Say your 15 yr old daughter requests Birth Control
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You didn't read what I wrote. You can't pick and chose what you want because then you take away the intent of my words and I have the right to speak and be understood as I intend.Whoa. Did you really just link the "decline" of America to its diversity? Because that comes awfully close to some serious prejudices and greatly undermines your credibility.
decline of morals is what I said
I never said diversity. There are many wonderful ways to which people who are different create value.0 -
really? opinion and correlation (and really hard to read because of grammatical errors). You're starting to sound stereotypically white, middle america, bigoted. Please don't blame variety on your ideas of immorality because variety is not to blame. That sort of thinking often begets elitism. Variety is the spice of life and the mode of evolutionary change.
Ideas of morality are varied among people. But mind you I think conservative views on say... homosexuality are morally wrong. I know that doesn't make you like me, and I'm part of that great downturn of civilization but keep in mind that I think YOUR views on homosexuality (assuming your views on this are as stagnant as your ones on sex) are morally wrong and wholly contributing to the downturn of society. And I'm sure you feel my view are as equally wrong. Funny how that works. Variety.
Who's to say who's right?0 -
Not what I said either. Your bagging on me because I gave a real life example? Not cool.America is also on the highest decline of morals. So it totally makes sense. Here we're completely declining on all issues of morality and it's not gonna get better any time soon. You name it were declining in it. Were being completely undone as "the melting pot" grows bigger which causes the country in whole to want a one size fits all constitution and a majority here believe they are entitled it doesn't suprise me. When you have so many comming here with different faiths and religions and beliefs it can cause a collapse because to those people in general, the laws of the land don't apply. This is proven by the rise in crime and violation of laws that occur and the ones left paying the price are the ones born here. If you are American you get the consequence in general. Recently on the news we had a case where a lady got hit by an illegal and when she told the police they said it had to be reported to ICE and they said that immigration crimes are not priority. This is not the only case. So it pretty much goes that experts see America collapsing in on itself. I hope not but you can't help but see the way it's going. Especially if you look at our debt crisis.
LOL. Okay, lady. People who are not your ethnicity = bad. Got it!0 -
If you look at change in values and growth of our country, being pulled in all directions and compared to the times where there was a standard yes things have gotten worse and continue.0
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I'm talking about drawing the line. There are NO clear lines of morality anymore. Everyone defines it their own way and when you keep fudging the line and it get's blurry enough people use it as an excuse to behave however they want when that is the presidence that is set. When you skew the line of morality so bad that no one can define it you are put in the position of making up your own rules and that is where crime comes in. Criminals make up their own rules and the law is a non issue. Most crime goes unpunished.You keep on trying to draw an direct line between sex and criminal acts. I would like to see some actual studies on this, rather than your own pondering. I have seen more proof that religion leads to criminal acts than sex does.
You seem to have some issues with people having sex before marriage, which you are allowed to have, but these issues need to be based on actual studies and proven theories before you can use them in an argument.
Things I find funny in this situation: murder of spouses. criminal acts associated with marriage
And who decides where the line is drawn? Why should your morals be more worth than mine? I consider myself a respectable person, I've never been in trouble with the law, I've never done anything I shouldn't do, I'm respectful of my elders, I'm going to college, I'm doing brilliantly in school according to my last report, and yet because I've had sex you keep on putting my in the same box as criminals because I do not follow your morals on that issue. As if having sex before marriage has doomed me for life, and I'm now gonna go into a spiral of divorce, drugabuse, selling my children and killing my husband. I just don't see the link between those two. I'm 19 years old, and apparently I'm doomed.
Did you know that Italy, the world-capital of Catholic-religion, is by your standards one of the most "immoral" countries in the world? It's common for a man to have a mistress in that country, so common that it's weird if he doesn't. Most of my family live in Italy, and my aunt often tell me about how her husband is getting TEASED for not having a mistress. The capital of catholicity, how about that?0 -
Not what I said either. Your bagging on me because I gave a real life example? Not cool.America is also on the highest decline of morals. So it totally makes sense. Here we're completely declining on all issues of morality and it's not gonna get better any time soon. You name it were declining in it. Were being completely undone as "the melting pot" grows bigger which causes the country in whole to want a one size fits all constitution and a majority here believe they are entitled it doesn't suprise me. When you have so many comming here with different faiths and religions and beliefs it can cause a collapse because to those people in general, the laws of the land don't apply. This is proven by the rise in crime and violation of laws that occur and the ones left paying the price are the ones born here. If you are American you get the consequence in general. Recently on the news we had a case where a lady got hit by an illegal and when she told the police they said it had to be reported to ICE and they said that immigration crimes are not priority. This is not the only case. So it pretty much goes that experts see America collapsing in on itself. I hope not but you can't help but see the way it's going. Especially if you look at our debt crisis.
