How do you feel about fat pride?
Replies
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Im not callous, Im a wife and mother of two who was trained by the military to view things like this asside from my feelings. To view it with all emotion contained in order to not loose my sanity because of it. I dont like what I have seen and what I have been a part of but I will not appologize for it. I simply view it like I am stepping outside of myself. In a sterile mindset I can take a look at what happens and not scream from anger, hurt and sadness. I am far from callous. I am just unwilling to ever let it consume my mind and heart again.
First, who are their alies (Libya, and Syria) in what way does it affect our allies, then last we are under a contract to assist our allies when ever they call ( yes it is a contract). So the question is, what arent you being told about the whole of that tangled mess? Syria and Libya are allies to Russia and or China and or North Korea I believe, currently we are unable to take on these countries head on, however their allies, whose airfields and supplies will be used by them in the event of military manuevers, are accessable. Its been done time and again by military strategists. Attack the supply chain ( in this case another country) and you have crippled your enemy.
As I had to learn the hard way.. Freedom isnt Free... there are way more twists and turns to how these campaigns begin and end up than you or I could ever decipher. Being a global police man is the small part of the job believe it or not. I will just say this, I paid with my health for what we have and I dont regret it or want to exchange it. I just want others to appreciate what they have and be thankful for those who gave even more than I to get it.
You know, as a retired Veteran I resent that statement. Because if it wherent for the Department of Defense and all of us military past and present you whould have the rights you have today to say that mess.
^yeah.. but ppl's bad decisions being subsidized by others is still wrong.. very wrong for the market.. individuals keeping their money are much more efficient at using it then a bureaucrat... the utility and velocity of money moves efficient period.
one of my degrees was in economics :smokin:
Says the former drug addict.
People need help all the time for different things. A lot of those things are direct results of bad decisions - that doesn't make them less worthy of the help.
I'd rather pay for medical care for an obese person than funnel another billion dollars into the DoD.
I think we all LOVE the Vets - I Love them enough not to put them in harms way over needless campaigns and being a global police man...
#letsworryaboutourbordersbeforeworryingaboutpakistans
- and I'm also for totally open borders and totally free trade.
Economics :smokin: you sound like a crackpot in today's times till you get into the roots..
There is blowback and an increased risk of terrorism with us trotting around the globe acting like we are the big brother to all other countries..its nuts, it doesn't work, our founders warned us about this.. ..soldiers are making sacrifices I know and I appreciate it, and I have friends & family that serve and make those sacrifices - but they are not defending America's national security - the only time we should EVER go to war is when there is a war resolution created by congress (not the president saying.. 'hey I think Syria needs to be punished' or 'lets go invade libya because...well no reason needed there general public' ...
@sunofabeach14 - 5 years getting that degree.. countless papers and text read - I'm not going to even delve into it - I believe in the Austrian School Economics - you can be a Keynesian - I disagree respectfully but I'm not going to waist my time arguing about it because this just isn't the place for it.. its very very complicated, and variables are many and inconsistent.
First off, we should have ZERO ZERO ZERO allies, as the greatest Founder of all said, Thomas Jefferson, "alliance with none commerce with all". Look at our relationship with China.. they hated us and we built it up through a mutual hatred of Japan at the time because of WW2 and commerce...
China has a huge presence in Syria and Libya.. who cares??! We don't need to attack any supply chain?! Yeah we almost fought a proxy war in Russia over Syria... my point is WHY ARE WE EVEN GIVING A FLYING HOOT? It doesn't effect our national interest, it puts our soldiers in harms way, and it waste money and CIVILIANS DIE IN WAR.
- I'm shocked by how callous your attitude about life is.
War is an evil terrible thing.. there is no *just war... some are just more excusable, and it should only be partaken in when AMERICA is at stake.. not any of our allies.
The entire middle east wouldn't give a flip about us for the most part if we just stayed out of it all... let Saudi Arabia and Israel do it.. Israel right now is so frustrated with America because of our meddling..
#bringhomethetroops0 -
As I had to learn the hard way.. Freedom isnt Free... there are way more twists and turns to how these campaigns begin and end up than you or I could ever decipher. Being a global police man is the small part of the job believe it or not. I will just say this, I paid with my health for what we have and I dont regret it or want to exchange it. I just want others to appreciate what they have and be thankful for those who gave even more than I to get it.
You know, as a retired Veteran I resent that statement. Because if it wherent for the Department of Defense and all of us military past and present you whould have the rights you have today to say that mess.
^yeah.. but ppl's bad decisions being subsidized by others is still wrong.. very wrong for the market.. individuals keeping their money are much more efficient at using it then a bureaucrat... the utility and velocity of money moves efficient period.
one of my degrees was in economics :smokin:
Says the former drug addict.
