Sugar addiction....

maillemaker · August 2013

What you're experiencing is the yo-yo of your blood glucose levels spiking, and then crashing. It's not "withdrawal." It's your body's natural response to keep your blood glucose levels regulated. And what gets those levels up there faster than anything else? Simple carbohydrates (e.g. sugar). Hence the craving.

If you keep your blood glucose levels stable, this won't happen.

I would submit to you that this most definitely is withdrawal. It may not be like withdrawal from heroine, but the fact of the matter is, you feel bad when you crash and you feel good when you mitigate the crash by consuming more simple carbohydrates!

Yes, it's a "craving", and if you can't summon the willpower to resist it you will find yourself "shooting up" every time you are crashing. Every addiction is a "craving" - it's a craving that you can't summon the willpower to ignore.

I totally agree, however, that the best way to get out of this cycle is to keep your blood glucose levels stable and the best way to do this is to avoid simple carbs and eat more protein to mitigate hunger.

SDkitty · August 2013

What you're experiencing is the yo-yo of your blood glucose levels spiking, and then crashing. It's not "withdrawal." It's your body's natural response to keep your blood glucose levels regulated. And what gets those levels up there faster than anything else? Simple carbohydrates (e.g. sugar). Hence the craving.

If you keep your blood glucose levels stable, this won't happen.

I would submit to you that this most definitely is withdrawal. It may not be like withdrawal from heroine, but the fact of the matter is, you feel bad when you crash and you feel good when you mitigate the crash by consuming more simple carbohydrates!

Yes, it's a "craving", and if you can't summon the willpower to resist it you will find yourself "shooting up" every time you are crashing. Every addiction is a "craving" - it's a craving that you can't summon the willpower to ignore.

I totally agree, however, that the best way to get out of this cycle is to keep your blood glucose levels stable and the best way to do this is to avoid simple carbs and eat more protein to mitigate hunger.

As someone who has battled with addiction over half of my life (I've been sober 22 months now) I have to say that I can't really understand why everyone feels the need to argue the point of whether you can really be addicted to sugar. We make the jokes about "sucking *** for ****" and it's funny and we giggle but in the end, the severity of the substance being abused doesn't matter to the person stuck in the midst of it. It is all a matter of perception.

I will never understand being a heroin junkie. I will never be able to have a conversation with them where they say "yes you know exactly what I mean" because I don't. I can't. I can read all the medical papers and real life stories I want but I haven't lived it.
Someone who can't stop shoveling Twinkies in their face isn't going to understand how I could throw my life away for a bottle of booze and a line. Have you ever scrapped for just enough change in the seats to buy liquor instead of gas? Probably not. But that doesn't make you wrong about how you feel. It's just a different level of pain.

To want something so bad that you dismiss the consequences and suffer later, that is addiction. When people tell you you need to stop, you need to watch your health...The fact that you aren't going to OD on a cupcake makes it a less severe problem, not no problem at all.

I realize that there are a lot of conflicting medical opinions on the subject, I am only speaking from experience and the heart. Don't judge each other. Everyone has their own problems to overcome.

Confuzzled4ever · August 2013

Sugar is addicting. Whenever i start, my body craves it. If I don't eat more sugar, I develop headaches, my eyes hurt, i get cranky and I cant' sleep, all I think about is cake and candy and sugary foods. I'm not talking having a cookie here or there.. I mean when I go and eat sugary foods at each meal. After 1 day of this (yep, for me 1 day is enough) i'm craving it and my body is looking for more. I'm going through it right now actually. I have a killer headache, i couldn't sleep last night. My eyes hurt and i'm having a really hard time resisting eating a handful of the M&Ms in my co-workers office, because i know they will make it stop, but it will also mean that I will have to deal with this again tomorrow and the next day.

You can say it's a myth all you want. All I can do is say. For me, there's a physical reaction to sugar withdrawal. Is it as severe as a drug or alcohol addiction? not by a long shot. But it exists. Thankfully it's over in a few days and it only returns surrounding my second piece of cake or if I over indulge on sugary foods. (yep I check labels and avoid them)

Everyone is different. It could be that I have a very high chance of addiction. It's in my family, I grew up with an alcoholic and could slip into very easily. But instead of vodka, I drown my sorrows in sugar.

