December 2017 Running Challenge

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  • JessicaMcB
    JessicaMcB Posts: 1,503 Member
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    @PastorVincent this is just my n=1 experience but I can race a half in the high 1:30's on what feels like less effort than a sub 4 full.

    The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise. My half split at Edmonton Marathon for example was 1:42 because I was trying to pace against having to keep running for another 13 miles- if I had raced Edmonton as a half I know my time would have scored in the 1:30's (which wouldn't have been good enough to place or anything but okay considering how effed up my guts were that day).

    So I think that coupled with the fact that you are a quick guy in your age category bodes very well for you running it sub 1:50. I believe in your infinite potential people!

    And 4AM is late af in my world governed by an army I created myself. I assume I will sleep again when I am dead :#
  • Eire228
    Eire228 Posts: 238 Member
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    My goal for the month is 15 miles a week, for a total of 60 miles for the month. I need to look for a race to register for to keep me honest. I haven't
    been hitting my goal, and I'd really like to! New week, new month, new opportunities to hit it. :smile:

    12/4: 4.5 miles
  • fitoverfortymom
    fitoverfortymom Posts: 3,452 Member
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    zdyb23456 wrote: »
    skippygirlsmom wrote: »

    I need to find that sweet spot of losing weight but fueling enough.

    When you figure that out let me know! I’m struggling losing the last 5 pounds, but when I cut calories my running suffers.

    Story of my life.
  • dutchandkiwi
    dutchandkiwi Posts: 1,389 Member
    edited December 2017
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    My gym was not open yet when I arrived home. So instead of weight training I switched to a run. Slowish but still
    6.25 km added to my total. Total 14,25 but my ticker won't show properly today

    Thinking of switching gyms as my current gym's opening times are getting restrictive
  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    Yikes. I just went out for lunch and the temps have dropped almost 20 degrees since I came to work this morning. Forecast is also calling for 30-40 mph wind gusts. I am afraid I severely underpacked for my run this evening. I doubt I will have time to swing by home and run before my appointment with my trainer at 7, so it looks like I might be doing some type of dreadmill interval workout for my run tonight. What is your favorite interval workout to do on the dreadmill?
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
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    lporter229 wrote: »
    Yikes. I just went out for lunch and the temps have dropped almost 20 degrees since I came to work this morning. Forecast is also calling for 30-40 mph wind gusts. I am afraid I severely underpacked for my run this evening. I doubt I will have time to swing by home and run before my appointment with my trainer at 7, so it looks like I might be doing some type of dreadmill interval workout for my run tonight. What is your favorite interval workout to do on the dreadmill?

    When I run the dreadmill, I set it for the pace I want to learn to run (say 6 or 7mph) because it forces you to keep a steady pace. The hope is I will learn the beat and keep it when not forced.

    Then I tell the dreadmill "give me random hills with an average incline of 5%" - There are no downhills on the dreadmills I use, so that means I run for a solid hour uphill the entire way with steepness that ranges from 3% to 7% for most of the route with an occasionally 9 or so % tossed.

    The idea is I will do all the uphills at the same pace regardless of incline giving an interval style work out based on endurance instead of speed.

    Maybe not the intervals like you were thinking, but it is another way to use the dreadmill.
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
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    JessicaMcB wrote: »
    And 4AM is late af in my world governed by an army I created myself. I assume I will sleep again when I am dead :#

    :lol:

    I only have 1 spawn, but I get most days at 5am. He is 14, so he is moving into that sleep all morning age which is a big help! :D
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
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    JessicaMcB wrote: »
    The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise.

    Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.

  • MNLittleFinn
    MNLittleFinn Posts: 4,271 Member
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    PastorVincent wrote: »
    JessicaMcB wrote: »
    The half for me is a lovely distance in the sense that it doesn't require the strategy the full or ultras require- you just run as fast as you can since it's definitely less than 2 hours ykwim? The full is a different animal endurance wise.

    Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.

    well, if you don't mind being out there for 5 or so hours, I bet you could
  • Mari33a
    Mari33a Posts: 1,091 Member
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    01/12 4.12 miles
    05/12 4.14 miles - really enjoyed this run, felt I was able to push a little harder.


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  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    @PastorVincent - I despise doing hills on the treadmill. So maybe that's what I need to do tonight.
  • hist_doc
    hist_doc Posts: 206 Member
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    _nikkiwolf_ wrote: »
    Quick question for everyone who owns Saucony Kinvaras: What's your experience on the life span compared to other running shoes?