People need help all the time for different things. A lot of those things are direct results of bad decisions - that doesn't make them less worthy of the help.
I'd rather pay for medical care for an obese person than funnel another billion dollars into the DoD.
I think we all LOVE the Vets - I Love them enough not to put them in harms way over needless campaigns and being a global police man...
#letsworryaboutourbordersbeforeworryingaboutpakistans
- and I'm also for totally open borders and totally free trade.
Economics :smokin: you sound like a crackpot in today's times till you get into the roots..
There is blowback and an increased risk of terrorism with us trotting around the globe acting like we are the big brother to all other countries..its nuts, it doesn't work, our founders warned us about this.. ..soldiers are making sacrifices I know and I appreciate it, and I have friends & family that serve and make those sacrifices - but they are not defending America's national security - the only time we should EVER go to war is when there is a war resolution created by congress (not the president saying.. 'hey I think Syria needs to be punished' or 'lets go invade libya because...well no reason needed there general public' ...
@sunofabeach14 - 5 years getting that degree.. countless papers and text read - I'm not going to even delve into it - I believe in the Austrian School Economics - you can be a Keynesian - I disagree respectfully but I'm not going to waist my time arguing about it because this just isn't the place for it.. its very very complicated, and variables are many and inconsistent.
Congrats on your degree. I have two graduate degrees, have been published, and have negotiated several billion dollars in international financings for the top investment banks, but I wasn't aware that this was a pissing contest so much as a discussion on the fat acceptance movement. Enjoy.
lol well you won that pissing contest sir!
Just trying to point out that it's best that we all keep it in our pants and focus instead on making cogent arguments
ok fair fair!
my bad!0 -
Im not callous, Im a wife and mother of two who was trained by the military to view things like this asside from my feelings. To view it with all emotion contained in order to not loose my sanity because of it. I dont like what I have seen and what I have been a part of but I will not appologize for it. I simply view it like I am stepping outside of myself. In a sterile mindset I can take a look at what happens and not scream from anger, hurt and sadness. I am far from callous. I am just unwilling to ever let it consume my mind and heart again.
First, who are their alies (Libya, and Syria) in what way does it affect our allies, then last we are under a contract to assist our allies when ever they call ( yes it is a contract). So the question is, what arent you being told about the whole of that tangled mess? Syria and Libya are allies to Russia and or China and or North Korea I believe, currently we are unable to take on these countries head on, however their allies, whose airfields and supplies will be used by them in the event of military manuevers, are accessable. Its been done time and again by military strategists. Attack the supply chain ( in this case another country) and you have crippled your enemy.
As I had to learn the hard way.. Freedom isnt Free... there are way more twists and turns to how these campaigns begin and end up than you or I could ever decipher. Being a global police man is the small part of the job believe it or not. I will just say this, I paid with my health for what we have and I dont regret it or want to exchange it. I just want others to appreciate what they have and be thankful for those who gave even more than I to get it.
You know, as a retired Veteran I resent that statement. Because if it wherent for the Department of Defense and all of us military past and present you whould have the rights you have today to say that mess.
^yeah.. but ppl's bad decisions being subsidized by others is still wrong.. very wrong for the market.. individuals keeping their money are much more efficient at using it then a bureaucrat... the utility and velocity of money moves efficient period.
one of my degrees was in economics :smokin:
Says the former drug addict.
People need help all the time for different things. A lot of those things are direct results of bad decisions - that doesn't make them less worthy of the help.
I'd rather pay for medical care for an obese person than funnel another billion dollars into the DoD.
I think we all LOVE the Vets - I Love them enough not to put them in harms way over needless campaigns and being a global police man...
#letsworryaboutourbordersbeforeworryingaboutpakistans
- and I'm also for totally open borders and totally free trade.
Economics :smokin: you sound like a crackpot in today's times till you get into the roots..
There is blowback and an increased risk of terrorism with us trotting around the globe acting like we are the big brother to all other countries..its nuts, it doesn't work, our founders warned us about this.. ..soldiers are making sacrifices I know and I appreciate it, and I have friends & family that serve and make those sacrifices - but they are not defending America's national security - the only time we should EVER go to war is when there is a war resolution created by congress (not the president saying.. 'hey I think Syria needs to be punished' or 'lets go invade libya because...well no reason needed there general public' ...
@sunofabeach14 - 5 years getting that degree.. countless papers and text read - I'm not going to even delve into it - I believe in the Austrian School Economics - you can be a Keynesian - I disagree respectfully but I'm not going to waist my time arguing about it because this just isn't the place for it.. its very very complicated, and variables are many and inconsistent.
