Coronavirus prep

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  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,817 Member
    T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »
    I finally found some TP online last night and it is on the way. Then today, the store magically has it again for the first time in about 6 weeks.. That is how it works, I suppose.

    OMG I HOPE YOU PICKED SOME UP AT THAT STORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



    :flowerforyou: :flowerforyou: :flowerforyou: :flowerforyou:
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,195 Member
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    lynn_glenmont wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    lynn_glenmont wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    lynn_glenmont wrote: »
    amusedmonkey wrote: »
    Things are looking promising here. It has been a few days since the last new case. 2-4 cases daily, all are either children who are already at the hospital with their sick parents or import drivers who test positive at the border before entering the country (but mostly drivers).

    Most things are open now under strict sanitation and distancing rules (even non-essentials). There aren't any plans to open gathering places yet (churches, mosques, wedding venues, clubs...etc). Restaurants are all open for delivery and pickup. Almost half the provinces are almost back to life as usual and can drive freely. The rest can drive but with restrictions. Cars with an even plate number drive one day, and cars with an odd number drive the next. No more than 2 people in one car. Public transport is now also open at 30% capacity.

    People are...well... people.     They're not distancing as much as they should be. It's Ramadan and they're flooding to buy food without any regard for safety. Some places are better organized than others - we've been buying and freezing bread once every 10 or so days to avoid crowds at bread bakeries and buying our vegetables at the grocery store (more expensive) because produce stores are less organized. I used to get upset at people, but I feel less upset now, probably because it's looking good right now. I have resigned to "people are people, and will keep doing what people do"

    This is what concerns me. I think we could reasonably safely open up a lot of businesses, if people were just capable of continuing to obey social distancing advisories. They had a piece on "60 Minutes" yesterday of an automobile plant that has retooled to produce ventilators, and they have erected plastic barriers between work stations, everyone was wearing masks, and they had smart watches that buzzed if they got within six feet of another smart watch (also storing data on what watches they were near, for future contact tracing if necessary). And the company is doing all that because people are people, and if you don't have systems in place to stop them, they're going to go back to their old ways of swapping germs and not washing their hands.

    They are adding a mask requirement for indoor shopping and places where you can't maintain 6 ft of separation, but opening up some of the closed outdoor areas and then adding as new essential businesses "greenhouses, garden centers and nurseries" (many of which were already doing business through curbside and delivery, and Home Depot was open). "These stores must follow social distancing requirements and must require that employees and customers wear a face covering."

    "Animal grooming services may also re-open," and "[r]etail stores not designated as non-essential businesses and operations may re-open to fulfill telephone and online orders through pick-up outside the store and delivery."

    This seems reasonable to me. However, a politician downstate sued to prevent the order from applying to him, so clearly others disagree. I don't think a majority, and I get the impression the police here are enforcing the orders and concerned for their own safety in that they are on the front lines of having to deal with people who may have the virus and are not compliant. (Mostly enforcement is ticketing and breaking things up.)

    To clarify, I have concerns far short of intentional violations of restrictions.

    I think there's a difference between effective social distancing and nominal, perfunctory compliance with the bare letter of restrictions. I don't have a lot of faith that folks wearing homemade cloth masks and bandanas (not their fault -- that's what's available), touching their faces right over their mouths and noses about every 20 seconds (based on my observations of folks in essential businesses and out walking -- I've even seen this in interviews with medical personnel on local news), mistaking three feet for six feet, not comprehending that talking when you're standing that close to someone presents increased risk, just as sneezing or coughing does .... I don't have a lot of faith with that as our baseline, that lifting restrictions with rules about social distancing will lead to effective social distancing.

    Not sure why this is the response to my post, but I will say that I don't think people are mistaking 6 ft for 3, and most of the time in my neighborhood I see 6 ft of distancing, and it's easy outside.

    Masks are a mixed bag, of course.

    I really don't see a big deal with opening up curbside pickup and most outdoor spaces.

    The issue with violations of social distancing aren't people mistaking 6 ft for 3 ft, but people who, for whatever reason, don't care at all, like a crazy huge house party that was shut down here or people trying to make points for social media. I don't get it, but it's happening.


