Coronavirus prep
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TBH, I'm glad I felt some effects after my two shots.
I feel it's actually working when I see the immune system responding.13 -
I understand. My husband had no response at all after either shot and it does worry me. He's older though, and that makes a difference.5
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My husband and I just had shot 1. We went to one of those big sites (Dodger Stadium) where, after I missed a couple of turns, went into the parking lot, had to go through a complex maze of traffic cones over potholes (my Duckmobile is not happy) and then get into a line. 1 1/2 hours later, they took our IDs and a guy gave us our shots.
I guess we were good because he gave us lollipops "to take the sting away"
13 -
My husband and I just had shot 1. We went to one of those big sites (Dodger Stadium) where, after I missed a couple of turns, went into the parking lot, had to go through a complex maze of traffic cones over potholes (my Duckmobile is not happy) and then get into a line. 1 1/2 hours later, they took our IDs and a guy gave us our shots.
and to think one of our whingey whiny patients complained last week about waiting for 7 minutes.
I am not kidding - she complained because she was told the clinic is running separate to the regular surgery appt's and there would be no waiting time.
But there was!! she had to wait 7 minutes!!
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Regardless, they noted that many drugs in use have rare side effects that are similarly dangerous and infrequent, so they think it is a mistake to limit A-Z usage.
So true. Those are just rarely discussed because very rarely the majority of the population starts getting mass treated with the same new medication in a span of a few months. Just to compare, I pulled the instruction/warning papers of some meds I keep at home, OTC painkiller (paracetamol) and an OTC antacid. Listed side effects of the antacid include rash, hives, facial swelling, anaphylactic shock, muscle weakness, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. Paracetamol lists changes in blood, decrease in white blood cells, anemia, skin itching and swelling, hives, headaches, stomach aches, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, liver malfunction and liver necrosis, fever, swallowing pains, urination problems, anaphylactic shock, blisters, kidney failure and skin peeling. A prescription skin cream I have lists lymphoma and herpes-induced eye infections, to name some highlights.
I think this whole side effect discussion (while important for informed consent) is a result of this mass treatment, anti-vaxxing environment, and the problems that occured with the swine flu vaccine and people freaking out about another quickly developed vaccine.5 -
paperpudding wrote: »
and to think one of our whingey whiny patients complained last week about waiting for 7 minutes.
I am not kidding - she complained because she was told the clinic is running separate to the regular surgery appt's and there would be no waiting time.
But there was!! she had to wait 7 minutes!!
I don’t know if this makes me an angel or a pushover compared to this patient, but my last covid test was at a walk-in site that’s basically a trailer dropped on a central plaza/square, so the line is outside. It was February and -15C/5F degrees, and I waited outside maybe 10 minutes for my appointment and then 5 more minutes for my husband, as our appointments were 5 minutes apart. This was a test we took because we had flu symptoms, and ended up standing outside in the cold waiting with our sore throats and runny noses. Didn’t complain (except to each other), it’s not the test-takers fault some other patient ran late or they were overbooked.5 -
patient in question wasn't waiting outside in the snow or the blazing sun though - but inside seated in an air conditioned surgery
and complained because there wasnt literally no waiting time, there was a wait.
of a whole 7 minutes.
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@Theo166
"TBH, I'm glad I felt some effects after my two shots.
I feel it's actually working when I see the immune system responding."
@spiriteagle99
"I understand. My husband had no response at all after either shot and it does worry me. He's older though, and that makes a difference."
A Professor of Virology was speaking today about the big range of responses to the vaccine shot and stated there wasn't a correleation between the absense or strength of a reaction and the effectiveness of the vaccine to that person.
From trials there was no difference in them actually developing antibodies whether no reaction or a strong reaction / side-effects was observed.14 -
paperpudding wrote: »
and to think one of our whingey whiny patients complained last week about waiting for 7 minutes.
I am not kidding - she complained because she was told the clinic is running separate to the regular surgery appt's and there would be no waiting time.
But there was!! she had to wait 7 minutes!!
I don’t know if this makes me an angel or a pushover compared to this patient, but my last covid test was at a walk-in site that’s basically a trailer dropped on a central plaza/square, so the line is outside. It was February and -15C/5F degrees, and I waited outside maybe 10 minutes for my appointment and then 5 more minutes for my husband, as our appointments were 5 minutes apart. This was a test we took because we had flu symptoms, and ended up standing outside in the cold waiting with our sore throats and runny noses. Didn’t complain (except to each other), it’s not the test-takers fault some other patient ran late or they were overbooked.
