Something I learned to avoid carbs
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kellysdavies wrote: »
So on your theory I shouldn't blindly follow something and I should question it. Urm. So this is what happened with CICO...
You don't get it.
You may not literally be counting calories, but your TDEE numbers are obviously miscalculated, so that with what little you consume, you are eating at a calorie deficit.0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Well I kinda did but a) I got told off for advertising and being obsessive and b) nobody seems willing to at least read it instead choosing to completely dismiss it as even a possibility because it doesn't suit their current beliefs/own obsession.
Zoe doesn't even have a degree in nutrition. She is not a researcher.
From an education standpoint, the person you're basing your whole belief on, the person who gets told off by actual science that she's full of it, doesn't know more about nutrition than you or me.0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Well I kinda did but a) I got told off for advertising and being obsessive and b) nobody seems willing to at least read it instead choosing to completely dismiss it as even a possibility because it doesn't suit their current beliefs/own obsession.
No you didn't, you posted a bunch of stuff about that diet website.
Can you please provide links to peer review studies backing up your claims that CICO does not matter as to weight loss? Some can be found here: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/ncbisearch/0 -
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mamapeach910 wrote: »
You said, in reply to a post of mine suggesting you do a refeed at maintenance, that YOU DID THAT. If you ate 1300 and thought it was a refeed, it wasn't.
You're not paying attention to what I'm saying. You had adaptive thermogenesis. That's why your rate of loss slowed down. Your TDEE at those stats was around 1600 calories. You should have eaten up to that for a while... about 2 weeks if not more, then slowly backed down to eating about your BMR level. You would have resumed a normal rate of loss at that point.
What you've done now is nothing more than a refeed, just as I've outlined here.
Without presenting proof that you're eating in an actual energy surplus (especially since you only counted calories all of once), I frankly don't believe you, unless you have an undiagnosed underlying medical condition (in which case there really isn't an underlying energy surplus).
Not sure how I can prove it? I could put anything into MFP couldn't I? It wouldn't be proof. So today as an example I burned around 1,600 calories which is prob average (I have a FITBIT)
I ate
Breakfast
4 pieces of streaky bacon
3 eggs cooked in butter
A tomato
Lunch
A pack of antipasto meats
Chicken and veg soup
Dinner (Sunday lunch round the mother in law's!)
Boiled egg salad and loads of olive oil
Roast pork, chicken and cauliflower mash, peas and carrots, brocolli and peas
Strawberries and double cream
Cheddar and Brie
A bit of 85% dark chocolate
Decaf teas and coffees about 4
Yesterday - same breakfast (have the same most days - some days porridge and banana)
Lunch - pork chop and cauliflower rice and courgette noodles cooked in butter
Dinner - duck breast and all the skin and same veg
Full fat Greek yoghurt
I'm being as honest as I can here. No lies. You ca chose to believe me or not. It's fine!
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stevencloser wrote: »
Wanna have a look at some of the links I posted? All linking to things listing off exactly why that Zoe person doesn't know what she's talking about.
Oh you have googled for bad stuff - random blogs. You can find whatever you want to find. I could post loads of links as to why calorie controlled diets don't work! Come on.
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kellysdavies wrote: »
Not sure how I can prove it? I could put anything into MFP couldn't I? It wouldn't be proof. So today as an example I burned around 1,600 calories which is prob average (I have a FITBIT)
I ate
Breakfast
4 pieces of streaky bacon
3 eggs cooked in butter
A tomato
Lunch
A pack of antipasto meats
Chicken and veg soup
Dinner (Sunday lunch round the mother in law's!)
Boiled egg salad and loads of olive oil
Roast pork, chicken and cauliflower mash, peas and carrots, brocolli and peas
Strawberries and double cream
Cheddar and Brie
A bit of 85% dark chocolate
Decaf teas and coffees about 4
Yesterday - same breakfast (have the same most days - some days porridge and banana)
Lunch - pork chop and cauliflower rice and courgette noodles cooked in butter
Dinner - duck breast and all the skin and same veg
Full fat Greek yoghurt
I'm being as honest as I can here. No lies. You ca chose to believe me or not. It's fine!
Without weights that doesn't help.0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Not sure how I can prove it? I could put anything into MFP couldn't I? It wouldn't be proof. So today as an example I burned around 1,600 calories which is prob average (I have a FITBIT)
I ate
Breakfast
4 pieces of streaky bacon
3 eggs cooked in butter
A tomato
Lunch
A pack of antipasto meats
Chicken and veg soup
Dinner (Sunday lunch round the mother in law's!)