    I had posted expressing doubts about people's ability to comply with social distancing constraints that government officials at all levels keep emphasizing should be followed even as businesses reopen. You responded to my post with one about (1) what the rules are in your area and (2) people who are actively opposing the rules. I wanted to clarify that I wasn't talking about either of those things -- I don't think the biggest problem is what the specific rules are or people who are actively opposing the rules but the large majority of people who will things think rules are a good idea, but just not for them right now in this particular situation. Or that situation. "Yes, of course we need to keep safe, but it's not going to be a problem if I just go over to a friend's house for a few drinks with them and one other person from one other household ... It's been a tough time being apart from everybody for so long. Just one evening isn't a big deal."

    In effect, my whole last post was my explanation of why I wasn't sure what your response had to do with my post, or to clarify what I meant if my earlier post was being misunderstood as being about people actively protesting against rules.

    Okay. I misunderstood your prior post.

    Mine was intended to say that the rules had been loosened as you suggested could work and that I thought it was going to, as I see most following the rules -- certainly most who care at all.

    I do disagree with the notion that people cannot comply with social distancing.

    Ah, thanks. I had not followed the line of thinking you describe in the second paragraph.

    Written communication is hard sometimes. I've started making colleagues call me because it can be so exhausting to try to explain even mildly complicated or fiddly things in emails or texts.
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,195 Member
    SuzySunshine99 wrote: »
    lynn_glenmont wrote: »
    I haven't seen toilet paper in a store in six weeks. Last time I was in a grocery store they had small packages of flushable wipes, limit two per household, so I bought one. Haven't had to use it yet, though. Not sure I trust it to be flushable and not damage my plumbing.

    Do NOT flush those...they will definitely damage your plumbing. I'm not sure how they get away with calling them flushable. My nephew is a plumber, and he says 90% of his calls are people who tried to flush those things. They don't break down like toilet paper does.

    A gross as it may be, you'll need to keep a plastic bag handy and just throw out the used wipes with the trash.

    Thanks. If I reach the point of needing to use any substitute for TP, I will do that.
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,195 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    lynn_glenmont wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    Things are starting to go a little sideways for the mayor of Grants, NM...He has repeatedly called the governor a Nazi and the state police her Gestapo...and at the same time he's firing anyone employed by the town that won't go back to work in defiance of the governor's stay at home order, including the golf course manager who initially opened up, but was cited by the state police and afterwards refused to open the golf course...you're fired!

    I can actually see being a bit rebellious here and being a mayor of a small rural town and wanting to open things up...but when you start canning people who want to be consistent with state orders, you're just creating a *kitten* storm for yourself. He's going to end up with lawsuits so far up his *kitten*, he won't know what to do. Not a particularly bright individual.

    Is it a public golf course? I mean, it seems weird that every job in town is subject to firing by the mayor?

    It is a city course, it's the only one in town.

    Grants was once a booming little town when the uranium mines were in operation, but these days, the vast majority are employed by either the "city" or the county. There are a few little restaurants and shops and a couple hotels mostly used by truckers, but that's about it. It's been a dying town for a long time, and I'm frankly surprised it isn't a complete ghost town at this point.

    Ah. Sounds like a scary place to be with someone in charge trying to force everyone to risk exposure. I guess he can't force people to go and play golf, etc.
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,195 Member
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    ReenieHJ wrote: »
    GaleHawkins wrote: »
    For the first time in a few weeks I went to WM this evening. They had a selection of a few different brands of paper towels and TP;and good stock but not all the brands they normally carry. The optional foods like chicken, pork and beef were wiped out after the news media talk of a lock down of meat plants. Corn is being planted and the farmers are sad because demand for corn for cars is down. We may be eating a lot of corn flitters if meat goes off line.

    On a sad note I went by to pay the rent for the guy that I am his guardian that lives in an assisted living home for the past 25 years after his mom pasted. He is 76 and has COPD and one resident tested positive for COVID-19 today. He grew up without hearing so he did not develop speech or go to school. He is bright and watches TV so I expect he kind of knows what is going one. I have a former neighbor that lives there as well who is 96. Like another home near here it will sweep every hall in time I expect. They have been locked down for a month expecting something to happen.