First off, we should have ZERO ZERO ZERO allies, as the greatest Founder of all said, Thomas Jefferson, "alliance with none commerce with all". Look at our relationship with China.. they hated us and we built it up through a mutual hatred of Japan at the time because of WW2 and commerce...
China has a huge presence in Syria and Libya.. who cares??! We don't need to attack any supply chain?! Yeah we almost fought a proxy war in Russia over Syria... my point is WHY ARE WE EVEN GIVING A FLYING HOOT? It doesn't effect our national interest, it puts our soldiers in harms way, and it waste money and CIVILIANS DIE IN WAR.
- I'm shocked by how callous your attitude about life is.
War is an evil terrible thing.. there is no *just war... some are just more excusable, and it should only be partaken in when AMERICA is at stake.. not any of our allies.
The entire middle east wouldn't give a flip about us for the most part if we just stayed out of it all... let Saudi Arabia and Israel do it.. Israel right now is so frustrated with America because of our meddling..
#bringhomethetroops
I shouldn't go back and forth - your a Vet! Love your sacrifice, the terrors you guys experience is too me just awful, and I do feel empathy for you guys.
-your life experience on the subject is personable while mine has been scholastic- so I will take a backseat - I
m not an authority on this.
#stillhavesomestuff2learn
#onlyage24stilllearning0 -
Now that was cute....LOL But really both arguments where impressive. So you both won. I just think Scottie got beat to the ending.:laugh:
As I had to learn the hard way.. Freedom isnt Free... there are way more twists and turns to how these campaigns begin and end up than you or I could ever decipher. Being a global police man is the small part of the job believe it or not. I will just say this, I paid with my health for what we have and I dont regret it or want to exchange it. I just want others to appreciate what they have and be thankful for those who gave even more than I to get it.
You know, as a retired Veteran I resent that statement. Because if it wherent for the Department of Defense and all of us military past and present you whould have the rights you have today to say that mess.
^yeah.. but ppl's bad decisions being subsidized by others is still wrong.. very wrong for the market.. individuals keeping their money are much more efficient at using it then a bureaucrat... the utility and velocity of money moves efficient period.
one of my degrees was in economics :smokin:
Says the former drug addict.
People need help all the time for different things. A lot of those things are direct results of bad decisions - that doesn't make them less worthy of the help.
I'd rather pay for medical care for an obese person than funnel another billion dollars into the DoD.
I think we all LOVE the Vets - I Love them enough not to put them in harms way over needless campaigns and being a global police man...
#letsworryaboutourbordersbeforeworryingaboutpakistans
- and I'm also for totally open borders and totally free trade.
Economics :smokin: you sound like a crackpot in today's times till you get into the roots..
There is blowback and an increased risk of terrorism with us trotting around the globe acting like we are the big brother to all other countries..its nuts, it doesn't work, our founders warned us about this.. ..soldiers are making sacrifices I know and I appreciate it, and I have friends & family that serve and make those sacrifices - but they are not defending America's national security - the only time we should EVER go to war is when there is a war resolution created by congress (not the president saying.. 'hey I think Syria needs to be punished' or 'lets go invade libya because...well no reason needed there general public' ...
@sunofabeach14 - 5 years getting that degree.. countless papers and text read - I'm not going to even delve into it - I believe in the Austrian School Economics - you can be a Keynesian - I disagree respectfully but I'm not going to waist my time arguing about it because this just isn't the place for it.. its very very complicated, and variables are many and inconsistent.
Congrats on your degree. I have two graduate degrees, have been published, and have negotiated several billion dollars in international financings for the top investment banks, but I wasn't aware that this was a pissing contest so much as a discussion on the fat acceptance movement. Enjoy.
lol well you won that pissing contest sir!
Just trying to point out that it's best that we all keep it in our pants and focus instead on making cogent arguments
ok fair fair!
my bad!0 -
I'm 5'9 and 260 pounds so my weight is unhealthy.
I have perfect blood pressure, sugar, cholesterol, thyroid, and passed my stress test with flying colors.
My doctor tells me I'm the healthiest overweight person she knows. Is overweight equal unhealthy? No. But I do think that it can make you walk that plank to a much unhealthier life and as my doctor says, only takes one thing for it all to crumble.
As far as fat pride I don't prance around in bikinis or midriffs but I do take pride in looking nice and try to embrace a confident attitude every day. That is more for me than for anyone else.0 -
Im only going to say one thing that comes to mind reading this..suck it up and grow a pair, this is the *kitten* you signed up for soldier/sailor/marine. We all signed the contract, by choice,we knew what we where getting into, so offing yourself , TO ME, is a weak minded way of handling things. :grumble:
You know, as a retired Veteran I resent that statement. Because if it wherent for the Department of Defense and all of us military past and present you whould have the rights you have today to say that mess.
