December 2017 Running Challenge
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@PastorVincent you are a sub-4 marathoner you just haven't actually done it yet. I would say a 1:50 half should be very possible. Simple math you need to be able to run 9 minute miles for 13.1. You shown that ability.0
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Sub 1:50 HM should give you confidence for a sub-4 full. That's plenty of leeway on the timing. I'm not at sub-1:50 for HM yet, and I'm pretty sure that under good conditions I'm in the shape to go sub-4 on a full now.... If I ever run a road race again...... you got this.PastorVincent wrote: »I am confident with reasonable conditions I could have a sub 2 hour half. Sub-1:50 maybe even. The Sub-4 Marathon I am not yet there. Hopefully by May!
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PastorVincent wrote: »skippygirlsmom wrote: »@rolaasad I can promise you every person here started at less than 1 mile. What I love about this group is there is zero judgement and 100% support, no matter if you run ½ or 200 miles, if you are hurt, if you are coming back, if you are having a baby or getting married, if you lost someone or just want to brag on your kiddos. This group is awesome.
This is very true! We have quite a range of runners here too. Some working on their first none stop mile all the way to @JessicaMcB who is annoyed when she ONLY gets 81 miles in a run and oversleeps to FOUR AM!
We have all types for sure 
I can remember how excited I was when I ran my first nonstop mile! It took over 14 minutes. 6 -
12/1 - Les Mills Body Pump / CX Works
12/2 - 12
12/3 - REST
12/4 - 4
12/5 - 2.5
18.5/80
A little short on my 3 miles today, but it was fun to run faster. It was Benjamin Frankly hard to get out of bed this morning and it sure was cold. I think it was 27. I was fine once I was bundled up and in it. Another quick two miler tomorrow before a couple rest days and then HM! I wish it was tomorrow. So. Ready.
Also, plotting my 2018 races. Kind of a mix of things I want to have fun with.
02/10/18 - Mardi Crawl 10k
04/14/18 - Rattler Mad Moose 10k (Trail)
06/03/18 - Gluten Free Gallop 5k
06/23/18 - Slacker Half Marathon (it's downhill, yo)
07/XX/18 - Something on a trail, I don't know what yet
09/23/18 - Xterra Mountain 8k (Trail)
10/28/18 - Kooky Spooky 10k
11/XX/18 - A Turkey Trot 5k of some sort
I wanted to do an 8k trail race in May, but we have a trip to Mexico planned. Have a mix of trail and others. Going to spend 2018 doing long runs on trails and shorter runs as the weather and light permits closer to spring/summer.
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12/1 9.75mi
12/2 4mi
12/3 rest
12/4 4mi
12/5 6mi
Mild and cloudy this morning. We have a warm front pushing through, but we might get snow this Sunday! And by snow I mean a light sprinkle, but it’s a big deal in these parts!
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Yesterday I was able to crank out 5 miles on the mill while watching The Great British Baking Show on Netflix. I'm on to season two now. The bread episode had me craving all of their breadsticks.
So now I'm up to 12 miles for December. Woot.
Yesterday was 61 degrees, and today it's only going to get into the 30s. What a rude awakening this morning. Windy as all get out too, so today's lunch walk should be a blast.2 -
I am just getting back to running. It has been a very long time. Started back at the gym today. I am going to set a goal of 30 miles. I did 1 today. 1/308
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I started the couch 2 5k program last week as well as the NIKE running app. I found the more I did it, the more I like it and my husband actually says to me, okay, you running today and helps me set a time to run or even just comes downstairs and tinkers while I run.3
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12/1-P90X CVX and yoga
12/2-rest day
12/3-8.3 miles
12/4- P90X3 Warrior
I did my P90X3 workout, but I didn't do my planned yoga yesterday due to time constraints. Today is run and strength session with my trainer, so unlikely that I will be able to make up for it today. Maybe I will be able to do a power yoga session tomorrow after my P90X3 workout. I need to get that stretching in.
@JessicaMcB_ I had a similar encounter with a doe a few years ago. She came right out in front of me and we were within inches of a collision. Scared the living crap out of me. I am pretty sure I would have come up on the short end of that encounter!
@WandaVaughn - That looks like a fabulous run! My goal for 2018 is to hit more trails. I wish they were more convenient for me because I am pretty sure I would give up road running all together.