LOL. Okay, lady. People who are not your ethnicity = bad. Got it!
Where does this claim that the U.S. is the highest in declining morals come from? Any sources? Who decides what morals are the guide post for this? Morals are a human construct, and as such there can be great differences. An increase in premarital sex, to me, hardly equates to an increase in the rate of murder. (And this does not mean that I condone young teenagers having sex, I do not think they are emotionally or psychologically ready, but I would at least educate them on prevention of pregnancy and disease so they can protect themselves from that if they do have sex. However, people who have premarital sex are not automatically void of morals.)0 -
Please no name calling it's really not necessary. I'm looking at the facts. And please quit putting words in my mouth I'm not willing to participatereally? opinion and correlation (and really hard to read because of grammatical errors). You're starting to sound stereotypically white, middle america, bigoted. Please don't blame variety on your ideas of immorality because variety is not to blame. That sort of thinking often begets elitism. Variety is the spice of life and the mode of evolutionary change.
Ideas of morality are varied among people. But mind you I think conservative views on say... homosexuality are morally wrong. I know that doesn't make you like me, and I'm part of that great downturn of civilization but keep in mind that I think YOUR views on homosexuality (assuming your views on this are as stagnant as your ones on sex) are morally wrong and wholly contributing to the downturn of society. And I'm sure you feel my view are as equally wrong. Funny how that works. Variety.
Who's to say who's right?
"homosexuality are morally wrong."
I never said that. and I'm not going there.0 -
America is also on the highest decline of morals. So it totally makes sense. Here we're completely declining on all issues of morality and it's not gonna get better any time soon. You name it were declining in it. Were being completely undone as "the melting pot" grows bigger which causes the country in whole to want a one size fits all constitution and a majority here believe they are entitled it doesn't suprise me. When you have so many comming here with different faiths and religions and beliefs it can cause a collapse because to those people in general, the laws of the land don't apply. This is proven by the rise in crime and violation of laws that occur and the ones left paying the price are the ones born here. If you are American you get the consequence in general. Recently on the news we had a case where a lady got hit by an illegal and when she told the police they said it had to be reported to ICE and they said that immigration crimes are not priority. This is not the only case. So it pretty much goes that experts see America collapsing in on itself. I hope not but you can't help but see the way it's going. Especially if you look at our debt crisis.
You are joking, right? If anything, diversity is helping this country gain some moral backbone. Did you forget, or perhaps you never knew, that this country was started by stealing land, killing, lynching, raping and separating families. Perhaps you will feel better if the country went back to the time when women could not own property, vote or work in "male" professions. In an attempt to return to" good ole values", I’m sure a man has an opening in the kitchen for thinkers like you.0 -
And since everyone wants to go to the level of crying prejiduce I'm going to go along with your desire to squelch my voice and leave. Not one of you is any better than you are deciding to view me based on your willingness to climb on top of your bully pulpets and attack my character and place words on me I didn't say. So feel empowered that you attacked me out of here because I will not participate your words of ill gotten desires towards me. Have a wodnerful day.0
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Please no name calling it's really not necessary. I'm looking at the facts. And please quit putting words in my mouth I'm not willing to participatereally? opinion and correlation (and really hard to read because of grammatical errors). You're starting to sound stereotypically white, middle america, bigoted. Please don't blame variety on your ideas of immorality because variety is not to blame. That sort of thinking often begets elitism. Variety is the spice of life and the mode of evolutionary change.
Ideas of morality are varied among people. But mind you I think conservative views on say... homosexuality are morally wrong. I know that doesn't make you like me, and I'm part of that great downturn of civilization but keep in mind that I think YOUR views on homosexuality (assuming your views on this are as stagnant as your ones on sex) are morally wrong and wholly contributing to the downturn of society. And I'm sure you feel my view are as equally wrong. Funny how that works. Variety.
