Meat and early mortality

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  • rotnkat
    rotnkat Posts: 393 Member
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    I have a vegetarian friend (she has been for over 20 years) and she has heart disease. Just goes to show you anybody can have heart disease vegetarian or not.

    I feel that studies like this don't take into account all the other crap people put into their mouths.
  • FireTigerSoul
    FireTigerSoul Posts: 274 Member
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    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    When did I ever say I was speaking for the OP? Read my posts fully before you respond.
  • Sp1nGoddess
    Sp1nGoddess Posts: 1,138 Member
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    Meat or no meat?
    God or no God?
    Democrat or Republican?

    Everyone needs to make their own informed choice. Most studies are flawed and the outcome skewed by the researchers own opinions. There are simply too many variables. You are certainly better off eating grass fed beef than a hunk of salami.

    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/will-eating-red-meat-kill-you/#axzz1p7jCyXTS
  • MuscleBear
    MuscleBear Posts: 21 Member
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    I looked at the study and specifically the aggregate data tables, and thought it was interesting that Q2 and Q3 had lower mortality rates than Q1 - am I reading this wrong, or did anyone else notice that too?
  • FireTigerSoul
    FireTigerSoul Posts: 274 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So only omnivores get to post in the public forums?

    Are there special drinking fountains we should be using as well?
  • nehtaeh
    nehtaeh Posts: 2,977 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So only omnivores get to post in the public forums?

    Are there special drinking fountains we should be using as well?

    Simmer down, I was merely pointing out that if you don't like the opposition, take it to a safe place.
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
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    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    When did I ever say I was speaking for the OP? Read my posts fully before you respond.

    This was you speaking for the op. One doesn't have to say you are before actually doing it.

    "The OP wasn't trying to push anything. If anything, she was just trying to share her opinion about the article. Notice how she only said 'ME' or 'MY'. She didn't tell anybody they should switch to any kind of diet."


    So in reality, you have no idea what the OP is trying to get accross? Or you do, but you dont' want to actually say it? You said she was trying to "share her opinion". And that opinon would be??
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So, posting results of nutrition study is a bad thing on MFP now just because it may conflict with how some members eat??
  • TinkrBelz
    TinkrBelz Posts: 888 Member
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    Just thinking out loud. Could it be that if we banned all red meat because we will get cancer from it and die, then all of the big corporations that sell red meat will go out of business (McDonalds, Burger King, Hardees, etc) We all know that corporations are evil.

    Also, if red meat is banned, then all cattle ranchers would stop raising cattle. If we have less cattle, then that will help global warming. Cattle produce 70 and 120 kg of Methane per year (cow farts) and this Methane contributes to green house.

    Soooo...I usually believe that things are researched for certain reasons. Saying red meat will kill us helps the government to ban red meat (obviously not right away, but maybe over time) and then the Government can kill two birds with one stone (close some corporations (fast food restaurants) and help global warming)

    BTW: My SIL is a vegetarian and I do not care and I never push my food onto her. Just like she does not lecture me that I am unhealthy and that I am going to die early because I eat meat. Vegetarians and omnivorous can get a long!!
  • _VoV
    _VoV Posts: 1,494 Member
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    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    I am perfectly able to speak for myself, but appreciate what FireTigerSoul had to say. Sadly, I won't be contributing anything to this thread for hours because I will be away. I posted this thread because I thought the study and video were interesting. What people choose to make of this information is up to them to decide.
  • FireTigerSoul
    FireTigerSoul Posts: 274 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So only omnivores get to post in the public forums?

    Are there special drinking fountains we should be using as well?

    Simmer down, I was merely pointing out that if you don't like the opposition, take it to a safe place.

    I like opposition. I find intelligent, well-thought out debates interesting and informative. That's not what's going on here. But you're right, this has become more than just a discussion. I think this thread needs to be locked to prevent further replies. Clearly this isn't going to end anytime soon.
  • nehtaeh
    nehtaeh Posts: 2,977 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So, posting results of nutrition study is a bad thing on MFP now just because it may conflict with how some members eat??