Boiled egg salad and loads of olive oil
Roast pork, chicken and cauliflower mash, peas and carrots, brocolli and peas
Strawberries and double cream
Cheddar and Brie
A bit of 85% dark chocolate
Decaf teas and coffees about 4
Yesterday - same breakfast (have the same most days - some days porridge and banana)
Lunch - pork chop and cauliflower rice and courgette noodles cooked in butter
Dinner - duck breast and all the skin and same veg
Full fat Greek yoghurt
I'm being as honest as I can here. No lies. You ca chose to believe me or not. It's fine!
If your Fitbit says you burned 1600 calories, you must have done some intense exercise for a really long time.
In what quantities did you eat that food?
Peer reviewed studies, please.0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Oh you have googled for bad stuff - random blogs. You can find whatever you want to find. I could post loads of links as to why calorie controlled diets don't work! Come on.
So you're saying she DOES have a degree in nutrition? That she did any research? That she has even the slightest clue about what she is talking about?0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Oh you have googled for bad stuff - random blogs. You can find whatever you want to find. I could post loads of links as to why calorie controlled diets don't work! Come on.
Peer reviewed studies will be just fine for that. Please.0 -
Well at least if you ask me how CICO works, how the body works, how macronutrients get metabolized I can explain that I have answers. You can't. You are claiming things that differ from actual science but you yourself said you can't even explain yourself.
@kellysdavies
Can you comment on the links the user above posted about Zoe?stevencloser wrote: »
Without weights that doesn't help.
Lol! I don't weigh anymore ! Urm, porridge about 100g, pork chop tesco finest - guess about 200g, duck breast maybe 250 (it was big from the butchers) Greek yoghurt half a 500g tub, bacon no idea - just 4 strips of streaky bacon from the butchers, butter large knob, 10g maybe ? Cauliflower half a whole one (medium sized) oh and that has butter in it and onions and garlic ... Strawberries a dessert bowl full and maybe 50ml of double cream (not sure maybe less - the old MFP me still struggles pouring cream on without watching it!) ...0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Lol! I don't weigh anymore ! Urm, porridge about 100g, pork chop tesco finest - guess about 200g, duck breast maybe 250 (it was big from the butchers) Greek yoghurt half a 500g tub, bacon no idea - just 4 strips of streaky bacon from the butchers, butter large knob, 10g maybe ? Cauliflower half a whole one (medium sized) oh and that has butter in it and onions and garlic ... Strawberries a dessert bowl full and maybe 50ml of double cream (not sure maybe less - the old MFP me still struggles pouring cream on without watching it!) ...
Well there's your problem.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjKPIcI51lU
Works both ways.0 -
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I love these people who have no idea how much they are eating but insist they are eating at a surplus despite losing weight (or vice versa).0
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If your Fitbit says you burned 1600 calories, you must have done some intense exercise for a really long time.
I climbed a mountain.
In what quantities did you eat that food?
I have no idea as I don't weight now (yippeeee !) but all big plates. You can visualise 3 medium eggs scrambled and 4 rashers of bacon... A bowl of porridge about 100g, a roast dinner not piled up but plate full... Half a Cauli mashed, half a large courgette spiraled... Can't be more specific sorry as I don't need to weigh anymore !
Peer reviewed studies, please.
Oh sorry. You mean other people who have reviewed this particular diet. I haven't looked for these (sorry I misunderstood reviewed studies for the actual book ... Thicko) I'll have to see if there are any! At this point I can only give my experience (but there are loads of people on her forum (much like this one ) who have also seen incredible results)
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kellysdavies wrote: »
Lol! I don't weigh anymore ! Urm, porridge about 100g, pork chop tesco finest - guess about 200g, duck breast maybe 250 (it was big from the butchers) Greek yoghurt half a 500g tub, bacon no idea - just 4 strips of streaky bacon from the butchers, butter large knob, 10g maybe ? Cauliflower half a whole one (medium sized) oh and that has butter in it and onions and garlic ... Strawberries a dessert bowl full and maybe 50ml of double cream (not sure maybe less - the old MFP me still struggles pouring cream on without watching it!) ...
Ding ding ding! Here's your problem. You have no clue how many calories you are eating because you don't weigh your food. It's simple. Weigh your food if you want to lose weight.0 -
kellysdavies wrote: »
Oh sorry. You mean other people who have reviewed this particular diet. I haven't looked for these (sorry I misunderstood reviewed studies for the actual book ... Thicko) I'll have to see if there are any! At this point I can only give my experience (but there are loads of people on her forum (much like this one ) who have also seen incredible results)
Do you climb mountains and all that often?
