High Fructose Corn Syrup is Bad?
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I'll probably just make my own pean rolls or get some from the local farmer's market. Not free but less effort than traveling cross country for mythical free food.
But.. but... its the magical pecan express bus! How can you pass up the opportunity to be a part of a trip that might become a MFP fable?
I thought it was an offer to cook for us. :bigsmile:bhadbahabi wrote: »I escaped into chit-chat indefinitely to avoid this chatter.....why is this in my safe space of debauchery?
Wait - what? We're in Chit-Chat now? When did that happen??
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rheddmobile wrote: »bostonjim23 wrote: »i am not sure of the science behind High Fructose though it is meant to make you eat more which is why in many restaurants they will give you something that includes that prior to serving your meal.
What restaurants are you going to? The freebie starters in restaurants I've been in have tended to be good quality bread, breadsticks, or rolls, with olive oil or butter; or tortilla chips and salsa. In many cases, those won't include HFCS or high fructose anything, and in those few cases where those do have a bit of fructose (from the tomatoes in the salsa (1.7g fructose per tomato), for example, or corn syrup in the bread (quite unusual), those foods are far from an efficient delivery mechanism for this appetite-inducing magical "High Fructose". They're trivial sources, at most.
Lots of alcoholic drinks include fructose in some form, and most soda pop certainly does . . . but those are things we order, not things the restaurant gives us. In fact, those "High Fructose" things provide a major portion of many restaurants' profits, because the markup is so high.
With respect, because I mostly agree with the point you're trying to make, I disagree with your specific comments about restaurant starters. I'm a type 2 diabetic and I test my blood glucose often. I've given up most highly sweetened foods because my body doesn't handle them well, which has made me more aware of the extremely sweet taste of bread served in American style chain restaurants. Longhorn and Logan's steakhouses for example serve rolls which taste like cake. They are not normal tasting "good quality bread" and half a roll from either of those places will send my levels into the stratosphere, so clearly there's additional sugar of some kind in those light, fluffy rolls.
That being said, there's nothing magical about HFCS and its effect on blood glucose as opposed to any other sugar. It's just that since corn is subsidized in America, it's very inexpensive and tends to show up more often in processed American foods, as opposed to other, more expensive sweeteners.
Speaking seriously: With you, 100%. Many foods are way more sweetened than they need to be, and I don't love it. And I'm not even diabetic!
I have to admit, I don't do steakhouses (vegetarian for 44 years), so I may just not be seeing those breads. I understand that carbs generally, and extra-sweetened things specifically, will be a problem for diabetics, and sympathize.
It's still true that they're not much of a stealth delivery mechanism for HFCS. Even King's Hawaiian - which taste pretty sweet, and do contain HFCS - have only 7g sugars per serving. If someone were running a conspiracy to force-feed us secret HFCS, this isn't a very efficient route.
I do sympathize with your situation, though. And I empathize, as a vegetarian: Unnecessary (untastable) chicken broth and gelatin are also pretty common. It's not essentially poisonous to me as sugar/carbs might be (in excess) to you, but it's still annoying.0 -
bhadbahabi wrote: »I escaped into chit-chat indefinitely to avoid this chatter.....why is this in my safe space of debauchery?
Because my debauchery includes pecan rolls. Now that I've thought of it, at least. Or now that @bostonjim23 pointed out that potential.
(Apologies to those with different fantasy lives. The fantasy is now not so much the pecan rolls, as the bus/road trip.)2 -
here's some insight from the NIH; draw your own conclusions:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3522469/0 -
This thread has made a crappy morning better.
However, it's all your fault if I go looking for pecan roll recipes later today.3 -
High fructose corn syrup is the single greatest killer among all the killers that have ever killed.9
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Well I never thought my post would lead to y'all planning a cross-country pecan-roll road trip, but I'm glad something good came of it.
Here is the kind of stuff supposedly supporting the claims I heard.
https://www.drdavidwilliams.com/dangers-high-fructose-corn-syrup
When you ingest fructose, rather than staying in the bloodstream like sugar, it gets shuttled directly to your liver. In the liver, it becomes one of the building blocks of triglycerides, which are fat-storage molecules. Triglycerides are released into the bloodstream, carried by LDL cholesterol, and deposited on the walls of the arteries.
and also
https://www.drsinatra.com/a-healthy-heart-diet-should-not-include-high-fructose-corn-syrup
These two look like pop doctors... so for me that's not too trustworthy... some of the claims are interesting and like a pp said, maybe there is some scientific support for some of the concern... But I'm still not worried about eating foods with HFCS.