    It seems both sides think one is attacking the other. Maybe it could have been presented differently to get a less defensive reaction.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    I have a vegetarian friend (she has been for over 20 years) and she has heart disease. Just goes to show you anybody can have heart disease vegetarian or not.

    I feel that studies like this don't take into account all the other crap people put into their mouths.

    I totally agree. Also, you can have vegetarians that eat very unhealthily (me being one but trying to get better!) and meat-eaters who eat much more heathily than the majority of vegetarians.
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
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    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    I am perfectly able to speak for myself, but appreciate what FireTigerSoul had to say. Sadly, I won't be contributing anything to this thread for hours because I will be away for several hours. I posted this thread because I thought the study and video were interesting. What people choose to make of this information is up to them to decide.

    I'm pretty sure you found it "interesting" because it supports your particular point of view. We get the subtle implications, don't worry :)
  • FireTigerSoul
    FireTigerSoul Posts: 274 Member
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    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    I am perfectly able to speak for myself, but appreciate what FireTigerSoul had to say. Sadly, I won't be contributing anything to this thread for hours because I will be away for several hours. I posted this thread because I thought the study and video were interesting. What people choose to make of this information is up to them to decide.

    I'm pretty sure you found it "interesting" because it supports your particular point of view. We get the subtle implications, don't worry :)

    Read what you want into anything you wish. You're clearly just arguing for argument's sake now.
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
    Options

    What is so clear from that statement? It's the results of the meat study. Does it say 'This short video proves that meat is bad and you should stop eating it'? No. It doesn't.

    If meat isn't bad and if she isn't pushing not eating meat (as a rabid veggie), then what IS the point of the article?

    I don't know, why don't you ask the researchers who actually conducted the article? How about the meat-eaters who started the conversation and brought up the article yesterday?

    You seem to be speaking for the OP so why don't you take a crack at it?

    I am perfectly able to speak for myself, but appreciate what FireTigerSoul had to say. Sadly, I won't be contributing anything to this thread for hours because I will be away for several hours. I posted this thread because I thought the study and video were interesting. What people choose to make of this information is up to them to decide.

    I'm pretty sure you found it "interesting" because it supports your particular point of view. We get the subtle implications, don't worry :)

    Read what you want into anything you wish. You're clearly just arguing for argument's sake now.

    And you are doing what? Pot kettle steak?
  • nehtaeh
    nehtaeh Posts: 2,977 Member
    Options
    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?

    So only omnivores get to post in the public forums?

    Are there special drinking fountains we should be using as well?

    Simmer down, I was merely pointing out that if you don't like the opposition, take it to a safe place.

    I like opposition. I find intelligent, well-thought out debates interesting and informative. That's not what's going on here. But you're right, this has become more than just a discussion. I think this thread needs to be locked to prevent further replies. Clearly this isn't going to end anytime soon.

    Believe it or not, the public forum might not be the best place for healthy debate around here.
  • ironanimal
    ironanimal Posts: 5,922 Member
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    Isn't this a fantastic reason why we have groups? Why not post this in a vegetarian group...unless it's to try to convince people who eat meat that they shouldn't?
    So only omnivores get to post in the public forums?
    Are there special drinking fountains we should be using as well?
    Nobody implied anything of the sort. We just don't appreciate repeatedly being told that the food we eat - which has been a perfectly viable, healthy and nutritious food option for centuries - is suddenly going to kill us all. The person you quoted is simply making a suggestion to take the discussion elsewhere if you're not liking the opposition to your views.
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
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    Nobody implied anything of the sort. We just don't appreciate repeatedly being told that the food we eat - which has been a perfectly viable, healthy and nutritious food option for centuries - is suddenly going to kill us all. The person you quoted is simply making a suggestion to take the discussion elsewhere if you're not liking the opposition to your views.

    Food eaten today has not been an option for centuries. Even if you limit to all natural, grass fed meat, it's still very different than what was available centuries ago due to breeding, chemicals in water and air, etc. This is true for any food, not just meat.
  • BrianSharpe
    BrianSharpe Posts: 9,248 Member
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    Maybe if it's so flawed you should call up some of the reviewers.

    Correlation does imply causality. Correlation does not prove causality.

    Thank you......

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