Meat and early mortality

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  • Bentley2718
    Bentley2718 Posts: 1,690 Member
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    I believe... when studies like this are performed, they are looking for a specific outcome. Only the data pertinent to the specific outcome is collected. Someone could do a study on how beef benefits the body and make the results look like beef is essential to take your next breath.

    Believe it or not, most scientists actually want to get the most accurate results possible. I hate this "they were just looking for x" argument.
  • PaleoPath4Lyfe
    PaleoPath4Lyfe Posts: 3,161 Member
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    I always look at the stats from studies with some skepticism and look at who is behind the study. The global warming/climate change/whatever they want to call it this week to fit their agenda people will never publish a study saying anything other than what they want it to say. Same for the other side.

    Besides, stats can be made to say anything. 40% of all people know that.

    Yes, very true.

    Look at what Ancel Keys did back in the 1950's to sway the public that saturated fat is bad. He cherry picked data and largely ignored data that went against his own thinking.

    So the outcome was what he wanted it to be when in turn we have found out that saturated fat in deed is not only healthy, but it is completely necessary for the brain, organs and cells to function properly.

    The same goes with cholesterol.
  • ironanimal
    ironanimal Posts: 5,922 Member
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    1325140871_Angry_bull_is_so_angry_gag.jpg
    Yes, Red Meat can kill. And a few years ago, peanut butter could give you cancer, as can plastic and microwaves. I do wish the vegetarian would come down off it's high horse, slaughter it, cook it and see that life isn't so bad as an omnivore. You never see that being pushed on anyone, and the OMG DONT EAT MEAT scares are a little rediculous.
  • Bentley2718
    Bentley2718 Posts: 1,690 Member
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    The study also notes that most red meat eaters tend to be people who indulge in copious amounts of fast food, soda's, alcohol and lack of exercising, but I'm sure none of that plays into the findings.

    They controlled for this using a multiple (not multivariate, grrr!) regression. They could have used matching techniques to make sure they had an area of common support, as a reviewer I might have asked for this analysis, but quite frankly I doubt it would have made a huge difference, since there are fairly wide variations in health habits.
  • dma1988
    dma1988 Posts: 7
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    Unless you're of the opinion that humans originally lived in an amazing garden and ate lots of wonderful plant foods.

    The physical evidence and findings does not point to that though.

    Not in my opinion, but this is ot the place for that debate. I'm just pointing out that we are from all walks of life and backgrounds and opinions. The one thing I notice on this site is a lack of tolerance for other opinions.

    At the end of the day, there's a multi-billion dollar industry because A LOT of approaches actually work. You just need to pick one and stick to it.
  • SilentRenegade
    SilentRenegade Posts: 245 Member
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    I always look at the stats from studies with some skepticism and look at who is behind the study. The global warming/climate change/whatever they want to call it this week to fit their agenda people will never publish a study saying anything other than what they want it to say. Same for the other side.

    Besides, stats can be made to say anything. 40% of all people know that.

    Yes, very true.

    Look at what Ancel Keys did back in the 1950's to sway the public that saturated fat is bad. He cherry picked data and largely ignored data that went against his own thinking.

    So the outcome was what he wanted it to be when in turn we have found out that saturated fat in deed is not only healthy, but it is completely necessary for the brain, organs and cells to function properly.

    The same goes with cholesterol.

    I tried the low fat, barely any meats deal a few years ago... and was extremely depressed a few days in. I had meat again and felt better... I admit, I eat a much higher protein/fats diet and not many carbs, but I feel really great on that type of diet.
  • ncahill77
    ncahill77 Posts: 501 Member
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    Don't take my comment wrong on the soda's and alcohol, I love red meat. My point was the mortality rate can't be explained by red meat alone as they didn't factor in that many in the study lead unhealthy lifestyles in various ways. full disclosure, i enjoy an occassional soda and any type of acohol.
  • AvsFreak
    AvsFreak Posts: 152 Member
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    http://www.livestrong.com/blog/are-burgers-healthy-why-red-meat-is-not-bad-for-you/
  • JPod279
    JPod279 Posts: 722 Member
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    Don't get me wrong...I am all for other people being vegan. Leaves more delicious meat for me. :)
  • ekz13
    ekz13 Posts: 725 Member
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    in my mind, god, evolution, whatever... look at the facts..

    humans have both flat grinding teeth and sharper pointy ones, this suggests omnivore, we need a good BALANCE of both of these..


    and beer...lots and lots of beer (which qualifies as both meat and grain... Hops and "pork chop in a can")
  • SwannySez
    SwannySez Posts: 5,864 Member
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    wow.... I love propaganda. I took a stroll around the whole site, it seems just a tiny bit biased. do you have a link to the whole study in print, not just a video taking the parts that further a certain agenda.

