Spare the rod and spoil the child?
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No kids and frankly, I go back and forth on the whole thing. I see arguments both ways and guess I won't know how I really think unless I have kids.
But, I was spanked as a child and it didn't make me violent or teach me it was ok to hit at all. That being said it was always a big deal to get spanked, it wasn't done on the fly. It was almost a ritual both proceeded and follow-uped with a "this is what you did, this why it was wrong, and there are consequences" type of speech.
Your parents did it right. Spanking is a temporary consequence for wrongdoing until a child is out into the world enough that real consequences set in. If done correctly, the child knows exactly why they were spanked, it stings but does not leave bruises and the child still knows they are loved.
Incidently, that "Spare the rod spoil the child" is a misquote from the Bible, it's "spare the rod, hate the child." I'm sure as many pages as there are on this topic, somone has already pointed that out, but I thought I'd throw in my two cents.
I never saw on here where it was quoted as coming from the bible. I believe it was used as the topic subject, but not quoted. I agree that it is commonly misquoted, though.
I didn't say it was misquoted here, I just said it is a misquote.0 -
I don't have children, but I was raised with many doses of spanking. I now teach high school students... I don't hit them and I teach them not to hit others. I'm well-adjusted and feel happy and successful.
I've seen tto ground children fail miserably because of the kid's stubborness. Sometimes I think a good old whack is the only thing that can get certain kids' attention.
Of course... corporal punishment is illegal in schools....;-)
Shannon0 -
Of course... corporal punishment is illegal in schools....;-)
Shannon
Not always! In the school district I went to for middle school/junior high (this was early/mid 80s), there were wooden paddles in the rooms. Guess what *they* were for?
My parents would have screamed bloody murder if any of their kids were paddled...then again, I can't imagine any of us acting up enough to ever *be* paddled.
The paddles were removed from the classrooms a couple years later after Mom and Dad joined the PTO and spearheaded a vote on the issue.
My siblings and I were never spanked. My mom always did this thing that used to crack up my friends - she would say "This is a yell." She wouldn't actually raise her voice, but that sentence would strike the fear of God into us! It's kind of funny to think of it now, but when we heard it then, WOW, we were in big time trouble!
I was grounded a lot. I used to think my friends who got spanked got off easier, because it was over and done with. Grounding took up a lot of time. Then again, I loved hanging out in my room when I was grounded - I could read or draw/color uninterrupted. :laugh:0 -
I have 3 children and I've only spanked my oldest once, I have established a relationship with them where they have a love, fear, and reverence of me as their father. I have a deep voice so that tends to be a little more intimidating, every time there is an event at our church i am always playing the "voice of God" (my voice is like that) But i was spanked growing up, the only thing i would really disagree with is spanking out of frustration .. if you had a bad day do not take it out on your child, if you've had a bad week don't take it out on your child.. if it's not necessary do not do it out of just because .. every family and child is different i've seen some children (like mine) who has been taught it's better to be rewarded for good behavior than not and than i've seen other kids that you want to check the back of their necks for 6's ... and than i've seen the kids where i was like dang you the child from children of corn aren't you??? those you almost have to dropkick (lol) but the point of a spanking is correction and direction not corporal punishment but the other argument is there is no such thing as bad children just bad parenting.. I'd rather use a staff than a rob in raising my children0
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Of course... corporal punishment is illegal in schools....;-)
Shannon
Not always! In the school district I went to for middle school/junior high (this was early/mid 80s), there were wooden paddles in the rooms. Guess what *they* were for? My parents would have screamed bloody murder if any of their kids were paddled...then again, I can't imagine any of us acting up enough to ever *be* paddled.
The paddles were removed from the classrooms a couple years later after Mom and Dad joined the PTO and spearheaded a vote on the issue.
My siblings and I were never spanked. My mom always did this thing that used to crack up my friends - she would say "This is a yell." She wouldn't actually raise her voice, but that sentence would strike the fear of God into us! It's kind of funny to think of it now, but when we heard it then, WOW, we were in big time trouble!
I was grounded a lot. I used to think my friends who got spanked got off easier, because it was over and done with. Grounding took up a lot of time. Then again, I loved hanging out in my room when I was grounded - I could read or draw/color uninterrupted. :laugh:0 -
I think striking another person is demeaning (for both) and humiliating. It doesn't 'teach' anything except bigger ppl can get their way with violence.
I strongly disapprove of hitting children and animals. They are completely defenseless and WHAT can a child or dog do to deserve that? Now when my 18 mo old son was sticking his finger in an electrical socket, I did smack his hand - I felt terrible, but I figure it's better than him being electrocuted.