    I am going to try and be nice so maybe my son or daughter will let me have a tiny house in the back yard when I get near my end.

    Now that doctors are seeing patients it seems like twice as many cars were on the road today. I made an 80 mile trip to the optometrist to rule out a detached retina before I do much tractor work and thankful it is just a vitreous detachment that is normal but can pull and tear the retina if the separation is suddenly. The flashing lights of the last week have really slowed down.

    GaleH, I had the vitreous detachment thing going on a year or so ago. It was scary because I've never had issues like that. But after it fully detached(that, in itself, sounds freaky because aren't things supposed to hold together?? Lol), it's been fine. Good luck with yours and hopefully it'll settle down for you.

    Thanks for share because it tends to freak one out.

    In my case I first thought the green flashes were from my Com Pilot hanging around my neck for my blue tooth hearing aids. As the flashing become more visual in brighter light I became concerned about a retina tear may be developing or had happen. I refreshed my mind the condition and was quite sure it was a vitreous detachment in progress but knew a blow or heavy lifting could cause the traction on the retina and could lead to a tear. I never had the curtain blowing in a breeze symptom of a torn retina but for the last two years Joe had been questioning me hard about seeing flashes and knew he would not be happy if I ignored it.

    Actually the vitreous detachment is normal with aging but normally it occurs over many years so there is no flashing, etc so we never know about it. Near sighted people tend to be at higher risk of retina tears we read.

    I think of it as old contact paper we put on a wall, cabinet, etc that starts to curl at the seams. If we remove it slowly instead of with a jerk often it will come off completely and not tear or pull a layer of old paint/paper that may be under it that would be the layer of brain material called the retina.

    The flashes are coming less often and I am going to take it easy until they stop completely.

    WARNING: Semi-graphic medical details coming.

    Major digression from point of thread, but: Another potential complication (besides retinal detachment) is having the vitreous detachment tear & bleed into the vitreous. This happened to each of my eyes, a little over a month apart. At first, it looked like dark droplets swimming around, like some kind of evil snow-globe, then it can get worse (more solid) depending on severity. If you start seeing dark dots or waves, see your retinologist. (I had a laser procedure to stop the bleeding in one eye, a cryo procedure on the other - difference because of tear location. Done while awake, and moderately sub-recreational. Essential, though.)

    How long for the blood to clear also depends on details. My first eye cleared pretty well in a month or so (just in time for the other eye to fail 🙄). The other one was super slow to clear, pretty much 100% blocked for weeks (vitrectomy surgery to clear it was an option; didn't want that). I was legally blind in that eye (mostly from the blood obscuring vision, though slowly clearing) for almost 2 years, over which time I developed a cataract that obscured vision in that eye in a different way (possibly from them messing with that eye so much) - hard to tell when the cataract vs. the blood accounted for the vision impairment. Removal of the cataract on that side got the vision in that eye back in legal range again, but several years later, there's still some floaty stuff.

    Bottom line: If dots, spots, or waves appear, go to retinologist immediately. The less blood swimming around in your eye, the better.

    Apologies for the diversion from coronavirus topics, folks! 😬 Hope you'll forgive. :flowerforyou:

    Well, pink-eye is a COVID symptom, so we can rationalize an on-topic connection. :smile:

    Besides, now that most of us are many weeks into sustained coping strategies, rather than strictly-speaking "prepping" for something that hasn't arrived, it seems like anything addressing how to deal with things that are no longer readily available (like medical services for non-life-threatening conditions) is now on-topic.

  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
    missysippy930 wrote: »
    Our governor went to Worthington MN yesterday. Minnesota is the # 2 pork processor in the US. Covid is running through meat processing plants here. Employees were protesting in their vehicles, the presidential order that the meat processing plants have to stay open. They are scared, and I can’t say that I blame them.
    There was a definite shortage of fresh pork products at the grocery store yesterday.
    There was TP and paper towels yesterday. Still no yeast.