    After yesterdays 5km run, I woke up this morning with a bit of pain in my left knee again; when I was perfectly fine after a 14km run on Sunday. :neutral: Looking back through my running log, I noticed that this time as well as the last time (two weeks ago) my knee hurt, I had been running in the Kinvaras the evening before. So of course now I'm hoping the easy solution to fix my knee would be to replace them.
    On the other hand, it could be just a coincidence. I usually run 600km to 700km in a pair of shoes before replacing them (and then I usually only retire them because I want an excuse to buy new shoes ^^). The Kinvaras only have 460km (=285mi) on them, so they should be good for quite a few more runs...

    So now I'm wondering if anybody else has noticed Kinvaras wearing out more quickly than normal?

    @_nikkiwolf_
    Kinvaras used to be my "go to" shoe, but I noticed that the last pair I bought wore out rather quickly and I haven't bought them since. Like you, I experienced odd knee and hip pain. I believe I was wearing version 7 at the time, purchased in 2016--don't quote me on that because I had a baby recently and my memory isn't what it used to be! I now alternate between ONs Cloudventure (for light trail runs) and New Balance Vazee (which I have found to be similar to the Kinvaras).


    exercise.png

  • Elise4270
    Elise4270 Posts: 8,375 Member
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    An update on my busted face, it's bruising nicely. No one has seemed to notice since I have to wear safety glasses that seem to hide it.

    I skipped dinner last night, no breakfast so by time I get out at lunch I decide splurge on Arby's. The line was long so I went to freddys.... I don't order fries but never explicitly said I didn't want them. So... They were in the bag. I ate them. So So Greasy... urp.. I'ma regret that.

    I really need to run. My foots bothering me again, same place same foot. It's like tendonitis on the top, like 3-4 metatarsals. I complained to my doc like 2 years ago he thought it was a neuroma and sent me for an MRI. Nothing. Well just some kinda boney tumor on my big toe that he dismissed. Maybe I'll get in that TM today.

    czhfkb9782ox.jpg
  • WandaVaughn
    WandaVaughn Posts: 420 Member
    edited December 2017
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    Just now getting to post: I ran 3 miles this morning and managed to finish before the rain hit my part of the state. (sorry you got a soaking, @skippygirlsmom )
  • Ericsmi
    Ericsmi Posts: 128 Member
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    date miles monthly total
    12/5 2.74 mi 2.74 mi
  • 7lenny7
    7lenny7 Posts: 3,493 Member
    edited December 2017
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    @HonuNui that's awesome! It took me a bit to get it, but I did get it. I'll have to remember that one!

    @MNLittleFinn you need to chill, man, lol! Moving your run a day early is NOT going to affect your Zumbro time one second.

    @PastorVincent I agree with @JessicaMcB . That description was written to sell registrations and there may or may not be any substance behind it. That one hill does look significant, particularly for a less experienced runner, but you see it, you plan for it, and you run it.. No problem. That 2.5% is just the average. Some spots are steeper, some are flatter.

    I agree with you that a sub 2 hr HM does not equal a sub 4 hr full. My first HM was 1:56. My first full, 6 months later, was 4:09. I had the pace I needed for a sub 4 for the first 22 miles but then muscle fatigue took over and I gradually slowed my pace the final 4. Six months just wasn't enough time to build up the leg strength and endurance needed for me to get to 4 hours. I had three 20+ mile training runs but those were at training pace, not marathon pace.

    @_nikkiwolf_ I have a pair of Kinvara trail shoes but have not wore them yet. One thing I noticed when I bought them is that they are quite a bit lighter than my other trail shoes. Could the lighter weight lead to less life span?

    losing weight vs. optimizing running performance...that's very, very difficult. Running is a calorie intensive activity, which is hard to reconcile with losing weight. I do think it works better if you can train your body to increase the percent of fat you burn vs. carbs at a given pace. You do that by keeping your pace down on long runs...in the aerobic zone... so your body doesn't need to dip into your glycogen stores. The more your body can burn fat, the better it becomes at doing so. Even those folks with 6-pack abs have enough fat in their bodies to fuel running an ultra, but we need to get our bodies trained to be efficient at it. Ditch the sugar and refined carbs, eat more good fats and protein, and run slower. That also reduces the stress hormone cortisol in your body, which helps in other areas. Now if you're goal is to get a podium finish at the next 5K or 10K, this is not going to work. If that's the case spend 6 months a year optimizing your running, and 6 months losing weight.
    PastorVincent wrote: »
    Yeah. It is funny but someplace between HM and FULL there is a major change in running. I mean I literally could go out right now and knock down a HM with no tapper or etc. But a full? That is just a different animal.

    You may already know this, but the main difference is due to your glycogen stores. Many runners have enough glycogen (carbs) stored in their muscles and liver to fully fuel a HM race. Most runners do NOT, however, have enough to fuel a full marathon. Glycogen stores last about 90 to 120 minutes. That's a doable HM time. For a full, however, you need to take fuel from the beginning because you cannot ingest carbs at the high rate you burn them. Because of that, and because there's about a 30 minute lag from when you start taking your gels to the time those calories are available to your body as fuel, you should start your fueling for a full about 15 minutes before the race starts and keep at it until 30 minutes before the end. You should have experimented and discovered how many calories per hour your body can digest without gastrointestinal issues during your training and use that as a basis for your marathon fueling plan.