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Motorsheen wrote: »here's some insight from the NIH; draw your own conclusions:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3522469/
@Motorsheen , there we go, an actual study from a reliable source. Thank you.
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Someone is telling me that some panel of doctors have concluded that hfcs leads to weight gain because the body deposits something from the hfcs into the fat cells; and then the body can’t burn the fat cells up, or the body can’t ever get rid of the chemical or whatever it is that’s deposited. Sounds like a bunch of total hogwash to me, the same kind of stuff I’ve heard many times over by people who are just trying to make money off of their nonsense. I’m interested in hearing what anyone here knows about this topic.
This sounds 100% true. I'm pretty good at recognizing true facts. I like to think of HFCS like light sabers. Originally, lightsabers were built using crystals harvested manually an individually from the planets of Ruusan and Ilum. In the current universe however, processes for synthesizing crystals have become fairly common and several lightsabers are built using these synthetic crystals. The crystal is wired to the conduit and power cell such that the user can alter the length, width and intensity of the emitted blade.
When the fully constructed lightsaber is activated, the internal power cell generates photo-electric energy by which the plasma blade is focused through the crystal. a non-thermal beam of plasma is packed tightly and focused through anywhere from 1 to 3 crystals with multiple facets. The formed beam is positively charged and is attracted back to the emitting hilt by way of negatively-charged high energy flux apertures. A power cell superconductor is then used to recycle individually emitted plasma packets into one long beam which continues to self regenerate during the time duration over which the lightsaber remains activated. The blade is tangible and because both blades on two dueling sabers are positively charged, the blades are capable of repelling one another.
Ordinarily, the emission of the plasma blade for long durations of time would drain the power cell on the saber fairly quickly as was the case with older sabers from several millenia back in the past. However, through use of The Force, a Jedi is capable of combining all of the elements of his saber into one hightly efficient weapon such that the only major power drain occurs from the blade coming in contact with another material.
So you see, what you said about HFCS is true just like it relates to light sabers.5 -
Some panel of doctors somewhere. Hm. How verifiable is that?
You have a gut feeling it’s hogwash, which I personally agree with but the two of us are still working off feels.
At the base of it, is there anything essentially wrong with fructose? It’s in fruit, and there’s lots of it in honey. It’s sweeter than sugar. It’s highly palatable and digestible.
I’m not swapping out my highly varied diet for an all fructose diet. There’s an ancient story of a prophet who lived off locusts and honey and all it got him was his head lopped off. So there’s that danger to consider.2 -
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Some panel of doctors somewhere. Hm. How verifiable is that?
You have a gut feeling it’s hogwash, which I personally agree with but the two of us are still working off feels.
At the base of it, is there anything essentially wrong with fructose? It’s in fruit, and there’s lots of it in honey. It’s sweeter than sugar. It’s highly palatable and digestible.
I’m not swapping out my highly varied diet for an all fructose diet. There’s an ancient story of a prophet who lived off locusts and honey and all it got him was his head lopped off. So there’s that danger to consider.
Although I think death by having my head lopped off could be interesting, I'm not sure I'm willing to eat locusts to accomplish it. I may have to remove that from my bucket list (last item, of course). One must always consider the cost to play/win.4 -
Lightsabers FTW!
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Nothing is definitive - but there are studies that suggest cause for concern and the need for further investigation. For example:
"HFCS consumption with chow diet did not induce weight gain compared to water, chow-only controls but did induce glucose dysregulation and reduced evoked dopamine release in the dorsolateral striatum. These data show that HFCS can contribute to metabolic disorder and altered dopamine function independent of weight gain and high-fat diets. " https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5747444/
"Our findings suggest that HFCS and SUC have differential effects on lipid metabolism: while sucrose promotes obesogenesis, HFCS primarily enhances inflammation and insulin resistance, and ghrelin confers protective effects for these metabolic dysfunctions." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28629187
"The effect of the 55% high-fructose corn syrup on the tested parameters of lipid metabolism was not equivalent to that of sucrose. Using HFCS-55 instead of sucrose has an adverse effect on blood lipid parameters, while weight gains and peri-organ fat deposits are comparable. Moreover, the obtained results confirm that tested animals were susceptible to the adverse effects of sugars added to their diet, even in small amounts. This emphasises the need to precisely control the amount of added sugars in the diet.' https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28703963
@All1971 , thank you very much for your thoughtful post.
