Coronavirus prep
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I'm not in any way a virologist or other relevant expert, just a regular ignorant bozo, so I'll throw this speculation out there to see what others, especially those more knowledgeable, think:
I'm thinking that if it turns out we do need a different vax because of Omicron, it would be surprising if they specified a loooong required interval between current booster and new formulation.
Thought process:
I haven't seen much that suggested getting vaccine doses "too close together" would be particularly injurious to healthy people (or to immune suppressed ones, for that matter), where "too close together" was less than the 6 months between second vax and booster, or even less than the X weeks between dose 1 and dose 2, if it wasn't like subsequent days or something really silly.
What I've understood was more that close doses wouldn't be as effective in stimulating the immune system in the useful ways. Most other vaccines (of different types) don't seem to need long separations (like the Covid booster and flu, or flu and shingles, etc.).
What is making y'all think that if one gets a booster now, there's a meaningful risk that you won't be able to get this speculative new vax when it comes out in March, given what you know at this point?
Just saw this now. Vaccine rollout is a little slower here, and we have a little less freedom of choice. For example we are just offering boosters to 50+ beginning December 13th, younger age groups will be in the new year, and we are only eligible after 6 months.
When I posed the question of waiting it actually never occurred to me that I won't be able to get another booster if I take one now, just not really wanting to get more shots than I need. But now that you mention it I would imagine if a new booster comes out people who already had a recent 3rd dose would probably be last on the list to get it.
That's not exactly what I'd expect here (not sure where you are). If there's limited supply of the new vax at first, I'd expect any priority scheme to be similar to the previous ones, i.e., most at-risk first. It's still unclear who that will be (unvaxed vs. old/comorbidities vs. immune compromised, or whatever). That might mean people with 3rd boost prioritized lower, but I'm not convinced that would be true. But I'm still speculating.
If people with a recent third dose would be last on the list, wouldn't that be a reason to get #3 ASAP anyway, to move up that list as fast as possible? Really a lot of people are just getting the booster now, more or less. I was high priority (over 65), and my booster wasn't that long ago. I wasn't instant out of the blocks in signing up for booster, but not greatly lagging, either. Without looking it up, I think the delay vs. exactly 6 months wasn't more than a couple of weeks, and that was all me, not supply or rules.
I got the initial doses as early as I could schedule them here, though I won't pretend I was necessarily maximally efficient. (Some of my friends searched long distance for example: I just tracked multiple local sources until I found an appointment, for #1.)2 -
News out of Southampton, Uni research, UK this morning. They looked into the best timing distance between the 2 vaccines and then the booster, it seems to be coming out at 3 months!
Isn't there an underlying assumption you would then get another booster every three months, to keep you at the peak of protection?
I'm taking the approach that I'm already due my shot, and I need the booster to get me through the rest of the winter/spring. Maybe by that time we'll have a "new and improved" version available
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Then you are told to go wait 10 minutes, after which you will receive back your vaccination card ( a clever way to make sure people do not leave prematurely :P )
I remember when we were first organising the Covid clinics at the medical centre where I work - and we discussed this same issue - how to enforce people staying 15 minutes afterward in a friendly but no getting out of it way
They get their paper work on arrival- information, questionairre, consent form, and then after the vaccine is given the time they can leave - eg 10:15 if vaccine given 10:00 - is marked in large print on front of paperwork - take this back to front desk then so we can record it in your notes (and from our software to the Australian Immunisation Registry)
They know front desk staff won't take it back until the marked time
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So there was a large party in Norway where Omicron spread among exclusively vaccinated people with no trouble. It does seem to completely ignore the vaccine as far as infection is concerned. So far no one from the party is very ill, but since they are all younger healthy people that doesn’t tell us much about how serious the infections are yet, since statistically they would probably be fine, even unvaxxed, with previous variants.5
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Got my booster 4 hours ago. Process is a little odd. Arrive at scheduled appointment and fill out form by checking off lots of various boxes. A few minutes later, you get the shot. Then you are told to go wait 10 minutes, after which you will receive back your vaccination card ( a clever way to make sure people do not leave prematurely :P ). So at the 10 minutes, I get handed a whole packed, including my card.