But no, I think hitting is wrong. period. it is never right. and people who hit eventually meet someone who can & will kick their *kitten*
One could easily use the same logic regarding timeouts (or whatever other punishment one chooses).
"I think confining another person against their will is demeaning (for both) and humiliating. It doesn't 'teach' anything except bigger ppl can get their way.
But no, I think confining someone is wrong. period. it is never right. and people who confine others eventually meet someone who can & will kick their *kitten*"
A parent's job is to use the means necessary to get a point across. The VAST majority of the time spanking is unnecessary. But there are appropriate situations, and it should never be a spur of the moment emotional reaction. If a parent spanks a kid in anger that probably IS physical abuse. But in using well understood boundaries and escalating punishments i believe there is a place for spanking.
I went through about a month where my older son would push his younger brother for fun. We tried EVERYTHING. Literally everything we read. Taking away toys, timeouts, etc. And eventually we ended up using spanking, using the logic that an IMMEDIATE physically painful association with pushing would help deter him from pushing, and you know what? Within two or three spankings it worked. He hasn't pushed his brother in about 9 months.
It's not fair to my younger son to grow up in a place where his brother is physically abusive toward him, and it's impractical to keep them separated all the time.
So, in my opinion, coming up with absolutes in this parenting business is a quick way to be wrong.0 -
I have 3 children and I've only spanked my oldest once, I have established a relationship with them where they have a love, fear, and reverence of me as their father. I have a deep voice so that tends to be a little more intimidating, every time there is an event at our church i am always playing the "voice of God" (my voice is like that) But i was spanked growing up, the only thing i would really disagree with is spanking out of frustration .. if you had a bad day do not take it out on your child, if you've had a bad week don't take it out on your child.. if it's not necessary do not do it out of just because .. every family and child is different i've seen some children (like mine) who has been taught it's better to be rewarded for good behavior than not and than i've seen other kids that you want to check the back of their necks for 6's ... and than i've seen the kids where i was like dang you the child from children of corn aren't you??? those you almost have to dropkick (lol) but the point of a spanking is correction and direction not corporal punishment but the other argument is there is no such thing as bad children just bad parenting.. I'd rather use a staff than a rob in raising my children
dang i actually could hear the voice reading this! i feel like my father just had a nice chat with me.
Very well said!0 -
I also think that if you are mad and frustrated enough to spank your child, you are probably too mad to be spanking your child.
This quote displays that you have a very messed up perception of spanking. Anyone who hits a child out of anger or frustration has no business giving any discipline to that child. What a horrible thing to assume.0 -
I'm a mother of two and have never spanked my kids. They are lovely, well mannered and respectful. I think kids learn by example and should never be demeaned or humiliated in this (or any) way.
Can you please explain to me how spanking of more demeaning or humiliating than any other kind of punishment where you are taking away their free will and forcing them to perform whatever activity you have lined up for them?0 -
Is is ok to hit your spouse if they disobey you? No. So it isn't ok to hit a child who is smaller and more defenceless. I am quite horrified by most of the responses on this thread.
Is it okay to make your spouse run 10 laps around the garden if they disobey you?
Your flawed logic horrifies me.0 -
Is is ok to hit your spouse if they disobey you? No. So it isn't ok to hit a child who is smaller and more defenceless. I am quite horrified by most of the responses on this thread.
Wow.........This is not comparing apples to apples at all! Poor analagy!
and to think my ex husband literally told me (several times and with a completely serious expression) that he felt like if i disobeyed him he had every right to discipline me.
thus the "ex".
There you go! Obviously some people really do come away with that message.
to be fair - he came from quite an abusive home that still has some questionable creeds. It's still a poor analogy.0 -
I was "spanked" (aka beaten) up through my teens. I swore I would NOT inflict that on my own children. And I never have.
I have three biological children and have raised several others (step and foster). I have never spanked or hit any of them. They are proof positive that you can raise well-behaved children without hitting them. The oldest is 28 and the youngest is 6. They're wonderful kids who stayed out of trouble and did no more than the usual limit testing that all kids do. None of them were ever arrested, observed drunk, did drugs, or got pregnant/got anyone else pregnant. Nor did they ever get into physical fights, abuse anyone or end up being abused by anyone. And I am very proud of them.0 -
I'm a mother of two and have never spanked my kids. They are lovely, well mannered and respectful. I think kids learn by example and should never be demeaned or humiliated in this (or any) way.
Can you please explain to me how spanking of more demeaning or humiliating than any other kind of punishment where you are taking away their free will and forcing them to perform whatever activity you have lined up for them?