@ddsmom22 - A good run is the best hangover cure ever. Or so I've heard
@PastorVincent - I am certain you will have no problem going sub 1:50 on that half marathon. You regularly train on hilly routes. I have found there is not a whole lot of difference in race times for hilly vs. flat courses if you are used to running similar elevation changes. I ran a half marathon last month that had around 600ft of elevation change and was only about a minute and a half off of my PR, which probably had more to do with lack of training than the actual course. If you are used to running hills, the difference in time lost on the uphills is usually less than the time you make up on the downhills, IMO.1 -
skippygirlsmom wrote: »
I need to find that sweet spot of losing weight but fueling enough.
When you figure that out let me know! I’m struggling losing the last 5 pounds, but when I cut calories my running suffers.2 -
@PastorVincent this is just my n=1 experience but I can race a half in the high 1:30's on what feels like less effort than a sub 4 full.
The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise. My half split at Edmonton Marathon for example was 1:42 because I was trying to pace against having to keep running for another 13 miles- if I had raced Edmonton as a half I know my time would have scored in the 1:30's (which wouldn't have been good enough to place or anything but okay considering how effed up my guts were that day).
So I think that coupled with the fact that you are a quick guy in your age category bodes very well for you running it sub 1:50. I believe in your infinite potential people!
And 4AM is late af in my world governed by an army I created myself. I assume I will sleep again when I am dead
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My goal for the month is 15 miles a week, for a total of 60 miles for the month. I need to look for a race to register for to keep me honest. I haven't
been hitting my goal, and I'd really like to! New week, new month, new opportunities to hit it.
12/4: 4.5 miles3 -
skippygirlsmom wrote: »
I need to find that sweet spot of losing weight but fueling enough.
When you figure that out let me know! I’m struggling losing the last 5 pounds, but when I cut calories my running suffers.
Story of my life.0 -
My gym was not open yet when I arrived home. So instead of weight training I switched to a run. Slowish but still
6.25 km added to my total. Total 14,25 but my ticker won't show properly today
Thinking of switching gyms as my current gym's opening times are getting restrictive0 -
Yikes. I just went out for lunch and the temps have dropped almost 20 degrees since I came to work this morning. Forecast is also calling for 30-40 mph wind gusts. I am afraid I severely underpacked for my run this evening. I doubt I will have time to swing by home and run before my appointment with my trainer at 7, so it looks like I might be doing some type of dreadmill interval workout for my run tonight. What is your favorite interval workout to do on the dreadmill?1
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lporter229 wrote: »Yikes. I just went out for lunch and the temps have dropped almost 20 degrees since I came to work this morning. Forecast is also calling for 30-40 mph wind gusts. I am afraid I severely underpacked for my run this evening. I doubt I will have time to swing by home and run before my appointment with my trainer at 7, so it looks like I might be doing some type of dreadmill interval workout for my run tonight. What is your favorite interval workout to do on the dreadmill?
When I run the dreadmill, I set it for the pace I want to learn to run (say 6 or 7mph) because it forces you to keep a steady pace. The hope is I will learn the beat and keep it when not forced.
Then I tell the dreadmill "give me random hills with an average incline of 5%" - There are no downhills on the dreadmills I use, so that means I run for a solid hour uphill the entire way with steepness that ranges from 3% to 7% for most of the route with an occasionally 9 or so % tossed.
The idea is I will do all the uphills at the same pace regardless of incline giving an interval style work out based on endurance instead of speed.
Maybe not the intervals like you were thinking, but it is another way to use the dreadmill.
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JessicaMcB wrote: »And 4AM is late af in my world governed by an army I created myself. I assume I will sleep again when I am dead
I only have 1 spawn, but I get most days at 5am. He is 14, so he is moving into that sleep all morning age which is a big help!
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JessicaMcB wrote: »The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise.
Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.
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PastorVincent wrote: »JessicaMcB wrote: »The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise.
Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.
well, if you don't mind being out there for 5 or so hours, I bet you could0 -
01/12 4.12 miles
05/12 4.14 miles - really enjoyed this run, felt I was able to push a little harder.
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@PastorVincent - I despise doing hills on the treadmill. So maybe that's what I need to do tonight.0
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_nikkiwolf_ wrote: »Quick question for everyone who owns Saucony Kinvaras: What's your experience on the life span compared to other running shoes?
After yesterdays 5km run, I woke up this morning with a bit of pain in my left knee again; when I was perfectly fine after a 14km run on Sunday.
