Ketogenic Diet

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  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    Did I say I was? My estimated BF is about 28% using wrist size to height to weight calculator.
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    Did I say I was? My estimated BF is about 28% using wrist size to height to weight calculator.

    thus the book does not apply to you
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    Did I say the book applied to me? Did I even say I was following it?

    I'll reiterate what I said 3 posts ago

    [the reason] "I cited the 1500 calorie/day (from the UD2.0 book) [is to] to prove Reddy, who claimed one should never go below BMR, that it's fine to go below BMR."

    If it were not acceptable to go slightly below BMR, ever, it would not have been suggested
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    Did I say the book applied to me? Did I even say I was following it?

    I'll reiterate what I said 3 posts ago

    [the reason] "I cited the 1500 calorie/day (from the UD2.0 book) [is to] to prove Reddy, who claimed one should never go below BMR, that it's fine to go below BMR."

    If it were not acceptable to go slightly below BMR, ever, it would not have been suggested

    so if the book doesn't apply to you, why are you eating 1500 calories a day? coincidence?
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    If you go back 2 or 3 pages, you'll see that I chose 1500 calories because a 500 calorie deficit from my TDEE of 2000 calories is.... 1500!
  • JessicaOnKeto
    JessicaOnKeto Posts: 364 Member
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    Bump, to read/reply/look at later :wink:

    Edit to say: I :heart: my ketogenic way of life.
    Feel free to add/message/taunt/friend me :drinker:
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    If you go back 2 or 3 pages, you'll see that I chose 1500 calories because a 500 calorie deficit from my TDEE of 2000 calories is.... 1500!

    I know, the problem is you've got some crazy notion in your head that you only expend 200 calories over the course of your day, which... is not the case.

    dude listen, we want you to succeed, that's why we're arguing with you. you'll get better results if you eat more, that's just the reality. with your body comp as it stands, if you lifted heavy 3 days a week and did some sprinting or a bit of HIIT cardio you'd get killer results. Except you have to eat to do it.

    do you think that guy you want to look like eats 1500 calories a day? I guarantee he eats at LEAST 3000 maintenance.
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    do you think that guy you want to look like eats 1500 calories a day? I guarantee he eats at LEAST 3000 maintenance.

    You're totally right here. But here's the thing, I do not expect to make a transition from where I am now, to that guy.

    I have a 2 step plan: lean out, then go on a separate, caloric surplus diet with resistance training to put on muscle.
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    do you think that guy you want to look like eats 1500 calories a day? I guarantee he eats at LEAST 3000 maintenance.

    You're totally right here. But here's the thing, I do not expect to make a transition from where I am now, to that guy.

    I have a 2 step plan: lean out, then go on a separate, caloric surplus diet with resistance training to put on muscle.

    why not use the mass you already have and just convert it to muscle...? much simpler. you can do it all at once. you actually aren't very overweight, you just need to do body re-composition, and eating that little won't do the trick.

    Eat a slight deficit, lift heavy, do a little bit of cardio, done. One step process.
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    Because as previously stated, gaining muscle on a cut is not feasible.

    Oh and...
    why not use the mass you already have and just convert it to muscle...?
    Fat does not "convert to muscle".
  • writetomab
    writetomab Posts: 226
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    obligatory "keto diets are unsustainable" post

    So no different than any other diet then really??? Fact: 95% of people who go on a diet gain it all back within 3 years! Of course, none of this has anything to do with the diet itself but more to do with peoples motivation, willpower and long term commitment and determination to succeed and to genuinely change their lifestyle.

    Is it harder to follow than some other diets?? For some maybe, but then again so are many other types of diets. This does not detract from the fact that ketogenic diets and low carb diets can be very effective and if maintained can deliver great results and health benefits and have no adverse effects whatsoever despite what many people like to say to the contrary.

    I wonder, how many of the disbelievers have actually even tried it properly? I'm not saying its for everyone and I personally am not on a ketogenic diet at present although I have done in the past and will do again. Point being, just because it might be tough for some people to follow, and just because some people can't stand the thought of living without their daily bread, pasta, rice etc... It does not make it a bad diet!
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    I know, the problem is you've got some crazy notion in your head that you only expend 200 calories over the course of your day, which... is not the case.

    I also want to address this:

    How do you know this? Is it possible that the activity factor multiplier is overestimated?