10 minutes ago, i opened the packet to see if it is anything I need to keep or recycle. Page two of the packet has a section titled "What you need to know before you get this vaccine". Page four has a section titled "What are the risks of the vaccine". Page six contains "what if I decide not to get the comirnaty (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) or the Pfizer-Biotech COVID-19 Vaccine?" Seems like this process could stand for a little improvement. Shouldn't this packet be being given out BEFORE the shot??
It's so interesting the differences in procedures. My first two were at a mass vaccination site run by the National Guard. After the shot, they gave you a sticker with a time on it and sent you to a waiting area. When your time was up you could leave, but the Army guys at the door were checking stickers to make sure you weren't leaving early. They gave me a packet of information after the shot.
I got my booster at Walgreens. No packet of information at all. They did have me stay 15 minutes and were strict about it. I asked if I could wander around the store and shop while I waited, and they said no, they wanted me to stay in the pharmacy area. They had already given me my card back, so I guess I COULD have left, but, yeah, I figure better safe than sorry in case I had a weird reaction that I didn't have to the first two.0 -
Had my booster yesterday at a clinic through my GP's office in central MN. Different exp than my first two shots which were in a small, rural hospital. Was well organized. Wasn't expecting the question of "which vaccine do you want". Had the option for either J&J, Moderna or Pfizer. Went with Pfizer since that was the same as my previous two.
My vac card was updated and I moved to the wait for the jab. I asked the person if they would aspirate and she cheerily agreed. She said they had 550+ appointments scheduled and expected at least that many walk ins.
I had requested my booster last week via MyChart since I'm 55+ and my DH is scheduled for surgery next week. I'll feel better being with him in the hospital having been 'boosted. Covid cases in the area are like other areas, extremely high and National Guard medical has been assigned to assist at the hospital where DH is scheduled for surgery.4 -
In the past week the active cases in the counties around me have doubled. We haven't been this high since December of last year. What is happening where you live?3
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In Pennsylvania, the numbers have been really high. Not quite as bad as last Christmas, but still high. One day this week was 9000+ and another day was 10,000+. Before the recent spike, a really bad day was 5000. Deaths aren't that high, because it is younger people testing positive, but obviously still happening. But our statewide vaccination rate is only 65%. The county where I live is only 47%.2
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In the past week the active cases in the counties around me have doubled. We haven't been this high since December of last year. What is happening where you live?
Active cases are climbing here too (Ontario, Canada). Not surprising since winter is rolling in and outdoor activities are decreasing. They're saying we haven't seen these numbers since April. Most of the early cases were reported as travel (outside our region) and just spread from there.
Not a lot of hospitalizations but there have been a couple of deaths here and there. The health unit is not reporting vaccination status to protect individual privacy... because when there are only one or two cases in hospital, it's not going to be a secret. Vaccination uptake has been high here, 86% of 12+ are fully vaccinated.2 -
In the past week the active cases in the counties around me have doubled. We haven't been this high since December of last year. What is happening where you live?
Bad.
New cases recently were highest ever in the state (Michigan), 7-day average of new cases at least close to highest. Seems to be dropping off slightly in last few days, but still really bad. Multiple hospital systems overwhelmed, big hospitals unable to accept severe cases from small rural hospitals in the usual way; federal emergency teams have already been brought into some hospitals, others on the brink. Most cases in the hospitals are unvaccinated people.
It's cold here, has been snow, people moving inside. I don't think that's the only factor - far from it. But it's one factor.4 -
Just spent $130 at Walgreens for 10 rapid tests. A few unvaccinated family members may not like it, but we’re telling anyone who wants to come for Christmas that they need to test first. And that we are providing the tests at the door.
I know I’ll get blowback from a few of them, but I’ll just say we are ALL doing this, vaccinated or not, so we are not singling them out.15 -
SuzySunshine99 wrote: »Just spent $130 at Walgreens for 10 rapid tests. A few unvaccinated family members may not like it, but we’re telling anyone who wants to come for Christmas that they need to test first. And that we are providing the tests at the door.