I was supposed to get a covid test on Thursday, my appt was at 5:30, and you are not supposed to arrive early. I got there at 5:25 and there was a line of at least 25 people outside waiting, below freezing temperatures and windy, so I turned around and left.
Normally I am in and out in about 3 minutes so I hope this isn't a sign of things to come with the surge in cases we are having. I rebooked for next Tuesday and will come properly dressed to wait outside this time, just in case.
These weekly tests are getting annoying. 6 -
My daughter has covid. She woke up last Monday with runny nose and head achy. She was tested Monday afternoon. The state department of health interviewed her yesterday for contact encounters, etc. She visited us last Saturday and at the time she had no symptoms. She has not been around people for 15 minutes or more except us, grocery store, and the laundromat. She works from home. We tested and are negative, so far. We’re scheduled for our second Moderna shot on 4/8, which will be 12 days from our exposure. The pharmacy that’s administering our vaccine, said we should probably test again Monday and if it’s negative, we probably will be fine to receive the second shot, even though it will only be 12 days instead of the recommended 14. Question for anyone who may know about this type of situation. Should I get a second opinion on this?12
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Regardless, they noted that many drugs in use have rare side effects that are similarly dangerous and infrequent, so they think it is a mistake to limit A-Z usage.
So true. Those are just rarely discussed because very rarely the majority of the population starts getting mass treated with the same new medication in a span of a few months. Just to compare, I pulled the instruction/warning papers of some meds I keep at home, OTC painkiller (paracetamol) and an OTC antacid. Listed side effects of the antacid include rash, hives, facial swelling, anaphylactic shock, muscle weakness, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. Paracetamol lists changes in blood, decrease in white blood cells, anemia, skin itching and swelling, hives, headaches, stomach aches, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, liver malfunction and liver necrosis, fever, swallowing pains, urination problems, anaphylactic shock, blisters, kidney failure and skin peeling. A prescription skin cream I have lists lymphoma and herpes-induced eye infections, to name some highlights.
I think this whole side effect discussion (while important for informed consent) is a result of this mass treatment, anti-vaxxing environment, and the problems that occurred with the swine flu vaccine and people freaking out about another quickly developed vaccine.
I think the main difference is that most drugs are treating an illness or condition, so for the individual receiving the treatment there is a risk vs. benefit scenario of the drug vs the illness.
With vaccines you are exposing healthy people who potentially may never get Covid, so the risk vs. benefit becomes a little more tricky to calculate. Tell a healthy person to take a drug that has "XYZ" side effect just in case they get sick (especially if they are young and unlikely to die from covid) and it might give them pause.
Of course this is on an individual level - from a public health perspective even if a certain number of people react the benefits of course outweigh the risks on a population level.3 -
@Theo166
"TBH, I'm glad I felt some effects after my two shots.
I feel it's actually working when I see the immune system responding."
@spiriteagle99
"I understand. My husband had no response at all after either shot and it does worry me. He's older though, and that makes a difference."
A Professor of Virology was speaking today about the big range of responses to the vaccine shot and stated there wasn't a correleation between the absense or strength of a reaction and the effectiveness of the vaccine to that person.
From trials there was no difference in them actually developing antibodies whether no reaction or a strong reaction / side-effects was observed.
Thank you for this, my mother had no reaction to either shot and I had to reassure her that yes, the shot is working.6 -
Regardless, they noted that many drugs in use have rare side effects that are similarly dangerous and infrequent, so they think it is a mistake to limit A-Z usage.
So true. Those are just rarely discussed because very rarely the majority of the population starts getting mass treated with the same new medication in a span of a few months. Just to compare, I pulled the instruction/warning papers of some meds I keep at home, OTC painkiller (paracetamol) and an OTC antacid. Listed side effects of the antacid include rash, hives, facial swelling, anaphylactic shock, muscle weakness, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. Paracetamol lists changes in blood, decrease in white blood cells, anemia, skin itching and swelling, hives, headaches, stomach aches, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, liver malfunction and liver necrosis, fever, swallowing pains, urination problems, anaphylactic shock, blisters, kidney failure and skin peeling. A prescription skin cream I have lists lymphoma and herpes-induced eye infections, to name some highlights.
I think this whole side effect discussion (while important for informed consent) is a result of this mass treatment, anti-vaxxing environment, and the problems that occurred with the swine flu vaccine and people freaking out about another quickly developed vaccine.
I think the main difference is that most drugs are treating an illness or condition, so for the individual receiving the treatment there is a risk vs. benefit scenario of the drug vs the illness.
