Meat eating vs. Vegan debate
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Welcome!
It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.0 -
There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
According to both dictionary.com and merriam-webster.com, "carnist" is not a word.
http://www.carnism.com/carnism.htm
Oh well, if someone created an internet site using the word then all the dictionaries must just be wrong, I guess. :huh:
Amazeballs is used all the time and probably not in the dictionary... yet. Language is always being enhanced and developed. Please don't be mean when someone is just presenting their defence.
Um ... okay. I will henseforth refrain from pointing out that the "defense" that all meat eaters are inhuman and lack empathy and compassion used words not in the dictionary because it's mean.0 -
Welcome! It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.
Really? That's interesting. Is that just due to the supplements that vegans and vegetarians often take, or no?
And yes, I know I can Google it, and probably will. I'm reading and responding in between folding laundry, getting ready for a road trip.0 -
No plant based foods contain B12 or cholesterol (which is needed to make testosterone and estrogen). Other than that, it just comes down to personal choice of whether or not you want to be vegan or a meat eater.
A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer/Group Fitness Instructor
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I agree about it being personal choice, but there is vegan nutritional yeast, which is grown on molasses, that has B12. Or there are B12 supplements.
I think Marmite and Vegamite have high levels of B12. Never tried it myself but apparently it's used as a spread.
Where would one get cholesterol supplements that aren't animal based though?0 -
Bump. Sorry, saving my spot so I can go to the gym...the info here is really interesting and thus interfering with the day haha.0
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There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
According to both dictionary.com and merriam-webster.com, "carnist" is not a word.
http://www.carnism.com/carnism.htm
Oh well, if someone created an internet site using the word then all the dictionaries must just be wrong, I guess. :huh:
Amazeballs is used all the time and probably not in the dictionary... yet. Language is always being enhanced and developed. Please don't be mean when someone is just presenting their defence.
Um ... okay. I will henseforth refrain from pointing out that the "defense" that all meat eaters are inhuman and lack empathy and compassion used words not in the dictionary because it's mean.
Hehe, yeah I know it can be so frustrating biting your tongue when you feel strongly against what someone else has said. I just don't want this threat to tumble down into an angry mishmash of insults, sarcasm etc. against eachother.0 -
You need to see a mental health professional.There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
No. I'm having none of that here.0 -
You need to see a mental health professional.There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
That is not helpful.0 -
Welcome! It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.
Really? That's interesting. Is that just due to the supplements that vegans and vegetarians often take, or no?
And yes, I know I can Google it, and probably will. I'm reading and responding in between folding laundry, getting ready for a road trip.
Like I said, it was SO brief that I didn't really look into it properly (posts are looooooong).0 -
No plant based foods contain B12 or cholesterol (which is needed to make testosterone and estrogen). Other than that, it just comes down to personal choice of whether or not you want to be vegan or a meat eater.
A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer/Group Fitness Instructor
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I agree about it being personal choice, but there is vegan nutritional yeast, which is grown on molasses, that has B12. Or there are B12 supplements.
I think Marmite and Vegamite have high levels of B12. Never tried it myself but apparently it's used as a spread.
Where would one get cholesterol supplements that aren't animal based though?
Hehe, cholesterol supplements. And that's true. Don't we get all of our cholesterol from animals? Or can that be found in plants too?0 -
There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
According to both dictionary.com and merriam-webster.com, "carnist" is not a word.
http://www.carnism.com/carnism.htm
Oh well, if someone created an internet site using the word then all the dictionaries must just be wrong, I guess. :huh:
Amazeballs is used all the time and probably not in the dictionary... yet. Language is always being enhanced and developed. Please don't be mean when someone is just presenting their defence.
Um ... okay. I will henseforth refrain from pointing out that the "defense" that all meat eaters are inhuman and lack empathy and compassion used words not in the dictionary because it's mean.