Looking back through my running log, I noticed that this time as well as the last time (two weeks ago) my knee hurt, I had been running in the Kinvaras the evening before. So of course now I'm hoping the easy solution to fix my knee would be to replace them.
On the other hand, it could be just a coincidence. I usually run 600km to 700km in a pair of shoes before replacing them (and then I usually only retire them because I want an excuse to buy new shoes ^^). The Kinvaras only have 460km (=285mi) on them, so they should be good for quite a few more runs...
So now I'm wondering if anybody else has noticed Kinvaras wearing out more quickly than normal?
@_nikkiwolf_
Kinvaras used to be my "go to" shoe, but I noticed that the last pair I bought wore out rather quickly and I haven't bought them since. Like you, I experienced odd knee and hip pain. I believe I was wearing version 7 at the time, purchased in 2016--don't quote me on that because I had a baby recently and my memory isn't what it used to be! I now alternate between ONs Cloudventure (for light trail runs) and New Balance Vazee (which I have found to be similar to the Kinvaras).
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An update on my busted face, it's bruising nicely. No one has seemed to notice since I have to wear safety glasses that seem to hide it.
I skipped dinner last night, no breakfast so by time I get out at lunch I decide splurge on Arby's. The line was long so I went to freddys.... I don't order fries but never explicitly said I didn't want them. So... They were in the bag. I ate them. So So Greasy... urp.. I'ma regret that.
I really need to run. My foots bothering me again, same place same foot. It's like tendonitis on the top, like 3-4 metatarsals. I complained to my doc like 2 years ago he thought it was a neuroma and sent me for an MRI. Nothing. Well just some kinda boney tumor on my big toe that he dismissed. Maybe I'll get in that TM today.
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Just now getting to post: I ran 3 miles this morning and managed to finish before the rain hit my part of the state. (sorry you got a soaking, @skippygirlsmom )3
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date miles monthly total
12/5 2.74 mi 2.74 mi2 -
@HonuNui that's awesome! It took me a bit to get it, but I did get it. I'll have to remember that one!
@MNLittleFinn you need to chill, man, lol! Moving your run a day early is NOT going to affect your Zumbro time one second.
@PastorVincent I agree with @JessicaMcB . That description was written to sell registrations and there may or may not be any substance behind it. That one hill does look significant, particularly for a less experienced runner, but you see it, you plan for it, and you run it.. No problem. That 2.5% is just the average. Some spots are steeper, some are flatter.
I agree with you that a sub 2 hr HM does not equal a sub 4 hr full. My first HM was 1:56. My first full, 6 months later, was 4:09. I had the pace I needed for a sub 4 for the first 22 miles but then muscle fatigue took over and I gradually slowed my pace the final 4. Six months just wasn't enough time to build up the leg strength and endurance needed for me to get to 4 hours. I had three 20+ mile training runs but those were at training pace, not marathon pace.
@_nikkiwolf_ I have a pair of Kinvara trail shoes but have not wore them yet. One thing I noticed when I bought them is that they are quite a bit lighter than my other trail shoes. Could the lighter weight lead to less life span?
losing weight vs. optimizing running performance...that's very, very difficult. Running is a calorie intensive activity, which is hard to reconcile with losing weight. I do think it works better if you can train your body to increase the percent of fat you burn vs. carbs at a given pace. You do that by keeping your pace down on long runs...in the aerobic zone... so your body doesn't need to dip into your glycogen stores. The more your body can burn fat, the better it becomes at doing so. Even those folks with 6-pack abs have enough fat in their bodies to fuel running an ultra, but we need to get our bodies trained to be efficient at it. Ditch the sugar and refined carbs, eat more good fats and protein, and run slower. That also reduces the stress hormone cortisol in your body, which helps in other areas. Now if you're goal is to get a podium finish at the next 5K or 10K, this is not going to work. If that's the case spend 6 months a year optimizing your running, and 6 months losing weight.PastorVincent wrote: »Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.
You may already know this, but the main difference is due to your glycogen stores. Many runners have enough glycogen (carbs) stored in their muscles and liver to fully fuel a HM race. Most runners do NOT, however, have enough to fuel a full marathon. Glycogen stores last about 90 to 120 minutes. That's a doable HM time. For a full, however, you need to take fuel from the beginning because you cannot ingest carbs at the high rate you burn them. Because of that, and because there's about a 30 minute lag from when you start taking your gels to the time those calories are available to your body as fuel, you should start your fueling for a full about 15 minutes before the race starts and keep at it until 30 minutes before the end. You should have experimented and discovered how many calories per hour your body can digest without gastrointestinal issues during your training and use that as a basis for your marathon fueling plan.