You're assigning meaning to my words that just aren't true. My lack of support of the DoD is not a reflection of my feelings about our military, or my support of them as individuals.
Our military budget is three times that of the budget of the next country - and more than the next 8 countries COMBINED. And after all that money we are FAILING our veterans horribly. The money being spent is not going where it should (to the VA hospitals, to support the men and women coming home and experiencing PTSD, to help our military acclimate back into civilian life).
Am I really supposed to want to support an organization that rips lives apart and doesn't help put them back together? No, I won't.
That does not mean, however, that I do not support our troops, past and present.
I'm sorry if my words and opinions offend you, but but I take serious issue with how our vets are treated and how badly the DoD fails them.
^Barnie Sanders & Dennis Kucinich just said that.. the real epidemic is our soldiers offing themselves soo much.. we need to bring them home.
Obama is Bushlite.. #dafaqwegointolibyaforbra?
!!! wow.. I have friends that are soldiers that were suicidal! They are really tough people, but they saw things that.. were like really really bad.. not to mention civilians are dying constantly ... especially with the crazy drone strikes in Yemen and Pakistan..
We need to bring home the troops - war should be an absolute last measure and a measure only taken if we as a country are at risk - this policing the world nonsense will never end, and it would be one thing if our country had the capital to do it, but we are paying for these wars on Credit from China & Japan while inflating our currency through quantitative easing by the federal reserve.
...end the wars. its total madness.
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.0 -
"How else do we learn but to ask, debate and ultimately make a mistake" - unknown, I've been told by my doctor that I am not allowed to get angry so that isnt a worry here. I like a good debate though so I should not have pulled the momma card out. My bad. But it does lead to another point. Sometimes it is hard to loose all of the weight you gained having children (for women) not to mention there are some genetics involved. So to strive to be healthy and still not become a "healthy weight" is not unusual. I even have a military background and I dont seem to be getting any smaller. Thats fine though, for reasons beyond my ability to prevent , I have been put on awefull meds that dont help, and Im getting older (that is not always a reason for everyone but for some people age is a factor). SO being healthy is a real goal for "Fat Pride" . Not flaunting fat everywhere and making an excuse to have McDonalds every night.
I shouldn't go back and forth - your a Vet! Love your sacrifice, the terrors you guys experience is too me just awful, and I do feel empathy for you guys.
-your life experience on the subject is personable while mine has been scholastic- so I will take a backseat - I
m not an authority on this.
#stillhavesomestuff2learn
#onlyage24stilllearning0 -
Going back to the original topic...
My only gripe with the "fat acceptance/pride" movement is the oft-repeated mantra of "fat != unhealthy".
I know a woman in her late eighties who has been drinking half a litre of vodka and smoking a pack of cigarettes every day for 50+ years now. She's in better shape than most people her age.
Nothing guarantees bad health (or good health, for that matter), but some things definitely skew the odds for or against you and being overweight correlates with bad health across the board.
If health isn't a top priority for someone there is nothing wrong with that... but be honest about it.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
So you ARE callous? :laugh:
ETA: You're the one calling soldiers "weak-minded", not me.0 -
Going back to the original topic...
My only gripe with the "fat acceptance/pride" movement is the oft-repeated mantra of "fat != unhealthy".
I know a woman in her late eighties who has been drinking half a litre of vodka and smoking a pack of cigarettes every day for 50+ years now. She's in better shape than most people her age.
Nothing guarantees bad health (or good health, for that matter), but some things definitely skew the odds for or against you and being overweight correlates with bad health across the board.
If health isn't a top priority for someone there is nothing wrong with that... but be honest about it.
It really doesnt. I had an arobics teacher who was at least 200 but this woman could out step me in a minute. I would often wonder why she didnt weigh 105 with the amount of activity she poored into her routines. I really think that genetics has a lot to do with it. By having some "Fat Pride" it may also be construed as having pride in your back ground. That may be a reach but still you can not always say fat = unhealthy when there are examples everywhere that it just simply isnt true.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.
The topic got derailed a long time ago when wars were brought up :laugh:0 -
You're putting words in my mouth, I didnt say all soldiers and they are a lot stronger than many give them credit for. Callous is looking at them and when they reach out you slap them away. I do not do that, but I will let them know that their choices affects way more than themselves, I will get them the help they are asking for, but I retain the opinion that they are being weak minded. I have long known that when they want help they will tell you about suicidal tendancies, if they have truely lost all hope. You will never know until it is too late that they where suicidal.