    @hist_doc hey, another Cloudventure wearer!! I just retired my first pair. I love those shoes! It's like wearing a comfortable pair of slipper with great traction. I got about 300 miles out of them, which is typical for me. At that point the pods were tearing and the uppers had a few small holes. I have a new pair to break out soon but I'm trying to wear out some other shoes first.
  • 7lenny7
    7lenny7 Posts: 3,493 Member
    edited December 2017
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    It was a crazy day yesterday. From a high of 58F dropping down to 18F this morning, with showers starting during the day, transitioning to snow around 8pm with high winds.

    I waited until the snow came down because running in the snow is divine. It was 28F at the start so I dress very warm but after a quarter mile I had to go back home. That wind made the snowflakes feel like little icy daggers on my face! I traded in my cap for a full face mask. that helped but when running into the wind, I had to close up the slit at much as possible and nearly close my eyes, looking through eyelashes to make sure i didn't stray off course. I think we only got about 2 inches but the wind was filling in my footprints so that when I ran a second loop I couldn't see the imprints from my first pass just 20 minutes earlier.

    I stayed near my house in case my knee flared up. I got 5 miles in and the knee felt pretty good during and after the run. I could feel something, but less than before. It's a bit full today. I'm still debating whether to schedule an appointment or not.

    In spite of the wind the run was awesome! It felt great and Kody & I LOVED running in the snow. Tonight may be a bit trickier since now the first layer of snow has turned to ice. That means I'll move my running from the paths to the streets, since the streets are treated with salt and get more traffic, so they're less treacherous.

    A slow start, but a start nonetheless

    1o5p46awnd28.jpg
  • PastorVincent
    PastorVincent Posts: 6,668 Member
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    7lenny7 wrote: »
    I agree with you that a sub 2 hr HM does not equal a sub 4 hr full. My first HM was 1:56. My first full, 6 months later, was 4:09. I had the pace I needed for a sub 4 for the first 22 miles but then muscle fatigue took over and I gradually slowed my pace the final 4. Six months just wasn't enough time to build up the leg strength and endurance needed for me to get to 4 hours. I had three 20+ mile training runs but those were at training pace, not marathon pace.

    Yeah, this year I am going to put more long (20+) runs into my training. I think that was a miss last year. 10-13 is a normal comfortable weekend run for me now, but come next year (as in soon! heh) I plan to push that more. All comes down to time and weather though. Neither of which are great in Pittsburgh winters.

    7lenny7 wrote: »
    You may already know this, but the main difference is due to your glycogen stores. Many runners have enough glycogen (carbs) stored in their muscles and liver to fully fuel a HM race. Most runners do NOT, however, have enough to fuel a full marathon. Glycogen stores last about 90 to 120 minutes. That's a doable HM time. For a full, however, you need to take fuel from the beginning because you cannot ingest carbs at the high rate you burn them. Because of that, and because there's about a 30 minute lag from when you start taking your gels to the time those calories are available to your body as fuel, you should start your fueling for a full about 15 minutes before the race starts and keep at it until 30 minutes before the end. You should have experimented and discovered how many calories per hour your body can digest without gastrointestinal issues during your training and use that as a basis for your marathon fueling plan.

    I fueled very poorly my first marathon and paid dearly for it, but been working on things since then. For the marathon, I am pretty sure (need more testing, but early testing looks good) that roughly a scope of TailWind in my water each hour will be sufficient. That is 100 calories. That puts me in the ballpark of the Gel recommendations - without the mass of the gels.

    The only problem is that for the marathon that means carrying my own water. Gels are much lighter to carry! :) Still working on a plan. Might carrying 1/2 the water I need - all with TailWinds in and then get rest of my water form the race people. MIght be a good balance.

    I know from experience if the weather is warm, I can easily burn through 80oz of water in 4 hours at MP. Which I know sounds like a lot to some people, but we are all different and I loose greater than a pound an hour in water if I do not hydrate for spring/summer runs.
  • skippygirlsmom
    skippygirlsmom Posts: 4,433 Member
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    @7lenny7 thanks for the weight running balance info. Very informative. I lost weight while running before, but I was maxing out at half of what I’m running now. At my happy weight I was running about 40 miles more a month than I am now. Skip looked at the On Cloud shoes a couple weeks ago, she ran all over the parking in them came back into Fleet Feet and said I hate them for running, love them for walking, the owner said “me too”. Oh geesh. She didn’t like the feel of the tread on her feet if that makes sense. You need some snow googles.

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