@hist_doc hey, another Cloudventure wearer!! I just retired my first pair. I love those shoes! It's like wearing a comfortable pair of slipper with great traction. I got about 300 miles out of them, which is typical for me. At that point the pods were tearing and the uppers had a few small holes. I have a new pair to break out soon but I'm trying to wear out some other shoes first.2 -
It was a crazy day yesterday. From a high of 58F dropping down to 18F this morning, with showers starting during the day, transitioning to snow around 8pm with high winds.
I waited until the snow came down because running in the snow is divine. It was 28F at the start so I dress very warm but after a quarter mile I had to go back home. That wind made the snowflakes feel like little icy daggers on my face! I traded in my cap for a full face mask. that helped but when running into the wind, I had to close up the slit at much as possible and nearly close my eyes, looking through eyelashes to make sure i didn't stray off course. I think we only got about 2 inches but the wind was filling in my footprints so that when I ran a second loop I couldn't see the imprints from my first pass just 20 minutes earlier.
I stayed near my house in case my knee flared up. I got 5 miles in and the knee felt pretty good during and after the run. I could feel something, but less than before. It's a bit full today. I'm still debating whether to schedule an appointment or not.
In spite of the wind the run was awesome! It felt great and Kody & I LOVED running in the snow. Tonight may be a bit trickier since now the first layer of snow has turned to ice. That means I'll move my running from the paths to the streets, since the streets are treated with salt and get more traffic, so they're less treacherous.
A slow start, but a start nonetheless
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So.... March race is now officially official. Got my discount code and got registered!6
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I agree with you that a sub 2 hr HM does not equal a sub 4 hr full. My first HM was 1:56. My first full, 6 months later, was 4:09. I had the pace I needed for a sub 4 for the first 22 miles but then muscle fatigue took over and I gradually slowed my pace the final 4. Six months just wasn't enough time to build up the leg strength and endurance needed for me to get to 4 hours. I had three 20+ mile training runs but those were at training pace, not marathon pace.
Yeah, this year I am going to put more long (20+) runs into my training. I think that was a miss last year. 10-13 is a normal comfortable weekend run for me now, but come next year (as in soon! heh) I plan to push that more. All comes down to time and weather though. Neither of which are great in Pittsburgh winters.You may already know this, but the main difference is due to your glycogen stores. Many runners have enough glycogen (carbs) stored in their muscles and liver to fully fuel a HM race. Most runners do NOT, however, have enough to fuel a full marathon. Glycogen stores last about 90 to 120 minutes. That's a doable HM time. For a full, however, you need to take fuel from the beginning because you cannot ingest carbs at the high rate you burn them. Because of that, and because there's about a 30 minute lag from when you start taking your gels to the time those calories are available to your body as fuel, you should start your fueling for a full about 15 minutes before the race starts and keep at it until 30 minutes before the end. You should have experimented and discovered how many calories per hour your body can digest without gastrointestinal issues during your training and use that as a basis for your marathon fueling plan.
I fueled very poorly my first marathon and paid dearly for it, but been working on things since then. For the marathon, I am pretty sure (need more testing, but early testing looks good) that roughly a scope of TailWind in my water each hour will be sufficient. That is 100 calories. That puts me in the ballpark of the Gel recommendations - without the mass of the gels.
The only problem is that for the marathon that means carrying my own water. Gels are much lighter to carry! Still working on a plan. Might carrying 1/2 the water I need - all with TailWinds in and then get rest of my water form the race people. MIght be a good balance.
I know from experience if the weather is warm, I can easily burn through 80oz of water in 4 hours at MP. Which I know sounds like a lot to some people, but we are all different and I loose greater than a pound an hour in water if I do not hydrate for spring/summer runs.0 -
@7lenny7 thanks for the weight running balance info. Very informative. I lost weight while running before, but I was maxing out at half of what I’m running now. At my happy weight I was running about 40 miles more a month than I am now. Skip looked at the On Cloud shoes a couple weeks ago, she ran all over the parking in them came back into Fleet Feet and said I hate them for running, love them for walking, the owner said “me too”. Oh geesh. She didn’t like the feel of the tread on her feet if that makes sense. You need some snow googles.0
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