Who's to say who's right?
"homosexuality are morally wrong."
I never said that. and I'm not going there.
Never said you stated that. I clearly put that in as an assumption. buck up0 -
I don't think we should put you in a box either. You have never mentioned your view on homosexuality, and we should not draw any conclusions on it, nor bring that issue into the debate as well, I believe.
I would however like to have some sources as to where you get your facts from. As my teacher always say: "You can have all the opinions you want, but without sources you are as untrustworthy as wikipedia!"0 -
I had my daughter when I was 17. I was in total denial that "people like me" (upper middle class family, professional parents and grandparents, honor roll student, didn't drink or do drugs, etc.) didn't get pregnant in high school.
If my daughter felt she needed it, I would help her get it, while also talking about diseases and things like that so she would also use condoms and be smart about sex. You can't stop your kids from having sex if they want to do it, but you can assist them in making sure that one not-so-great decision doesn't impact the rest of their lives.
great advice! i rarely see girls in my office "before" they have sex. they have either gotten pregnant and need me to take care of them or they have gotten scared and want to be more careful.0 -
There is no sense debating with people who don't operate on a fact or logic basis.0
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Think of it this way.. she is mature enough to ask you for something that would prevent pregnancy... give it to her and discuss how it doesn't prevent STD's etc..0
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When my 15 year old started dating I put her on birth control. I felt it was better to give her every chance of protection that I could.
(I certainly didn't want to raise another child or put her in the position to have to make that choice if I could avoid it)
of course I also set strict rules, be home by this time, I need to know where you are at all times etc..
She's married now, and still on birth control. And can talk to me about just about anything.0 -
I don't have a daughter, I have 2 sons. I suppose my oldest son wasn't paying ATTENTION to me, when I told him the CONDOM story. He was one month shy of being 22 when he became a father. My Granddaughter is 5 years old now, she has certainly MADE him a more responsible adult. I thank God for her......every day
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Saying Birthcontrol increases the desire to have sex is like saying the Garadsil (HPV vaccine) increases a girl wanting to have sex.
Its all about education. Is she's asking for it and not sexually active yet its likely her friends are, so why not protect her from the possibility of getting pregnant? *Most* STIs are treatable but from working in an OBGYN office, take her to one to get her bith control instead of your PCP or pediatrician. Then we can show her disgusting pictures of what HPV looks like on your cervix and what the acid treatments are like to get rid of the majority of the cells, how its somethign you never get rid of. SO we can show slides of Trich (really cool if youre a science geek but really gross) moving around and eating things in your vaginal discharge. Show pictures of what happens to your uterus an ovaries due to untreated STIs. Guidelines actually say a girl does not need her first pap until she has been sexualy active for 3 years and/or turns 21 so you dont need to worry about her having an annual pap, but an annual blood draw to rule out STIs is a good scare tactic too. As far as using the Implanon or the shot vs a pill due to teenage memory spans, carefully research the side effects, such as bone loss, before giving those to your teenage girls. There is the option of the Nuva Ring too.0 -
A teenage girl can walk into a doctor's office and get birth control at age 15 without parental permission. If my 15 year old came to me to ask about birth control, I'd be thankful that she felt comfortable talking to mommy about it. We'd also have a long talk about self-respect and self-value, and make sure she wasn't planning on having sex to get a boy (or, God forbid, boyS) to like her. For me, the issues surrounding WHY a young girl decides to have sex are more important that the fact that she's made the decision. If she has a long-term BF and they are monogamous and believe they are in love, and he's a decent boy, I'm OK with it.
Of course we'd still have the STI talk, complete with Google images of what infections look like. Yuck.0 -
Not all girls go on birth control because they want to have sex. One of my best friends got birth control when she was 13 just to regulate her period and to stop from getting such bad cramps.
Better safe than sorry, though.0 -
There is no sense debating with people who don't operate on a fact or logic basis.
Amen. My motto when dealing with difficult people is "You cannot have a rational conversation with an irrational person." There is only one way to deal with someone like fit4mom: speak calmly and avoid personal attacks. They will do one of two things: 1) they will calm down with you, or 2) they will escalate themselves to a point where they leave. fit4mom picked option 2 0
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