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
So you ARE callous? :laugh:
ETA: You're the one calling soldiers "weak-minded", not me.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.
The topic got derailed a long time ago when wars were brought up :laugh:
War is the continuation of fat acceptance by other means0 -
I think I derailed the thread with my DoD budget comment - sorry!
I enjoyed this conversation. I like having discussions with people that are intelligent - it makes me see the world in a new way.0 -
Derailed isnt even the word for this.:laugh: But a good debate is something everyone should be part of. It opens your horizons. :flowerforyou:0
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Yes I can still be that callous after that.So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that.You're putting words in my mouth, I didnt say all soldiers and they are a lot stronger than many give them credit for. Callous is looking at them and when they reach out you slap them away. I do not do that, but I will let them know that their choices affects way more than themselves, I will get them the help they are asking for, but I retain the opinion that they are being weak minded. I have long known that when they want help they will tell you about suicidal tendancies, if they have truely lost all hope. You will never know until it is too late that they where suicidal.
I didn't put any words in your mouth. You typed them up on your own.
I have been working in Suicide Prevention long enough to be neutral about it. I honestly do not feel pity for someone who takes their life.
But what I DO know, is that when someone knows all of those things you mentioned (they're leaving behind family, it's going to hurt their family, etc.), and still sees death as the only way out, that is incredibly sad.
But whatevs.0 -
How do I feel about it? I feel that it doesn't matter how I feel about it. It's not my job to legislate how other people feel about themselves or determine whether they have a right to feel that way. And I certainly can't muster enough arrogance to assume that, by merely taking a glimpse at someone else's physique, I can KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt whether that person is really happy or takes pride in him/herself. I know this may be a shocker, but I'm pretty sure some people can be happy and overweight because their physical appearance isn't the key marker they use to judge their own worth.
Your own self-image is your own business...and people who think they have a right to comment on it when not expressly invited to do so are sadly deluded.
I will say this, though. Fat is not "disgusting" or some of the other choice judgment-charged words that have been thrown around in this thread. Fat is a substance that the body produces, and the body needs a certain amount for its own survival. You may not personally care for the aesthetics of a body that has more than is needed. Everyone is entitled to his or her own personal preferences. But your preference does not give you the right to try to make it into a moral issue or to pontificate about it as if you are the governing moral authority over someone else's body -- especially if you don't know for sure what all the contributing factors to that weight gain were or what efforts that person may be making.
As for paying for someone else's health: if you participate in an insurance system, you understand that it is a pool, comprised of all users regardless of their individual personal choices. Almost everyone has bad habits that can negatively impact health (even if it's speeding, or running too much, or making ill-advised comments about others' physical features that result in the speaker getting punched). Often, the obese already pay higher premiums, as do many who are judged to have "less healthy" lifestyles.
If you buy a ticket with a passenger airline, well...you and your fellow passengers all pay for that flight together because it's much cheaper than buying and maintaining your own private jet. In some cases, the person who can't fit into the ever-narrowing airline seat is forced to buy a second seat. If not...oh well. On planes, I've had to sit next to people who were not overweight but had no concept of personal space -- arms and elbows everywhere, people's heads practically in my lap. I've had to sit next to people who had body odor or wore way too much perfume. And it takes far less time and effort for those folks to keep their arms to themselves, keep their seats in the upright position, and take a shower than it takes for a person to lose weight even when s/he is making an effort to do so.
If someone else wants to embrace his/her weight and say "I don't want to change," so what?! It's none of my business -- just like it's not my business to try to deflate the ego of some guy spending his time on a forum talking about his clothes, his 28" waist, his self-flirtation in the mirror, and his belief that his physique rivals Michelangelo's David. His self-opinion may not match my opinion of him, but if he wants to love himself a lot as he is, it's not my job to point out what I perceive as personal deficiencies in order to try to make his self-opinion match mine. I say, let him love himself. His self-esteem is not a threat to me.
Very few people need help hating themselves. A lot of people need help loving themselves, though. Being helpful is not tearing others down, but is, instead, pointing out those things in others that are valuable and lovable. Focus on those things you can respect and admire in them, and make sure they see them, too. If you can't see those things just because they are fat, then I respectfully submit that their weight isn't the real problem.0 -
Confidence is a beautiful thing regardless of your physical appearance. It's attractive and sexy. I believe everyone is beautiful regardless of downfalls they believe they have. Find what works for you and you should have confidence in yourself.