I know I’ll get blowback from a few of them, but I’ll just say we are ALL doing this, vaccinated or not, so we are not singling them out.
Good for you! Although I'm sure that's nothing compared to the blowback you'll get if someone tests positive and you turn them away.4 -
SuzySunshine99 wrote: »Just spent $130 at Walgreens for 10 rapid tests. A few unvaccinated family members may not like it, but we’re telling anyone who wants to come for Christmas that they need to test first. And that we are providing the tests at the door.
I know I’ll get blowback from a few of them, but I’ll just say we are ALL doing this, vaccinated or not, so we are not singling them out.
Good for you! Although I'm sure that's nothing compared to the blowback you'll get if someone tests positive and you turn them away.
Yeah, right? My husband said we could send the tests out to family so they can test at home before they drive over here.
But, these are people who carry fake vaccination cards, so I don’t really trust them to do it unless I see them do it.13 -
rheddmobile wrote: »So there was a large party in Norway where Omicron spread among exclusively vaccinated people with no trouble. It does seem to completely ignore the vaccine as far as infection is concerned. So far no one from the party is very ill, but since they are all younger healthy people that doesn’t tell us much about how serious the infections are yet, since statistically they would probably be fine, even unvaxxed, with previous variants.
Remember that bear week celebration in Massachusetts over the summer where so many vaxxed people got Delta and everyone said that meant vaxxed people weren't protected? It turned out that while it's not 100%, the vaccines are preventing many infections. And no one knows why that super spreader happened.6 -
I asked if I could wander around the store and shop while I waited, and they said no, they wanted me to stay in the pharmacy area. They had already given me my card back, so I guess I COULD have left, but, yeah, I figure better safe than sorry in case I had a weird reaction that I didn't have to the first two.
We let people wait anywhere in the surgery or in a sort of mall down the middle of the building or go in the pharmacy or the blood collection site in the building -( the building consists of drs surgery one side and pharmacy, lab collection site and mental health counselling the other with a large hallway or mall down the middle) as they are still in the vicinity and under general supervision.
But we get the questions: can I go out to the coffee van, can I go out for a smoke, can I sit in my car?
No, of course not
You have to stay inside under general supervision.2 -
In the past week the active cases in the counties around me have doubled. We haven't been this high since December of last year. What is happening where you live?
Same here; I live in Vermont. I have a friend who's fully vaccinated, caught Covid and had a headache one day. Few days later she tested negative. This is what the vaccine is hopefully doing!! I've heard of many who've caught the virus but don't know their vaccination status. And a couple who have died as well, vaccination status unknown. My sister has a couple elderly friends who adamantly refused to get vaccinated and got really sick, both are still feeling very weak, one is on oxygen and it's been 3 weeks or so.
But yes, our numbers are increasing every day, more cases in schools, less people wearing masks in the stores.
Dartmouth is at capacity and their employees have been told no gatherings aside from immediate family.
This feels scarier than before yet people feel safer. Don't let your guard down. Definitely, live your life but safely and intelligently. It doesn't just affect you. Stay well everyone! 6 -
Theo 68. I've just come back in. I suppose that would be the implication, a booster in three months after the first booster one is advised to have! The advice I received was 6 months but that has now changed though my time lapse will be best part of 8! I believe there is all kinds of research not least to see how the vaccines we already have protect against the range of variants. Scientists do keep hard at work discovering short comings of situations and trying to better what is available.
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Got my booster yesterday at like 12:30pm.
At about 11:30pm I was woken up because my muscles/joints hurt so badly. I had also started running a fever. Took some tylanol so I could fall back to sleep. Woke up a few more times because my fever was coming and going so I was hot then cold then hot then cold. So a rough night. Still feeling really drained and achy plus still have a mild fever. Glad I got so much done Friday/Saturday so I could rest today.
Still worth it.13 -
Not over here in Europe. For travel both vaccinated and unvaccinated have to have 24 hour negative test results as of this week in France and Germany. Other countries are even more strictly mandated.0
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Not over here in Europe. For travel both vaccinated and unvaccinated have to have 24 hour negative test results as of this week in France and Germany. Other countries are even more strictly mandated.