Hehe, yeah I know it can be so frustrating biting your tongue when you feel strongly against what someone else has said. I just don't want this threat to tumble down into an angry mishmash of insults, sarcasm etc. against eachother.
BTW, what is an amazeball? I'm not trying to be mean or sarcastic, just never heard that term.0 -
There are no benefits of meat. The reason vegans cannot "accept" your lifestyle is because it promotes murder, rape, and torture of living beings for the sole purpose of selfish human desire for taste. That is something I cannot and will not ever condone. Meat eating is cultural and that is why people get so defensive and feel under attack when all the evidence points to the lack of ethics in the choice to eat animal products. Scientific studies prove that humans do not need meat to survive and live a healthy lifestyle. Millions of vegans prove this by simply living their lives. Carnists view animals as objects and property, not creatures with thoughts or feelings or lives of their own. Carnists lack empathy and compassion, which in itself is inhuman.
According to both dictionary.com and merriam-webster.com, "carnist" is not a word.
http://www.carnism.com/carnism.htm
Oh well, if someone created an internet site using the word then all the dictionaries must just be wrong, I guess. :huh:
Amazeballs is used all the time and probably not in the dictionary... yet. Language is always being enhanced and developed. Please don't be mean when someone is just presenting their defence.
Um ... okay. I will henseforth refrain from pointing out that the "defense" that all meat eaters are inhuman and lack empathy and compassion used words not in the dictionary because it's mean.
Hehe, yeah I know it can be so frustrating biting your tongue when you feel strongly against what someone else has said. I just don't want this threat to tumble down into an angry mishmash of insults, sarcasm etc. against eachother.
BTW, what is an amazeball? I'm not trying to be mean or sarcastic, just never heard that term.
Hahaha! I don't even know! Some ridiculous slang again that is slowly making it's way around the English-speaking people. My mum and dad have even started saying 'STFU' *facepalm*0 -
Welcome! It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.
Really? That's interesting. Is that just due to the supplements that vegans and vegetarians often take, or no?
And yes, I know I can Google it, and probably will. I'm reading and responding in between folding laundry, getting ready for a road trip.
Like I said, it was SO brief that I didn't really look into it properly (posts are looooooong).
B12 deficiency can happen because of the bodies inability to digest B12. It is an actual, physical inability to digest B12. It could happen to anyone.
From what I understand it is a matter of numbers. More people eat meat, so more meat-eaters have B12 deficiencies. Does that make sense?0 -
Hehe, cholesterol supplements. And that's true. Don't we get all of our cholesterol from animals? Or can that be found in plants too?
We get it all from animals, because humans are animals. Dietary cholesterol is usually unnecessary. Uunless you have liver problems your body will make all it needs.0 -
I get a B12 shot in my *kitten* every 3 months to keep my levels up. I am not a vegan but I am a pescatarian (eating eggs, dairy and fish). I was 10 years old when I made that life changing decision. I also get iron infusions because I cannot absorb iron. I have a live and let live philosophy. There are plenty of people that eat meat and people not eating meat that are completely unhealthy. It is not my job to police everyone. Where I have a problem, is when people make choices like being a vegan for their children. My kids eat meat because that is not my decision to make for them. If they want to follow in my footsteps in the future, they can do that, but it is not my place to control them. I feed them healthy well balanced meals. I agree with the comment that food lifestyle is a personal choice like reliegion. Similarly I do not believe people the religious scientists have the right to dictate whether their child receives a life saving blood donation. Kids are little people too and should be allowed to make their own choices.0
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Welcome! It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.
Really? That's interesting. Is that just due to the supplements that vegans and vegetarians often take, or no?
And yes, I know I can Google it, and probably will. I'm reading and responding in between folding laundry, getting ready for a road trip.
Like I said, it was SO brief that I didn't really look into it properly (posts are looooooong).
B12 deficiency can happen because of the bodies inability to digest B12. It is an actual, physical inability to digest B12. It could happen to anyone.
