Holy sexism, batman!

I don't think anyone needs to be taught not to rape lol do you think someone would be raping people for years, then hear someone say "no dude rape is bad you shouldn't do that" and they'd be like "really? guess I'll stop". And this whole thought that there is a culture that promotes rape completely blows my mind. Rapists are criminals. That's it.

So, it couldn't possibly be the case that some dudes are ignorant about what constitutes explicit, affirmative consent and would not benefit from being educated that consent is never implied, or that consent cannot be given by someone who is impaired by alcohol or drugs? OK. Carry on then.

date rape. drunk rape. drugs rape.

As I said before. If both parties are equally intoxicated, all blame falls on the man and he can be charged with rape, even if she consented while drunk. This is where things get ridiculous. And I'm in no way saying that rape or date rape or anything like that are ok, but the double standards are out of hand.

If only there were some way we could, oh, I don't know, *teach* people that if she (or he) was drunk/drugged, she (or he) didn't give affirmative consent! If only there were some way of combating these ridiculous double standards! http://www.doctornerdlove.com/2013/03/enthusiastic-consent/

Um like I said, if both parties are intoxicated.

Say you go out to the bar, meet a girl, bring her back home. She's definitely down for sex, in fact taking your clothes off. You guys do the deed, while both of you are drunk. She can turn around the next morning and charge you for rape.

How can anyone think that is just? Are you saying that women can't comprehend anything if they've had a few drinks but men are evil masterminds? But I thought men and women were equal?

I will say this, clearly and unequivocally, one. more. time. There should not be such a double standard as you have described. What you are describing is wrong. No I am not saying women can't comprehend anything if they've had a few drinks but men are evil masterminds. That is the double standard you have described. I most certainly do not think that.

What I *am* saying is that neither party was capable of giving informed, enthusiastic consent.

So, maybe don't do the deed when you're impaired. I know, that's a crazy radical idea. Nobody ever got their rocks off when they were stone cold sober.

Wait so no one should have sex if they've been drinking? Are you serious? Lol ok I'm out this is ridiculous.

Drink|Drunk. Know your line.

If it works for driving a frickin' car, why is it so crazy for applying to intimate actions involving another human being's body?!

Exactly. Don't have sex with someone who wouldn't consent to sleeping with you while s/he was sober.

You look like a teacher, so I expected you to read and comprehend what whoha was saying, but somehow you seemed to have missed it all

"As I said before. If both parties are equally intoxicated, all blame falls on the man and he can be charged with rape, even if she consented while drunk. This is where things get ridiculous. And I'm in no way saying that rape or date rape or anything like that are ok, but the double standards are out of hand. "

hes saying if both parties are drunk, not just a sober guy trying to take advantage of a drunk chick.

also I doubt you have this problem anyway

Not a teacher any more. Whoha seems to think street harassment is funny, which I comprehended when I read all the "lol"s he was typing. If a woman consents to sex and then later accuses a man of rape, that's a terrible thing to do.

And I have no idea what you mean when you say you doubt I have this problem. I've never falsely accused someone of rape, but I have been harassed on the street, which is what this started out as.

I don't think harassment is funny. but I do think that people saying someone wanted to rape someone cuz they were "catcalling" or looked at them when they walked by is pretty damn funny.

I understand that women have a reason to be cautious, and they should be cautious. But to call someone sexist cuz they hit on you or tell people after the fact that you were almost raped because someone looked at you is completely insane.

lol

Catcalling is not the same thing as hitting on someone.

And now you're just nit picking because you have no argument.

How is it nitpicking to differentiate catcalling and hitting on someone, but not to differentiate what the OP was talking about and sexism?

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

I don't think harassment is funny. but I do think that people saying someone wanted to rape someone cuz they were "catcalling" or looked at them when they walked by is pretty damn funny.

I understand that women have a reason to be cautious, and they should be cautious. But to call someone sexist cuz they hit on you or tell people after the fact that you were almost raped because someone looked at you is completely insane.

lol

I think you're reading a lot of stuff in that wasn't there. Nobody said the catcallers wanted to rape someone or that the OP was almost raped. All we're saying is that that is an attitude, behavior, or condition that perpetuates stereotypes based on gender. If the OP had been male, that would not have happened. (Though then there is the possibility of someone being harassed because they "appeared to be gay" or whatever).

Contradictory Statement

Not at all. One is a behavior rooted in sexism, the other in gay-bashing. Although if you want to deconstruct the anti-gay phenomenon and point out that it is really rooted in sexism too, I'm willing to entertain that discussion.

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

Because she is not walking down the street so that you can look at her. When it's part of culture that it's okay to do that, it sends the message to both men and women that women are here primarily for men's pleasure. And that contributes to rape culture.