It's just what I believe, hey this parenting business is just guess work most of the time. I think that most children misbehave for a reason and usually for attention. Give kids some of your time and you'll be amazed at how well they behave (and how happy they are).0 -
I was spanked as a child, usually with a belt or a hand. A few times, when I was really bad, with a piece of wood. I would've never classified any of it as abuse. Sometimes it hurt like hell but it was always deserved. I spank my childern, only with my hand though, and have found out that while it works wonders with my daughter, my son doesn't respond well to it. So its a trial and error thing to figure out what works for the child. Some all spanking does is make them worse, others respond just like you want them to. My son we have to come up with very creative ways to punish him. Extra chores seem to work well espeically the one's that he really hates to do(usually the same one's that I hate doing too lol).
I will say it is a very fine line between disicpline and abuse when it comes to spanking. If I'm too frustrated I will not spank as I don't want to cross that line and anger is the way to cross it. If I'm too angry they get put in a corner and left there until I can calm down enough to calmly give out punishment. Usually by then its going to be talking about what they did wrong instead of spanking cause it won't work at that point anyways.
That's my view on it. Whether people agree with me or not I don't care cause my family does and so does my husband and they are all that matters.0 -
It's just what I believe, hey this parenting business is just guess work most of the time. I think that most children misbehave for a reason and usually for attention. Give kids some of your time and you'll be amazed at how well they behave (and how happy they are).
You're certainly right that there is a lot of guess-work, and trial and error involved. But you must have a reason to believe that spanking is "demeaning and humiliating" but other punishments are not. It's that perspective that I'm curious about.
I believe kids are more often humiliated and demeaned by parents who treat them as if they are unable to reason and make independent decisions. And I believe setting boundaries (which may include spanking) make children feel safe and comfortable in an environment. Yes, I just said that spankings can be a part of a 'safe' environment. I remember being spanked (very rarely) when I misbehaved. It was never a spur of the moment thing, and I always knew it was coming, yet pushed my parents anyway.
It certainly never humiliated or demeaned me. It taught me that my behaviors had consequences, and, looking back, I recognize how hard it is to give that kind of discipline as a parent, and I respect my parents for it.0 -
I was spanked and I have spanked all of my children. My oldest loves to let me know how unfair it is that I lived and learned AFTER her spankings.
That being said - it has been a very long time. I have found that 'things they love' (consequences) are a very useful tool.
(e.g. You didn't keep your room clean? Oh - then I am unable to allow you to go skating. You were disrespectful to someone? Oh - then I am unable to respect your wish that I let you go with your friends to the mall. You stayed up past your bedtime? Too bad - you still have to get up at 6am. Sucks huh?)
:bigsmile:0 -
These topics always break down. Very little objectivity. Always becomes subjective.
Oh well....Hey? Do you know what to say to a woman with two black eyes??
Nothing. She wouldn't listen the first two times. Nyuk Nyuk Nyuk0 -
^^ FUNNY!
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I think spanking is lazy parenting. I have 3 kids and they don't get spanked. The middle one is extremely "exuberant" and the only times I've ever wanted to spank him has been because I've been frustrated or exhausted or distracted and didn't want to do what was needed; which would be to assess the situation and figure out an appropriate way to communicate with him.
Hitting is wrong. The end.
We teach compassion and grace by using compassion and grace.
And honestly, when we are on our toes regarding parenting, there is seldom a need for us to "punish" them at all.0 -
I totally agree with these ideas! If my kids are causing problems it's usually because they are tired/hungry, bored/energetic, or having an emotional day. And hitting wouldn't fix any of those problems.
We also punish our oldest (younger two don't quite get the concept) with "fines" and chores instead of grounding. It really hits home.
You are exactly right! Amazing what people think!! I've made them run, jumping jacks, push ups, any thing I can think of to burn off some excess energy. You can tell when your kids start acting up it's usually because they sat in a class room all day or in front of a tv, they need to get out & run around & sometimes they don't want to. Always, after, they feel better, act better & are in a much better mood. That is so hilarious that anyone would think making your kids do some physical activity as a form of punishment or time out would be considered abuse!!! My daughter got into some big trouble when she was a teenager (I don't even remember what is was now) so we put her to work!! We made her move the entire wood pile piece by piece from one side of the yard to the other. One time her & my teenage step daughter got into some BIG trouble & they were grounded for a month. I surely wasn't going to let them sit around & do nothing for that month, everyday I gave them a LONG list of chores, washing walls, cleaning closets, anything I could think of to keep them busy. I guess this would also be some sort of abuse?!What I originally said was most bad behaviour is as a result of pent up energy. I get my children to run around the garden when they are being vile, and they are much happier for it. Twist all you like, you are just totally 100% twisting my words.
Seriously, some of you have some seriously warped logic going on here.0
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