From what I understand it is a matter of numbers. More people eat meat, so more meat-eaters have B12 deficiencies. Does that make sense?
Yeah, it does. So rather than percentages, it's based on actual numbers? Which is not the right way to look at that kind of data.
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Welcome! It's something I researched before going vegan, so glad I could help!
I did very very briefly see some stuff about how meat-eaters are more prone to B12 deficiency than vegans/vegetarians.
Really? That's interesting. Is that just due to the supplements that vegans and vegetarians often take, or no?
And yes, I know I can Google it, and probably will. I'm reading and responding in between folding laundry, getting ready for a road trip.
Like I said, it was SO brief that I didn't really look into it properly (posts are looooooong).
B12 deficiency can happen because of the bodies inability to digest B12. It is an actual, physical inability to digest B12. It could happen to anyone.
From what I understand it is a matter of numbers. More people eat meat, so more meat-eaters have B12 deficiencies. Does that make sense?
Does indeed! I did also think that maybe all these studies between health benefits between vegans and meat-eaters may be based on uneven numbers. Plus the fact that, especially Western cultures, eat so much processed rubbish now that maybe these things are contributing to bad health and not necessarily the meat that we eat?0 -
No plant based foods contain B12 or cholesterol (which is needed to make testosterone and estrogen). Other than that, it just comes down to personal choice of whether or not you want to be vegan or a meat eater.
A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer/Group Fitness Instructor
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I agree about it being personal choice, but there is vegan nutritional yeast, which is grown on molasses, that has B12. Or there are B12 supplements.
I think Marmite and Vegamite have high levels of B12. Never tried it myself but apparently it's used as a spread.
Where would one get cholesterol supplements that aren't animal based though?
Hehe, cholesterol supplements. And that's true. Don't we get all of our cholesterol from animals? Or can that be found in plants too?
I think the rule of thumb is "if it ddin't come from something with a liver, it doesn't have cholesterol"
Not sure if that's an absolute though.0 -
No plant based foods contain B12 or cholesterol (which is needed to make testosterone and estrogen). Other than that, it just comes down to personal choice of whether or not you want to be vegan or a meat eater.
A.C.E. Certified Personal Trainer/Group Fitness Instructor
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I agree about it being personal choice, but there is vegan nutritional yeast, which is grown on molasses, that has B12. Or there are B12 supplements.
I think Marmite and Vegamite have high levels of B12. Never tried it myself but apparently it's used as a spread.
Where would one get cholesterol supplements that aren't animal based though?
Hehe, cholesterol supplements. And that's true. Don't we get all of our cholesterol from animals? Or can that be found in plants too?
I think the rule of thumb is "if it ddin't come from something with a liver, it doesn't have cholesterol"
Not sure if that's an absolute though.0 -
FIrst off I'd like to give a huge kudos to the OP who has been able to keep this thread on track with respecfful discussion among participants (except for the onsies and twosies (sorry if those aren't words lol) here and there who choose to be confrontational and defensive) I was fully expecting the thread to be locked by page 5! It's been very informative and I love when topics can be discussed, argued and defended in reasonable ways.
I've been a pescetarian for about 6 years, after doing a project in college on factory farms I decided to experiment with it and it was so easy that 6 years later I never went back to beef and poultry. My personal justification for still eating seafood is I know if it came down to it I could kill a fish, I don't think I could ever look a cow, chicken, pig etc in the face and kill it
If I wouldn't be able to do the killing myself I don't think it's reasonable that I allow someone else to do it for me. But that's just MY logic for me.
I think a problem with seeking out and buying directly from organic/cage free/open range farms is that eventually if a lot of people did this, those small farms wouldn't be able to supply for the demand. We would end up back at square one.
I think from andethical and environmental stand point people should REDUCE their meat consumption but I don't believe eliminating the meat industry is a reasonable goal or solution.
I also don't judge other's diets, but don't mind having discussions about my choices and the benefits I've found.0
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