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

It doesn't contribute to rape culture. It is symptomatic of rape culture. When you do that, you are in effect saying that her worth to you as a human being is based solely on her sex appeal. If I were you, I would really keep that sort of revelation to myself while I worked on it in therapy. If, in fact, you valued her for something else, you would express your interest in a different fashion.

Okay,

"If the OP had been male, that would not have happened." <- So you know for a fact that if the OP was a male it wouldnt have happened? No, you really cant say you do. If so, please tell me what the next Powerball numbers are going to be so I can win M'kay?

Also if you REALLY believed beyond a shadow of a doubt that the OP would never have been harassed if they were a male why would you feel the need to say "Though then there is the possibility of someone being harassed because they "appeared to be gay" or whatever" ??

Because its possible it might happen....just not with this particular OP right? Someone else, at a different place in a different time? Definitely! Maybe the OP lives in some sort of sexism vortex that makes it impossible for this to happen?

So, we're talking about this person being harassed because of sexism. I mentioned the possibility because I was trying not to minimize the experience of men who have been harassed because of prejudice against gays (whether the harasser or harassee was in fact gay is immaterial). It's called having an inclusive discussion that doesn't alienate other marginalized groups.

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

Because she is not walking down the street so that you can look at her. When it's part of culture that it's okay to do that, it sends the message to both men and women that women are here primarily for men's pleasure. And that contributes to rape culture.

I'm sorry I was unaware that females were some all mighty being that I have to avert my eyes from when I see them. As I said before, "rape culture" is the stupidest saying. No one is teaching that rape is ok. Everyone knows it's wrong. You could take anything and say "this promotes rape culture" just because you don't like it.

"My cashier smiled at me today. I'm not here for his pleasure. He needs to avert his eyes and stop promoting rape culture."

You really don't get it, do you? You can look at women. You can smile at them. That's fine. Don't look at them lasciviously, don't holler at them from across the street (unless you know them), don't say something obscene to them, and if you're going to approach a woman with the intent of flirting or asking her out, do it in a way that shows you respect her as a human being, not just as a hot body you want to bang.

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

It doesn't contribute to rape culture. It is symptomatic of rape culture. When you do that, you are in effect saying that her worth to you as a human being is based solely on her sex appeal. If I were you, I would really keep that sort of revelation to myself while I worked on it in therapy. If, in fact, you valued her for something else, you would express your interest in a different fashion.

So if I were to instead say "I really like that dress you're wearing today." By your logic wouldn't that also be saying her worth to me as a human being is based solely on how she looks?

You don't get to tell people how much worth they put into someone because of one action.

"I really like that dress you're wearing today" is polite, unless you say it while licking your lips or doing something else disgusting.

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

It doesn't contribute to rape culture. It is symptomatic of rape culture. When you do that, you are in effect saying that her worth to you as a human being is based solely on her sex appeal. If I were you, I would really keep that sort of revelation to myself while I worked on it in therapy. If, in fact, you valued her for something else, you would express your interest in a different fashion.

So if I were to instead say "I really like that dress you're wearing today." By your logic wouldn't that also be saying her worth to me as a human being is based solely on how she looks?

You don't get to tell people how much worth they put into someone because of one action.

"I really like that dress you're wearing today" is polite, unless you say it while licking your lips or doing something else disgusting.

Like chewing food with their mouth open? Thats disgusting.

I dont usually post, but I found myself LOLing at all of this. Its been a little like torture getting thru reading this thread. Am I the only girl in here that isnt going to hate on men?

Have you ever been to a bar, strip club, idk just out of your houses? Girls have the advantage when out these days, not vice versa. Doyouevendate?

I have to say that two people getting drunk and having sex...is well pretty fun. It is enthusiastic actually. Ofc everything seems like a better idea when drunk. No great story ever begins with "man after my last salad we got wild and......"
We all know our inhibitions are lessened as we drink... so make the call of not drinking if you dont want to end up in bed with Mr. right now.

Catcalls promoting rape culture??? Secretly, we like it. We may act all...OMG I cant believe he said that... but inside...admit it. We would much rather be the girl someone finds attractive than not. We wouldn't spend hours getting ready for no one to notice.... ALSO.. I hear us girls doing it also. Mebe not hanging out the car window... but we do it.. Again, ever been to a male stripclub? The doors shut and all the sudden its girls gone wild and his pants need to go.

live a little. No one gets raped by catcall.

So if I were to instead say "I really like that dress you're wearing today." By your logic wouldn't that also be saying her worth to me as a human being is based solely on how she looks?

You don't get to tell people how much worth they put into someone because of one action.

Of course not! That's an evaluative statement expressing an opinion about an object. There's no reason you shouldn't say something like that.

But what if I don't like the girls dress and I am only interested in having sex with her and that's it? If I tell her I like her dress then I would be lying. Lying is wrong.