    I found the whole study in print rather easily using google. And I just read it. The authors were quite thorough.

    Wow! You should totally link to it. And thanks!
  • darkling_glory
    darkling_glory Posts: 239 Member
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    From what I understand of the study, the reserachers recommend less than 1 pound of red meat per person, per week.

    If someone told you (general you, not anyone specific) that it was recommended to eat less than 1 pound of *cake* per person, per week. Everyone would say, "Well of course! Cake is bad for you. Eat in moderation. A little goes a long way!"

    But as soon as someone says you should limit your meat intake, people get super defensive about it. "You can take my meat over my cold dead body!"

    I wonder why that is... possibly because people understand that red meat isn't *really* good for you in the long run?
  • scapez
    scapez Posts: 2,018 Member
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    Steak & BJ day is probably not the day for men to be worrying about meat leading to their early demise...:sad:
  • lukeout007
    lukeout007 Posts: 1,247 Member
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    Steak & BJ day

    What day is this? Someone tell my wife...I'm taking the day off.
  • ncahill77
    ncahill77 Posts: 501 Member
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    The study also notes that most red meat eaters tend to be people who indulge in copious amounts of fast food, soda's, alcohol and lack of exercising, but I'm sure none of that plays into the findings.

    They controlled for this using a multiple (not multivariate, grrr!) regression. They could have used matching techniques to make sure they had an area of common support, as a reviewer I might have asked for this analysis, but quite frankly I doubt it would have made a huge difference, since there are fairly wide variations in health habits.

    So they had 1 dependent variable vs 2 or more using multivariate? The dependant variable being death/sickness and the meat being the manipulated independent variable correct? As each person is unique and this was not done under a 24 hour watch to make sure all other independent variables be the same how was this controlled?
  • JTTaylor33
    JTTaylor33 Posts: 2
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    Steak & BJ day is probably not the day for men to be worrying about meat leading to their early demise...:sad:


    LOL
  • Lyndi4
    Lyndi4 Posts: 442 Member
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    Steak & BJ day

    What day is this? Someone tell my wife...I'm taking the day off.

    ^^:laugh: Must not let husband find out about this day... LOL. :wink:
  • Purple_Orchid_87
    Purple_Orchid_87 Posts: 517 Member
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    I'm going to die
    not yet decided what of
    but up until a few years ago, it could have been illegal drugs
    but I know I am going to die of something
    and with my family history, it's likely to not be good (if onyl we all died in a nice peaceful way, with no pain)
  • lukeout007
    lukeout007 Posts: 1,247 Member
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    I'm going to die
    not yet decided what of
    but up until a few years ago, it could have been illegal drugs
    but I know I am going to die of something
    and with my family history, it's likely to not be good (if onyl we all died in a nice peaceful way, with no pain)

    That was a strangely morbid post...good luck with that.
  • jaymek92
    jaymek92 Posts: 309 Member
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    Yes, Red Meat can kill. And a few years ago, peanut butter could give you cancer, as can plastic and microwaves. I do wish the vegetarian would come down off it's high horse, slaughter it, cook it and see that life isn't so bad as an omnivore. You never see that being pushed on anyone, and the OMG DONT EAT MEAT scares are a little rediculous.
    really? nobody pushes eating meat? because my grandmother pushes meat on me all the time, despite the fact that i haven't eaten meat in four years. everybody i meet tries to push fish or seafood on me because they insist it's not meat (it was once alive, now it is dead- i'm not eating it). it seems like you're pushing meat on vegetarians and your horse is just as high as "the vegetarian"'s.

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