With vaccines you are exposing healthy people who potentially may never get Covid, so the risk vs. benefit becomes a little more tricky to calculate. Tell a healthy person to take a drug that has "XYZ" side effect just in case they get sick (especially if they are young and unlikely to die from covid) and it might give them pause.
Of course this is on an individual level - from a public health perspective even if a certain number of people react the benefits of course outweigh the risks on a population level.
You absolutely have a point. The public health perspective is a no-brainer: according to what Kimny posted on the previous page, the risk of blood clot disorder from the A-Z vaccine seems to be about 1 in 6 million. Finland has about 5,5 million people, so close enough to compare. As of today we have 264 patients hospitalized due to covid, out of which 52 are in intensive care. So, if every single person in Finland was given the A-Z shot, statistically one citizen would get a blood clot disorder and that’s not infectious. 1 treatable blood clot disorder throughout the entire vaccination period vs. 52 intensive care patients with an infectious disease that keeps spreading through the population seems like a no-brainer from a public health perspective.
Whenever someone says ”young and unlikely to die from covid” I think about my young and previously healthy friend who has long covid that caused neurological issues that still linger more than a year after she got sick, and whose healthy middle-aged (late 50s, apparently) uncle died from covid. Then I think about my friend’s prematurely born 3-year-old who would most likely die if she got covid, and the fact that her young and healthy parents and their young and healthy colleagues, friends, grocery cashiers etc. getting vaccinated could save her life because it makes them that much more unlikely to be asymptomatic carriers that could give the virus to her parents who could give it to them. Then I think of myself and my little fetus who will likely die if I get covid, and pregnant women are currently disqualified from vaccination so the only way for me to stay safe is intense social distancing, masks, and relying on the young and healthy population around me getting the vaccine to stop the virus from spreading. Since we’re currently still vaccinating risk groups and the 65+ age group, it’s going to take a long time for my 20s-30s friend circle to get vaccinated.18 -
Just had my 2nd Pfizer dose yesterday. No different than the first...didn't even feel the needle. Arm is mildly sore as with any vaccine, otherwise no worse for the wear. Just back from the weight room and eating breakfast. I have a couple hours of yard work ahead of me and then I'm going to the skate park with my boys for a couple hours and I will be brining my free style scooter with me. Burgers pool side and some swimming late this afternoon.8
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Regardless, they noted that many drugs in use have rare side effects that are similarly dangerous and infrequent, so they think it is a mistake to limit A-Z usage.
So true. Those are just rarely discussed because very rarely the majority of the population starts getting mass treated with the same new medication in a span of a few months. Just to compare, I pulled the instruction/warning papers of some meds I keep at home, OTC painkiller (paracetamol) and an OTC antacid. Listed side effects of the antacid include rash, hives, facial swelling, anaphylactic shock, muscle weakness, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea. Paracetamol lists changes in blood, decrease in white blood cells, anemia, skin itching and swelling, hives, headaches, stomach aches, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, liver malfunction and liver necrosis, fever, swallowing pains, urination problems, anaphylactic shock, blisters, kidney failure and skin peeling. A prescription skin cream I have lists lymphoma and herpes-induced eye infections, to name some highlights.
I think this whole side effect discussion (while important for informed consent) is a result of this mass treatment, anti-vaxxing environment, and the problems that occurred with the swine flu vaccine and people freaking out about another quickly developed vaccine.
I think the main difference is that most drugs are treating an illness or condition, so for the individual receiving the treatment there is a risk vs. benefit scenario of the drug vs the illness.
With vaccines you are exposing healthy people who potentially may never get Covid, so the risk vs. benefit becomes a little more tricky to calculate. Tell a healthy person to take a drug that has "XYZ" side effect just in case they get sick (especially if they are young and unlikely to die from covid) and it might give them pause.
Of course this is on an individual level - from a public health perspective even if a certain number of people react the benefits of course outweigh the risks on a population level.
You absolutely have a point. The public health perspective is a no-brainer: according to what Kimny posted on the previous page, the risk of blood clot disorder from the A-Z vaccine seems to be about 1 in 6 million. Finland has about 5,5 million people, so close enough to compare. As of today we have 264 patients hospitalized due to covid, out of which 52 are in intensive care. So, if every single person in Finland was given the A-Z shot, statistically one citizen would get a blood clot disorder and that’s not infectious. 1 treatable blood clot disorder throughout the entire vaccination period vs. 52 intensive care patients with an infectious disease that keeps spreading through the population seems like a no-brainer from a public health perspective.
