YOU CAN.
DISCLAIMER - i am not a doctor. just another lady that has tried several things and so far the best is.... CLEAN 'REAL FOOD' EATING! :-)
wars - why do we get into wars when we all the the same goal? HA.
Define clean & "real food"
FIFY0 -
I doubt the OP is still reading this since it has turned into drivel and mostly just insulting each other. If you are just looking for something to try for a month, I'd look into the Whole30. It's strict paleo, and it can be pretty difficult to stick to (and the people who run the website don't suggest doing it for longer than 30 days). But, you'd get a very good idea of what paleo is, plus it's a free website with a free list of "do eat" foods and "don't eat" foods. It's clearly laid out.
Then, after 30 days, assess your experience. If you couldn't follow strict paleo, then strict paleo probably isn't for you. If you found recipes you really liked, incorporate those into your diet. If you mostly liked it except that it was too strict, try an 80/20 approach. If there were foods on the "do not eat" list that you miss and can't do without, incorporate those back into your diet.
I always wonder what happens to the OP in these types of threads. :laugh:0 -
What's your point? He specifically addressed protein powders and you're trying to counter that specific point with his general guidelines? That's asinine.
So he doesn't really believe anything he writes? Either he thinks added sugars are a poison or they aren't, same with processed foods. You can't say well these are terrible terrible things, then say but this product I sell is alright cause I happen to sell it.
Maybe his thought processes isn't so one dimensional?0
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