Oh I'm going to Germany in a couple of days and hadn't seen this, I kept checking as it changes so quickly. Was this just announced?1 -
Got my booster 4 hours ago. Process is a little odd. Arrive at scheduled appointment and fill out form by checking off lots of various boxes. A few minutes later, you get the shot. Then you are told to go wait 10 minutes, after which you will receive back your vaccination card ( a clever way to make sure people do not leave prematurely :P ). So at the 10 minutes, I get handed a whole packed, including my card.
10 minutes ago, i opened the packet to see if it is anything I need to keep or recycle. Page two of the packet has a section titled "What you need to know before you get this vaccine". Page four has a section titled "What are the risks of the vaccine". Page six contains "what if I decide not to get the comirnaty (COVID-19 Vaccine, mRNA) or the Pfizer-Biotech COVID-19 Vaccine?" Seems like this process could stand for a little improvement. Shouldn't this packet be being given out BEFORE the shot??
Well given it was your third shot - wouldn't the assumption be that you already received the pertinent information with your first dose?4 -
Anyone else having problems finding a new vet? We've just moved, and wanted to switch to Mom's vet, but they are not taking new clients, and neither is the second place I tried.
Our old vet is part of the VCA chain, which does have a location near enough us, so I guess we will stick with them.6 -
In the past week the active cases in the counties around me have doubled. We haven't been this high since December of last year. What is happening where you live?
We're close to the numbers we were at last December in NM, which was kind of freaking my wife out a bit, but I had to remind her that last year we were in an essentials only lockdown from early November and through January whereas everything is open as usual this year and everyone is out and about, back to work, etc. It's hard to compare these numbers since the context is vastly different. Had we been open last year like we are now, who knows what those numbers would have been...double? triple? quadruple? Who knows?
Putting it in context helped calm my wife down a bit. Our hospitals are close to the brink and around 93% of COVID patients are unvaxed.10 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Anyone else having problems finding a new vet? We've just moved, and wanted to switch to Mom's vet, but they are not taking new clients, and neither is the second place I tried.
Our old vet is part of the VCA chain, which does have a location near enough us, so I guess we will stick with them.
There was a piece on the local news a few weeks ago about this. During the pandemic, a lot of people got pets that didn't have them before as they had more time to spend with the animals. This, plus the fact that there is a lot of burnout among vets means that the demand for services exceeds the supply of veterinarians. Our vet's office went from 5 vets to 2, with an occasional locum. It takes a month or more to get an appointment and we've been going there for 11 years.3 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Anyone else having problems finding a new vet? We've just moved, and wanted to switch to Mom's vet, but they are not taking new clients, and neither is the second place I tried.
Oddly enough I recently heard there is a massive vet shortage here. If you don't already have a pet with a clinic, you won't get a vet. People with new pets have been driving three and a half hours away to obtain treatment. I've also heard of people pretending that a family member's new pet is theirs.2 -
I'm not in any way a virologist or other relevant expert, just a regular ignorant bozo, so I'll throw this speculation out there to see what others, especially those more knowledgeable, think:
I'm thinking that if it turns out we do need a different vax because of Omicron, it would be surprising if they specified a loooong required interval between current booster and new formulation.
Thought process:
I haven't seen much that suggested getting vaccine doses "too close together" would be particularly injurious to healthy people (or to immune suppressed ones, for that matter), where "too close together" was less than the 6 months between second vax and booster, or even less than the X weeks between dose 1 and dose 2, if it wasn't like subsequent days or something really silly.
What I've understood was more that close doses wouldn't be as effective in stimulating the immune system in the useful ways. Most other vaccines (of different types) don't seem to need long separations (like the Covid booster and flu, or flu and shingles, etc.).
What is making y'all think that if one gets a booster now, there's a meaningful risk that you won't be able to get this speculative new vax when it comes out in March, given what you know at this point?