    Yeah, I don't quite get the thinking behind ordering the plants to be open. You can keep them open, but you can't force people to go to work (except through firing them when they don't show up).
  • GaleHawkins
    GaleHawkins Posts: 8,159 Member
    hipari wrote: »
    For the first time during the social isolation, I'm genuinely concerned and devastated. Concerned that the next 48 hours will result in breaking the rules en masse and a spike in infections, and devastated I can't join the party. I live in Finland and May 1st is May Day, or Walpurgis Day, and the night before as well as the day itself are huge outdoor celebrations. Students normally start celebrations at least a couple of weeks before and ramp it up for the big day, and things kick off on Walpurgis Eve, April 30th, at 6PM when a famous statue in downtown Helsinki is given its high school graduation hat in a ceremony that has a crowd of at least 50 000 people gathering around to watch, and put on their own hats at the same time. Wearing high school graduation hats for May Day is a major tradition and marks the beginning of the summer season. The night is a big celebration, and on May Day people gather for outdoor brunches and picnics, especially one specific park that usually gathers at least 50 000 people regardless of weather. The statue has been walled off and covered for several days now to prevent crowds (it will get its hat via some sort of virtual art performance, this year conveniently happens to be the art students' turn to perform the ceremony as the ceremony is performed each year by different student unions of area universities) and I've heard rumors of riot police closing the park. The same holiday is also celebrated in Sweden, and it was just on the news that a major university city there will fertilize park lawns with chicken poop the night before, to make them smelly and gross and prevent mass congregating. So yeah, this is serious.

    This is going to be a really difficult weekend for most people I know because we can't celebrate, meet and go out on the town like we normally do for this holiday. My friends who are still students are devastated because they can't celebrate end of semester, my graduated friends are devastated because Walpurgis Day is a rare opportunity for everyone to be partying together, and even my almost 60-year-old mother is devastated and when social distancing measures were announced, she was serious about going to that park unless police physically stops her. I hope people still stay strong and stay home, so the epidemic doesn't get out of hand - it's been fairly in control here so far and there's talks about controlled reopening of some measures if the situation stays stable.

    I read the chicken poop story out of Sweden this morning since I have made Sweden one of my pandemic leading indicators. The general outlook for China and Europe post full lock down is concerning. In the USA the state of Georgia has my attention since restrictions for the most part have been greatly lifted. Actually in the USA tight lock down actions are being removed by more and more people regardless of what Governors say.

    Our Civil War over state's rights of 165 years ago still has not been fully resolved. At the federal level states are being warned not to impose restrictions that violate USA constitutional rights.

    Our second wave may be a few weeks later than like in China and Europe and it is expected to be broader in scope this time around. I hope 3 weeks after Walpurgis Day goes better than expected.

    Our meat packing houses shutting down due to the pandemic may soon make our TP shortage look like a non event. Many in the USA eat meat 1-3 times daily and it will take a year or two to get the farms back to growing beef, pork and chickens like before because they are having to put down so many animals due to lack of processing plants to buy them.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
    bpetrosky wrote: »
    janejellyroll wrote: »
    missysippy930 wrote: »
    Our governor went to Worthington MN yesterday. Minnesota is the # 2 pork processor in the US. Covid is running through meat processing plants here. Employees were protesting in their vehicles, the presidential order that the meat processing plants have to stay open. They are scared, and I can’t say that I blame them.
    There was a definite shortage of fresh pork products at the grocery store yesterday.
    There was TP and paper towels yesterday. Still no yeast.

    Yeah, I don't quite get the thinking behind ordering the plants to be open. You can keep them open, but you can't force people to go to work (except through firing them when they don't show up).

    I think the industry wanted the Defense Production Act order to give them legal cover against liability claims from workers in the plants if they remain open without sufficient protection. It also gives the government the ability to impose wage controls and settle labor disputes, which would limit the ability of unions (if any) representing the workers to do much other than complain. This also effectively cuts the workers off from unemployment since the plants are mandated to operate and pay them for working. Since many of the workers in the plants have few other opportunities for employment, especially now, they have to decide between working in the plants or going without any income.

    Super insightful, thanks for sharing.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 37,202 Member
    I went to CVS today to pick up some prescriptions.

    I think I may've reported being skeezed out by using the drivethrough a while back (people with no masks or gloves pawing all over the card acceptor, that one had to pull out of the drawer to use, and that I can't see without getting kind of close).