Keep in mind, I am not calling people overweight unhealthy, although over time there will be affects. I understand health may not be a priority for most people. Although, an overweight person carrying 2 or 3 times normal body weight is going to have degeneration in knee joints. The joints are not made to withstand that much weight over extended periods of time. With meniscus and bursa sacks breaking down over time eventually you will have bone on bone. Horrible pain at the age of 50. This is no way for anyone to live their life. On pain meds which will in turn affect liver and other vital organs. Eventually the body will break down. And the quality of life decreases. Pain is not something I wish on anyone. There is no reason someone should have to suffer performing normal day to day activities. Just my opinion.0 -
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.
The topic got derailed a long time ago when wars were brought up :laugh:
War is the continuation of fat acceptance by other means
You're funny :flowerforyou:
And I see people are trying to get it back on track:grumble:
So I will let it continue on..
Fat acceptance, blah blah, body love, yadda yadda, pride and hoohaa.. image and shaming0 -
How do I feel about it? I feel that it doesn't matter how I feel about it. It's not my job to legislate how other people feel about themselves or determine whether they have a right to feel that way. And I certainly can't muster enough arrogance to assume that, by merely taking a glimpse at someone else's physique, I can KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt whether that person is really happy or takes pride in him/herself. I know this may be a shocker, but I'm pretty sure some people can be happy and overweight because their physical appearance isn't the key marker they use to judge their own worth.
Your own self-image is your own business...and people who think they have a right to comment on it when not expressly invited to do so are sadly deluded.
I will say this, though. Fat is not "disgusting" or some of the other choice judgment-charged words that have been thrown around in this thread. Fat is a substance that the body produces, and the body needs a certain amount for its own survival. You may not personally care for the aesthetics of a body that has more than is needed. Everyone is entitled to his or her own personal preferences. But your preference does not give you the right to try to make it into a moral issue or to pontificate about it as if you are the governing moral authority over someone else's body -- especially if you don't know for sure what all the contributing factors to that weight gain were or what efforts that person may be making.
As for paying for someone else's health: if you participate in an insurance system, you understand that it is a pool, comprised of all users regardless of their individual personal choices. Almost everyone has bad habits that can negatively impact health (even if it's speeding, or running too much, or making ill-advised comments about others' physical features that result in the speaker getting punched). Often, the obese already pay higher premiums, as do many who are judged to have "less healthy" lifestyles.
If you buy a ticket with a passenger airline, well...you and your fellow passengers all pay for that flight together because it's much cheaper than buying and maintaining your own private jet. In some cases, the person who can't fit into the ever-narrowing airline seat is forced to buy a second seat. If not...oh well. On planes, I've had to sit next to people who were not overweight but had no concept of personal space -- arms and elbows everywhere, people's heads practically in my lap. I've had to sit next to people who had body odor or wore way too much perfume. And it takes far less time and effort for those folks to keep their arms to themselves, keep their seats in the upright position, and take a shower than it takes for a person to lose weight even when s/he is making an effort to do so.
If someone else wants to embrace his/her weight and say "I don't want to change," so what?! It's none of my business -- just like it's not my business to try to deflate the ego of some guy spending his time on a forum talking about his clothes, his 28" waist, his self-flirtation in the mirror, and his belief that his physique rivals Michelangelo's David. His self-opinion may not match my opinion of him, but if he wants to love himself a lot as he is, it's not my job to point out what I perceive as personal deficiencies in order to try to make his self-opinion match mine. I say, let him love himself. His self-esteem is not a threat to me.
Very few people need help hating themselves. A lot of people need help loving themselves, though. Being helpful is not tearing others down, but is, instead, pointing out those things in others that are valuable and lovable. Focus on those things you can respect and admire in them, and make sure they see them, too. If you can't see those things just because they are fat, then I respectfully submit that their weight isn't the real problem.
That was amazing. What a beautiful heart you must have.0 -
You got the callous part, when I get angry I do become callous. I admit it, but I said weak minded not calling them weak. Huge difference. All of us have a weak thought at some point. To continue that though is to act weak minded. Soldiers have already proven that, that type of thought process is not the normal state of mind for them. Hence weak minded. And that is where you put words in my mouth. But enough with you I am getting back on topic.0
-
WOW how did I miss this.:noway: :happy:How do I feel about it? I feel that it doesn't matter how I feel about it. It's not my job to legislate how other people feel about themselves or determine whether they have a right to feel that way. And I certainly can't muster enough arrogance to assume that, by merely taking a glimpse at someone else's physique, I can KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt whether that person is really happy or takes pride in him/herself. I know this may be a shocker, but I'm pretty sure some people can be happy and overweight because their physical appearance isn't the key marker they use to judge their own worth.