I dont usually post, but I found myself LOLing at all of this. Its been a little like torture getting thru reading this thread. Am I the only girl in here that isnt going to hate on men?

Have you ever been to a bar, strip club, idk just out of your houses? Girls have the advantage when out these days, not vice versa. Doyouevendate?

I have to say that two people getting drunk and having sex...is well pretty fun. It is enthusiastic actually. Ofc everything seems like a better idea when drunk. No great story ever begins with "man after my last salad we got wild and......"
We all know our inhibitions are lessened as we drink... so make the call of not drinking if you dont want to end up in bed with Mr. right now.

Catcalls promoting rape culture??? Secretly, we like it. We may act all...OMG I cant believe he said that... but inside...admit it. We would much rather be the girl someone finds attractive than not. We wouldn't spend hours getting ready for no one to notice.... ALSO.. I hear us girls doing it also. Mebe not hanging out the car window... but we do it.. Again, ever been to a male stripclub? The doors shut and all the sudden its girls gone wild and his pants need to go.

live a little. No one gets raped by catcall.

in after female misc

Catcalling is hitting on someone, but hitting on someone doesn't mean catcalling.

You see what I did there? There are different ways to hit on someone. Catcalling is one of them, even though it is rude.

Please go with your poverty arguments lol

If you think catcalling is hitting on someone, then I invite you to re-evaluate the statement about there not being a rape culture.

Ok so I whistle at a girl on the street or say "hey sexy what's up?"

How does that contribute to "rape culture"?

You have no argument left so when you get beat on one topic you switch to another, which you proceed to get wrecked on as well

Because she is not walking down the street so that you can look at her. When it's part of culture that it's okay to do that, it sends the message to both men and women that women are here primarily for men's pleasure. And that contributes to rape culture.

I'm sorry I was unaware that females were some all mighty being that I have to avert my eyes from when I see them. As I said before, "rape culture" is the stupidest saying. No one is teaching that rape is ok. Everyone knows it's wrong. You could take anything and say "this promotes rape culture" just because you don't like it.

"My cashier smiled at me today. I'm not here for his pleasure. He needs to avert his eyes and stop promoting rape culture."

You really don't get it, do you? You can look at women. You can smile at them. That's fine. Don't look at them lasciviously, don't holler at them from across the street (unless you know them), don't say something obscene to them, and if you're going to approach a woman with the intent of flirting or asking her out, do it in a way that shows you respect her as a human being, not just as a hot body you want to bang.

You really don't get it. What is acceptable to on person may not be acceptable to someone else. Who are you to say what is allowed and what is not? None of what you just said is against the law, so no one has to follow anything that you just said.

And once again you are getting completely off topic in an attempt to derail the discussion lol

First of all, no, it's not against the law, so I can't tell you not to do it. I can tell you, though, that if you want women to not be intimidated by you, it's probably best not to do that. And how is that off-topic? This whole thread started with catcalling!

But who are you to say people shouldn't catcall? Just because you don't like it? As the girl above just said a lot of girls secretly like it.

I dont usually post, but I found myself LOLing at all of this. Its been a little like torture getting thru reading this thread. Am I the only girl in here that isnt going to hate on men?

Have you ever been to a bar, strip club, idk just out of your houses? Girls have the advantage when out these days, not vice versa. Doyouevendate?

I have to say that two people getting drunk and having sex...is well pretty fun. It is enthusiastic actually. Ofc everything seems like a better idea when drunk. No great story ever begins with "man after my last salad we got wild and......"
We all know our inhibitions are lessened as we drink... so make the call of not drinking if you dont want to end up in bed with Mr. right now.

Catcalls promoting rape culture??? Secretly, we like it. We may act all...OMG I cant believe he said that... but inside...admit it. We would much rather be the girl someone finds attractive than not. We wouldn't spend hours getting ready for no one to notice.... ALSO.. I hear us girls doing it also. Mebe not hanging out the car window... but we do it.. Again, ever been to a male stripclub? The doors shut and all the sudden its girls gone wild and his pants need to go.

live a little. No one gets raped by catcall.

I don't hate on men. Most of my friends are men. I prefer the company of men to the company of women. I guess I'm just choosy about what those men are like.

Why would I ever go to a strip club? I don't like the music, I don't drink, and I don't really care to look at naked women (or men, really *shrug*).

And no, Idon'tevendate. Because I've been happily married for almost 21 years. But if I was single, I sure wouldn't put up with the crap I see younger women putting up with today.

I am scratching my eyeballs out over the statement that "we" secretly like catcalls. "Secretly liking it" is very thin ice, I'm sure you can agree.

Just because women are being just as sexist pigs as men does not mean that the behavior is not sexist and piggish. It just means women can be equally douchey. Which I have never, ever disputed.