Just saw this now. Vaccine rollout is a little slower here, and we have a little less freedom of choice. For example we are just offering boosters to 50+ beginning December 13th, younger age groups will be in the new year, and we are only eligible after 6 months.
When I posed the question of waiting it actually never occurred to me that I won't be able to get another booster if I take one now, just not really wanting to get more shots than I need. But now that you mention it I would imagine if a new booster comes out people who already had a recent 3rd dose would probably be last on the list to get it.
That's not exactly what I'd expect here (not sure where you are). If there's limited supply of the new vax at first, I'd expect any priority scheme to be similar to the previous ones, i.e., most at-risk first. It's still unclear who that will be (unvaxed vs. old/comorbidities vs. immune compromised, or whatever). That might mean people with 3rd boost prioritized lower, but I'm not convinced that would be true. But I'm still speculating.
If people with a recent third dose would be last on the list, wouldn't that be a reason to get #3 ASAP anyway, to move up that list as fast as possible? Really a lot of people are just getting the booster now, more or less. I was high priority (over 65), and my booster wasn't that long ago. I wasn't instant out of the blocks in signing up for booster, but not greatly lagging, either. Without looking it up, I think the delay vs. exactly 6 months wasn't more than a couple of weeks, and that was all me, not supply or rules.
I got the initial doses as early as I could schedule them here, though I won't pretend I was necessarily maximally efficient. (Some of my friends searched long distance for example: I just tracked multiple local sources until I found an appointment, for #1.)
Well no - if I get my booster next week and they come out with a "new and improved" one early next year then I imagine I would have to wait several months for it. I am thinking about a scenario where the eligibility is expanded in the new year to those under 50, and those people who haven't had it yet will presumably get the "new" shot as their booster (if one is available), while those of us who already had a third shot would have to wait until they are all done.
At any rate I booked for my booster, best to deal with the situation in front of me and not speculate on what might happen in the future. I'll be seeing family over Christmas and while we are keeping it small again this year it will still be nice to have the extra protection.
Now I am trying to wrap my head around the guilt I am feeling for getting a third shot when a lot of the world hasn't even got their first yet. Not sure how to feel about that.
(I'm in Ontario, Canada btw)1 -
Will be interesting how this plays out, NYC vaccine mandate for all private sector employees:
- The mandate will go into effect on Dec. 27, Mayor Bill de Blasio said.
- The mandate applies to in-person employees who are in a workplace with other coworkers, de Blasio said during a press conference on Monday.
- It doesn’t give unvaccinated employees the option to get tested regularly, de Blasio said.
- New York has identified eight cases of the omicron variant as of the weekend, seven in the New York City area and one in Suffolk County on Long Island.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/12/06/covid-vaccine-new-york-city-imposes-shot-mandate-for-all-private-sector-employers.html
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Now I am trying to wrap my head around the guilt I am feeling for getting a third shot when a lot of the world hasn't even got their first yet. Not sure how to feel about that.
Don't know if this helps, but the way I think of it, whether or not you get a booster doesn't affect whether someone in another continent has a shot available. Also, my understanding is that there is a lot of vaccine resistance in various other places too (like South Africa), it's not simply a matter of lack of availability.10 -
kshama2001 wrote: »Anyone else having problems finding a new vet? We've just moved, and wanted to switch to Mom's vet, but they are not taking new clients, and neither is the second place I tried.
Our old vet is part of the VCA chain, which does have a location near enough us, so I guess we will stick with them.
Not getting a new vet, but appointments for our vet right now are about a month out. I have also heard that they are not currently taking new patients.0 -
Now I am trying to wrap my head around the guilt I am feeling for getting a third shot when a lot of the world hasn't even got their first yet. Not sure how to feel about that.
Don't know if this helps, but the way I think of it, whether or not you get a booster doesn't affect whether someone in another continent has a shot available. Also, my understanding is that there is a lot of vaccine resistance in various other places too (like South Africa), it's not simply a matter of lack of availability.
That seems to be the case. I had my own mixed feelings about getting a booster for the same reason but forgoing protection for myself won't get that same shot into the arm of an unvaccinated person.
https://amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/620901/5
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