What you're experiencing is the yo-yo of your blood glucose levels spiking, and then crashing. It's not "withdrawal." It's your body's natural response to keep your blood glucose levels regulated. And what gets those levels up there faster than anything else? Simple carbohydrates (e.g. sugar). Hence the craving.

If you keep your blood glucose levels stable, this won't happen.

I know this. And i know what sugar does to me and I know the long term health ramifications of eating the sugary foods. There's a chemical reason behind almost ever addiction. that doesn't mean they are not addiction or invalid because if you "just fix this one thing (that you are doing to yourself in most cases)" it will go away. Most addictions are psychological moreso then physical. You stop needing a cigarette physically within 3 days, but physiologically it takes months, or years. Some people are addicted to eating soap. That's no more or less valid an addiction then heroin, alcohol or sugar. Sugar addiction is real and has very real consequences, just as other addictions do. I have to battle the urge to eat those M&ms daily. Sometime to the point where I can't go to his office. I have to call him from mine or ask him to come to mine.

This right here. You can eat sugar. You can eat cookies. Just don't eat a whole bag. Go for the smaller packs. And tell yourself they are to last a week and if they don't no more. If you can fit it in your Cals then eat it. If you eat to much remember you have to go work out more.

I would just eat 2 or 4 small packs.. and being full isn't enough to stop myself if i'm really on a binge. i ate an entire chocolate ring cake in one sitting once and didn't even realize it until the package was empty. An hour or so later I was into the bag of cookies. You all can say that's lack of will power and i'm just giving up, but i had a headache developing by then and i wanted it gone. Aspirin doesn't work. Knowing that I will feel terrible later, and likely be sick and end up with a worse headache and no sleep couldn't deter me. And only sweet sugar laden food. I can have all the other food I want in my house, healthy or unhealthy and I won't have a problem. Just don't buy it works sometimes. but if i'm really in the grasp of sugar I will just go to the store and get some or i'll bake a cake or something.

I do work hard at it.. when the craving really strikes I eat high cocoa dark chocolate or pineapple (sweetest fruit ever!) to try to quell it without ODing on sugar and getting myself back into the cycle.

Moral of the story: Never put an entire pan of hot brownies in front of me.. *sigh*

ETA: I think sugar is one of the hardest things to overcome.. simply because it's there readily available and it an cost as little as 25 cents. It's in everything. i was shocked when I started reading labels. It amazing the entire human population isn't diabetic. Other addictions are very hard too, but you have to know where to go to get heroin and other drugs, you have to have money or know someone to borrow from to gamble all the time. Not downs grading them, but sugar addiction is the easiest and it's available to you from birth. Chef will sprinkle sugar on their dishes so people like them better. ( i know 2 chef's personally who do this and their restaurants are always packed!) Parents stock the pantry with cakes and cookies and granola bars. Things that don't need sugar have it added tot hem. Bread does not need sugar (of needs very little depending on the kind), yet many breads do have sugar and lots of it in them. Sweet tea, when tea really requires no sugar. Many peanut butters have sugar in them.. (why???)

Morn66 · August 2013

Once again, this is true of all addictions. You CAN indeed control it, and you have to to kick the addiction. Even long after the physiological addiction has been broken, most alcoholics cannot permit themselves a drink lest they fall back into their old behavioral patterns again and become both physiologically and behaviorally addicted once again.

Actually, not all addictions can be controlled, at least not by a non-superpowerful human being. My brother was unable to control his heroin addiction. Even after nearly dying from an overdose. Twice. In a month. He was a rabid animal. I had to chain him and lock him away. It was horrible, although getting him through the experience did rather bind us for life even more than we already are because we're twins, so that was a good thing. But it was not a matter of him saying, "OK, I'm just not going to do this anymore," as it is with over-consuming sugar/food. Your body needs sugar/food so you must have it, and you "simply" need to learn to control what/how much you eat.