Your own self-image is your own business...and people who think they have a right to comment on it when not expressly invited to do so are sadly deluded.
I will say this, though. Fat is not "disgusting" or some of the other choice judgment-charged words that have been thrown around in this thread. Fat is a substance that the body produces, and the body needs a certain amount for its own survival. You may not personally care for the aesthetics of a body that has more than is needed. Everyone is entitled to his or her own personal preferences. But your preference does not give you the right to try to make it into a moral issue or to pontificate about it as if you are the governing moral authority over someone else's body -- especially if you don't know for sure what all the contributing factors to that weight gain were or what efforts that person may be making.
As for paying for someone else's health: if you participate in an insurance system, you understand that it is a pool, comprised of all users regardless of their individual personal choices. Almost everyone has bad habits that can negatively impact health (even if it's speeding, or running too much, or making ill-advised comments about others' physical features that result in the speaker getting punched). Often, the obese already pay higher premiums, as do many who are judged to have "less healthy" lifestyles.
If you buy a ticket with a passenger airline, well...you and your fellow passengers all pay for that flight together because it's much cheaper than buying and maintaining your own private jet. In some cases, the person who can't fit into the ever-narrowing airline seat is forced to buy a second seat. If not...oh well. On planes, I've had to sit next to people who were not overweight but had no concept of personal space -- arms and elbows everywhere, people's heads practically in my lap. I've had to sit next to people who had body odor or wore way too much perfume. And it takes far less time and effort for those folks to keep their arms to themselves, keep their seats in the upright position, and take a shower than it takes for a person to lose weight even when s/he is making an effort to do so.
If someone else wants to embrace his/her weight and say "I don't want to change," so what?! It's none of my business -- just like it's not my business to try to deflate the ego of some guy spending his time on a forum talking about his clothes, his 28" waist, his self-flirtation in the mirror, and his belief that his physique rivals Michelangelo's David. His self-opinion may not match my opinion of him, but if he wants to love himself a lot as he is, it's not my job to point out what I perceive as personal deficiencies in order to try to make his self-opinion match mine. I say, let him love himself. His self-esteem is not a threat to me.
Very few people need help hating themselves. A lot of people need help loving themselves, though. Being helpful is not tearing others down, but is, instead, pointing out those things in others that are valuable and lovable. Focus on those things you can respect and admire in them, and make sure they see them, too. If you can't see those things just because they are fat, then I respectfully submit that their weight isn't the real problem.
That was amazing. What a beautiful heart you must have.0 -
^yeah what the smarter guy said!
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.
The topic got derailed a long time ago when wars were brought up :laugh:
War is the continuation of fat acceptance by other means
@ribqah -
1st off brah ... I'm a diehard libertarian - I'm not promoting legislating anything lolzzz
2nd.. Obesity is repulsive bro?! smells bad, its unhealthy, it looks disgusting... I'm blunt about hating it because I hate it.. its absolutely nasty.. the individual that is in a cycle of pain and hurt living like that? - I feel empathy for them!
"If someone else wants to embrace his/her weight and say "I don't want to change," so what?! It's none of my business -- just like it's not my business to try to deflate the ego of some guy spending his time on a forum talking about his clothes, his 28" waist, his self-flirtation in the mirror, and his belief that his physique rivals Michelangelo's David. His self-opinion may not match my opinion of him, but if he wants to love himself a lot as he is, it's not my job to point out what I perceive as personal deficiencies in order to try to make his self-opinion match mine. I say, let him love himself. His self-esteem is not a threat to me. "
:frown:
you don't think I could be the next rival to Michelangelo's David?
- LOLZ I'm just flattered you listened to me ramble on about my love for myself.
:drinker:
Read on I'm sure your in for more treats!
0 -
You have a point, confidence is sexy and attractive. Its not that women love the bad boys, they love the confidence they exude. :blushing:Confidence is a beautiful thing regardless of your physical appearance. It's attractive and sexy. I believe everyone is beautiful regardless of downfalls they believe they have. Find what works for you and you should have confidence in yourself.
Keep in mind, I am not calling people overweight unhealthy, although over time there will be affects. I understand health may not be a priority for most people. Although, an overweight person carrying 2 or 3 times normal body weight is going to have degeneration in knee joints. The joints are not made to withstand that much weight over extended periods of time. With meniscus and bursa sacks breaking down over time eventually you will have bone on bone. Horrible pain at the age of 50. This is no way for anyone to live their life. On pain meds which will in turn affect liver and other vital organs. Eventually the body will break down. And the quality of life decreases. Pain is not something I wish on anyone. There is no reason someone should have to suffer performing normal day to day activities. Just my opinion.0 -
You have a point, confidence is sexy and attractive. Its not that women love the bad boys, they love the confidence they exude. :blushing:Confidence is a beautiful thing regardless of your physical appearance. It's attractive and sexy. I believe everyone is beautiful regardless of downfalls they believe they have. Find what works for you and you should have confidence in yourself.