Whenever someone says ”young and unlikely to die from covid” I think about my young and previously healthy friend who has long covid that caused neurological issues that still linger more than a year after she got sick, and whose healthy middle-aged (late 50s, apparently) uncle died from covid. Then I think about my friend’s prematurely born 3-year-old who would most likely die if she got covid, and the fact that her young and healthy parents and their young and healthy colleagues, friends, grocery cashiers etc. getting vaccinated could save her life because it makes them that much more unlikely to be asymptomatic carriers that could give the virus to her parents who could give it to them. Then I think of myself and my little fetus who will likely die if I get covid, and pregnant women are currently disqualified from vaccination so the only way for me to stay safe is intense social distancing, masks, and relying on the young and healthy population around me getting the vaccine to stop the virus from spreading. Since we’re currently still vaccinating risk groups and the 65+ age group, it’s going to take a long time for my 20s-30s friend circle to get vaccinated.
Yep for sure young and healthy doesn’t necessarily protect from covid death and severe illness, just makes it much less likely.
And idk about the 1 in 6 million the figures I read was 1 in 25000 or 1 in 100000, depending on the source. Still rare but not quite as rare.
At any rate they are looking into it more now so I’m sure more information will come out soon on the risk numbers, as well as the treatment for anyone who does react.
The other issue is that it isn’t the only vaccine available - so if there is a safer one then I wouldn’t blame someone who wanted to wait a little longer to get that one.1 -
The other issue is that it isn’t the only vaccine available - so if there is a safer one then I wouldn’t blame someone who wanted to wait a little longer to get that one.
You have a point there. Finland resumed vaccinating with A-Z, but only on people older than 65 since the blood clot issue was only found on younger population. Seems like a fair deal since we’re mostly vaccinating older people anyway, they can get the safe-for-them A-Z and younger risk groups are currently getting Pfizer. All the vaccine scheduling information I’ve seen has been very clear on the fact that you do not get to choose which vaccine you get.4 -
missysippy930 wrote: »My daughter has covid. She woke up last Monday with runny nose and head achy. She was tested Monday afternoon. The state department of health interviewed her yesterday for contact encounters, etc. She visited us last Saturday and at the time she had no symptoms. She has not been around people for 15 minutes or more except us, grocery store, and the laundromat. She works from home. We tested and are negative, so far. We’re scheduled for our second Moderna shot on 4/8, which will be 12 days from our exposure. The pharmacy that’s administering our vaccine, said we should probably test again Monday and if it’s negative, we probably will be fine to receive the second shot, even though it will only be 12 days instead of the recommended 14. Question for anyone who may know about this type of situation. Should I get a second opinion on this?
Average onset of symptoms is 5.1 days, so I would expect if you have no symptoms at 12 days and test negative twice anyway, you are more certain you don't have it than most everyone else.7 -
The other issue is that it isn’t the only vaccine available - so if there is a safer one then I wouldn’t blame someone who wanted to wait a little longer to get that one.
Not the case everywhere.
In Australia there are only 2 brands - Pfizer and AZ..
Pfizer is only available through hospital hubs for people in phase1a criteria - residents and staff of aged care and disability homes, front line health workers, quarantine hotel and airport workers
Everyone else will be getting AZ - currently on phase1b- people over 70, aboriginal people over 55, other health workers, people with specific high risk medical conditions.3 -
paperpudding wrote: »The other issue is that it isn’t the only vaccine available - so if there is a safer one then I wouldn’t blame someone who wanted to wait a little longer to get that one.
Not the case everywhere.
In Australia there are only 2 brands - Pfizer and AZ..
Pfizer is only available through hospital hubs for people in phase1a criteria - residents and staff of aged care and disability homes, front line health workers, quarantine hotel and airport workers
Everyone else will be getting AZ - currently on phase1b- people over 70, aboriginal people over 55, other health workers, people with specific high risk medical conditions.
Just because Australia is choosing not to use them doesn’t mean they are not available. There are other vaccines available for purchase/use was my point.
I’m pretty sure if the AZ vaccine was no longer available for use the Australian government would source one of the other ones.
3 -
Was just reading that the Vancouver Canucks have 15 players and 2 coaches out on covid protocol, many actually testing positive (not just close contact), more than one described as very sick, and the cases have been confirmed to the Brazilian variant which is spiking in Vancouver. They're not sure they'll be able to finish the season
As a huge hockey fan I've been enjoying watching the games, but I've been uneasy the whole time that they're playing at all. It just takes one asymptomatic case to get into the building.9
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