    If you say no, then consider this:

    My maximum heart rate is 193 beats per minute according to the formula: 220-age=MHR.

    I did a set of kettlebell swings yesterday. I am sick, so I took it easy with slow swings. By the end of my 14 minute workout with a work:rest set of 20:60 my heart rate was 172. If you follow the MHR formula, this is 90% of my max heart rate. I should've been collapsed on the floor, gasping for breath, and probably with a faint taste of blood in my mouth.

    Yet I continued to walk around, putting my KB away, etc and within 90 seconds, my respiratory function was normal and I felt fine.

    Obviously I wasn't at 90% of my MHR and the MHR formula is wrong.

    Long story short:

    MHR formula isn't accurate. Strong chance activity factor multiplier is inaccurate.
  • writetomab
    writetomab Posts: 226
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    Because as previously stated, gaining muscle on a cut is not feasible.

    You were doing soo well... This is one thing I do have to disagree with speaking from experience!

    <<<<<<<<< I built all this muscle and got lean whilst on a calorie deficit!
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    Nice going! Still not sure if it's feasible. Quite probably you already had that muscle and saw it when you leaned up.

    What all did you do? Any use of chemicals?
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    I know, the problem is you've got some crazy notion in your head that you only expend 200 calories over the course of your day, which... is not the case.

    I also want to address this:

    How do you know this? Is it possible that the activity factor multiplier is overestimated?

    If you say no, then consider this:

    My maximum heart rate is 193 beats per minute according to the formula: 220-age=MHR.

    I did a set of kettlebell swings yesterday. I am sick, so I took it easy with slow swings. By the end of my 14 minute workout with a work:rest set of 20:60 my heart rate was 172. If you follow the MHR formula, this is 90% of my max heart rate. I should've been collapsed on the floor, gasping for breath, and probably with a faint taste of blood in my mouth.

    Yet I continued to walk around, putting my KB away, etc and within 90 seconds, my respiratory function was normal and I felt fine.

    Obviously I wasn't at 90% of my MHR and the MHR formula is wrong.

    Long story short:

    MHR formula isn't accurate. Strong chance activity factor multiplier is inaccurate.

    i saw a painting where the sky was purple so therefore the sky must actually be purple.

    this is what you've just said.

    your one isolated, potentially inaccurate assessment of your heart rate throws decades of fitness science out the window. got it.
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    Because as previously stated, gaining muscle on a cut is not feasible.

    Oh and...
    why not use the mass you already have and just convert it to muscle...?
    Fat does not "convert to muscle".

    no obviously it doesn't actually convert, it's just a turn of phrase.

    but if your body has other fuel sources to burn besides your muscle tissue, it will burn them, thus shedding fat at the same time as your lifting heavy builds muscle size and strength
  • RiesigJay
    RiesigJay Posts: 151 Member
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    Hmm, ok how about a New York Times article that validated what I said about the MHR formula being bunk:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2001/04/24/health/maximum-heart-rate-theory-is-challenged.html
  • yuliyax
    yuliyax Posts: 288
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    bump
  • CoachReddy
    CoachReddy Posts: 3,949 Member
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    Hmm, ok how about a New York Times article that validated what I said about the MHR formula being bunk:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2001/04/24/health/maximum-heart-rate-theory-is-challenged.html

    that's interesting and i'll look into it, but what does it have to do with how many calories you burn daily, and thus, your TDEE? how much are you exercising?
  • writetomab
    writetomab Posts: 226
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    Nice going! Still not sure if it's feasible. Quite probably you already had that muscle and saw it when you leaned up.

    What all did you do? Any use of chemicals?

    Well I can certainly assure you it was not there at the start and definitely no use of 'chemicals'. I lost 40lbs doing a mix of FB and HIIT sessions, ate a high protein and clean diet and to a calorie deficit of 1800 cals a day, only supplements I took was protein shakes, fish oils and multivitamins. Also, in terms of strength gains, these were huge. At my peak I was squatting 145kg for 3 reps ( I only weighed 72kg at the time) was able to do 21 chins and bench press was 110kg for my one rep max. I also did 86 press ups in 60 seconds where at the start I was able to do around 40ish. So yes, it is possible to build muscle while on a calorie deficit! But that was because I was chunky to start with... Once I got lean then yes, my progress would have stalled and I would have had to eat more to build more muscle. But, if you are looking to lose weight then you can burn fat and build muscle at the same time.

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