Keep in mind, I am not calling people overweight unhealthy, although over time there will be affects. I understand health may not be a priority for most people. Although, an overweight person carrying 2 or 3 times normal body weight is going to have degeneration in knee joints. The joints are not made to withstand that much weight over extended periods of time. With meniscus and bursa sacks breaking down over time eventually you will have bone on bone. Horrible pain at the age of 50. This is no way for anyone to live their life. On pain meds which will in turn affect liver and other vital organs. Eventually the body will break down. And the quality of life decreases. Pain is not something I wish on anyone. There is no reason someone should have to suffer performing normal day to day activities. Just my opinion.
Yeah I absolutely love when a lady is confident...
#notgannalie0 -
I feel almost like you should be grounded for life or something...I'm speechless. :noway:
^yeah what the smarter guy said!
Far from ignorant and quite informed, suicide prevention is part of our trainning (quarterly) when active duty. I made it clear that it was in my oppinion. You can like my oppinion or lump it, it matters not to me but back up when you call me something like ignorant. I am ignorant of a lot of things. I have been suicidal myself. Yes I can still be that callous after that. Because I learned that when you kill yourself you kill your family your friends and every wonderful memory you where involved in. So yes I call it weak minded, because I have been there and done that. Those soldiers are a damn site stronger thay you obviously give them credit for. So take your label/ accusation of ignorance and shove it! (Now I'm angry)
Was staying out of it until the statement about soldiers offing themselves being weak.
Just like you were/are in the military and take offense to certain statements, I work in suicide prevention, specifically with soldiers, and I take offense to your ignorant statement.
I personally think that suicide and suicide prevention are also very worthy topics, they happen to be close to my heart, but what the heck do they have to do with fat acceptance? I think we are in full thread derail mode at this point.
The topic got derailed a long time ago when wars were brought up :laugh:
War is the continuation of fat acceptance by other means
@ribqah -
1st off brah ... I'm a diehard libertarian - I'm not promoting legislating anything lolzzz
2nd.. Obesity is repulsive bro?! smells bad, its unhealthy, it looks disgusting... I'm blunt about hating it because I hate it.. its absolutely nasty.. the individual that is in a cycle of pain and hurt living like that? - I feel empathy for them!
"If someone else wants to embrace his/her weight and say "I don't want to change," so what?! It's none of my business -- just like it's not my business to try to deflate the ego of some guy spending his time on a forum talking about his clothes, his 28" waist, his self-flirtation in the mirror, and his belief that his physique rivals Michelangelo's David. His self-opinion may not match my opinion of him, but if he wants to love himself a lot as he is, it's not my job to point out what I perceive as personal deficiencies in order to try to make his self-opinion match mine. I say, let him love himself. His self-esteem is not a threat to me. "
:frown:
you don't think I could be the next rival to Michelangelo's David?
- LOLZ I'm just flattered you listened to me ramble on about my love for myself.
:drinker:
Read on I'm sure your in for more treats!0 -
You got the callous part, when I get angry I do become callous. I admit it, but I said weak minded not calling them weak. Huge difference. All of us have a weak thought at some point. To continue that though is to act weak minded. Soldiers have already proven that, that type of thought process is not the normal state of mind for them. Hence weak minded. And that is where you put words in my mouth. But enough with you I am getting back on topic.
Yea...just like how I called your statement ignorant and you flew off the handle and took that to mean that I called YOU ignorant.
If you really want to play semantics.:flowerforyou:
Have fun getting back on topic.0 -
Confidence is a beautiful thing regardless of your physical appearance. It's attractive and sexy. I believe everyone is beautiful regardless of downfalls they believe they have. Find what works for you and you should have confidence in yourself.
Keep in mind, I am not calling people overweight unhealthy, although over time there will be affects. I understand health may not be a priority for most people. Although, an overweight person carrying 2 or 3 times normal body weight is going to have degeneration in knee joints. The joints are not made to withstand that much weight over extended periods of time. With meniscus and bursa sacks breaking down over time eventually you will have bone on bone. Horrible pain at the age of 50. This is no way for anyone to live their life. On pain meds which will in turn affect liver and other vital organs. Eventually the body will break down. And the quality of life decreases. Pain is not something I wish on anyone. There is no reason someone should have to suffer performing normal day to day activities. Just my opinion.
This, too. And you're right, confidence at any size is sexy.0
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