You're right, though; it is a matter of degree, BUT the biochemistry of a chemical addiction to drugs, illicit or otherwise, and an "addiction" to something that isn't a drug is very different. Drugs tend to alter the body in some way. Such as: Caffeine intake forces the body to create additional adenosine receptors to make up for the fact that caffeine can bind to the adenosine receptors your body already has. Most drugs (or poisons) work in similar ways, binding to receptors meant for something else, thus causing altered states of consciousness. (Although, interestingly, your body naturally has cannabis receptors, which is part of the reason why marijuana is non-addictive.) Behaviors, on the other hand, tend to trigger certain physiological responses, such as an adrenaline release or a dopamine release or an endorphin release. (My brother has exchanged heroin for exercising heavily, since endorphins act on the body like opiates.) People like those releases and, if anything, THAT is what they are addicted to, not to the substance or the event or behavior that causes the release. Certainly, there are behavioral components of an addiction, but those are simply learned/conditioned patterns of behavior. (i.e., "I have to have coffee while reading my newspaper." You don't really have to have the coffee at all; you've simply learned to associate one thing with the other.)

So perhaps in the end it's just a matter of semantics. I prefer clearly-defined terms and, to me, a "true" addiction is a physiological/biochemical one with perhaps behavioral/psychological components, not a purely psychological one. I used to be addicted to caffeine in that sense. Alcohol addiction is an addiction in that sense. A gambling "addiction" is not. Neither is a food "addiction." To me, the word is becoming far too loosely used, often as a justification for a behavior that a person wants to continue even though they know it's bad for them because they don't want to make the effort to change. It makes their problem "not their fault"...even though, in reality, all addictions are the fault of the person who has them. After all, no one forces you to inject heroin into yourself. Or to binge on Twinkies. Or to drink alcohol. Or to live at the blackjack tables, etc. I still maintain that you cannot be addicted to something that the body requires and that solving a sugar/food addiction, in particular, is more a matter of behavior modification than one of "overcoming an addiction." It's more a matter of learning to moderate one's behavior. Avoidance of certain foods might help at first, yes, but IMO to exaggerate that avoidance such that you start to demonize food is merely exchanging one behavioral disorder for another.

But you know, like I said, I'm a snobby a**hole about this, so there's that, too.

And just out of curiosity: You make chainmail? That's cool. I used to be really into the SCA, eons ago.

maillemaker · August 2013

I will never understand being a heroin junkie. I will never be able to have a conversation with them where they say "yes you know exactly what I mean" because I don't. I can't. I can read all the medical papers and real life stories I want but I haven't lived it.
Someone who can't stop shoveling Twinkies in their face isn't going to understand how I could throw my life away for a bottle of booze and a line. Have you ever scrapped for just enough change in the seats to buy liquor instead of gas? Probably not. But that doesn't make you wrong about how you feel. It's just a different level of pain.

To want something so bad that you dismiss the consequences and suffer later, that is addiction. When people tell you you need to stop, you need to watch your health...The fact that you aren't going to OD on a cupcake makes it a less severe problem, not no problem at all.

Great reply, and congratulations on staying sober!

maillemaker · August 2013

So perhaps in the end it's just a matter of semantics. I prefer clearly-defined terms and, to me, a "true" addiction is a physiological/biochemical one with perhaps behavioral/psychological components, not a purely psychological one. I used to be addicted to caffeine in that sense. Alcohol addiction is an addiction in that sense. A gambling "addiction" is not. Neither is a food "addiction."

Well, a lot of professionals seem to agree with you and some disagree. Both gambling and binge eating are now listed in the DSM-V, with gambling being listed as an addiction while binge eating is a disorder.

Yes, there does appear to be still controversy on exactly what constitutes an addiction and what does not. It appears to me that more behavioral disorders are becoming accepted in medical professional circles and that includes addictions that do not have a physiological component.

As has been cited in this thread, there is emerging research that is showing that non-physiological stimuli can affect the same areas of the brain associated with physiological addiction. And there is emerging research that showing that even when it cannot be detected through eating, sugar is also triggering a similar brain response.