    So, I went inside this time. That really was more limited touching of stuff, comparatively, so I guess the difference comes down to how a person feels about the indoor air vs. the card/drawer nonsense.

    While there, walked a couple of aisles to see what they had, until no one was at pharmacy counter: In most categories there were at least some options, maybe not one's favorite brand/scent. Foam hand soap pump bottles were very low but not zero (lots of other types of soaps), masks were out, no disinfectant wipes. But there were baby wipes, some disinfectant sprays and liquids, some TP, some other paper products. Most other areas looked fine, but I didn't check all that closely. Hardly any other customers in the store. Pharmacy cashier wearing mask but no gloves, plastic shields between her and customers, except the pass-through for the bag'o'drugs.
  • lemurcat2
    lemurcat2 Posts: 7,887 Member
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    I went to CVS today to pick up some prescriptions.

    I think I may've reported being skeezed out by using the drivethrough a while back (people with no masks or gloves pawing all over the card acceptor, that one had to pull out of the drawer to use, and that I can't see without getting kind of close).

    So, I went inside this time. That really was more limited touching of stuff, comparatively, so I guess the difference comes down to how a person feels about the indoor air vs. the card/drawer nonsense.

    While there, walked a couple of aisles to see what they had, until no one was at pharmacy counter: In most categories there were at least some options, maybe not one's favorite brand/scent. Foam hand soap pump bottles were very low but not zero (lots of other types of soaps), masks were out, no disinfectant wipes. But there were baby wipes, some disinfectant sprays and liquids, some TP, some other paper products. Most other areas looked fine, but I didn't check all that closely. Hardly any other customers in the store. Pharmacy cashier wearing mask but no gloves, plastic shields between her and customers, except the pass-through for the bag'o'drugs.

    I got my current masks at a gas station with a window (serendipitous discovery), although I have made some lame ones (I am not crafty and hate sewing) and now ordered some cloth ones that seem good. I still have leftover hand sanitizer from before the rush, although have not been using it a lot (I just wash my hands for the most part). My local Walgreens was awful before all this, so I may drive to another or a CVS soon (haven't used my car since Easter so that's a reason to drive it also).
  • TonyB0588
    TonyB0588 Posts: 9,520 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »
    Nony_Mouse wrote: »
    I would post a photo of the absurd displays of TP at my supermarket, but it feels kind of cruel to do that to you guys :\

    You saw what @rheddmobile said about the Memphis area - that is about 2 hr. drive away. My mom in Omaha says they have plenty in the stores and are limiting it to 1 package per person. She lives with my sister and family, and tells me that my sister and her husband are buying 1 package every time they go to the store because they don't want to run out... to what end, I don't know. I assume there is a point where they will have stockpiled enough that they will stop that. In rural Iowa where I used to live, about 90 min. drive from Omaha, they have it and are limiting quantities as well. I heard the same from people I know in Des Moines. Maybe people in my specific area are just worse with hoarding than elsewhere?! I'm actually starting to get pretty upset about this now that I'm seeing other places have it.

    I'm in rural Central VA and any of the stores I can get to all still have more empty shelves than filled. I haven't seen TP, tissues, pasta, soup, canned or dry beans, cleaning products, rice, or rubbing alcohol since the beginning of March. I don't know if it means people are still hoarding or if it is a delivery issue, but I'm starting to take it personal!

    We don't have any shortages, and certainly not of toilet paper. But supermarkets started limiting how many total items you can purchase, as a way to get customers out faster so other waiting customers could get in. No time for slow casual browsing of the shelves.
  • TonyB0588
    TonyB0588 Posts: 9,520 Member
    cmriverside wrote: »
    I'm pretty concerned about this whole food chain thing - and not just meat. I would say to everyone, stock up on protein powder, pasta or wheat, nuts, beans, whatever protein sources you see at the store. Canned vegetables and fruits, etc.

    I guess the government *could* deploy the National Guard or military to run the factories if it comes to that. Let's pray it doesn't.

    Yes, but of course the military aren't immune to the virus, so you couldn't just put them into a factory right after there was evidence of the presence of the disease in there.

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