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That list of breads...
How many of us knew the #1 answer without even scrolling down?
Also, I bet we could get that bus to run on HFCS, right? It's gotta count as biodiesel.4 -
hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?1
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cmriverside wrote: »hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?
Entropy.6 -
cmriverside wrote: »hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?
And I have gotten several unwanted "friend requests" since they moved it. I wish they wouldn't do that, I stay out of Chit Chat and Fun & Games for a reason
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cmriverside wrote: »hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?
And I have gotten several unwanted "friend requests" since they moved it. I wish they wouldn't do that, I stay out of Chit Chat and Fun & Games for a reason
ohhhh. I missed that if you guys already discussed it.
Because that's just weird...
..and now kimny72 will get even more FRs. 1 -
So.
Pecan rolls. Are we talking about this:
or this:
(and I probably answered my own question, but Pecan Log roll is where my mind went. It's like Divinity wrapped in Excellence. )
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cmriverside wrote: »hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?
And I have gotten several unwanted "friend requests" since they moved it. I wish they wouldn't do that, I stay out of Chit Chat and Fun & Games for a reason
wait.
Friend Requests are 'unwanted' ??
.... I don't think I've ever turned one down.2 -
cmriverside wrote: »hm. How did I end up in Chit Chat?
And I have gotten several unwanted "friend requests" since they moved it. I wish they wouldn't do that, I stay out of Chit Chat and Fun & Games for a reason
Friend Request Expedited.2 -
cmriverside wrote: »So.
Pecan rolls. Are we talking about this:
or this:
(and I probably answered my own question, but Pecan Log roll is where my mind went. It's like Divinity wrapped in Excellence. )
The top one. But the bus can pick up some of the pecan logs for the road.
(Don't worry: Yoga 7A, Zumba 11A, Karate lessons 1P, mountain trail scramble 3P, boulder lift/toss 5P, line/square/contra/country-swing dancing 7P. All activities available but optional; participants may organize other options. We'll hook up a bike/canoe/SUP/kayak/rowing shell trailer to the bus, and stow weights/racks/benches/kettlebells/rowing machine/elliptical in the underbus luggage area with your suitcases. One large roll-y bag, one standard carry-on, one personal item (day pack/briefcase/purse/small tote) per person, please, to allow room for shared exercise equipment. Volunteer musicians for dancing may add instrument (no grand/upright pianos, please; max of 2 upright bass). Regular stops at laundromats for washing workout/dance clothes . . . and for pecan rolls, naturally. ) 3 -
janejellyroll wrote: »\Chow diet? Who on earth is eating chow?
Oh, mice.
Yes, mice and rats - that is how toxicology testing is done. it is one fundamental and important step in testing of consumer products and medicine and environmental pollutants and occupationally hazardous chemicals.
This would be a good point if my comment was in response to mice being used in a toxicology test.5 -
cmriverside wrote: »So.
Pecan rolls. Are we talking about this:
or this:
(and I probably answered my own question, but Pecan Log roll is where my mind went. It's like Divinity wrapped in Excellence. )
The top one. But the bus can pick up some of the pecan logs for the road.
(Don't worry: Yoga 7A, Zumba 11A, Karate lessons 1P, mountain trail scramble 3P, boulder lift/toss 5P, line/square/contra/country-swing dancing 7P. All activities available but optional; participants may organize other options. We'll hook up a bike/canoe/SUP/kayak/rowing shell trailer to the bus, and stow weights/racks/benches/kettlebells/rowing machine/elliptical in the underbus luggage area with your suitcases. One large roll-y bag, one standard carry-on, one personal item (day pack/briefcase/purse/small tote) per person, please, to allow room for shared exercise equipment. Volunteer musicians for dancing may add instrument (no grand/upright pianos, please; max of 2 upright bass). Regular stops at laundromats for washing workout/dance clothes . . . and for pecan rolls, naturally. ) 0 -
serious question:
If there is so much doubt (and much of it negative in nature) about HFCS, why even eat it at all ?
It's a very affordable additive for so many products.... but 'So What?'. That benefits the companies that sell the products but might not necessarily benefit the end user.
There are much better options other than HFCS, right?
Why not just have those?1
This discussion has been closed.
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