But the bottom line is, you have a reward circuitry problem in play here and it requires willpower to break it. The stronger the reward is perceived the more willpower it takes to resist it.

So we call it whatever we want, when you crave certain kinds of foods so badly that you will break your diet for it even though you know it's wrong, there is an addiction-like symptom at work.

To me, the word is becoming far too loosely used, often as a justification for a behavior that a person wants to continue even though they know it's bad for them because they don't want to make the effort to change. It makes their problem "not their fault"...even though, in reality, all addictions are the fault of the person who has them. After all, no one forces you to inject heroin into yourself. Or to binge on Twinkies. Or to drink alcohol. Or to live at the blackjack tables, etc.

As I've said before, I haven't seen anyone here using addiction as an excuse for their behavior, but rather to explain why they avoid certain foods and how that makes them feel.

I still maintain that you cannot be addicted to something that the body requires and that solving a sugar/food addiction, in particular, is more a matter of behavior modification than one of "overcoming an addiction." It's more a matter of learning to moderate one's behavior.

Again, all addictions are a matter of learning to moderate one's behavior. There is no doubt that some addictions have behaviors that are harder to moderate than others. But every single addiction, whether it is heroin, alcohol, cocaine, or gambling, or internet use, or whatever - they all require learning to moderate one's behavior in order to break the addiction.

Avoidance of certain foods might help at first, yes, but IMO to exaggerate that avoidance such that you start to demonize food is merely exchanging one behavioral disorder for another.

Certainly if your avoidance of certain foods was exaggerated into an avoidance or demonization of all food that would be a different kind of eating disorder.

But I haven't seen anyone with that kind of issue here. Most people who are having a problem with avoiding certain kinds of foods are adamant about just that - certain kinds of foods. Namely, the foods that they have a hard time summoning the willpower to avoid if it is in front of them for the eating.

And just out of curiosity: You make chainmail? That's cool. I used to be really into the SCA, eons ago.

Not so much anymore, but I did at one time. Basically I invented the modern technique for making fairly historical-looking wedge-riveted maille. It has been adopted by all the manufacturers of it in the world as I sent them the tooling to make it.

Confuzzled4ever · August 2013

To me, the word is becoming far too loosely used, often as a justification for a behavior that a person wants to continue even though they know it's bad for them because they don't want to make the effort to change. It makes their problem "not their fault"...even though, in reality, all addictions are the fault of the person who has them. After all, no one forces you to inject heroin into yourself. Or to binge on Twinkies. Or to drink alcohol. Or to live at the blackjack tables, etc.

With this definition nothing is an addiction. Because every addiction is bad for you and pretty much every addiction can be assigned the view of "you simply want an excuse not to change your behavior or choices". It's a true and false statement. People are on here everyday fighting against the sugar cravings. I'd wager that most of them are trying to change, and win lose or draw they are still at trying and have the will to change it. It's not a matter of simply throwing out the Twinkies, it throwing them out and not grabbing the cookies or running to the store to replace them. Whether it's psychological, biological or physical addiction its' still addiction. Sugar addiction can lead to diabetes, so it does have a negative long term affect on our bodies because it hinders our bodies ability to properly regulate blood sugar.

I don't want to continue it. And it's hard to forgo the M&Ms in my coworkers office. they are logged often here, because i often do not make it the entire day without getting a fix. I didn't log all the sweets I ate this week, only some of them. It does help a lot. I hate having to put on here that i ate 3 pieces of apple crumb cake and 2 pieces of chocolate crunch ring cake. BUT I do it and it helps, plus i have great friends that help me keep the food choices in check.. most of the time. lol

The fact that you need to eat food to sustain life, make is a very hard thing to control. I need to eat, therefore I eat. But i need to moderate it and not over or under eat, but I still must eat. Thankfully the sugary foods are not a requirement for a nutritious and healthy diet. I feel bad for people who cannot control their eating of regular foods, that's got to be so hard to overcome.

Sugar addiction....

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