That burns a lot of calories you know. Probably enough to lose weight at 2000 calories.0 -
Sciencebeliever wrote: »
Sounds yummy! The classic high-fat, no refined sugars, no carbs from grains way of life (it is not a diet) that is sweeping the nation.
Also works great if you are pre-Type 2 diabetic because it stops diabetes in its tracks (but not great for the endocrinologists, who would lose you as a life-time Type 2 patient).
Well this was just two days! Last week I had a bowl of quinoa with veg for lunch and another day brown rice pasta ... Oooooh and a butternut squash curry with brown rice for dinner one night ... So I am getting some grains (what with these and my porridge) I just don't eat them with fat.
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stevencloser wrote: »
Well there's your problem.
What problem ? I don't have a problem.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjKPIcI51lU
Works both ways.
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I took a nap, why is everyone on kelly's case? What "claims" is she making that you see as aren't true?
I went back 6 pages trying to catch up, but, yeah, that's not going to work in a reasonable time frame.
She thinks you can lose weight while in a calorie surplus, which is just plain false.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »
Do you climb mountains and all that often?
That burns a lot of calories you know. Probably enough to lose weight at 2000 calories.
Nope! Last time was in January. We had to come back down because it was too icy. Went back today to get to the top. And we did. Hurrah!
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kellysdavies wrote: »
The possible problem that you're looking at the food and thinking "Oh that must be like 2000 calories!" when it might in fact be a lot less. And now attributing it on that diet by someone who has no business creating diets.0 -
Nony_Mouse wrote: »I love these people who have no idea how much they are eating but insist they are eating at a surplus despite losing weight (or vice versa).
*Sigh*. Why was that enough to get me off me *kitten* and headed out for a run?I took a nap, why is everyone on kelly's case? What "claims" is she making that you see as aren't true?
I went back 6 pages trying to catch up, but, yeah, that's not going to work in a reasonable time frame.
Dunno about anyone else. Personally I was told I wasn't interesting. When I thought about it, I decided Kelly was
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We can lose weight (fat) while in a caloric surplus. A net deficit isn't needed.
We can't eat fat and carbs together.
Haters gonna hate ...
Yes to your first point. This is the bit which jars with everyone because I choose to believe not all calories are equal..and it's daft to think all our food does the same thing in our bodies ..
No to your second. But I am following a food lifestyle where I don't do this while I am losing weight. Or to lose weight. Once I am where I am wanna a be a bit of mixing comes back into play. But I'll always 'manage' my carbs - if i get to this point. Not sure I will cause I'm losing the will to live right now.
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Wow.....that woman is so dumb.
Dumb? Probably not. Just another charlton who found a way to separate people from their money.0 -
Well if that's the case, I do understand her point of view, but I think she misunderstood what actually happened. I seen many low carbers go around saying "I used to eat x calories, and i couldn't lose weight, now i eat x+y calories and I am losing weight, calories don't matter"
As I said so myself, I 'when I do low carb I lose at 2,500 calories, when i incorporate a higher carb intake I have to eat around 2,000 calories"
The thing with these types of diets they don't have such a big negative impact on metabolic rate.
"Among overweight and obese young adults compared with pre-weight-loss energy expenditure, isocaloric feeding following 10% to 15% weight loss resulted in decreases in REE and TEE that were greatest with the low-fat diet, intermediate with the low-glycemic index diet, and least with the very low-carbohydrate diet"
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22735432
My own personal data comparing a LOW CAL DIET and keto
Crash diet results for 28 days
Caloric Intake: 1461
Fat Mass Loss: 12.9lbs
LBM: 171lbs
Estiamted TDEE: 2839 (calculated from results)
Keto 28 day results
Calorie intake: 2,379
Fat Mass Loss: 8.9lbs
LBM: 170lbs
Estimated TDEE: 3,491
*cough cough*
"was greatest with the low-fat diet (mean [95% CI], -205 [-265 to -144] kcal/d), intermediate with the low-glycemic index diet (-166 [-227 to -106] kcal/d), and least with the very low-carbohydrate diet (-138 [-198 to -77] kcal/d;"
A 70 calorie difference.0 -
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amusedmonkey wrote: »
Dumb? Probably not. Just another charlton who found a way to separate people from their money.
Yep, in the end it comes down to just another way for someone to stuff their pockets. P0
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